Aggressive - right & wrong way? (Ms. Impatient)

muth3rluvx2

Hey all - I've been reading up on alot of posts regarding calorie intake and aggressive approaches. I am looking to be on the aggressive side, primariy because for my height, bone structure, what *should be* my muscle tone, etc etc etc - I am in really bad shape. Not only do I need to lose lbs (although not alot), I'd say 90% of it is a conversion from fatty cells to muscle. I'm a fat small person. Hehe. Now, let me also state that I have - by sheer necessity - and excruciatingly sedentary life-style. I literally spent TWELVE HOURS sitting on my couch yesterday... working. I spent a grand total of 10 minutes stair stepping at the end of the night because my brain fried and I was determined to end my day under my count.

So - with the aggessiveness in mind, I set my calorie counter originally at 900 and after a couple of days, realized that there's no way I would end the day on that no matter what. I then upped it to 1000. Some days I can swing this, some days I can't. I'll feel like I can up my calories when I'm in better shape and more active. But I've not lost anything yet and I am still very frustrated.

BTW - my body is accustomed to starvation diets, so it doesn't go into that mode anymore. I could still not eat and lose weight. But I'm trying to do this the right and healthy way this time. How can I get my system on the go? I'm reading about other people having too low of a count and losing 5 lbs the first week....how come I'm not????

Thanks all!

ps: I eat all throughout the day... just not alot and I watch what it is.... usually.

pkgirrl

I think the most important thing for you to do is up your cals to at least 1200 a day, even if you don't eat the exercise cals on top (I know there's a lot of controversy over this, but I usually don't and it works fine for me). It may feel like your body is used to this level of dieting so it doesn't seem like you're going into starvation mode, but this probably means your body is in starvation mode almost all of the time, which will make it really hard to lose. Once your metabolism is functioning normally I think you'll start to see some more results.

As far as toning up goes there's really only one way, you gotta work those muscles! Personally I hate weight lifting, but I've found free running and tae kwon do have done wonders for my muscle tone, so you just gotta find something you like and stick to it!

nursevee

Oh I definately agree with the above noter. Your calories are wayyyy too low. I think starvation diets and being overly aggressive will ultimately turn on you - are you able to maintain this lifestyle for good??? To maintain you will need to make this decision very carefully or else it will pile back on and the effort will be null and void. 1200 calories is decent because it's manageable if you're careful and you think out your intake carefully. If your issue is not so much weight as muscle then you really should be measuring yourself and doing more exercise. I realise how easy it is to be latent but working out need not be done in a gym. There are some great workouts involving weights that can be done at home. Resistance bands are also really good.

Dom_m

I completely agree with the other comments. I was doing what you're doing (sorta). Came here and got told to eat more. I tried a combination of eating more and doing less gym (I was on about 1200 cal / day from food and maybe 1500 at the gym, and over 6 months I only lost about 5 lb). I took that up to 1400, then 1800 then 2000 cal / day from food and took gym down to around 600-1200 and lost 15 lb in 5 weeks. Go figure.

The first couple of weeks felt like I was eating ALL the time.

nolachick

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/23912-links-in-mfp-you-want-to-read-again-and-again

please read

muth3rluvx2

Okay, I read some of this and calculated from my suggested BMR (1200) to my TDEE (whatever that is?) and got 1440. One of the posts suggested that to lose 2 lbs a week, that's a subtraction of 1000 cals a day from your TDEE number.

Which means even at 1000, I'm consuming twice as many cals as I should be in order to lose 2 lbs a week. It doesn't even put me at 1 lb a week. It has me at 0.7 lbs a week.

By the way - on the days that I can't stay under 1000, I usually do hit around 1200. A whoppin' 200 cal. difference. I think that might be a bowl of cereal. lol... and eating more is what got me here in teh first place.

I do some sort of exercise every day AND my heart/lung health are not good (20 years smoking). My actual 30 minutes a day that I *plan on working out* is going to take longer than I'd hoped to get up to. I spend 2 days doing something stretchy like yoga, 2 days doing some heavy cardio like jump rope or stair running, and the other 2 days I do something a bit more fun and a combo of strength & cardio like a kick-box jazzercise or something. Mostly what I need to work up to, first, is endurance. I have none.

