Should I end my diet and start bulking?

djeffreys10

I need some more opinions on this, as I am having a hard time making up my mind. I have been doing a five day split lifting Monday through Friday. Also, I have been on a diet the last three weeks, eating 1350-1550 calories per day 5 days per week, and between 1800 and 2200 on the weekends. In that three weeks, I have gone from 170.2 lbs with a body fat of 17.5% to 164.8 lbs with a body fat of 14.37% this morning, according to 4 site skin fold measurements I have been doing and using this calculator: http://www.naturalphysiques.com/31. My plan was to continue my diet until my skinfold tests said 10%.

However, the Omron handheld at the gym is telling me I am at 10.8% body fat, and I had a trainer measure me this morning and he said 8.5%. I find that hard to believe given I still have a little flab on my stomach and some love handles. But he said that from looking at me, he would never guess I was much over 10%, because the only fat I have is that little bit around the mid section. He recommended I stop my diet and start eating a surplus and bulking.

So when is a good time to stop dieting and start bulking? How much faith should I put in the Omron over my skin fold measurements? I can't decide if I should loose 5-7 more pounds then start bulking, or if I should go ahead and get started on the bulk. What do you think?

Tricep_A_Tops

I would bulk since its winter and then start cutting for summer.

KANGOOJUMPS

now why the hell would you do that?

Gallowmere1984

If you're anywhere from 8.5-11% you are definitely in a good range to start working toward muscle increase.

djeffreys10

My goal was to get to 10% and start working toward increasing muscle again. I just don't know how much faith I should put in the omron handheld. If it is to be believed, I would just diet another week, maybe two tops. Then start going back to bulking.

dfquigley

In these cases there are 2 things I recommend.

1) Don't "bulk". It's not necessary to gain fat to gain muscle. Eat at a level to maintain your weight while making sure your protein levels are high enough to keep up with your workouts and add muscle.

2) Increase workout intensity. Harder weights, HIIT etc. This will stimulate more muscle growth.

What will happen as a result, is that you will gain muscle, but also continue to lose some body fat.

I have also found that this can help to change up the monotony of just cutting fat and can help against plateaus. I lost 50 pounds, and then just maintained and focused on fitness increases for a while. After that I went and lost another 10 pounds when I cut EASY, but didn't gain a pound while maintaining.

I'm now more ripped than ever, but have similar "belly flab" personal issues. Even other endurance athletes say "WHAT body fat" while I point to the bit of belly and love handle thickness I still have. It'll be off soon though.

Rather than "bulk" "cut" I recommend "maintain while gaining muscle" "cut" Much healthier than gaining fat, losing fat, which is not necessary if you nail your macronutrients right.

acogg

Love that site! It says I am at 14%, all the other circumference sites say 21%. Made my day, thanks!

waldo56

Can you see your abs flexed or unflexed?

If you can flexed you're at least in the 14% area.
If you can unflexed you're in the 10% or less area.

Good rule of thumb for bulking cutting, bulk until your abs start losing detail when flexed, cut until you start seeing them unflexed. Staying in that band should keep you in the ideal area for muscle growth, as well as always looking reasonably good.

Once you get down to 15% and lower, let the mirror (and/or photos) be your guide, visual estimation is every bit as accurate as any other method, and it almost never misses by a mile (8.5% to near 15%, at least one of those methods missed by a mile).

djeffreys10

In these cases there are 2 things I recommend.

1) Don't "bulk". It's not necessary to gain fat to gain muscle. Eat at a level to maintain your weight while making sure your protein levels are high enough to keep up with your workouts and add muscle.

2) Increase workout intensity. Harder weights, HIIT etc. This will stimulate more muscle growth.

What will happen as a result, is that you will gain muscle, but also continue to lose some body fat.

I have also found that this can help to change up the monotony of just cutting fat and can help against plateaus. I lost 50 pounds, and then just maintained and focused on fitness increases for a while. After that I went and lost another 10 pounds when I cut EASY, but didn't gain a pound while maintaining.

I'm now more ripped than ever, but have similar "belly flab" personal issues. Even other endurance athletes say "WHAT body fat" while I point to the bit of belly and love handle thickness I still have. It'll be off soon though.

