BMR can NOT truly be calculated online

Verity1111

I think the BMR calculators give us a rough idea of where to start. Over time I figured out where I maintain my weight and what I have to do to lose it.....and I since I eat a very healthy whole foods, clean diet and take my vitamins (believing I have my nutritional needs met) I don't worry about what people say. I read differing opinions and I consider them and I go on with what works for me. There are some added benefits to being successful at weight loss besides the obvious and a big one is that people tend not to tell me I'm doing it wrong anymore.

Lol. Yes, true. I have no issues losing, but I just see other people who finally figured it out and end up at 1200 (which works for them) then people start insisting on them not gaining muscles mass. What if we don't want to gain muscle mass? I'm quite okay with what I have at the moment. lol That is my main point, don't assume someone needs a higher caloric intake unless you know their activity level and goal, as well as you shouldn't assume 1200 is "too low" if they already tried higher numbers and dont lose.

nikilis

some can eat as low as 150cals, Like this guy



*Please note that the calorie counts provided are guidelines for average lightly active adult spayed or neutered dogs or cats (1 to 7 years old receiving less than 30 minutes aerobic activity per day). The caloric needs of a particular pet may differ depending on such factors as lifestyle, genetics, activity level and medical conditions. Your pet will likely be fed fewer calories if you are attempting to reduce weight and improve fitness. Note that most indoor cats receive very little sustained aerobic activity and many dogs do not receive adequate daily physical activity. We recommend a structured routine exercise and nutritional program for both you and your pet.

needernt

Forget about bmr or bmi
Just stand in front of mirror if you are satisfiyed that's it. otherwise change your body shape.

Totally this!!!

The problem is people don't know HOW to do it!

I don't care about BMI . I don't count calories annd I didn't feel food part in mfp.
I just look at my body after 2 weeks. If no changes happened then Ichange my diet. less carbs mor protein etc..
I Don't believe on BMI and thoes things.

Snooozie

just throwing my 2 cents in from a relatively newbie perspective:

I only started a few months ago on MFP... and I have to admit when I started readng a lot of the forums, I was a little overwhelmed. I had (and have) a lot to learn, and there are as many opinions and ideas on what's right as there are members, and when you first arrive... well, I didn't know where to start, I only knew I had to do something to change my lifestyle before it was too late. But I honestly didn't know where or how to start doing that.

At MFP, I have learned SO much about nutrition in general, and how what I eat and how I move impacts my body and my weight loss journey, so I am very grateful for all the information and tools people take the time to post, whether it be calculators or suggested calories or TDEE's or the difference between simple and complex carbs... many of us are not knowledgable (which is how we ended up here) and for me, I need to learn all I can and read as much as I can, and then do some research on my own, and I decide from there what makes sense to me, with the knowledge I am gaining.

I don't assume what each person says is the "be all and end all", but without having the opportunity to learn, i can't change. So while I rarely post in the forums, and I may not pop into every thread that teaches me something to say thanks, and yes, I've seen both sides of the love/hate topics that can happen.. but I'm all grown up.. and I can can choose to move on or ignore some things while still gaining valuable knowlege and information on the site.

So for me personally.... well, knowledge is power, so this site is a powerful source of knowledge for me, and I appreciate anyone and everyone willing to share their ideas or opinions..

Just my 2 cents...

nikilis

or up to 900! like this guy:



so I guess friends, what I'm trying to say is that people, like cats and dogs, are different. each has its own way to calculate their caloric needs and their own unique intake.

but if a big dog ate like a little cat, he could die, or at least his dog nuts would shrivel up and the other dogs would call him a Pu$$y.

check your pets BMR before its too late!

Salkeela

Thanks for this thread.... I am one of those exceptions I think.

I'm 5'5", 49 years old and have been forced into a long term sedentary lifestyle by ill health.
(I was very active previously even if "chunky" in stature then.)

I currently weigh 135 lbs & reckon my daily energy expenditure is now about 1550 cals. I have been - happily - eating on average 1200 cals a day since joining MFP about 2 months ago. My averaged weekly loss is about 1/2 lb /week.

