madcow lifters... what assistance work are you doing?

jacksonpt

For those of you who are doing (or who have recently done) the madcow 5x5 program, what assistance work did you do each day? Anyone not following the program in this area? I know I probably shouldn't change the program as it's boxed, but it's missing one of my favorite lifts (pull-ups), and most of the assistance work they have programmed I hate (sit-ups? really?). I'm probably going to start this program when my shoulder is fully healed, but for now I'm bored and tired of the "how many cals did I burn vacuuming" threads... so lets talk lifting!

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erickirb

I do very little assistance work, mainly due to limited time. I do add in weighted pull-ups to Wednesday. and at the end of Monday and I do a drop set of tricep push downs, and on Friday do a drop set of bicep curls.

ArroganceInStep

What happened to your old program?

I think Madcow is missing vertical pulls, dips, shrugs, and single leg movements. I'd probably focus on those for accessory (and arms of course).

Other than that since when I tried it it felt a lot like 5x5, I'd probably end up doing the exercise and variations. Bench Press would become Decline, Flat, and Incline. Squat I'd mix in Pause Squats and Front Squats. Deadlift I'd also hit deficit pulls and stiff legs. Overhead I'd alternate between a standing press and seated PBN. Finally with rows I'd probably switch between Pendlay, Tbar, and Kirk rows. With all the time (and food and sleep) in the world I'd love to do all of them each workout, and hit vertical pulls, pipe work, and single leg stuff on the weekends. That's never going to happen though, so it'd likely be some kind of rotation, maybe doing two of the exercises per workout.

How taxing are pullups on you? Given what I understand to be your level of fitness, have you considered doing them as your warmup? Then you can do them every day (though you wouldn't be going for PRs with it). A friend of mine does that with pretty good success, he is pretty small though so ymmv

jacksonpt

What happened to your old program?

Still have it, still an option, but since I never know as much as I think I know, I'm looking at going back to an established program (which I'll tweak, lol). Part of it is that I need something new to get excited about. I don't genuinely enjoy lifting, so I need something to get me into it again... and a new program/routine is great for that.

I think Madcow is missing vertical pulls, dips, shrugs, and single leg movements. I'd probably focus on those for accessory (and arms of course).

*snip*

Other than that since when I tried it it felt a lot like 5x5, I'd probably end up doing the exercise and variations.

Vertical pulls - yes. Dips are part of the scheduled accessory work. Shoulders and single leg movements are also missing.

It is based on a 5x5 program, but progressive (each set getting more weight) which I think I'll like. Especially if I could find a way to build in a few other lifts (overhead press, upright rows, pull-ups mostly).

How taxing are pullups on you? Given what I understand to be your level of fitness, have you considered doing them as your warmup? Then you can do them every day (though you wouldn't be going for PRs with it). A friend of mine does that with pretty good success, he is pretty small though so ymmv

hmmm... never thought about doing some other lifts with lighter weight as warm-up. Not seeing PRs in them isn't ideal, but I'd probably be OK with it as long as I saw progress in the program's core lifts. It's a relatively short program, which would help too.

ArroganceInStep

I was perhaps looking at the wrong bit but I thought it was
acc legs and abs M
acc abs W
acc pipes abs and chest F

or something like that.

Be careful about jumping around too much, it'll be hard to see the progress you want if you keep changing (but I'm sure you know that already).

OHP is already in there on Wednesday no?

Also, you like upright rows? I hate them. I'd suggest Kirk Rows over them by far, but to each their own.

jacksonpt

Maybe there are different versions?

The one I have has:
Monday: squat, bench, row... assistance work: hypers and situps
Wednesday: squat, incline bench, deads... assistance work: situps
Friday: squats, bench, rows... assistance work: curls, triceps pushdowns, dips


Looking into kirk rows...

ilovedeadlifts

This is roughly what I did:

Monday: Squat bench row then I'd do some pullups and maybe some pushdowns
Wed: squat overhead deadlift. then I did DB rows and abs
Fri: squat bench row. then curls and one other assistance excercise.

About midway through the cycle, on wednesday I started deadlifting first. Then squats were done off a box, just to add variety.
i kept things pretty basic and at the minimum. I think you've got a pretty good setup in the post above me.
Just add in some pullups on whatever day you want in addition to the rows or deads. you should be fine just dont go overboard

erickirb

Maybe there are different versions?

The one I have has:
Monday: squat, bench, row... assistance work: hypers and situps
Wednesday: squat, incline bench, deads... assistance work: situps
Friday: squats, bench, rows... assistance work: curls, triceps pushdowns, dips


Looking into kirk rows...

My Wed has OHP instead of incline

ArroganceInStep

Maybe there are different versions?

The one I have has:
Monday: squat, bench, row... assistance work: hypers and situps
Wednesday: squat, incline bench, deads... assistance work: situps
Friday: squats, bench, rows... assistance work: curls, triceps pushdowns, dips


Looking into kirk rows...

First, what deadlift said. Pullups, basically, whenever you want. Second, incline bench on Wednesday should be overhead press. If you're going to incline do it on Monday or Friday imo.

jacksonpt

Maybe there are different versions?

The one I have has:
Monday: squat, bench, row... assistance work: hypers and situps
Wednesday: squat, incline bench, deads... assistance work: situps
Friday: squats, bench, rows... assistance work: curls, triceps pushdowns, dips


Looking into kirk rows...

My Wed has OHP instead of incline

That makes more sense to me...

ArroganceInStep

Looking into kirk rows...

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/kirk_karwoski_rows

Basically half upright row half shrug. I like them a lot better than full uprights, but I recognize that's probably mostly personal preference.

That makes more sense to me...

http://stronglifts.com/madcow-5x5-training-programs/
Is where I got madcow from. I think OHP over Incline is the FAR superior choice.

ilovedeadlifts

I agree. I really liked overhead as opposed to incline.

with inclines I think I would have beaten myself up too much because I could move significantly more weight in an incline than a strict overhead press

jacksonpt

Inclines are something I want to work on though as it's a weak spot in my physique (I feel stupid saying that, the fat weakling that I am).

Maybe I'll take the progressive approach (which is really the appealing part of madcow) and adapt it to my own set of core lifts. Oh well... got lots of time to think about it at this point.... after squads/chins/rows this morning, I got on the bench and did some bar work (no plates)... could still feel a twinge in my shoulder. So while my shoulder is feeling 90% is day-to-day life, seems like it's still a ways off from being ready for any serious lifting.

FitBeto

bizzump for reading later at hizome