Now, if I don't eat and I'm out in my yard (and this is what I do in the summer) doing my yard work - which usually involves shovels and rocks - I'll lose 15 pounds in a few weeks. As long as I'm out there for 6+ hours. I have NEVER EVER been able to lose weight while still eating (I don't mean this literally - but it would be about every 2-3 days and something very small). In fact, I think that's what got me started on "starvation diets". It was the only thing that worked. Of course, this is history speaking. You can't change history but can certainly work for a better future. I'd just like to see some initial results. Even if there's a stall after the first 5 lbs - just would like to know that this will work for me.

ivykivy

I noted you signature. If you're already at 22% bodyfat there is no way you can lose 2lbs per week especially since you say you are used to starvation diets. I think that is a unrealistic expectation.

Banks/Boss posted a thread called called Guide to calorie deficits. You may want to consult that one.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/61706-guide-to-calorie-deficits?hl=guide+to+calorie+deficits

Nikiki

ok I have bad news. #1 your body doesnt get used to starvation diets. If it did, you would already be at your goal weight and you wouldnt gain it back. #2 You're small, and BECAUSE You're so small its going to be difficult for you to drop pounds quickly. I have read in many places on other websites & in books that you shouldnt attempt to lose more than 1% of your body weight per week through diet. I'm 180 lbs so I'm looking to lose 1.8lbs this week. You're only 130 lbs so thats 1.3 lbs per week.

Now you specifically said you need to transfer the fat you have into muscle, and you can't do that by not eating, when exercise without giving your body enough to eat you'll start losing muscle as your body breaks it down for fuel. As your body breaks down muscle your metabolism slows so that anything substantial you DO eat is stored imediately as fat for reserves. Dont get me wrong, starvation mode doesnt mean you wont lose weight at all, if you dont eat you will lose weight, its what happens when you start eating again that you're going to be hurting.

So step one: EAT! you're doing it right by eating small meals throughout the day just increase the calorie count on those meals. I dont know what exactly you should be eating because you're smaller than I am so if you have access to one, I'd recomend going to a nutritionist. They can acurately test your BMR (the internet tests are not accurate, they're just calculators, every person is different and it depends on what you enter into it) and figure out how much food youshould be eating. Make sure you have something after you workout, if you dont your metabolism will slow because your body just burned up all the energy it has and wasnt replenished. Its going to take a few weeks for your body to recover from not getting enough food.

Good luck!

muth3rluvx2

I noted you signature. If you're already at 22% bodyfat there is no way you can lose 2lbs per week especially since you say you are used to starvation diets. I think that is a unrealistic expectation.

Banks/Boss posted a thread called called Guide to calorie deficits. You may want to consult that one.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/61706-guide-to-calorie-deficits?hl=guide+to+calorie+deficits

Thank you so much for the specific link, Ivy. That was very helpful. And, could you clarify why 2lbs/week is unrealistic at 22% body fat? So, what I'm getting - either way - is I don't get to lose the amount I want and its going to take me longer than apparently alot of people. * sniffles* no fair.

Questfor250

I strongly suggest eating what MFP suggests and then give and take on eating calories earned on exercise. 1200 minimum for women is a must. Once My wife picked up her calorie count she started losing. It doesn't make sense to us but the numbers speak for themselves.

BrendaLee

I noted you signature. If you're already at 22% bodyfat there is no way you can lose 2lbs per week especially since you say you are used to starvation diets. I think that is a unrealistic expectation.

Banks/Boss posted a thread called called Guide to calorie deficits. You may want to consult that one.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/61706-guide-to-calorie-deficits?hl=guide+to+calorie+deficits

Thank you so much for the specific link, Ivy. That was very helpful. And, could you clarify why 2lbs/week is unrealistic at 22% body fat? So, what I'm getting - either way - is I don't get to lose the amount I want and its going to take me longer than apparently alot of people. * sniffles* no fair.

A body needs a certain amount of calories to function- you want your body to function, right? You can't treat your body like crap and expect it to perform as you want it to. It just doesn't work that way. Your thinking seems to have gotten skewed somewhere along the way.

If you've been doing starvation diets for a while, then chances are your metabolism is out of whack, and that should be your first concern- getting that straightened out. That means eating more, not less.

Iceprincessk25

To gain more muscle you are going to have to eat.......1000 calories a day is not gonna do it for you. When you go into starvation modes you start to break down the muscle tissue you are so desperately trying to gain.

SHBoss1673

A body needs a certain amount of calories to function- you want your body to function, right? You can't treat your body like crap and expect it to perform as you want it to. It just doesn't work that way. Your thinking seems to have gotten skewed somewhere along the way.

