One of the dumbest PC things to date.
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I've never known a smart kid who was smart (and got good grades) because their parents punished/rewarded them based on their grades. I aced almost every test in school and it never had anything to do with punishment/reward because that was WAY too far off into the future to even care about when I was a kid.Those are my gripes. Yes, it's helpful in the respect that you know your kids strengths and weaknesses, but I reward my kids for a good report card. Without even an average, I don't know wether to reward or punish my kid. I don't even know how to translate these things to her so she will know her own performance. I assume that the expectation is that kids shouldn't be punished, but I can't reward her when it isn't really clear that she did well.
However I had a friend in '83 whose parents promised him $100 per A on his report card, so I used my computer to print him out a fake report card with straight As on it while he actually had a C average. The "reward" system also worked real well for him, LOL.
It's just positive reinforcement. I have offered my kids money, but the most part, I'm talking about praise. What am I supposed to say... "Great job on understanding those simple arithmetic functions, but you really need to work hard using algebraic expression."0 -
I got 10 bucks for straight As. And nothing for anything less.
I was a pretty rich kid.0 -
See this has been my complaint for years. These teachers go to State Conference's once or twice a year and hear lectures from some quack that convinces them to do something in their school system and the "don't use red ink" BS is a prime example of just that. The one that really chaffs my *kitten* is that our school has taken out spelling form the curriculum. When we asked why the answer we go back was " spelling is learned through repetition and phonics. Since we are now in the "computer age" there are now spell checkers on computer to help withe that." Yup, was the answer we go back. No joke. And that came out after the principal of our school came back from one of those conferences. Now we were left to teach spelling and proper punctuation of words to our kid who was half literally half deaf. Ton top it all off, we were having teachers telling us that our son had a speech and spelling issue. No **** you dumb *kitten*, you took the spelling program out of the schools and when we came to you for help with these issues you told us he did not qualify for any school program. Now that we have threatened to contact the state school board on several occasions we got some help, but only minimal.
This all really started big after the "No Child Left Behind Act of 2001" was put into place. Since then things like "There is no loser's" mindset where it does not matter if you win or lose, you still get a big medal for "participation" so no child have to feel the agony of defeat. It just goes to show you that America has fully jumped on board with all the PC squishy "don't hurt anyone's feelings" crap.
I love my country but come one, quit being *kitten* about every damn little thing.
Yes... making the children write things repetitively is apparently degrading to them... so my kid struggled with the times tables until I made her write them repetitively at home. Sure, it was part of a punishment, but she struggled no more.0 -
I was offered all sorts of money for high grades, I didn't care, it was way more fun to skip class. Do kids really get teased for their grades? I haven't been out of high school THAT long and I was never teased for my grades, ever. What would they honestly say? My grades can kick your grades *kitten*? I say bring on the red pens, if a kid can't handle seeing red on his schoolwork he/she is going to have a hard time adjusting to real life where everything isn't rainbows and unicorns.0
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When one is grading papers, the ink used for editing/grading should be a different color so the student can see what they did wrong. It can be ANY color other than what the student used. When I was teaching (and when I edited my kids' papers), I usually went for green or purple (but then, red is my least favorite color). If most students don't care, but it affects a few students negatively, I'd go for the solution that allows more kids to learn how to correct their mistakes and not make them the next time.
Grades are not about punishment. Grades are all about "this is where you have deficits in your knowledge, and these are the holes we have to fill with appropriate skills or data".
The most intelligent answer yet. :flowerforyou:0 -
yup old newsI've heard this for years.
Teachers still use red pen.
But people love to get on a soapbox and complain how the country is falling apart over something that isn't even happening.0 -
I do love it when people pine for the "good old days"
Back when you could call people retarded, when you could call kids gay and beat them up, when kids with learning disabilities weren't permitted to be educated alongside everyone else, when girls were forced to take home ec and not allowed to play sports...
Ah the good old days. Why on Earth did we ever change?
:flowerforyou:
Now everyone is just wimps for trying to be better people. :ohwell:0 -
I am curious - what will determine admission into university if we are using these benchmarks rather than a GPA? Because strictly using SAT/ACT scores will surely upset people whose children are "poor standardized test takers" and using some sort of essay format will harm the poor writers. I am being completely serious. What determines if you get into Dartmouth or a state school?
I was going to say the same thing :laugh:. Whoever could afford admission could go.0 -
I do love it when people pine for the "good old days"
Back when you could call people retarded, when you could call kids gay and beat them up, when kids with learning disabilities weren't permitted to be educated alongside everyone else, when girls were forced to take home ec and not allowed to play sports...
Ah the good old days. Why on Earth did we ever change?
Remember how awesome it was that women did the laundry and dishes every single night too? I don't know why on Earth we did change. It's ridiculous. We need the core values back NOW!!!0 -
But red ink scares me.
