More questions for runners

dobenjam

So I've finished my beginner 5k training program. I have a month until my race and I want to improve my speed before the race. I am looking at some "advanced" 5k training programs and i see more specific types of runs on different days.

A little background info. Up until now I have been using 5k trainer on my iphone and it just says run/walk. when I run I don't sprint but I definately work!

With these new plans they talk about "easy runs" and an easy run you should be able to talk casually with a partner. I don't gasp for air or anything, but even at only 6mph I am "focused" on my breathing and don't think I could hold a conversation.

Finally here are my questions...

1) On "easy" runs should I really slow to where I can have a conversation? It seems I may be walking fast at that point, or will I just get use to it.

2) Am I over training by working so hard? I gradually increase my pace through out every run until the end and I sprint for the last 1-2 min.

3) When it says things like 5x400, are those sprints?

4) Why can't I just run a 5k every workout and get better?

krisiepoo

YAY! Good for you, I hope you learn to love running as much as I do

1) Easy runs are supposed to be where you can hold a conversation. So if you start out walking fast, then do that and you'll gradually build up the ability to talk/run. I will sometimes sing along with a song. I'm sure people think I'm nuts but screw em

2) What you're doing are called "reverse splits" and many people swear by them. I personally start too fast and can't finish strong like that. although I always sprint the last .25 miles because I want to finish strong. It's a good skill to have

3) Yes. Sprint for 400 meters, walk, do again x5

4) you can, it'll just take longer if you don't do speed work

dobenjam

YAY! Good for you, I hope you learn to love running as much as I do

1) Easy runs are supposed to be where you can hold a conversation. So if you start out walking fast, then do that and you'll gradually build up the ability to talk/run. I will sometimes sing along with a song. I'm sure people think I'm nuts but screw em

2) What you're doing are called "reverse splits" and many people swear by them. I personally start too fast and can't finish strong like that. although I always sprint the last .25 miles because I want to finish strong. It's a good skill to have

3) Yes. Sprint for 400 meters, walk, do again x5

4) you can, it'll just take longer if you don't do speed work

Thanks for the advice and I do Love running... I think about it all the time. It is hard to make sure I don't increase my milage too quickly b/c I'd love to run everyday....

Is there anything wrong with me jogging and not being able to hold a conversation on "easy" run days? Wouldn't I eventually be able to hold a conversation at that pace? I ask because I don't enjoy walking nearly as much as running.

ThickMcRunFast

1) yes, slow down. You should learn several paces (easy, tempo, speed, race, etc).
2) Running negative splits is fine, its what most runners strive to do, but every run shouldn't be as fast as you can go.
3) Yup, sprint 400, rest, repeat
4) Because you get faster by forcing your muscles to adapt to a changing routine. Running one type of run is fine, but most runners will throw in different styles of running (hill repeats, sprints, fartleks, long runs, easy/recovery runs)

Congrats on your success.

Also, if you haven't, throw in some strength training.

krisiepoo

[/quote]

Thanks for the advice and I do Love running... I think about it all the time. It is hard to make sure I don't increase my milage too quickly b/c I'd love to run everyday....

Is there anything wrong with me jogging and not being able to hold a conversation on "easy" run days? Wouldn't I eventually be able to hold a conversation at that pace? I ask because I don't enjoy walking nearly as much as running.
[/quote]

You're not doing yourself any favors by running too fast. You'll have better long term results if you do easy days the way they're supposed to be done. Eventually you can speed up and you'll have a better base. Then don't walk, wog

fittertanme

hi there well you have done the hard work now but when your running all you want to do is run not talk you want to finish the run at the best time you can do and then next time try and beat that so dont worry just do your runs

LeenaRuns

In addition to the speed work, I would suggest longer runs as well. They'll improve your speed as well in a different way.

dobenjam

In addition to the speed work, I would suggest longer runs as well. They'll improve your speed as well in a different way.

I've heard this before, and I want to do longer runs. The only thing holding me back is fear of injury. I have been on the verge of shin splints and every once in a while take a few days off, do some exercises and stretches, and then pick it back up. I've been told not to increase distance by more than 10% per week. Until now I've been sticking strictly to the program but I'm good with longer runs. I may do some shorter runs so I don't go over the 10% increase and still have the longer run.