Rather than "bulk" "cut" I recommend "maintain while gaining muscle" "cut" Much healthier than gaining fat, losing fat, which is not necessary if you nail your macronutrients right.

When I say "bulk" I was planning on eating at around 100 calories over maintenance, 2200-2500 calories per day depending on which calculator you believe. When I end my diet, I am going to slowly up my calories to around 2200 over the course of a week or two while still hitting my macros, and stay there for around 3 weeks to examine my progress. Then adjust if needed. I was going to up my protien from ~150 grams to ~175 grams, and figure out how I want to structure the fat and carbs when the time comes.

djeffreys10

Can you see your abs flexed or unflexed?

If you can flexed you're at least in the 14% area.
If you can unflexed you're in the 10% or less area.

Good rule of thumb for bulking cutting, bulk until your abs start losing detail when flexed, cut until you start seeing them unflexed. Staying in that band should keep you in the ideal area for muscle growth, as well as always looking reasonably good.

I can't see my abs at all. The thing is that is the ONLY place I have fat. None on my legs or arms. None on my back (I think, I can't see it very well). Well, and my love handles as well.

waldo56

Unless you are tiny or have a really weird metabolism, you will not gain weight eating 2500 cal/day or less.

I'm 6'1" 203 lb, and gain about 0.8 lb/week eating around 4K cal/day.

Beginners almost always undershoot their bulking calorie requirements the first time around.

MyChocolateDiet

In these cases there are 2 things I recommend.

1) Don't "bulk". It's not necessary to gain fat to gain muscle. Eat at a level to maintain your weight while making sure your protein levels are high enough to keep up with your workouts and add muscle.

2) Increase workout intensity. Harder weights, HIIT etc. This will stimulate more muscle growth.

What will happen as a result, is that you will gain muscle, but also continue to lose some body fat.

I have also found that this can help to change up the monotony of just cutting fat and can help against plateaus. I lost 50 pounds, and then just maintained and focused on fitness increases for a while. After that I went and lost another 10 pounds when I cut EASY, but didn't gain a pound while maintaining.

I'm now more ripped than ever, but have similar "belly flab" personal issues. Even other endurance athletes say "WHAT body fat" while I point to the bit of belly and love handle thickness I still have. It'll be off soon though.

Rather than "bulk" "cut" I recommend "maintain while gaining muscle" "cut" Much healthier than gaining fat, losing fat, which is not necessary if you nail your macronutrients right.

bumping for plateau info.

Tricep_A_Tops

In these cases there are 2 things I recommend.

1) Don't "bulk". It's not necessary to gain fat to gain muscle. Eat at a level to maintain your weight while making sure your protein levels are high enough to keep up with your workouts and add muscle.

2) Increase workout intensity. Harder weights, HIIT etc. This will stimulate more muscle growth.

What will happen as a result, is that you will gain muscle, but also continue to lose some body fat.

I have also found that this can help to change up the monotony of just cutting fat and can help against plateaus. I lost 50 pounds, and then just maintained and focused on fitness increases for a while. After that I went and lost another 10 pounds when I cut EASY, but didn't gain a pound while maintaining.

I'm now more ripped than ever, but have similar "belly flab" personal issues. Even other endurance athletes say "WHAT body fat" while I point to the bit of belly and love handle thickness I still have. It'll be off soon though.

Rather than "bulk" "cut" I recommend "maintain while gaining muscle" "cut" Much healthier than gaining fat, losing fat, which is not necessary if you nail your macronutrients right.

Everything you say is true, I did the same from last March thru Nov., but just finished a 2 + month bulk last week and gained 11lbs. I have already lost 3 of it since starting my cut last week and only have 2-3 lbs left to go. Its faster to add LM by bulking and cutting then it is to do what you are suggesting.

dfquigley

I can't see my abs at all. The thing is that is the ONLY place I have fat. None on my legs or arms. None on my back (I think, I can't see it very well). Well, and my love handles as well.

Since we all genetically store fat SLIGHTLY differently, the "flexed abs" guideline for body fat % is only a guideline at best,

I am the same way, very thin virtually everywhere, but then a bit thicker right over the abs and love handles.

I want to get professionally measured soon, but that is even only "so" accurate.

