Is it possible that some people just can't get abs?

iorahkwano

I noticed a lot of people on here seem to have a hard time getting VISIBLE abs despite low body fat %, clean eating, lots of core training, weight-lifting etc. I don't have abs either, but it seems like a lot of people on here who should have them, can't seem to get them. Then other people post saying it was very easy for them. Is it possible some people's body types just can't create visible abs? Maybe apple-body types that store all the fat in the mid-section? Just wondering. I'm not really asking for myself, I know my diet could be better.

ninerbuff

Visible abs depend on how much body fat covers them. For some it's harder to attain because the midsection may be the last place they lose it. But I do believe everyone can attain them if their body fat % was low enough. How long they are attained will be based on keeping it at that level.


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iorahkwano

What body fat % should men and women aim for if they want visible abs? I don't really have a means of measuring body fat, but I know there are scales with metal foot prints in them that claim to measure it. The lowest body fat I've been (That I know of) was 18.5% because a health group came to my school and put my finger in some sort of clamp thing. That was the year I was training a lot in kickboxing and jiu jitsu.

Unknown

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Yogi_Carl

Where does the quest for visible abs end and the journey into anorexia begin?

MoreBean13

What body fat % should men and women aim for if they want visible abs? I don't really have a means of measuring body fat, but I know there are scales with metal foot prints in them that claim to measure it. The lowest body fat I've been (That I know of) was 18.5% because a health group came to my school and put my finger in some sort of clamp thing. That was the year I was training a lot in kickboxing and jiu jitsu.

I think for women the possibility starts around 19%, and will depend on how you carry your fat. If you're someone that carries your weight in your midsection, you may have to go quite a bit lower.

ETA: to the original question, I think it's technically possible for everyone, but may not be worth the sacrifices necessary for a lot of people- women in particular. I personally would not be willing to go so low BF% that I give up my curves to have visible abs.

jennaworksout

yes, i think genetics has alot to do with it as well ....??? and harder for females , not saying impossible, just harder
i'm 16.3% bf and do not have a 6 pack yet :grumble:

iorahkwano

I did mean "visible" abs! I corrected myself when I edited the post. I know everyone has abs under there somewhere.

Where does the quest for visible abs end and the journey into anorexia begin?

Exactly my thoughts! It's like we have to build muscle & eat a lot, then we're told we have to now eat very little and lose most of our fat I'm afraid my arms & legs will look disgustingly thin by the time one pair of abs starts to become visible...

ZozoMonster

According to some program I watched yesterday it is something to do with genes and is impossible for some people to get visible abs

geebusuk

Where does the quest for visible abs end and the journey into anorexia begin?

It's rare to see people with decent muscle be criticised as being 'anorexic' - but to be fair I'm probably more thinking the sort of Abs I want ('man abs', what with being a man ), while a lot of women would prefer a bit softer, just showing 'a bit of tone'.
I find it hard to believe that people couldn't get visible abs - everyone has the muscles and I can't believe if someone did a decent bit of exercise, then 'cut' to 6% body fat (for men, equivelent for women whatever that is) that they wouldn't have visible abs.

cwolfman13

I noticed a lot of people on here seem to have a hard time getting VISIBLE abs despite low body fat %, clean eating, lots of core training, weight-lifting etc. I don't have abs either, but it seems like a lot of people on here who should have them, can't seem to get them. Then other people post saying it was very easy for them. Is it possible some people's body types just can't create visible abs? Maybe apple-body types that store all the fat in the mid-section? Just wondering. I'm not really asking for myself, I know my diet could be better.

For one thing, I do believe genetics play a roll. Secondly, men build muscle easier/faster than women...the vast majority of women can't bulk without a lot of assistance and even then it's a challenge. Lastly, a lot of people...even if they're workingout aren't doing the right things to get the bodies they want. Women in particular seem to have an aversion to lifting heavy which is the only way to build those muscles and make them show, even if your at a pretty low body fat %. They could most certainly have a flat and toned tummy, but that doesn't mean those 6 packs are going to pop out.