Codefox

Shin splints have been a constant issue for me and I recently seem to have beaten them. I ramped up my mileage way too agressive this past few months and I avoided injury. A few things you might want to try:

1) RICE - Rest, Ice, Compression, Elevate. Get some compression sleeves. Ice your legs after every run even if you don't hurt. Elevate them while you do.

2) I've started training for triathlons, in part because I believe the x-training will help me. I think as I've always focused on running, my other leg muscles and core have suffered which only helps contribute to injury. The biking strengthens other leg muscles and the swimming helps my whole body.

3) Diet - When I started ramping up my mileage 20% - 30% a week in November (note...um, don't do that, I was lucky ) I started focusing on the food that I felt my body needed to fuel its recovery. Protein & calcium is what I felt I needed more of and I started eating a couple servings of greek yogurt every day. I actually attribute my adherence to a healthy and well rounded diet to a big reason that I didn't injure myself.

I've been doing 25 - 30 miles a week now for 3 months with no problems. The compression, icing and diet got me up to that and I've recently added the triathlon training. In 4 weeks I've started to feel even better on my runs than when I was just running.

rmdaly

For the 5x400s, there are a few ways these can be done.

1) Decide what you want your pace to be at the 5k. If you want to do 8-minute miles, then do the 400s in 2 minutes or less.For a 10 minute mile, its 2 1/2 minutes. If you are doing them on the track, do a 400, walk or jog to the other side (200) and do another. Try to make all of them the same time.

2) Do them as hill repeats. Find a nice gradual hill that you can run up for 2 -2 1/2 minutes. Mark your starting point and run up for 2 - 2 1/2 minutes. Mark where you got to on the hill. Jog/walk back down to where you started and try to make that mark in the same time as the first for the next 4.

3) On a regular run, warmup for 5-10 minutes at a conversational pace, then run hard for 2 - 2 1/2 minutes. Jog/ walk for 1 -2 minutes and repeat until you have completed all 5.

3laine75

Shin splints have been a constant issue for me and I recently seem to have beaten them. I ramped up my mileage way too agressive this past few months and I avoided injury. A few things you might want to try:

1) RICE - Rest, Ice, Compression, Elevate. Get some compression sleeves. Ice your legs after every run even if you don't hurt. Elevate them while you do.

2) I've started training for triathlons, in part because I believe the x-training will help me. I think as I've always focused on running, my other leg muscles and core have suffered which only helps contribute to injury. The biking strengthens other leg muscles and the swimming helps my whole body.

3) Diet - When I started ramping up my mileage 20% - 30% a week in November (note...um, don't do that, I was lucky ) I started focusing on the food that I felt my body needed to fuel its recovery. Protein & calcium is what I felt I needed more of and I started eating a couple servings of greek yogurt every day. I actually attribute my adherence to a healthy and well rounded diet to a big reason that I didn't injure myself.

I've been doing 25 - 30 miles a week now for 3 months with no problems. The compression, icing and diet got me up to that and I've recently added the triathlon training. In 4 weeks I've started to feel even better on my runs than when I was just running.

I get shin splints too. This might be a stupid question but how does the compression work - do you do this while or after running?

dobenjam

Shin splints have been a constant issue for me and I recently seem to have beaten them. I ramped up my mileage way too agressive this past few months and I avoided injury. A few things you might want to try:

1) RICE - Rest, Ice, Compression, Elevate. Get some compression sleeves. Ice your legs after every run even if you don't hurt. Elevate them while you do.

2) I've started training for triathlons, in part because I believe the x-training will help me. I think as I've always focused on running, my other leg muscles and core have suffered which only helps contribute to injury. The biking strengthens other leg muscles and the swimming helps my whole body.

3) Diet - When I started ramping up my mileage 20% - 30% a week in November (note...um, don't do that, I was lucky ) I started focusing on the food that I felt my body needed to fuel its recovery. Protein & calcium is what I felt I needed more of and I started eating a couple servings of greek yogurt every day. I actually attribute my adherence to a healthy and well rounded diet to a big reason that I didn't injure myself.

I've been doing 25 - 30 miles a week now for 3 months with no problems. The compression, icing and diet got me up to that and I've recently added the triathlon training. In 4 weeks I've started to feel even better on my runs than when I was just running.

Great Advice! Thanks! I was icing my shins but not while elevated. I'll look into compression sleeves... should I wear them all the time or just while I run? I have a pretty healthy diet and I'm Protein heavy though I am set up to lose 2 lbs a week so I may not be eating enough to help prevent shin splints.