Some days I eat less than 1200, some days more. These days average out.... I can understand how a larger and more active person cannot imagine eating so little and not feeling hungry. Believe me the "old" pre-illness me could not have stayed on a 1200 diet without blowing it because I was so active at that time.

However I am NOT starving by eating this amount..... It is all about self awareness. It is also about being realistic about diet and exercise; and the interplay between these two and your current body state....

petiteLady89

If I could do this all over again (meaning my first day on mfp four months ago) I would start eating at my "supposed" maintenance calories and every few weeks make adjustments as needed. I, personally, feel like starting at bare bones kind of screwed me up. It's taken me quite a while to realize I don't need to starve my self to lose weight. I could have avoided lots of emotional turmoil, binging and emotional stress. From someone who used to suffer from an eating disorder when I was a teenager and still currently struggle with self esteem issues, it's hard getting over the fact that I CAN eat more to lose weight. I wish we could spread the word that eating 1200 calories and then burning off hundred of calories is NOT healthy. Just think of this as long term. Would you want to eat 1200 calories for the rest of your life? And then beat your self up because you splurged and "went over" by a few hundred, or thousand? That is a horrible way to live! I would rather lose 1oz a week and continue to eat like the thin me and be happy and stop beating my self up then lose several pounds a week and torture my self.

Yep, that was my rant for the day.

Salkeela

And I do agree with others who say it's better to eat nearer your daily requirements and to loose weight steadily - than to aim for a quick fix with an unattainably low daily intake.

1200 would have been too low for me this time last year to contemplate.

Today with my new situation it is right.

Not everyone on 1200 is aiming to loose weight quickly....

ironanimal

or up to 900! like this guy:



so I guess friends, what I'm trying to say is that people, like cats and dogs, are different. each has its own way to calculate their caloric needs and their own unique intake.

but if a big dog ate like a little cat, he could die, or at least his dog nuts would shrivel up and the other dogs would call him a Pu$$y.

check your pets BMR before its too late!

Yup...my dog is 22kg (48lbs) and eats about 1200 a day.

healthyKYgirl

I completely agree with the OP that the best way to work out your TDEE is actually to try eating at it. I have yet to find a calculator, or even a gadget, that gets anywhere close to predicting my TDEE. Something about me is off the scale (Logging? BMR? NEAT?) but what it is doesn't really matter, now that I have already found my TDEE through experimentation.

I didn't have the sense to do this first, as the OP did. I think the OP is making a perfectly valid point about BMR calculators, and it is a pity that anger against 1200kcal backlashes has masked this. Personally I recommend that people start at mfp's suggested maintenance and adjust from there, but just like 1200, that's just a random number.

Me too! My TDEE is a lot different than calculated. That was my point. I know 1200 is not okay for everyone, but my point is that you shouldnt say "eat more" when for all we know they may need to eat lower than most people for some reason. Every person has a different metabolism and it is controlled by a lot more physical ailments than just activity level and weight. Thank you for the reply. xo Im happy to hear you finally found your TDEE too!

Metabolism is controlled by hormones, calorie/food intake, muscle %, environment (cold/heat/weather), your weight, activity level, vitamin and mineral deficiencies, and it changes to a slight degree daily. So even with a doctor's visit, it's not 100% accurate unless you get measured daily, and experimentation is a good thing, but something to consider, if you are vitamin deficient and that's impacting your metabolism then your metabolism may read low, but you may need to eat more to get more vitamins/nutrients to start it working properly again, and by eating less and less you end up exacerbating an underlying unknown condition. Therefore, you should have things checked out by a doctor if you continue to have to eat less and less to lose weight to the point you are at < 1200 calories like some people on here.

Blueberry09

If you take BMR as your bottom basement never eat below that number and your TDEE as your ceiling never eat above it number then you can start playing in the middle. See what works and it takes weeks to find out if any particular number is working not a couple days of trial then bounce off to another number.

A voce of reason - even if the BMR is an estimate!

Oishii

Something about my body/logging/diet means that I have to eat over 2500 kcal to not lose. A BMR prediction would only put me at 1336kcal, which would be half or less of my TDEE, which is one definition of 'starvation', so for me, a calculated BMR is not significantly better than 1200.