If you've been doing starvation diets for a while, then chances are your metabolism is out of whack, and that should be your first concern- getting that straightened out. That means eating more, not less.

Bingo, I wholeheartedly agree. If I were your trainer (and yes, I'm a trainer), first thing I would do is put you on maintenance for 6 weeks. And watch you gain about 6 lbs. Why? Because being on a diet so low in calories has essentially told your metabolism to shut down for the winter like an Ice Cream Stand in Wisconsin! It's possible to kick start it again, but it takes a little while, and until your body realizes it's ok to burn fat again, you're not going to have much luck.

Once you are back on track, I'd do all your measurements again and go from there. 22% body fat is not even close to bad for a woman, If that's your % then you need a small deficit (somewhere around 300 calories max), and learn patience as it's going to take a while to correctly work off all the fat you want.

Couple of things to note:

1) Fat doesn't turn into muscle, they are two completely separate forms of tissue, fat is fat, muscle is muscle, you can't turn fat into muscle and vice versa.

2) You burn fat by combining two concepts, the first is sufficient calories or the idea that the human body will see starvation as a trigger to store extra fat and to slow down the work done by organs, it also recognizes muscle as a problem when in starvation and starts to canabalize muscle for energy (making you smaller and fatter). The second is lean tissue. Exercise gives your body a reason to have more muscle, muscle is metabolically active, I.E. it burns calories even when you aren't working it, so it stands to reason, exercising and gaining muscle mass is good for helping with weight loss.

3) Planning goes a LOOOONG way. If you sit down one day a week and make a road map for the week, it makes things a lot easier. It's far easier to stick to your calories if you know which days you will work out. It's also far easier to eat the right amount if you set out a generic menu for your week and plan for extra calories the days that you work out. This only takes an hour or two, once a week, and can save you anguish and stress all week if you simply follow your own plan.

There's a lot of info out there on all this stuff,
if you go to the general area of messages and look at the sticky posts, there are quite a few that will help you out.

muth3rluvx2

Thanks everyone!

Well - so much for a "bikini" summer (as if, regardless!) huh? At least, not this year.

The metabolism/calorie intake/deficit concept is the one thing that has always stumped me - because it has to do with numbers and my comprehension of anything linear or mathematical is pretty shoddy, at best. :-p So, I REALLY appreciate everyone taking a minute to break it down to something more simple. I'm not an idiot, I promise. lol!

I'd love to read all the posts on all these topics AND when I'm on here, I'm not reading what I should be which are my text books. So, I'm probably being fairly redundant just because I don't currently have the time to go through all the posts and find the ones that might be pertinent to my questions - but eventually I will!!!! In the meantime, genuinely... thanks.

I need to find something on upping my workout capacity - I can only get in 5 minutes of intense (ie: jump rope/stairs) or 10 minutes of light (yoga/aerobics). If I could stick out a full 20 minute workout, I'd be thrilled! I also want to find out more about how you determine your metabolic rate... hopefully when I have a few more minutes, I'll find something posted about that too.

Hard to imagine that I used to be able to dance for hours (ballet & jazz classes, back to back for 3-4 hours, not to mention clubbing... lol) and now I can't keep up for 10 minutes. How sad.

1200 it is - and I'll find a day to plan AFTER mid-terms (about 2 weeks), and in there, schedule a specific block of time each week just for that. I may ask more questions about that, too. Planning things like that I don't have alot of practice in. Actually, it's not the planning so much as sticking to it. New habits and all.... (oh, and I think my maintenance is just over 1200.. like 1226 or something... but I could be misremembering).

muth3rluvx2

Bingo, I wholeheartedly agree. If I were your trainer (and yes, I'm a trainer), first thing I would do is put you on maintenance for 6 weeks. And watch you gain about 6 lbs. Why? Because being on a diet so low in calories has essentially told your metabolism to shut down for the winter like an Ice Cream Stand in Wisconsin! It's possible to kick start it again, but it takes a little while, and until your body realizes it's ok to burn fat again, you're not going to have much luck.

Once you are back on track, I'd do all your measurements again and go from there. 22% body fat is not even close to bad for a woman, If that's your % then you need a small deficit (somewhere around 300 calories max), and learn patience as it's going to take a while to correctly work off all the fat you want.