I was thinking of training for a triathlon as well to help with cross training but still keep cardio focused. In fact I signed up with a gym today for use of the pool and downloaded a training guide. I was going to wait until my race in march but maybe I'll go ahead and start.

bluefox9er

I did point #5. After finishing c25k, I consolidated running 5k's, speed was never an issue for me, my concern was,has and always will be running the distance and not speed...I am a slow runner.

However..the more miles you run, the faster you will become. speed work and HIIT are excellent techniques to build up speed, but make sure you don't increase your mileage by more than 10% each week.

Codefox

I get shin splints too. This might be a stupid question but how does the compression work - do you do this while or after running?

Both 8) Not a stupid question!

rybo

So I've finished my beginner 5k training program. I have a month until my race and I want to improve my speed before the race. I am looking at some "advanced" 5k training programs and i see more specific types of runs on different days.

A little background info. Up until now I have been using 5k trainer on my iphone and it just says run/walk. when I run I don't sprint but I definately work!

With these new plans they talk about "easy runs" and an easy run you should be able to talk casually with a partner. I don't gasp for air or anything, but even at only 6mph I am "focused" on my breathing and don't think I could hold a conversation.

Finally here are my questions...

1) On "easy" runs should I really slow to where I can have a conversation? It seems I may be walking fast at that point, or will I just get use to it.

2) Am I over training by working so hard? I gradually increase my pace through out every run until the end and I sprint for the last 1-2 min.

3) When it says things like 5x400, are those sprints?

4) Why can't I just run a 5k every workout and get better?

I have a bit of a different opinion than most of the advice given.

1) Yes, that's why its called easy. Over time your "easy" pace will get fater with the same percieved effort.
2) Probably not, but it's also not an optimal way to do things and running harder all the time increases your chance of injury.
3) It's not a sprint. If you can sprint for 5 400 M intervals, you are world class. It's defnitely a harder pace, but not a sprint. If it was a true sprint you would run one, and be wiped. And since you are just getting over a beginner program, speed work really shouldn't even come into play. Just keep running and building a base. Having a strong base will allow you to perform speed work to a level where it will be effective.
4) Cause that's not how it works. Well, at least for optimal performance. Keep most of your runs fairly easy. Run some a bit longer (up to 5 miles if you can) toss in a tempo run here and there, (1 mile easy, 1 mile comfortably hard, 1 mile easy) As you progress, expand the middle "comfortably hard" distance.

Amandatorie

1) On "easy" runs should I really slow to where I can have a conversation? It seems I may be walking fast at that point, or will I just get use to it.

I am even more of a beginner than you, but I've been told and agree with so far the idea that even if you're running at a pace so slow that you could walk faster, it's still running. And running is different on your body than walking. So yes, slow it down to where you can have a conversation, but stay running at that pace, don't go to walking.

dobenjam

So I've finished my beginner 5k training program. I have a month until my race and I want to improve my speed before the race. I am looking at some "advanced" 5k training programs and i see more specific types of runs on different days.

A little background info. Up until now I have been using 5k trainer on my iphone and it just says run/walk. when I run I don't sprint but I definately work!

With these new plans they talk about "easy runs" and an easy run you should be able to talk casually with a partner. I don't gasp for air or anything, but even at only 6mph I am "focused" on my breathing and don't think I could hold a conversation.

Finally here are my questions...

1) On "easy" runs should I really slow to where I can have a conversation? It seems I may be walking fast at that point, or will I just get use to it.

2) Am I over training by working so hard? I gradually increase my pace through out every run until the end and I sprint for the last 1-2 min.

3) When it says things like 5x400, are those sprints?

4) Why can't I just run a 5k every workout and get better?

I have a bit of a different opinion than most of the advice given.

1) Yes, that's why its called easy. Over time your "easy" pace will get fater with the same percieved effort.
2) Probably not, but it's also not an optimal way to do things and running harder all the time increases your chance of injury.
3) It's not a sprint. If you can sprint for 5 400 M intervals, you are world class. It's defnitely a harder pace, but not a sprint. If it was a true sprint you would run one, and be wiped. And since you are just getting over a beginner program, speed work really shouldn't even come into play. Just keep running and building a base. Having a strong base will allow you to perform speed work to a level where it will be effective.
4) Cause that's not how it works. Well, at least for optimal performance. Keep most of your runs fairly easy. Run some a bit longer (up to 5 miles if you can) toss in a tempo run here and there, (1 mile easy, 1 mile comfortably hard, 1 mile easy) As you progress, expand the middle "comfortably hard" distance.