There are a lot of ladies out there doing cardio to death and simply don't weight train the way they need to to build those muscles. Too many endless reps with low weight and too much isolation work. Those beautiful ladies who put on some muscle and have those nice visible abs didn't do it droaning away on a treadmill for two hours and doing crunches. Put the ab roller in the garage and lift heavy 3x weekly, full body compound routines. I wish I would have taken that advice months ago; I feel like I'm starting over.

wackyfunster

Depends a lot on how your body fat is distributed. I had a ton of abdominal fat when I started getting in shape, and it takes forever for guys to lose fat there, so I didn't start getting good visibility til around 10%, and even at 7% still had some fat on my lower abs (bottom 2 of six pack not clearly defined unflexed), despite visible chest/shoulder striations (which is total BS). I think one more round of bulking and cutting should get me to having a nice even body fat distrubtion, but this has taken a couple years of effort.

TL;DR: The quest for abs is like the search for the holy grail... difficult, but once you find it, you will LIVE FOREVER.

...ok, maybe that was a bad analogy.

SyStEmPhReAk

What body fat % should men and women aim for if they want visible abs? I don't really have a means of measuring body fat, but I know there are scales with metal foot prints in them that claim to measure it. The lowest body fat I've been (That I know of) was 18.5% because a health group came to my school and put my finger in some sort of clamp thing. That was the year I was training a lot in kickboxing and jiu jitsu.

Most men will start seeing abs at or below 10% BF. For women it's more, around 15% or so.

Genetics plays a roll in the shape of the ab muscle, therefore the definition and the ability to see a six pack vs a four pack. But generally speaking most individuals who train their abs, eat healthy, and have a low enough BF% will start to show abs.

The comment about anorexia, however is way off base.

etoiles_argentees

I don't know.... my belly always has definition but not abs. Sort of like this -

Capt_Apollo

two pretty good articles, in my opinion, on body fat, and abs.

http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2012/07/02/body-fat-percentage/

http://www.vicmagary.com/blog/uncategorized/truth-of-six-pack-abs/

Sublog

Its possible for all, but more difficult for some. Its a combination of fat mass over the abs and muscle size.

You can have very little fat but not have visible abs due to lack of muscle mass. In the end, its possible, but more difficult and time consuming for some. It took me the better part of 2 years to lose 150 lbs and see my abs. And I once had a 60+" waist.

So if I can do it, anyone can with the right amount of dedication and willpower and knowledge.

Cognito1025

I don't know.... my belly always has definition but not abs. Sort of like this -

Ummm, this is good. Damn near perfect.

Nataliaho

Very few people (maybe none) will have their bodyfat equally proportioned over their entire body. That is why the most accurate caliper measurements involve testing many sites over the body. So obviously the overall BF% to see visible abs (or ripped biceps etc) is going to vary from person to person, depending where their bodyfat happens to deposit. For me, I reckon I'll see a 6-pack before I'd see really lean sculpted arms and I'll never see a "thigh gap"...

petiteMom289

It was VERY hard for me. I was down to 100lbs and just barely started seeing my abs. I've since gained 8lbs and see no abs at all. I think in my case, it will take A LOT of hard work and dedication. I'm just not there right now. I just want to be healthy and fit. Maybe one day I will focus on getting abs. So to answer your question, yes, I think it might be harder for some than others. I carry my weight more in my upper body, especially mid section. So my body fat has to be very low. As apposed to someone who carries it in the lower body.

alyssamiller77

A couple thoughts I have on this subject as one who has a somewhat visible six-pack but not cut to the point that I'd like.

First, genetics: Different people put on fat differently. For most men their most stubborn fat (i.e. the last to go) is in the mid-section right around the very ab muscles we're talking about. For most women it's their thighs. However, this varies quite a bit.

Second, Body Fat %: The numbers I've read in many places for when Ab muscles start to show are 9% and below for men and 15% or below for Women. Again, the above consideration about genetics will affect this. In my experience with my own body, 9-10% is about where I start showing.

Third, Age: One thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet is age. As we get older it gets more and more difficult to get that chiseled or shrink wrapped look that is needed to get those model abs we see in all the pics. Skin becomes less resilient and adipose tissue (fat cells) tends to become "looser" as well.

Fourth, Skin Resiliency: As I said already, age can affect this. So can the amount of weight you were carrying before you lost it as well as how long you carried that excess weight. Especially in women this can be particularly problematic in the belly area. Skin just doesn't always return to it's previous state. Loose skin can make it much harder to get your abs visible. Things like smoking, excessive sun exposure and such can also impact your skin's resiliency.

