Should we encourage the belief?

sissiluv

I am now legitimately curious to see if there is any correlation between, say, a higher rate of lieing later in life or mistrust in parents over something as simple as the parents following the Christmas culture of telling their kids Santa exists (Or the tooth fairy, easter bunny, even God depending on your religion or lack thereof).

My personal experience would say otherwise but that's just me.

CharRicho

I am now legitimately curious to see if there is any correlation between, say, a higher rate of lieing later in life or mistrust in parents over something as simple as the parents following the Christmas culture of telling their kids Santa exists (Or the tooth fairy, easter bunny, even God depending on your religion or lack thereof).

My personal experience would say otherwise but that's just me.

It's basically impossible to draw any causation from any correlation that might be found there, as it's impossible to control all the different factors that affect the development of children. To determine causation, you'd have to have a study in which all children were raised EXACTLY the same way, but half were lied to about Santa and half were told the truth, and there were no other differences between the parenting styles. This is clearly unrealistic.

It is my OPINION that there is no reason to ever deliberately outright lie to your children, adding in that my degree in is this field was because I believe it's an educated opinion, but it's not necessarily the only one or the absolute correct one. But it's certainly something that was discussed at length in a few of my classes, and it seemed to be the consensus among the other students that it was not a positive thing to do with your children.\\

As other people have pointed out, talking about St. Nicholas, and the spirit of Christmas (giving to others or Christ if that's your thing) is a much more positive way to share the same Christmas joy with your children.

ladymiseryali

My fiance and I aren't going to do the whole Santa thing. We'll explain what Santa symbolizes, but we're not going to tell our kid(s) that he's an actual person who breaks into our house and eats our cookies, then leaves gifts as collateral. lol

ninerbuff

NOT POSTING THIS PIC TO MOCK ANYONES BELIEVES. JUST TO MAKE A POINT

Everyone have their own believes. If somebody wants their kids to believe in Santa, whats the harm?

THIS.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

sunsnstatheart

Yeah but do you have kids? All these little ideal's change when you become a parent.

Unfortunately, people don't have to be educated on how children develop psychologically to become parents. In fact they don't have to be educated at all. If it were up to me, every parent would have to take a course.

That's a skillful dodge to a legitimate question. Asking if you are a parent prods at the central point of your experience level with children to see if you have the experience to back up your opinion. If not, is there any hard research to back up your opinion that a belief in Santa Claus harms children? You see, there are decades of mistakes and changes in psychology that causes many people to lack a trust in it as a solution, or as psychologists as experts on people, particularly when assertions are made that seem to defy the listeners' own experiences.

It wasn't intended to be a dodge at all. I thought it was clear from my answer that I do not have children.

You're right, there are clearly not decades of mistakes made by parents... :S Parents make no mistakes! That's why every parent has such an amazing relationship with their child, every parent is a positive influence in their child's life, no children grow up to be criminals or bad parents themselves... please.

That's an interesting use of a logical fallacy. Perhaps, you could provide a point when you get around to it?

sunsnstatheart

I am now legitimately curious to see if there is any correlation between, say, a higher rate of lieing later in life or mistrust in parents over something as simple as the parents following the Christmas culture of telling their kids Santa exists (Or the tooth fairy, easter bunny, even God depending on your religion or lack thereof).

My personal experience would say otherwise but that's just me.

It's basically impossible to draw any causation from any correlation that might be found there, as it's impossible to control all the different factors that affect the development of children. To determine causation, you'd have to have a study in which all children were raised EXACTLY the same way, but half were lied to about Santa and half were told the truth, and there were no other differences between the parenting styles. This is clearly unrealistic.

It is my OPINION that there is no reason to ever deliberately outright lie to your children, adding in that my degree in is this field was because I believe it's an educated opinion, but it's not necessarily the only one or the absolute correct one. But it's certainly something that was discussed at length in a few of my classes, and it seemed to be the consensus among the other students that it was not a positive thing to do with your children.\\

As other people have pointed out, talking about St. Nicholas, and the spirit of Christmas (giving to others or Christ if that's your thing) is a much more positive way to share the same Christmas joy with your children.