Thanks, lots of good info here, and i did some additional research last night to better understand why it is important to do different workouts. I linked the article below. It is about using a heart rate monitor but what I really benefited from is why you should work out in different "zones". Thanks for all of the advice! Now to find a HRM, LOL.

http://www.runnersworld.com/running-tips/how-use-heart-rate-monitor?page=single

dobenjam

1) On "easy" runs should I really slow to where I can have a conversation? It seems I may be walking fast at that point, or will I just get use to it.

I am even more of a beginner than you, but I've been told and agree with so far the idea that even if you're running at a pace so slow that you could walk faster, it's still running. And running is different on your body than walking. So yes, slow it down to where you can have a conversation, but stay running at that pace, don't go to walking.

Great advice! I have already noticed my heart rate lowering throughout my runs and I'm sure it won't be long before I can run and converse. I'll take it down a notch and make sure I do my easy runs at the right pace. I think I'll add an extra day of running to help me with all of this. It is hard to do with only running 3 days a week.

Codefox

Thanks, lots of good info here, and i did some additional research last night to better understand why it is important to do different workouts. I linked the article below. It is about using a heart rate monitor but what I really benefited from is why you should work out in different "zones". Thanks for all of the advice! Now to find a HRM, LOL.

http://www.runnersworld.com/running-tips/how-use-heart-rate-monitor?page=single

There are lots of excellent running watches out there and most of them utilize HRM. Polar will give by far the best guidance using the HR while you run to guide your workout. Garmin I hear is pretty good but I love Polar. I have the RC3 GPS which is an integrated GPS/HRM. The RCX3 from Polar separates the GPS into a separate pod (I don't think I'd go that route)

Timex is coming out soon with the Run Trainer 2.0 and I think that would also be an excellent choice. I had the first Timex Run Trainer before the RC3 GPS and while it won't give you guidance during the workout itself, its a fine HRM/GPS watch that is super easy to use and you can design your own HR training around it.

scottb81

So I've finished my beginner 5k training program. I have a month until my race and I want to improve my speed before the race. I am looking at some "advanced" 5k training programs and i see more specific types of runs on different days.

A little background info. Up until now I have been using 5k trainer on my iphone and it just says run/walk. when I run I don't sprint but I definately work!

With these new plans they talk about "easy runs" and an easy run you should be able to talk casually with a partner. I don't gasp for air or anything, but even at only 6mph I am "focused" on my breathing and don't think I could hold a conversation.

Finally here are my questions...

1) On "easy" runs should I really slow to where I can have a conversation? It seems I may be walking fast at that point, or will I just get use to it.

2) Am I over training by working so hard? I gradually increase my pace through out every run until the end and I sprint for the last 1-2 min.

3) When it says things like 5x400, are those sprints?

4) Why can't I just run a 5k every workout and get better?

1. The purpose of easy runs is to build aerobic capacity. This is most effectively done at heartrates between 60 and 80% of max. Somewhere between 70 and 80% is where talking isn't real comfortable anymore. If you run it too fast you are not really effectively building aerobic capacity. The other reason for running easy is so you can run more and mileage and frequency is the best improver of aerobic capacity.

2. Probably not. Volume and frequency has to be pretty high in addition to intensity to venture into overtraining.

3. Not sprints. You should run them at a pace where you can run each one at the same pace with a couple of minutes rest in between. That is around 90 to 95% max HR. (note: If you are aerobiclly fit it takes a couple of minutes for the HR to ramp up that far so attempting to run short intervals by HR does not work.) If you have a recent race PR you can plug it into this pace calculator and it will tell you how fast to run. http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/
If you don't have a race PR now go out and run a mile as fast as you can and use that for the calculator. It will give a good baseline for your current fitness.
Running the first one too fast means either that you will not finish the workout or that you will run the others too slow. Either way the effectiveness of the workout is reduced.

4. You need progressive overload to improve. Additionally, to build aerobic capacity high requires runs of 90 minutes to 2 hours. Read this: Athletic Training by Arthur Lydiard, available free at http://www.lydiardfoundation.org/pdfs/al_training_eng.pdf