If I had had the guts and common sense when I started mfp to just log what I was eating (I was maintaining whilst eating family sized slabs of Cadbury's Dairy Milk on a daily basis) I would have realised 1200kcal was way too little. None of the calculators would have done that. I think starting at 1200 and adding would be very challenging, but if people started from what they were already eating, or maintenance on mfp, an experientially derived TDEE would be more reliable than any calculator.

nikilis

Heres the problem. lets say that the safe intake range for all heights / weights is 1000-2000 for women (it sort of is, but not exactly but close enough, anyways)

1200 calories or less is at the most 20% of this figure if all heights and weights and intakes = even distribution.

so when you say "its ok for people to eat less than 1200"

---

for 80% its not. so the statement is 2 1/2 times more incorrect than it is correct.

Just to be clear, I didn't say its not ok, I just stated the percentage that roughly in a simple world it would be ok for.

so when someone makes a statement that is only at best true for 20% of the population, people go WAIT A MINUTE, did you check your BMR because theres an 80% chance that their statement / intake is wrong.

if you took any range, 1400-1600, 1600-1800 in the same way, it would also only be correct for 20%

the accuracy of BMR when including a body fat percentage (Katch-McArdle) is around 80%, so although its not perfect its 65% more accurate than a guess. if you were to guess, the guess should be 1500, because thats the average.

so its either guess a number, or BMR!

so yeh 1/5 or (less statistically) can eat 1200 or below, but as its at the bottom end, people are trying to make sure they didn't get there out of a lack of information, and just through MFP stopping them from trying to loose 5kg a week.


*yes yes, its more complex than that. but FK it, you get my drift.

CoderGal

BMR is a estimated rate that can be calculated...

I met people who thought along the lines of what you are saying though. Ones who are convinced they are special snowflakes who will gain weight easier then everyone else in the world (sorry if that sounds harsh, I was once a special snowflake). Then I convinced them to let me give them a number much higher then what they have and stick with it for one month even though they'd 'gain on more' or would 'get fat if they ate that'. Some of them were convinced they had metabolic problems when they later found out they did not. All of them complained every day of the way until they realized it worked. All of them shut up.. And I was once in that boat of people too. And then I met people in the same boat as me currently, explaining everything to everyone trying to convince them to try it and they also have hundreds of people who have tried it and it has worked for. I haven't met a single person yet where it hasn't worked the way I explained it to them. When you eat low calorie diets, your RMR well be suppressed (the ones doctors well figure out, so you can in fact find out if your BMR is actually repressed). But there are ways to speed that up. And following a moderate deficit as opposed to a large one helps. The initial, temporary weight gain some people have can be caused by so many good, healthy, explainable things.

There's a reason why so many people follow the BMR standard. Because there's science to back it up. And then they stumble on the science that explains why they couldn't eat more without gaining weight before. And then it all starts to make sense. And then you don't feel like writing an essay to every single person who stubornly argues with you like you once did. Try it, do it correctly, do it as accurately as you can, and you'll see.

Sarauk2sf

I am not sure why there is much point getting worked up about someone's BMR being totally accurate whichever way it is calculated. They are not - its an estimate just like everything else in the equation including exercise calories, TEF, NEAT, food intake. But, you have to have a starting point - after that, tweak it based on actual results. The best estimate of your TDEE (as BMR is a small piece of the puzzle) is your actual results. I have found mine to be pretty spot on when compared to online calculators, Others, not so much.

neverstray

It takes a little time to understand TDEE, BMR and RMR, and the other things. I think the easiest advice to give someone, is to simply use what MFP provides, and then adjust up or down from there.

I don't see why this is so hard to do. But, it seems like it is almost impossible for people. But, if you take a slow and methodical approach to it, you'll find that point.