Never mind. You did reach a point. What you are saying is that it is your personal opinion that a belief in Santa Claus encouraged by parents harms children. You're certainly entitled to your personal opinion. Perhaps you will want to study the issue further, however, before claiming it as your professional opinion.

Best of luck.

BeachGingerOnTheRocks

*Imagining a scenario of a mom and son walking in a mall early December. Kid sees a line of happy and excited kids waiting to tell the nice man with the white beard what they want for Christmas. Little Timmy looks up and his mom and asks "Mom, can I go see Santa, too? Please? Look! I see George in line....Hi George! Please, Mom?" "Honey, Santa isn't real..."

Little Timmy kicks rocks and wonders why his mom is such a tool.*

So yes, my kids believe in Santa until they don't. Don't mess with happy childhood memories. Pretty sure I'm not scarred and don't have trust issues with my mother for that little holiday ruse. Pretty sure that I don't know anyone who has trust issues stemming from a belief in a jolly elf who gives them presents.

LMT2012

I don't do the entire "Santa" thing with my kids. They know who he is, but understand he is not real, just like Superman or Cartoons on TV. I have no problem with other people doing whatever they want with their kids though.

This. We never really played it up, but played along for a reasonable amount of time. I never found it one of the more fun aspects of having children. Shrug.

ninerbuff

No, I don't plan to lie to my children. Santa isn't a little white lie you tell them to not hurt them, it's a deliberate deception. You might think it's harmless but it's really not. All your children learn from it is that you don't always tell them the truth, they can't always trust you.

Sure, it's probably fun for them, but totally not worth it in my opinion. There are plenty of other ways to have fun with them.


I have a degree in psychology with a specialization in child and adolescent development.

Should one deliberately lie to a child if they have a face deformity and ask if they are ugly? I'd want to know how you handle that without hurting or dissuading the child. I'm not asking to mock, I'm asking because it does happen in real life.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

CharRicho

Never mind. You did reach a point. What you are saying is that it is your personal opinion that a belief in Santa Claus encouraged by parents harms children. You're certainly entitled to your personal opinion. Perhaps you will want to study the issue further, however, before claiming it as your professional opinion.

Best of luck.

When did I claim it as my "professional opinion"? That's not even my profession (currently studying forensic investigation and my previous profession is clinical research). I did study and discuss it extensively as part of my previous degree.

CharRicho

No, I don't plan to lie to my children. Santa isn't a little white lie you tell them to not hurt them, it's a deliberate deception. You might think it's harmless but it's really not. All your children learn from it is that you don't always tell them the truth, they can't always trust you.

Sure, it's probably fun for them, but totally not worth it in my opinion. There are plenty of other ways to have fun with them.


I have a degree in psychology with a specialization in child and adolescent development.

Should one deliberately lie to a child if they have a face deformity and ask if they are ugly? I'd want to know how you handle that without hurting or dissuading the child. I'm not asking to mock, I'm asking because it does happen in real life.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

"Santa isn't a little white lie you tell them so as not to hurt them"

Pretty sure I addressed how that was different in my original post. That you quoted.

Besides, I would hardly call any child ugly. Children are a beautiful wonderful thing, regardless of what they look like.

lachesissss

collingmommy

theres only one fat person that brings gifts, and his name aint santa!! lol!!

Actually, i think its perfectly ok for kids to believe, in my opinion, "santa" is the magic behind christmas, it stops being fun when u stop believing. kind of like a magic show, whats the fun in a magician if you know all the secrets? some things are best left alone.

My fiance stopped believing when he was 5 cause he seen his mom putting gifts under the tree,, so its our main goal to make sure that our little boy believes as long as he wants, children grow up to fast as it is.

dirtnap63

Yeah but do you have kids? All these little ideal's change when you become a parent.

Unfortunately, people don't have to be educated on how children develop psychologically to become parents. In fact they don't have to be educated at all. If it were up to me, every parent would have to take a course.