Will you be my buddy??? LOL
I wish I had a personal trainer. I could use someone to kick me in the rear and push me - keep me on track. I easily get lost in the day-to-day. AND - this is also an area that people need to learn self-accountability. Alot to learn. Gain 6 lbs.. ugh. But if that's where I gotta' start to do this right..... and if that's what happens, then at least I know I'm on track, even if I hate it.
I have a 30" waist - should be 23-24", thighs are 22-23" inch and I don't know what they should be, but not that! 16-18, maybe? hips are 38" - they won't go down but a few - 34" if I'm lucky. Not only broad to begin with but 2 kids... eh. (I plan to revisit this post!). My cals are at 1200 now - what would YOU recommend - if my memory is correct and they are only 26, 27 cals more? And off I go... not gonna' enjoy the first part of this ride. :-(

nolachick

Gain 6 lbs.. ugh. But if that's where I gotta' start to do this right..... and if that's what happens, then at least I know I'm on track, even if I hate it.

This article is ridiculously long but I think will help clear up a lot of things like why u have to gain before you lose.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/3047-700-calories-a-day-and-not-losing

muth3rluvx2

This article is ridiculously long but I think will help clear up a lot of things like why u have to gain before you lose.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/3047-700-calories-a-day-and-not-losing

eegads and yuk and even more importantly, thanks. Alot of similarities - except for the what is being eaten. I don't do fast food, high fat, etc. Too many simple carbs, but thats as bad as it gets as far as the what. The rest is pretty spot on. Going for serving 2 of my omelette. heh.

ivykivy

How tall are? That makes a difference too.

Hopefully Brenda & Banks/Boss answered your question about why 22% body fat trying to lose 2lbs per week isn't the best idea. I'll tell you I'm obese and 2lbs a week is impossible for me w/o a lot of exercise.

KatWood

I just wanted to say this has been a very interesting thread. When I read the original post I was very eager to add my two cents but having read on I am pleased to see that everyone has already said what I had planned to. Also, I just wanted to give a high five to the poster for being open minded and asking questions. Some people are really set in their ways and are not open to having their beliefs challenged, especially when it comes to their own bodies. Way to go and best of luck. Please keep us updated on your progress as I believe it could help many other people on this site who have had similar issues and questions.

Supermel

I'm impatient too! I so hear yah on how frustrating it is to feel like progress must be slow. I just keep reminding myself it didn't take a month to put my extra weight and fat on AND it won't take a month to get it back off. I've been terribly out of shape for years and am really working hard on getting back into things. While I may not be losing the pounds as fast as i have in the past when on 'plan' I see other results very quickly, a few inches off my waist almost immediately were gone, my skin cleared up and looks so much healither, i swear my hair is shinier, i feel better and have tons more energy and a brighter outlook AND my immunity is doing awesome so far this season. Just a few things you can look out for as you make changes that may help you feel better til the scale starts moving.

An aside, as someone getting back into exercise into the winter (normally an outside kinda gal too) I have seen great results with the Jillian Micheals 30 day shred. There are tons of posts on it, or feel free to pm me for more info ... I have seen tone and definition in places my body hasn't seen in a decade. Its only 20 minutes a day too.

muth3rluvx2

I just wanted to say this has been a very interesting thread. When I read the original post I was very eager to add my two cents but having read on I am pleased to see that everyone has already said what I had planned to. Also, I just wanted to give a high five to the poster for being open minded and asking questions. Some people are really set in their ways and are not open to having their beliefs challenged, especially when it comes to their own bodies. Way to go and best of luck. Please keep us updated on your progress as I believe it could help many other people on this site who have had similar issues and questions.

Thanks, Kat!

I am set in my ways and a big part of me is railing against all of this - particularly the initial weight gain requirement. But I also know that many times, when we are fighting against something that hard, there's a bit of denial going on there which then leads to hey, there's truth in this and you just don't like it!!! So... why beat around the bush. I can not like it all I want - that doesn't change the fact that it's probably all dead on and if I want to do this thing the right way in all honesty, then I need to follow the guidelines I'm given by those far more experienced and knowledgable than I am and literally get with the program. I'm getting too old to screw around. LOL!!! I have some BAAAD habits to overcome, and that right there is never fun. We have two choices - talking about where we want to be or doing it. I'm tired of talking about it (have been for YEARS!!!). It's time to do. I think that's the reason a site like MFP exists. To help people transition from teh talk to the act; not an easy thing.

I started a blog.. I was thinking the same thing about not being the only one like me and with so little knowledge about how to move forward. :-) Thanks for the support and I will keep my progress noted!