Work out to tone but not bulk calves?

IronPlayground

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

Wrong

There's no such thing as "toning"

I think most people here kinda understand that, but "toning" is a simple one word to describe the 'building lean muscle that looks healthy yet not 'weight lifter large'..."
Like we all know that people don"t mean 1# muscles weighs more than 1# fat when they say "muscle weighs more that fat"

No, I think when most people talk about tonight they are talking about fat loss, potentially combined with some hypertrophy.

Muscle is lean by definition so you don't build lean muscle - you build muscle. And anyone who is worried about getting weight lifter large needs to understand how long it takes to gain even a small amount of muscle.

Some people... yes, even some women... do put on muscle easily. This women is saying that she has. I don't understand why you're going to try to tell her she hasn't or that that is not possible. And no, it doesn't take everyone a long time to gain even a small amount of muscle. It really doesn't. If you eat enough, and you work your muscles, and you are predisposed to put on muscle, you put on muscle. I'm so sick of everyone saying lift lift lift, you need to lift, you won't bulk up. I put on muscle from exercsing without any extra weights. I've been boxing for a year now, and my arms have gotten all huge and my shoulders have these big bulging vissible veins on them (not during or after working out, like permanently). WTF? And that's just from doing pushups and hitting heavy bags. I don't do extra strength training, and I won't because I know I WILL look like a weight lifter in 3 months.

Key phrase "if you eat enough". People, men or women, will not get "bulky" eating at a deficit.

I didn't assume she was eating at a deficit. Why train at all eating at a deficit? Seems counterproductive to damage tissue and not supply adequate nutrients for repair. I assumed she was eating at maintenance. Personally, I do put on muscle even eating at a deficit, but I get super lean and weak at the same time.

To preserve LBM while trying to decrease body fat. It's not counterproductive at all.

Yeah, but you aren't going to spend the rest of your life cutting bodyfat. People talking about lifting are talking about doing it as a permanent thing... even after they cut fat. So the problem of bulking is still there for anyone who has a predisposition to put on muscle... unless they lift but carefully restrict calories to the point where it is physically impossible to put on muscle... for the rest of their lives? Why would anyone do that? Why not just NOT lift and do lighter strength training instead.

Increased strength is still a factor. This has to do with the central nervous system not just building muscle. Also, increased bone density.

chrishgt4

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

Wrong

There's no such thing as "toning"

I think most people here kinda understand that, but "toning" is a simple one word to describe the 'building lean muscle that looks healthy yet not 'weight lifter large'..."
Like we all know that people don"t mean 1# muscles weighs more than 1# fat when they say "muscle weighs more that fat"

No, I think when most people talk about tonight they are talking about fat loss, potentially combined with some hypertrophy.

Muscle is lean by definition so you don't build lean muscle - you build muscle. And anyone who is worried about getting weight lifter large needs to understand how long it takes to gain even a small amount of muscle.

Some people... yes, even some women... do put on muscle easily. This women is saying that she has. I don't understand why you're going to try to tell her she hasn't or that that is not possible. And no, it doesn't take everyone a long time to gain even a small amount of muscle. It really doesn't. If you eat enough, and you work your muscles, and you are predisposed to put on muscle, you put on muscle. I'm so sick of everyone saying lift lift lift, you need to lift, you won't bulk up. I put on muscle from exercsing without any extra weights. I've been boxing for a year now, and my arms have gotten all huge and my shoulders have these big bulging vissible veins on them (not during or after working out, like permanently). WTF? And that's just from doing pushups and hitting heavy bags. I don't do extra strength training, and I won't because I know I WILL look like a weight lifter in 3 months.

Whoah - stream of consciousness...

First - you aren't bulky - not by most people's standards (I guess a lot of communicative issues stem from people having differing opinions on what constitutes 'bulky'). Bulging veins comes mainly from low body fat. I'm pretty confident you would not look like a weightlifter if you trained for 3 months.

Second - I stand by my advice that if she needs to 'tone' then the main thing there is fat loss. If she believes her calves are already big enough then she can simply stop working them.

3foldchord

I think most people here kinda understand that, but "toning" is a simple one word to describe the 'building lean muscle that looks healthy yet not 'weight lifter large'..."

.

Muscle is lean by definition so you don't build lean muscle - you build muscle. And anyone who is worried about getting weight lifter large needs to understand how long it takes to gain even a small amount of muscle.

I know muscle is lean, I was using an over abundance of descriptive words .. To kinda prove my point about it being wordy when phrased in exactitudeness.

ItsCasey

Yeah, but you aren't going to spend the rest of your life cutting bodyfat. People talking about lifting are talking about doing it as a permanent thing... even after they cut fat. So the problem of bulking is still there for anyone who has a predisposition to put on muscle... unless they lift but carefully restrict calories to the point where it is physically impossible to put on muscle... for the rest of their lives? Why would anyone do that? Why not just NOT lift and do lighter strength training instead.