That's a skillful dodge to a legitimate question. Asking if you are a parent prods at the central point of your experience level with children to see if you have the experience to back up your opinion. If not, is there any hard research to back up your opinion that a belief in Santa Claus harms children? You see, there are decades of mistakes and changes in psychology that causes many people to lack a trust in it as a solution, or as psychologists as experts on people, particularly when assertions are made that seem to defy the listeners' own experiences.

It wasn't intended to be a dodge at all. I thought it was clear from my answer that I do not have children.

You're right, there are clearly not decades of mistakes made by parents... :S Parents make no mistakes! That's why every parent has such an amazing relationship with their child, every parent is a positive influence in their child's life, no children grow up to be criminals or bad parents themselves... please.

Physician, heal thyself.

Alohathin

No, I don't plan to lie to my children. Santa isn't a little white lie you tell them to not hurt them, it's a deliberate deception. You might think it's harmless but it's really not. All your children learn from it is that you don't always tell them the truth, they can't always trust you.

Sure, it's probably fun for them, but totally not worth it in my opinion. There are plenty of other ways to have fun with them.


I have a degree in psychology with a specialization in child and adolescent development.

Should one deliberately lie to a child if they have a face deformity and ask if they are ugly? I'd want to know how you handle that without hurting or dissuading the child. I'm not asking to mock, I'm asking because it does happen in real life.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

Why would it be lying if you told your deformed kid that he/she is not ugly?

I don't particularly have a problem with people raising their kids to believe in Santa, but I personally could not tell kids that he is real when I know he is not.

Besides, I want to raise my kids to be critical thinkers. To not accept anything without questioning it first.

sunsnstatheart

Never mind. You did reach a point. What you are saying is that it is your personal opinion that a belief in Santa Claus encouraged by parents harms children. You're certainly entitled to your personal opinion. Perhaps you will want to study the issue further, however, before claiming it as your professional opinion.

Best of luck.

When did I claim it as my "professional opinion"? That's not even my profession (currently studying forensic investigation and my previous profession is clinical research). I did study and discuss it extensively as part of my previous degree.

You, ma'am, made your point and then stated that "I have a degree in psychology with a specialization in child and adolescent development." You can attempt to parse words all you want but you made a clear implication that your opinion was professional and backed by your degree. You then subsequently dodged probing questions on that exact point, and have now backtracked.

Again, you are entitled to your personal opinion.

ninerbuff

Besides, I would hardly call any child ugly. Children are a beautiful wonderful thing, regardless of what they look like.

The thing about children is that they usually will tell the truth even if it's not in good taste or appropriate. :laugh:
So the question I asked was to see how you would respond to the child. Telling a child that they are a beautiful, wonderful thing, didn't address the question that they may have asked about their physical looks.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

CharRicho

Why would it be lying if you told your deformed kid that he/she is not ugly?

I don't particularly have a problem with people raising their kids to believe in Santa, but I personally could not tell kids that he is real when I know he is not.

Besides, I want to raise my kids to be critical thinkers. To not accept anything without questioning it first.

THIS.

Critical thinking is such an important thing that seems to have fallen by the wayside. I want to raise little scientists!

(That's mostly a joke, I want my kids to be whatever they want to be, obviously)

collingmommy

No, I don't plan to lie to my children. Santa isn't a little white lie you tell them to not hurt them, it's a deliberate deception. You might think it's harmless but it's really not. All your children learn from it is that you don't always tell them the truth, they can't always trust you.

Sure, it's probably fun for them, but totally not worth it in my opinion. There are plenty of other ways to have fun with them.


I have a degree in psychology with a specialization in child and adolescent development.

how many kids do you have?
I grew up believing that santa was real and i dont feel "lied to " by my parents.
in my opinion, teaching a kid about santa and the fun of the holidays, is just that, fun.. y take it away from a child that wants to believe in something bigger then themself? i enjoy seeing childrens faces when they see santa at the malls. I have no intention of taking fun and joy from my son or any other kid. Just saying. .

links_slayer

I believe in Santa Clause. Seriously.