If you MFP sets you at 1300 to lose 1lb per week, and you lose 2 lbs, you can maybe go up 100 caories. The idea is to find the point where you are getting the results you want. If you are not losing any weight at 1300, adjust it to 1200. And see how that goes. I'm not sure about going below 1200. People say it's unhealthy. I don't have enough knowledge about that to make a judgement, so my advice would be to see your doctor, tell him/her that you plan to eat less than 1200 calories per day based on the fact that you are not losing weight eating 1200 per day, and see what he/she suggests. Maybe you have a different problem than calories in/out. I don't know.

But, slow and steady wins the race. It sets you up for the long term if you take a more slow and steady approach. By the time you hit your goal, this has become your lifestyle.

Oishii

It takes a little time to understand TDEE, BMR and RMR, and the other things. I think the easiest advice to give someone, is to simply use what MFP provides, and then adjust up or down from there.

I don't see why this is so hard to do. But, it seems like it is almost impossible for people. But, if you take a slow and methodical approach to it, you'll find that point.

If you MFP sets you at 1300 to lose 1lb per week, and you lose 2 lbs, you can maybe go up 100 caories. The idea is to find the point where you are getting the results you want. If you are not losing any weight at 1300, adjust it to 1200. And see how that goes. I'm not sure about going below 1200. People say it's unhealthy. I don't have enough knowledge about that to make a judgement, so my advice would be to see your doctor, tell him/her that you plan to eat less than 1200 calories per day based on the fact that you are not losing weight eating 1200 per day, and see what he/she suggests. Maybe you have a different problem than calories in/out. I don't know.

But, slow and steady wins the race. It sets you up for the long term if you take a more slow and steady approach. By the time you hit your goal, this has become your lifestyle.

The problem comes when you lose too much at the recommended intake, not too little, IMHO. I got scared after losing over 2lb a week when mfp thought I should be losing 1lb, but I suspect the damage was done. Trying to get back to eating enough I ended up with hot flushes, following which blood tests showed I was anaemic. So I have a reason to believe that starting from finding your TDEE via experience, preferably from a high starting point (eg mfp maintenance) is the healthiest option.

cmriverside

I just want to say thanks to nikilis, CoderGal, and Sarauk2sf for having the patience to fight the good fight.

For several years I answered these types of threads with disiplined, rational, reasoned, arguments. I am tired. I've been here too long and have see too many of these threads to even try to argue anymore. Every once in a while, I'll spend time with someone new to help them understand how the site works; but for the most part I figure let Darwin's Theory take its course.

This OP seems to want to argue the special snowflake theory. I loved nikilis's logical, statistical counter-post.

Sara and CoderGal and nikilis, keep up the good work. Wine at my house later.

CoderGal

It takes a little time to understand TDEE, BMR and RMR, and the other things. I think the easiest advice to give someone, is to simply use what MFP provides, and then adjust up or down from there.

I don't see why this is so hard to do. But, it seems like it is almost impossible for people. But, if you take a slow and methodical approach to it, you'll find that point.

If you MFP sets you at 1300 to lose 1lb per week, and you lose 2 lbs, you can maybe go up 100 caories. The idea is to find the point where you are getting the results you want. If you are not losing any weight at 1300, adjust it to 1200. And see how that goes. I'm not sure about going below 1200. People say it's unhealthy. I don't have enough knowledge about that to make a judgement, so my advice would be to see your doctor, tell him/her that you plan to eat less than 1200 calories per day based on the fact that you are not losing weight eating 1200 per day, and see what he/she suggests. Maybe you have a different problem than calories in/out. I don't know.

But, slow and steady wins the race. It sets you up for the long term if you take a more slow and steady approach. By the time you hit your goal, this has become your lifestyle.

One thing I'll add to this comment is I put in to lose a lb a week when I was 30 lbs heavier and it brought me to 1200. I, being ignorant, used the calculator to determine my weight. What the calculator didn't realize is, my fat%, some other things, and most notably I guess is while I was a complete sedentary blob who spend her day with her eyes into algorithms, I spend a lot of time toe tapping, and leg shaking. I managed to burn more then the estimated values because my NEAT was higher, because I have restless legs feel like I constantly need to be shaking something :P

Yanicka1

Your logic is flawed--the most acceptable LOW POINT is going to cause hormonal changes that will skew the scale number. Dieting and super high deficits = higher cortisol = more water weight = less weight LOST on the scale than is actually true = distorted picture of your true TDEE = further undereating when you could eat more and get results.

