How to know when enough weight is enough?

Cat_Lifts

I've been feeling discouraged lately with my workout regime/how much I should be lifting (weight and sets/reps). Is it normal to not feel sore the following day after most workouts? How do you know when it's too much, and not enough? I know that's a very vague question, but do you pretty much want muscle failure in your last set? Do you want that crazy burn to the point where your muscles can't burn anymore? Example, I do squats up into shoulder presses with 15lb dumbbells, 3 sets of 12. Usually by the second set, I'm struggling at 10 to push through, and by set 3, rep 10, 11, and 12 are almost impossible. I pretty much wear an excruciating constipated look and get vocal (which I normally don't with weights)!

Here's a typical workout with weights day for me (seems a little sad, I know. I'd love to incorporate deadlifts somehow in here, but I have no one to spot me for it. Also, our gym has pre-weighted barbells - yuck!):

3 sets/12 reps of 15lb dumbbells - squat to shoulder press
3 sets/10 reps of squats with 40lb barbell
3 sets/10 reps bent over rows with 40lb barbell
3 sets/10 front lat pulldown at 35lbs
3 sets/10 bench press with 40lb barbell
3 sets/10 tricep extensions with 20lb barbell behind head

Another silly question - is more reps/less weight any different in effectiveness (in terms of muscle gaining, "fat burning", etc) compared to say the 5x5 stronglifts guide of less reps/more weight? If I were to do stronglifts for say a squat to shoulder press, would 25-35 lb dumbbells be too much? Would I be better off just upping the weight on all my exercises, cutting reps, and doing a few more sets? Thank you!

Cat_Lifts

Bump.

bostonwolf

If you can do the last reps on the last set with ease (and keep doing what you are doing and pushing yourself and you will get there, it is time to raise the weight and drop the reps down to 8. When you can do 3 sets of 8, go up to 10. Then 12. Then add weight and drop back to 8.

I do 5x5 now, but I used that strategy successfully for almost 20 years. I prefer a full body workout now and want to be done in less than an hour, which 5x5 lets me accomplish.

meshashesha2012

i try to increase weight every single time i do the movement

as for the question about doing your routine strength training style, you'd also need to figure out the most efficient way to do your exercise which means you can use more weight for instance in your squat to shoulder press movement, technically the power to raise the weight should be coming from your hips not from your arms or shoulders which are more used for stabilizing the weight in the up position. it sounds like you are doing a squat then doing a shoulder press

also one of the issues with doing so many reps is that it's difficult to tell if you're being held back because of the weight or because of the cardio component. for instance when i do cosgrove evil 8 complex i'm dying with just an oly bar, yet in terms of the individual component movement, i can easily lift more than 3 times that amount for most of those. the difference is that i'm moving quicker when i'm doing the complex than when i'm straight out lifting. so that in no way means that 50 pounds is a hard weight for me in a deadlift because i know for a fact that i can DL 200 pounds

1ConcreteGirl

Going to muscle failure =/= feeling DOMS the next day.

DOMS is an indicator of how acclimated your muscles are to your workouts, not of how effective your workouts are.

whierd

It may be time to shake up your routine.

jadedone

I wouldn't be shocked if you could up the weight. For example, I do 110 for 3 x 12 reps on the lat pulldown. (don't think this translates into anything else, my upper body is pretty week).

Add 5 pounds and try to get to your usual number of sets. If you make it no problem, then add 5 more on the next set and see how you feel. Especially for the large muscles/compound movements. If you are still hitting the same number of reps with the same level of fatigue, you know you aren't pushing hard enough!

Cat_Lifts

I wouldn't be shocked if you could up the weight. For example, I do 110 for 3 x 12 reps on the lat pulldown. (don't think this translates into anything else, my upper body is pretty week).

Add 5 pounds and try to get to your usual number of sets. If you make it no problem, then add 5 more on the next set and see how you feel. Especially for the large muscles/compound movements. If you are still hitting the same number of reps with the same level of fatigue, you know you aren't pushing hard enough!

I know right off the bat that doing 20lbs for 3 sets of 12 reps with the squat into shoulder press is gonna be tough to finish on that last set, lol. I'll definitely give it a try though, may be easier than I'm expecting! I know with lat pull downs I could probably increase 5-10lbs, and possibly with squats, too. I'm carrying an extra 40-50 lbs on me, so squatting a mere 40lbs can be a challenge at the last few reps of the last set.

Also, deadlifts - I really, REALLY need to learn them. I want to learn them, more than anything right now. Our gyms preweighted barbells are lame, and I've given dumbbells a try... but there's a pain I'm feeling in my middle back (probably due to my poor posture from sitting at the computer). My form is apparently good (coworker/local crossfit trainer spotted me on keeping my back straight, lifting with hips and shoulders, etc), but after that 5 or 6th lift, right between the shoulder blades it starts to ache rather than feel like a muscle burn. I'm nervous about tweaking my back.

meshashesha2012

^ is the bar maintaining contact with your legs during the entire movement (except for when you touch it down on the floor of course) for every rep?

Cat_Lifts

^ is the bar maintaining contact with your legs during the entire movement (except for when you touch it down on the floor of course) for every rep?

I was recommended to use dumbbells since we only have preweighted barbells at my gym, and they're so small (the weights) that it's further down to grasp (it's typically only 3 inches up off the floor) than a typical olympic barbell. I could try it, considering the dumbbells aren't hitting the ground either. It doesn't feel what maybe a true deadlift should feel like without the olympic barbell, though! But again, I'm willing to try anything to at least learn form.

meshashesha2012

with dumbbells you should start with the weights on the outside of your foot, at the instep and keep in that location during the lift for every rep

you could try using the preweighted bar, just prop them up on the ends with something like an aerobic step. your foot should be under the bar with the bar over your mid foot so that when you bend your knees to grasp the bar, your shins touch the bar and the bar makes contact with your front during the entire motion

i guess i dont understand why using dumbbells are better than using barbells when you have those available to you :laugh:

also just to check we are talking about deadlifts and not romanian deadlifts, right? the two are completely different and work different main muscles yet many people mistake the RDL for the DL

Cat_Lifts

with dumbbells you should start with the weights on the outside of your foot, at the instep and keep in that location during the lift for every rep

you could try using the preweighted bar, just prop them up on the ends with something like an aerobic step. your foot should be under the bar with the bar over your mid foot so that when you bend your knees to grasp the bar, your shins touch the bar and the bar makes contact with your front during the entire motion

i guess i dont understand why using dumbbells are better than using barbells when you have those available to you :laugh:

also just to check we are talking about deadlifts and not romanian deadlifts, right? the two are completely different and work different main muscles yet many people mistake the RDL for the DL

I like the idea of the preweighted barbell on the aerobic steps, actually. I think I honestly just need to practice form more than anything at this point, then feel out what weight may be more convenient for me. And yes, regular deadlifts, not romanian. Thank you for the advice Mesha!