If you don't want to gain weight, of course you have to ensure that you are eating at maintenance. But you would have to eat a huge surplus for quite some time, while training specifically for hypertrophy to get the kind of muscle growth you are talking about. That just does not happen in a few months OR on a normal diet OR a training program meant for strength, rather than mass.

As for continuing to lift heavy weights, there is still a limit to how much lean mass a woman is going to add. At some point, your strength gains come from CNS adaptations rather than piling on slabs of muscle. This is why you see really thin, lean women who are able to do incredible things with heavy weight.

For example:



This is a 44-year-old woman who weighs about 130 lbs. She's doing a barbell Turkish get-up with half her bodyweight (a very, very difficult thing to do). She also deadlifts 265 lbs. She is clearly not big and bulky. She's just freakishly strong. And she gets stronger by lifting increasingly heavy weights, not lighter ones. She could gain SOME muscle by eating more food. But the only way she's going to add huge amounts of muscle is by sticking needles in her butt.

tigersword

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

Wrong

There's no such thing as "toning"

I think most people here kinda understand that, but "toning" is a simple one word to describe the 'building lean muscle that looks healthy yet not 'weight lifter large'..."
Like we all know that people don"t mean 1# muscles weighs more than 1# fat when they say "muscle weighs more that fat"

No, I think when most people talk about tonight they are talking about fat loss, potentially combined with some hypertrophy.

Muscle is lean by definition so you don't build lean muscle - you build muscle. And anyone who is worried about getting weight lifter large needs to understand how long it takes to gain even a small amount of muscle.

Some people... yes, even some women... do put on muscle easily. This women is saying that she has. I don't understand why you're going to try to tell her she hasn't or that that is not possible. And no, it doesn't take everyone a long time to gain even a small amount of muscle. It really doesn't. If you eat enough, and you work your muscles, and you are predisposed to put on muscle, you put on muscle. I'm so sick of everyone saying lift lift lift, you need to lift, you won't bulk up. I put on muscle from exercsing without any extra weights. I've been boxing for a year now, and my arms have gotten all huge and my shoulders have these big bulging vissible veins on them (not during or after working out, like permanently). WTF? And that's just from doing pushups and hitting heavy bags. I don't do extra strength training, and I won't because I know I WILL look like a weight lifter in 3 months.

Whoah - stream of consciousness...

First - you aren't bulky - not by most people's standards (I guess a lot of communicative issues stem from people having differing opinions on what constitutes 'bulky'). Bulging veins comes mainly from low body fat. I'm pretty confident you would not look like a weightlifter if you trained for 3 months.

Second - I stand by my advice that if she needs to 'tone' then the main thing there is fat loss. If she believes her calves are already big enough then she can simply stop working them.

This. Bulging veins come from low body fat, regardless of muscle size. And you mentioned you get weak on a deficit. If you're getting weaker, you aren't building muscle, as building muscle will make you stronger. Maybe 1% of women naturally have the testosterone to build muscle easily, funny how they all seem to be on this site, and none if them ever have any of the other symptoms of excess testosterone... Funny, that...

RobynLB

Actually, I do have symptoms of high testosterone. High agression, high sex drive, thicker/more bodyhair, proportionaltely small breasts and hips, etc... I don't think it's all that uncommon.

And I am talking about being temporarily weak. I.e. if I am training hard and eating at a deficit, my performance suffers until I increase my calories to support my activity level. My actual strength is increased as soon as I have sufficient energy to use it.

ninerbuff

Some people mistake losing fat for building muscle. If your calves are actually getting bigger, it's because of your diet, i.e. you are eating at a surplus. If you are sure you are not eating at a surplus, then you probably have lost fat, so your muscles are more defined, and, thus, they merely LOOK bigger to you.

I've been lifting heavy for the past two years, and my entire body is smaller. My muscles are more noticeable because I have lost fat, but they have not grown in size. And while I am short and have a small frame, I am not a skinny person. I have a pretty athletic, gymnast-type body, like most women who claim they "build muscle easily." So this is not coming from one of those waif-like girls with sticks for arms and legs. And I am here to tell you, you are not going to look like a bodybuilder in three months just because you pick up some heavy weights a few times a week. If you are adding appreciable amounts of muscle, it is because you are eating too much.

I am so smitten with you right now.:blushing:

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

RobynLB

For example:



This is a 44-year-old woman who weighs about 130 lbs. She's doing a barbell Turkish get-up with half her bodyweight (a very, very difficult thing to do). She also deadlifts 265 lbs. She is clearly not big and bulky. She's just freakishly strong. And she gets stronger by lifting increasingly heavy weights, not lighter ones. She could gain SOME muscle by eating more food. But the only way she's going to add huge amounts of muscle is by sticking needles in her butt.
[/quote]

That is increddible!

theryan244

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

Not true!

Strength reps = 1-5
Hypertrophy reps = 6 - 15 <

---

Muscle gets bigger
Endurance reps = 15+

This isn't necessarily true either. Traditional strength training will do wonders for hypertrophy.