I think you have a good idea but I'd rather start the other way around--with the highest acceptable number and see how close it comes. Then adjust. You're not going to gain any significant amount of weight in 2-4 weeks.

How do you figure? If someone has a BMR of 975, or an RMR of around there lets say, then 1200 is above their low point. Also, if your RMR is 975 how is 1200 a "high deficit" smh. That is flawed. Plus, as I said, the point is that people should be able to do as they wish because they know what works for them better than anyone else usually.

If someone has a BMR that low.....the LAST thing I would suggest is to eat 1200 calories and doing even more damages. Sheesh that is the best way to be sure to gain the weight back.

californiagirl2012

I'm sorry, but I am so annoyed by all the BMR BS. BMR could be totally different from online. I started my diet at 1200 for a day or two and upped it 100calories per day until I found where I maintain weight. To lose I just subtracted some from that, upped my exercise, and ate back my exercise calories almost every time. Then people try to tell me I should not have eaten 1200 calories. It is funny because it worked for me and I lost tons of inches, not just lbs. I also only stayed there for a few days and slowly bumped myself up as high as my calories could go to still lose. Unless you see a Dr. for a BMR oxygen/gas test, you don't know your real BMR and it can differ by hundreds of calories, so before you tell people to eat less, eat more, or calculate their BMR and they need to exercise harder, not eat less, realize these calculators are not 100%. I have read stories about people with BMRs under 1000, crazy, but true. I don't recommend anyone eat that, but I also will re-iterate what I keep telling people, which is maybe you shouldn't say "can't" "won't work" "you must" unless you know, please. Lots of advice is bad advice and if you don't know for sure it is often better to say "I would" or "maybe you could try". I have people come to me freaking out stressed and confused because they don't know what to do as they gain on 1500 calories but are advised this is their "BMR". For all we know it could be 1000calories. Just saying.

P.S. BMR and RMR are not the same either.

BMR and RMR are mostly the same, except for the fact that BMR is going to be a slightly more accurate reading. However, both play a role in the process of weight loss and weight maintenance.

I totally agree with you in that the online estimate are not accurate. I was lucky enough to find a more accurate estimate over a year ago and and that helped me and then the DXA scan I got recently matched it, although I know a lab where you blow into the tube would have been the most accurate. It doesn't matter, I finally found what worked for me.

1200 is such a stupid number to get stuck on. What you need to eat for a deficit is relative to your RMR. If you are short you really don't have much room for up compared to the 1200. If you are taller you will have a higher RMR and can go up or down and still be in a deficit (way above 1200) so you can lose no matter what. All that matters is a calorie deficit.

To tell everyone eat more is wrong.

To tell everyone to eat less is wrong.

To find the exact amount of calories for you to be in a sustainable calorie deficit is correct. Some people can handle a deeper calorie deficit than others. Some people have emotional eating disorders and it comes into play. Even a small deficit puts your body in a state of flux with hormones and such and everyone is different.

You just need to find the correct calories for YOU to be healthy and sustainable and still lose weight. It might require some experimentation and tremendous patience. You can always notch up and down by 100 until you find what is sustainable and still allows you to lose weight.

Anyone can do this at any age. There really is no mystery. I used to think my metabolism was broken, low thyroid, adrenal fatigue, menopause, stress (well stress is certainly a factor in managing hunger hormones). I did the frustrating diet yo-yo for 15 years and finally achieved my dream at age 50 and have been maintaining for over a hear now (I'm almost 52). I finally realize thyroid medicine and everything else to address my myriad of age related health issues was not a magic pill. It all comes down to calories for weight loss and exercise for building your lean body mass (especially weight lifting). You cannot out exercise too many calories.

Too many changes at once can be hard on some people. I've always eaten healthy so it easy for me to simply eat less. Eating at a calorie deficit is hard on people; even a small deficit puts your body in a state of flux with hormones and such. Everyone is different. Some people can handle a deeper calorie deficit than others, this is not right or wrong, it just is. Stress in your life affects your hunger hormones; lack of sleep, fatigue, job stress, family stress, financial stress, etc. Add in emotional eating issues and it gets even more complicated. Most people can only handle so much change/stress at once, they try to do too much and fail. Sometimes it might be a better strategy to eat at maintenance and make some small changes first, it really depends on how much stress you are taking in at the moment.