Fifth, Muscle Mass: As you shrink down and loose the fat in your mid-section, you need the muscles behind it to have sufficient mass to become visible. The more mass they have the easier they will appear. Loose skin from weight loss requires additional muscle mass to compensate. It's easier for men than women to produce the type of muscle mass needed in most cases. Regardless if you're not doing strength training, in particular including movements that target your abs, your success will be limited.

So no, I don't think it's impossible for anyone, however there are a lot of factors that are common for many people that can make it much more difficult. So for some people it may be next to impossible and would require significant effort above and beyond the already difficult task of getting rid of the infamous last 10 lbs.

** EDIT ** If you want some additional information to help explain why it is so hard to lose that stubborn fat and give you some ideas to help, I really enjoyed Lyle McDonald's book "The Stubborn Fat Solution". I'm not following his protocols yet, but just the information he gives you is extremely helpful in terms of understanding why your body is doing what it's doing.

upgetupgetup

Definitely harder for women, and involves tradeoffs a man doesn't have to think about: get abs and lean legs, lose boobs and maybe menstruation. Unfortunately, the fat is there in case of babies, etc.

When you hit your mid-thirties, you'll probably want to keep some fat in your face, too, and as we all know there's really no choice in terms of where it comes off.

terracotti

personally I want a flat stomach, but even a flat stomach is hard to achieve (for me and some other girls, I bet) let alone abs. I'm guessing it also depends on your somatotype.

meggonkgonk

http://cdn.builtlean.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/body-fat-percentage-picture-men-women.jpg

To give you an idea of what to expect at what BF%'s

iorahkwano

I don't know.... my belly always has definition but not abs. Sort of like this -

Ummm, this is good. Damn near perfect.

I would love to have a stomach like that!

iorahkwano

A couple thoughts I have on this subject as one who has a somewhat visible six-pack but not cut to the point that I'd like.

First, genetics: Different people put on fat differently. For most men their most stubborn fat (i.e. the last to go) is in the mid-section right around the very ab muscles we're talking about. For most women it's their thighs. However, this varies quite a bit.

Second, Body Fat %: The numbers I've read in many places for when Ab muscles start to show are 9% and below for men and 15% or below for Women. Again, the above consideration about genetics will affect this. In my experience with my own body, 9-10% is about where I start showing.

Third, Age: One thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet is age. As we get older it gets more and more difficult to get that chiseled or shrink wrapped look that is needed to get those model abs we see in all the pics. Skin becomes less resilient and adipose tissue (fat cells) tends to become "looser" as well.

Fourth, Skin Resiliency: As I said already, age can affect this. So can the amount of weight you were carrying before you lost it as well as how long you carried that excess weight. Especially in women this can be particularly problematic in the belly area. Skin just doesn't always return to it's previous state. Loose skin can make it much harder to get your abs visible. Things like smoking, excessive sun exposure and such can also impact your skin's resiliency.

Fifth, Muscle Mass: As you shrink down and loose the fat in your mid-section, you need the muscles behind it to have sufficient mass to become visible. The more mass they have the easier they will appear. Loose skin from weight loss requires additional muscle mass to compensate. It's easier for men than women to produce the type of muscle mass needed in most cases. Regardless if you're not doing strength training, in particular including movements that target your abs, your success will be limited.

So no, I don't think it's impossible for anyone, however there are a lot of factors that are common for many people that can make it much more difficult. So for some people it may be next to impossible and would require significant effort above and beyond the already difficult task of getting rid of the infamous last 10 lbs.

** EDIT ** If you want some additional information to help explain why it is so hard to lose that stubborn fat and give you some ideas to help, I really enjoyed Lyle McDonald's book "The Stubborn Fat Solution". I'm not following his protocols yet, but just the information he gives you is extremely helpful in terms of understanding why your body is doing what it's doing.

This was great information! Thanks for that. I do think loose skin or loose fat cells may be the reason my abs are hiding. I was never fat or had kids, but I've always carried fat on my belly and had rolls, even when I was very thin. I think my stomach can't really snap back now that it's flat. The skin doesn't hang, but it's not tight or firm. I do have non-visible abs though. I can see certain muscle definition if I turn certain ways or if I lift weights over my head.

upgetupgetup

Third, Age: One thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet is age. As we get older it gets more and more difficult to get that chiseled or shrink wrapped look that is needed to get those model abs we see in all the pics. Skin becomes less resilient and adipose tissue (fat cells) tends to become "looser" as well.