Women's legs tend to blow up when they get trained as opposed to men who usually have small lower bodies when compared to their upper body. This is likely due to androgen receptor density differences between male and females (density is high in the upper body for males and high in the lower body for females). Genetics play a role as well but the most important factor is training. So if you're calves are getting too big for your liking, don't directly train them of course.

Kmenczynski88

Some strong broscience in this here thread

Jrabbit321

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

That's kind of what I was thinking too.

Jrabbit321

Some people mistake losing fat for building muscle. If your calves are actually getting bigger, it's because of your diet, i.e. you are eating at a surplus. If you are sure you are not eating at a surplus, then you probably have lost fat, so your muscles are more defined, and, thus, they merely LOOK bigger to you.

I've been lifting heavy for the past two years, and my entire body is smaller. My muscles are more noticeable because I have lost fat, but they have not grown in size. And while I am short and have a small frame, I am not a skinny person. I have a pretty athletic, gymnast-type body, like most women who claim they "build muscle easily." So this is not coming from one of those waif-like girls with sticks for arms and legs. And I am here to tell you, you are not going to look like a bodybuilder in three months just because you pick up some heavy weights a few times a week. If you are adding appreciable amounts of muscle, it is because you are eating too much.

No, actually I stay under 1300 cals a day & I don't eat back my work out calories.

Jrabbit321

Lower your body fat %.

My body fat is only 18% which is in the athletic range.

Jrabbit321

[/quote]
This. Bulging veins come from low body fat, regardless of muscle size. And you mentioned you get weak on a deficit. If you're getting weaker, you aren't building muscle, as building muscle will make you stronger. Maybe 1% of women naturally have the testosterone to build muscle easily, funny how they all seem to be on this site, and none if them ever have any of the other symptoms of excess testosterone... Funny, that...
[/quote]

I have bulging veins all the time. They come & go throughout the day.

Jrabbit321

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

Wrong

There's no such thing as "toning"

I think most people here kinda understand that, but "toning" is a simple one word to describe the 'building lean muscle that looks healthy yet not 'weight lifter large'..."
Like we all know that people don"t mean 1# muscles weighs more than 1# fat when they say "muscle weighs more that fat"

No, I think when most people talk about tonight they are talking about fat loss, potentially combined with some hypertrophy.

Muscle is lean by definition so you don't build lean muscle - you build muscle. And anyone who is worried about getting weight lifter large needs to understand how long it takes to gain even a small amount of muscle.

Some people... yes, even some women... do put on muscle easily. This women is saying that she has. I don't understand why you're going to try to tell her she hasn't or that that is not possible. And no, it doesn't take everyone a long time to gain even a small amount of muscle. It really doesn't. If you eat enough, and you work your muscles, and you are predisposed to put on muscle, you put on muscle. I'm so sick of everyone saying lift lift lift, you need to lift, you won't bulk up. I put on muscle from exercsing without any extra weights. I've been boxing for a year now, and my arms have gotten all huge and my shoulders have these big bulging vissible veins on them (not during or after working out, like permanently). WTF? And that's just from doing pushups and hitting heavy bags. I don't do extra strength training, and I won't because I know I WILL look like a weight lifter in 3 months.

Key phrase "if you eat enough". People, men or women, will not get "bulky" eating at a deficit.

I didn't assume she was eating at a deficit. Why train at all eating at a deficit? Seems counterproductive to damage tissue and not supply adequate nutrients for repair. I assumed she was eating at maintenance- i.e. how most people live most of their lives. Personally, I do put on muscle even eating at a deficit, but I get super lean and weak at the same time.

I'm eating at a deficit & I am putting on muscles, my macros are usually pretty much on point as well.

Jrabbit321

Lower your body fat %.

Even lower than 18%?

Jrabbit321

Calf exercising without wights? Things like sprinting on your toes, tennis, etc.

I'll try that, thank you.

Jrabbit321

Generally speaking...

More Weight + Less Reps = Big Muscles
Less Weight + More Reps = Toned Muscles

I guess I would recommend lower weights and more reps.

Yes lean muscle is exactly what I mean. Thank you.

Wrong

There's no such thing as "toning"

I think most people here kinda understand that, but "toning" is a simple one word to describe the 'building lean muscle that looks healthy yet not 'weight lifter large'..."
Like we all know that people don"t mean 1# muscles weighs more than 1# fat when they say "muscle weighs more that fat"

Jrabbit321

Are you asian (judging from your profile picture)? Asians tend to have good genetics for calf development, try laying off the calf workouts and see how your calves look just from compounds.

Thank you, I'm going to try this for a few weeks & yes I'm Korean.

Jrabbit321

I just want to clarify that I'm not a big person. I'm only 5'4 & around 16-118 pounds & I don't eat more than 1300 cals a day. So I don't think it's a matter of me eating at a surplus or needing to lower my body fat.

llaskoske

That's always what I'd heard too.

Find out what Michelle Obama does. That is one toned lady! Her arms are awe inspiring.

Jrabbit321

That's always what I'd heard too.

Find out what Michelle Obama does. That is one toned lady! Her arms are awe inspiring.

Yes, she does look amazing!