CoderGal

Your logic is flawed--the most acceptable LOW POINT is going to cause hormonal changes that will skew the scale number. Dieting and super high deficits = higher cortisol = more water weight = less weight LOST on the scale than is actually true = distorted picture of your true TDEE = further undereating when you could eat more and get results.

I think you have a good idea but I'd rather start the other way around--with the highest acceptable number and see how close it comes. Then adjust. You're not going to gain any significant amount of weight in 2-4 weeks.

How do you figure? If someone has a BMR of 975, or an RMR of around there lets say, then 1200 is above their low point. Also, if your RMR is 975 how is 1200 a "high deficit" smh. That is flawed. Plus, as I said, the point is that people should be able to do as they wish because they know what works for them better than anyone else usually.

If someone has a BMR that low.....the LAST thing I would suggest is to eat 1200 calories and doing even more damages. Sheesh that is the best way to be sure to gain the weight back.

After counselling hundreds of people and getting things to work for them. I disagree by allot.

Also, this:

WinnerVictorious

Also, this:

d'oh! i was going to change my avatar to that tomorrow.

CoderGal

I just want to say thanks to nikilis, CoderGal, and Sarauk2sf for having the patience to fight the good fight.

For several years I answered these types of threads with disiplined, rational, reasoned, arguments. I am tired. I've been here too long and have see too many of these threads to even try to argue anymore. Every once in a while, I'll spend time with someone new to help them understand how the site works; but for the most part I figure let Darwin's Theory take its course.

This OP seems to want to argue the special snowflake theory. I loved nikilis's logical, statistical counter-post.

Sara and CoderGal and nikilis, keep up the good work. Wine at my house later.

Thank you! I know exactly what you mean. I'm just getting my second wind back to blow all the snowflakes away haha.

I just get so overwhelmed by it sometimes. But then a nerve gets hit when I see a rare completely lost trusting innocent person lead astray by anything anyone tells them and I don't think it's fair. When all gets said and done, don't trust anyone, do your research, look at the research with a critical eye and try to look outside the box at the variables that aren't there. Allot of the time the opposite can be proven true if you leave out or add a variable. Make sure all the variables you look at include you. Are you a sedentary obese rat whose nutrient intake and macronutrient ratios mimic that of someone who only eats seeds? Perhaps not. Perhaps you have more variables that make things different. But in some cases, maybe that doesn't matter. Use your brain bits.

flechero

I started my diet at 1200 for a day or two and upped it 100calories per day until I found where I maintain weight.

the problem with this is the time frame... I can fluctuate a few lbs a day if I have high sodium for a day. If you change the word day to week you would be right on the money... except that I would use a TDEE calculator as the starting point.

Flowers4Julia

To the Original Poster! I totally get YOU on this one and it is so annoying to hear people battle it out. I think folks just wanna stir stuff up and "get heard" and I guess there is nothing wrong with that.....

So, I'm in your boat, there is no truly accurate way to measure BMR unless you can get to one of those testing situations and that costs money. So we all rely on these inaccurate calculators....:sad:

I could relate to the gal who said if she could do it over, she would eat at her maintenance calories (which is what brought us all here....) then take off a deficit....then you could figure out how you are going to lose! I love that, because "back in the day", that is what we were told to do! Figure out how many calories you've been eating! (no need to worry about BMR, TDEE, calculators, etc.)

I do know there are many scientists, researchers and mathematicians out there who work very hard to figure out how to help us and websites just like MFP I sincerely appreciate their work! Like you I am totally frustrated because I want things to be (not only easy) but scientifically correct!

So cheers to you OP, I got what you said, it makes sense and lets cross our fingers that we can continue our weight loss journeys peacefully :flowerforyou:

CoderGal

To the Original Poster! I totally get YOU on this one and it is so annoying to hear people battle it out. I think folks just wanna stir stuff up and "get heard" and I guess there is nothing wrong with that.....