Can you elaborate on this looseness and what to do about it please? Thanks

lornaloo3

Its possible for all, but more difficult for some. Its a combination of fat mass over the abs and muscle size.

You can have very little fat but not have visible abs due to lack of muscle mass. In the end, its possible, but more difficult and time consuming for some. It took me the better part of 2 years to lose 150 lbs and see my abs. And I once had a 60+" waist.

So if I can do it, anyone can with the right amount of dedication and willpower and knowledge.

I get you're saying you overcame lifestyle and maybe some genetic destiny here and while it's cool you managed to do it that doesn't mean everyone can. For one thing, you're a dude. Men need less body fat than women do, so you know we can have healthy cycles and whatnot. Plus, there are bodies that just will not go to that level of BF short of scary dieting extremes.

alyssamiller77

I can see certain muscle definition if I turn certain ways or if I lift weights over my head.

Then you really aren't very far off at all. Sounds like you're pretty much at that point where the remaining fat is crazy stubborn and it takes serious, sometimes extreme, work to get the last few pounds of fat off. Honestly, and this is just my opinion, I don't personally care for the look of a women with six pack abs. A flat stomach without all the ripples of the abdominal muscles is much more attractive in my book

alyssamiller77

Third, Age: One thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet is age. As we get older it gets more and more difficult to get that chiseled or shrink wrapped look that is needed to get those model abs we see in all the pics. Skin becomes less resilient and adipose tissue (fat cells) tends to become "looser" as well.

Can you elaborate on this looseness and what to do about it please? Thanks

Fat cells are "elastic" in a sense. As they fill with lipid material (stored as triglycerides) they expand. When we loose body fat, what we're actually losing is the lipid material stored in our fat cells (the cells themselves remain). A process called Lipolisys converts the stored Triglycerides to fatty acids and glycerol in our blood (which can then be used in other processes to generate energy for our muscles). As lipolysis occurs, the fat cells shrink. Subcutaneous fat cells sit between the skin layers and the muscles. The skin is connected to the muscles by a membrane called the Septae. As we get older, that septae becomes less elastic. So as the fat cells shrink, the septae doesn't pull the skin back as well and the end result is a "looser" fat layer between the muscles and skin.

As far as I know there's not really a whole lot you can do about it. It's just part of the aging process. The longer you go with a lower body fat %, the better your chances that the septae will eventually tighten and pull things back in. However, the older you are the less chance this will occur.

napson

thanks.

two pretty good articles, in my opinion, on body fat, and abs.

http://www.nerdfitness.com/blog/2012/07/02/body-fat-percentage/

http://www.vicmagary.com/blog/uncategorized/truth-of-six-pack-abs/

upgetupgetup

Third, Age: One thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet is age. As we get older it gets more and more difficult to get that chiseled or shrink wrapped look that is needed to get those model abs we see in all the pics. Skin becomes less resilient and adipose tissue (fat cells) tends to become "looser" as well.

Can you elaborate on this looseness and what to do about it please? Thanks

Fat cells are "elastic" in a sense. As they fill with lipid material (stored as triglycerides) they expand. When we loose body fat, what we're actually losing is the lipid material stored in our fat cells (the cells themselves remain). A process called Lipolisys converts the stored Triglycerides to fatty acids and glycerol in our blood (which can then be used in other processes to generate energy for our muscles). As lipolysis occurs, the fat cells shrink. Subcutaneous fat cells sit between the skin layers and the muscles. The skin is connected to the muscles by a membrane called the Septae. As we get older, that septae becomes less elastic. So as the fat cells shrink, the septae doesn't pull the skin back as well and the end result is a "looser" fat layer between the muscles and skin.

As far as I know there's not really a whole lot you can do about it. It's just part of the aging process. The longer you go with a lower body fat %, the better your chances that the septae will eventually tighten and pull things back in. However, the older you are the less chance this will occur.

Wonderfully clear explanation, even if the conclusion's depressing.

I've noticed this happening in myself (mid-30s). It really helps to be able to set realistic expectations.

Thank you.