Some people need to get to 7-8% body fat AND be slightly dehydrated to see their abs.

waldo56

Can you see your abs flexed or unflexed?

If you can flexed you're at least in the 14% area.
If you can unflexed you're in the 10% or less area.

Good rule of thumb for bulking cutting, bulk until your abs start losing detail when flexed, cut until you start seeing them unflexed. Staying in that band should keep you in the ideal area for muscle growth, as well as always looking reasonably good.

I can't see my abs at all. The thing is that is the ONLY place I have fat. None on my legs or arms. None on my back (I think, I can't see it very well). Well, and my love handles as well.

If you can't see abs when flexed, you aren't close to 10%.

Other signs of 10%/near 10%, an adonis belt, sharp serratus muscles, details in your quads, some striations (especially shoulders, possibly chest), strong deltoid/bicep separation, strong vascularity in the arms.

dfquigley

Everything you say is true, I did the same from last March thru Nov., but just finished a 2 + month bulk last week and gained 11lbs. I have already lost 3 of it since starting my cut last week and only have 2-3 lbs left to go. Its faster to add LM by bulking and cutting then it is to do what you are suggesting.

It'll depend on goals too.

Someone who is very conscious of body image and fat may prefer to stay leaner and bulk slightly slower, or for someone like me who is an endurance athlete, the extra fat would have too much of a negative impact on my running and cycling and I'm better off going the leaner route.

Someone who doesn't mind the extra fat of bulking could do well enough going that route as well, I just prefer that they don't "dirty" bulk, which can do some harm as opposed to a cleaner bulk with a controlled caloric excess.

Tricep_A_Tops

Unless you are tiny or have a really weird metabolism, you will not gain weight eating 2500 cal/day or less.

I'm 6'1" 203 lb, and gain about 0.8 lb/week eating around 4K cal/day.

Beginners almost always undershoot their bulking calorie requirements the first time around.

I agree! I am cutting and eating 2,440 calories per day. Im 6"1, 227lbs. I was eating 3,500-3900 calories per day while bulking.

dfquigley

If you can't see abs when flexed, you aren't close to 10%.

Other signs of 10%/near 10%, an adonis belt, sharp serratus muscles, details in your quads, some striations (especially shoulders, possibly chest), strong deltoid/bicep separation, strong vascularity in the arms.

I've got an adonis belt going, sharp serratus when I flex, a LOT of detail in my quads, shoulder and leg striations and MAD vascularity in the legs and particularly the arms, lots of little veins I didn't even know exist are visible when at rest.

I still see no ab definition, except for an outline around them, where the fat gets thicker, even when pumped up after a workout and flexed

dfquigley

I agree! I am cutting and eating 2,440 calories per day. Im 6"1, 227lbs. I was eating 3,500-3900 calories per day while bulking.

One other limitation, given that I do a LOT of endurance sport, I'm not sure I could AFFORD the nutrition required to bulk as well I have a hard enough time taking in enough food as it is at times

Tricep_A_Tops

Everything you say is true, I did the same from last March thru Nov., but just finished a 2 + month bulk last week and gained 11lbs. I have already lost 3 of it since starting my cut last week and only have 2-3 lbs left to go. Its faster to add LM by bulking and cutting then it is to do what you are suggesting.

It'll depend on goals too.

Someone who is very conscious of body image and fat may prefer to stay leaner and bulk slightly slower, or for someone like me who is an endurance athlete, the extra fat would have too much of a negative impact on my running and cycling and I'm better off going the leaner route.

Someone who doesn't mind the extra fat of bulking could do well enough going that route as well, I just prefer that they don't "dirty" bulk, which can do some harm as opposed to a cleaner bulk with a controlled caloric excess.

My perfomance when I run has actually improved at 231 lbs then when it was at 220 lbs prior to my bulk. And bulking for 8-12 weeks and then cutting once in a while is not harmful. But yes, It does depend on his goals like you said.

djeffreys10

I am thinking the best way for me to approach this may be to start adding 200-300 calories per day to my diet every week. Over the course of 3-6 weeks, I will get my calories up to a better place for gaining muscle. And at the same time, I will be getting used to eating more. I just have a hard time eating clean and still getting much over 2000 calories. That would probably still net me another 2-5 pounds of weight loss during the transition.