So, I'm in your boat, there is no truly accurate way to measure BMR unless you can get to one of those testing situations and that costs money. So we all rely on these inaccurate calculators....:sad:

I could relate to the gal who said if she could do it over, she would eat at her maintenance calories (which is what brought us all here....) then take off a deficit....then you could figure out how you are going to lose! I love that, because "back in the day", that is what we were told to do! Figure out how many calories you've been eating! (no need to worry about BMR, TDEE, calculators, etc.)

I do know there are many scientists, researchers and mathematicians out there who work very hard to figure out how to help us and websites just like MFP I sincerely appreciate their work! Like you I am totally frustrated because I want things to be (not only easy) but scientifically correct!

So cheers to you OP, I got what you said, it makes sense and lets cross our fingers that we can continue our weight loss journeys peacefully :flowerforyou:

Where is this battle you speak of? I don't think that anyone on this thread has ever said BMR is completely 100% on the nose accurate? Or that it stays exactly the same all the time? In fact I haven't seen it anywhere on this site ever....in fact I haven't seen it anywhere online or in the existence of my life? What is it that isn't scientifically correct exactly? How is it not scientifically correct? Have you ever heard of a standard deviation?

love4fitnesslove4food_wechange

I just want to say thanks to nikilis, CoderGal, and Sarauk2sf for having the patience to fight the good fight.

For several years I answered these types of threads with disiplined, rational, reasoned, arguments. I am tired. I've been here too long and have see too many of these threads to even try to argue anymore. Every once in a while, I'll spend time with someone new to help them understand how the site works; but for the most part I figure let Darwin's Theory take its course.

This OP seems to want to argue the special snowflake theory. I loved nikilis's logical, statistical counter-post.

Sara and CoderGal and nikilis, keep up the good work. Wine at my house later.

and here I thought I was fighting the good fight. shucks. haha.

Verity1111

Thanks for this thread.... I am one of those exceptions I think.

I'm 5'5", 49 years old and have been forced into a long term sedentary lifestyle by ill health.
(I was very active previously even if "chunky" in stature then.)

I currently weigh 135 lbs & reckon my daily energy expenditure is now about 1550 cals. I have been - happily - eating on average 1200 cals a day since joining MFP about 2 months ago. My averaged weekly loss is about 1/2 lb /week.

Some days I eat less than 1200, some days more. These days average out.... I can understand how a larger and more active person cannot imagine eating so little and not feeling hungry. Believe me the "old" pre-illness me could not have stayed on a 1200 diet without blowing it because I was so active at that time.

However I am NOT starving by eating this amount..... It is all about self awareness. It is also about being realistic about diet and exercise; and the interplay between these two and your current body state....

This. I also am only 5'4" and my maintenance is not much higher than the 1550 you mentioned, yet my BMR is calculated as 1550 online?! NO WAY. If I ate much higher than that I would gain weight, not lose.

Verity1111

If I could do this all over again (meaning my first day on mfp four months ago) I would start eating at my "supposed" maintenance calories and every few weeks make adjustments as needed. I, personally, feel like starting at bare bones kind of screwed me up. It's taken me quite a while to realize I don't need to starve my self to lose weight. I could have avoided lots of emotional turmoil, binging and emotional stress. From someone who used to suffer from an eating disorder when I was a teenager and still currently struggle with self esteem issues, it's hard getting over the fact that I CAN eat more to lose weight. I wish we could spread the word that eating 1200 calories and then burning off hundred of calories is NOT healthy. Just think of this as long term. Would you want to eat 1200 calories for the rest of your life? And then beat your self up because you splurged and "went over" by a few hundred, or thousand? That is a horrible way to live! I would rather lose 1oz a week and continue to eat like the thin me and be happy and stop beating my self up then lose several pounds a week and torture my self.

Yep, that was my rant for the day.

Yes, but some people don't need more than 1200 when on a diet and some only burn 1000 as their BMR. For people with lower BMR they can eat less and most likely it would be easier than someone who has a BMR of say 1400.