Squats and back discomfort

withchaco

Today, while doing squats, I felt this discomfort in my lower back. I'm suspecting a form issue here. Unfortunately I don't have any recordings of me squatting, but any common mistakes that cause this problem?

It's the same sensation I felt when over-arching while doing curls (which I don't do anymore). I don't think I was over-arching my back while doing squats... that just doesn't sound very likely, but then again, without a video, I guess I can't be sure.

HelloDan

Without a video, it's truly impossible to say.

What type of squats do you do though?
I'm assuming back squat, and if it's more of a low bar power lifting style squat, it's going to stress your lower back a bit more.

wellbert

Chest up, butt back, knees out, head neutral-ish.

Chest down? Back pain cometh.

Low bar squats also give you more mechanical advantage over high bar squats and put less stress on your back.

withchaco

Back squat. I'll keep the chest thing in mind.

HelloDan

Back squat. I'll keep the chest thing in mind.

High or low bar?

How deep do you go?
Do your knees come past your toes?

withchaco

Back squat. I'll keep the chest thing in mind.

High or low bar?

How deep do you go?
Do your knees come past your toes?

lol i r teh noob, I had to look up the difference between high/low bar squat. I've been doing high bar.
I go all the way down, and I try not to stick my knees out too much (which I find hard with my extra small feet!).

Hendrix7

Low bar squats also give you more mechanical advantage over high bar squats and put less stress on your back.

It's the other way round. High bar squats put you in a more upright position so there is less stress on the back/hips and more on the knees.

As had been said, without a Video it's impossible to say anything really.

DavPul

Like everyone else, video or at least a pic near the bottom is needed. Maybe have someone at your gym check your form. Or hold your cameraphone. And make sure you keep your head up. If you can see your feet in the mirror, your head angle is too low.

medennison123

You have to remember to keep everything tight. Back, butt, hams, core and quads tight.

MoreBean13

Do you keep your abs tight?

Nath07

Have a look at youtube for Mark Ripptoes sqaut videos, they go into great detail and are very helpfull.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kawBY5p29fQ

cmaceluch

You're probably doing more of a "squat morning" which is a cross between a good morning and a squat. Try to drive up through your heels, butt and hips, which will put less of a strain on the back.

wjranch

Like everyone else, video or at least a pic near the bottom is needed. Maybe have someone at your gym check your form. Or hold your cameraphone. And make sure you keep your head up. If you can see your feet in the mirror, your head angle is too low.

LOVE this Pic!! LOL
Perfect Form (y)

and without reading the whole thread (apologies) but, I would say the issue is absolutely poor form, possibly coupled with an egotistical amount of weight?

Drop the plates... just use the bar... until you PERFECT your form.... Good Luck....
and remember.... Get LOW or use a Box... otherwise, ur wasting ur time!

wellbert

High bar is less force on the lower back?
There does seem to be some debate, on the internets about it. Though a quick glance would say that shifting the weight further down the lever would reduce the force.


low bar vs high bar, Mark Rippetoe's take:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mC5-g1Ugmgc

As someone with a bulging disc, I can't do high bar squats as heavy. Low bar squats aren't so much a problem. YMMV.

Gallowmere1984

The lower the bar is, the greater the leverage that your lower back has on the weight, thus the less resistance it runs into, even when you bend a bit forward. It's simple mechanics really. Think about it this way: if you were to hold the bar behind you, say against your lower back, the force of the weight on your lower back muscles would be non-existent, since at that point, the weight is parallel with said muscles.

Obviously, this example would result in you falling on your *kitten*, due to weight placement and balancing, but you get the point.

To the OP: do you have longer legs? From what I've seen, people with long legs and short torsos have issues with squatting without bending over a fair amount.

cmaceluch

The lower the bar is, the greater the leverage that your lower back has on the weight, thus the less resistance it runs into, even when you bend a bit forward. It's simple mechanics really. Think about it this way: if you were to hold the bar behind you, say against your lower back, the force of the weight on your lower back muscles would be non-existent, since at that point, the weight is parallel with said muscles.

Obviously, this example would result in you falling on your *kitten*, due to weight placement and balancing, but you get the point.

To the OP: do you have longer legs? From what I've seen, people with long legs and short torsos have issues with squatting without bending over a fair amount.

Untrue. I have very long legs for being 6'1 and have developed my squat to go ATG on my highbar, front and overhead squats. Just make sure you stretch like a son of a gun.

Gallowmere1984

The lower the bar is, the greater the leverage that your lower back has on the weight, thus the less resistance it runs into, even when you bend a bit forward. It's simple mechanics really. Think about it this way: if you were to hold the bar behind you, say against your lower back, the force of the weight on your lower back muscles would be non-existent, since at that point, the weight is parallel with said muscles.

Obviously, this example would result in you falling on your *kitten*, due to weight placement and balancing, but you get the point.

To the OP: do you have longer legs? From what I've seen, people with long legs and short torsos have issues with squatting without bending over a fair amount.

Untrue. I have very long legs for being 6'1 and have developed my squat to go ATG on my highbar, front and overhead squats. Just make sure you stretch like a son of a gun.

Keep in mind, I am talking about a newer lifter. It's a natural habit, and something they have to focus on not doing. Since the legs are longer, the weight has a tendency to go further behind their center of gravity, thus making them feel like they will fall over backward if they don't bend forward. It can definitely be overcome, but it's more of a conscious effort for someone with long legs. As you mentioned, stretching is pretty much mandatory for these people.

Hendrix7

The lower the bar is, the greater the leverage that your lower back has on the weight, thus the less resistance it runs into, even when you bend a bit forward. It's simple mechanics really. Think about it this way: if you were to hold the bar behind you, say against your lower back, the force of the weight on your lower back muscles would be non-existent, since at that point, the weight is parallel with said muscles.

Obviously, this example would result in you falling on your *kitten*, due to weight placement and balancing, but you get the point.

To the OP: do you have longer legs? From what I've seen, people with long legs and short torsos have issues with squatting without bending over a fair amount.

Shear force and compression force are two different things. Your back can handle a lot of compression (the bar sitting at the top of the spine) it shear forces which are responsible for most back injuries which increase the further you lean forward, such as in a low bar squat,

HelloDan

Shear force and compression force are two different things. Your back can handle a lot of compression (the bar sitting at the top of the spine) it shear forces which are responsible for most back injuries which increase the further you lean forward, such as in a low bar squat,

Exactly what I was trying to get at in my early post.

Ultimately without seeing the OP squat, we won't know for sure, but in my experience most people I see squatting put way to much shear on their back, either due to the squat motor pattern they have, mobility restrictions, or weaknesses.