And if we keep score and I lose, I will be upset
And if I play dodgeball, I might get hurt0 -
Wait, just because 'some group' says something... it automatically becomes truth or the opinion of an entire country? WTF. It doesn't make the states any more whimpy just because a few people said red pen hurt some kids feelings, mkay.0
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I am curious - what will determine admission into university if we are using these benchmarks rather than a GPA? Because strictly using SAT/ACT scores will surely upset people whose children are "poor standardized test takers" and using some sort of essay format will harm the poor writers. I am being completely serious. What determines if you get into Dartmouth or a state school?
Wait, I thought that already was how you got into Dartmouth, Yale, Princeton, etc.
I got literally no encouragement to get good grades. No rewards, nothing and I was a straight A student. My brother got Cs and Bs and would get paid if he got As and Bs instead....which the only A he got was in slacker classes or history. I was just expected to get good grades or my father would see me as a disappointment.
And all my teachers used red pens...good or bad grades. I don't think people get teased for poor grades, but rather for high ones. I was often called a nerd and teacher's pet because I had been in advanced programs as a child and when I moved to a new city, the school system couldn't keep me intellectually stimulated enough at the current level....but skipping me ahead a grade wouldn't keep me socially stimulated and that is what won.
I am 24 years old and am still socially awkward so the academic challenges would have posed a far better outcome in my life, rather than allowing me to become bored and never striving for the excellence I was clearly capable of. Even in high school I wasn't challenged...we couldn't take AP classes or anything.
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This all really started big after the "No Child Left Behind Act of 2001" was put into place. Since then things like "There is no loser's" mindset where it does not matter if you win or lose, you still get a big medal for "participation" so no child have to feel the agony of defeat. It just goes to show you that America has fully jumped on board with all the PC squishy "don't hurt anyone's feelings" crap.
You clearly don't know what NCLB is about.
No Child was enacted to actually put some measurements in place. It has all these CRAZY ideas in it, like, for example, "all third graders WILL be able to read, or else their schools will be held accountable" (OHGODHOWWHYNOOOOOOO)
No Child was created specifically to make sure our children are reaching appropriate levels of education by prescribed grade levels. If they don't, and if schools fail to keep making adequate yearly progress, they get in trouble for it.
Now I know that it's popular to bash NCLB, and a WHOLE lot of comfy cozy tenured teachers (and their union thug bosses) did NOT like the idea that they would suddenly be measured by the student's learning outcomes.......but the truth is, reading literacy has risen, and the number of BAD schools who have been closed down or changed as a direct result of it......well, as a teacher who welcomes being held accountable for my students' outcomes......it's FANTASTIC.0 -
I'm a teacher as well. I was a k-12 teacher for many years. Never "tenured". No union. And I think NCLB is a travesty (and when you read it, it's full of things have have no business in an education law). And I WELCOME measurements, and accountability. That said, I agree that the shift from letter grades to alternate evaluations is NOT a result of NCLB. I do believe it has to do with increased involvement from state and local government, however.This all really started big after the "No Child Left Behind Act of 2001" was put into place. Since then things like "There is no loser's" mindset where it does not matter if you win or lose, you still get a big medal for "participation" so no child have to feel the agony of defeat. It just goes to show you that America has fully jumped on board with all the PC squishy "don't hurt anyone's feelings" crap.
You clearly don't know what NCLB is about.
No Child was enacted to actually put some measurements in place. It has all these CRAZY ideas in it, like, for example, "all third graders WILL be able to read, or else their schools will be held accountable" (OHGODHOWWHYNOOOOOOO)
No Child was created specifically to make sure our children are reaching appropriate levels of education by prescribed grade levels. If they don't, and if schools fail to keep making adequate yearly progress, they get in trouble for it.
Now I know that it's popular to bash NCLB, and a WHOLE lot of comfy cozy tenured teachers (and their union thug bosses) did NOT like the idea that they would suddenly be measured by the student's learning outcomes.......but the truth is, reading literacy has risen, and the number of BAD schools who have been closed down or changed as a direct result of it......well, as a teacher who welcomes being held accountable for my students' outcomes......it's FANTASTIC.0 -
But it's WORKING.
From USA Today, while trying to knock the law, "Scores on national assessment show significant gains in math among the 4th to 8th graders, with Hispanic and African American students peforming approximately two grade levels higher than they were when the law was passed a decade earlier."
Despite all the protest, despite all the wailing and gnashing of teeth, our kids are doing better. Whether teachers like it or not, it's WORKING.0 -
It may be. I'll be waiting for longer term data. And I guess to me the end doesn't always justify the means. Know what I mean? Have you read NCLB? There's some goofy stuff in there.But it's WORKING.
From USA Today, while trying to knock the law, "Scores on national assessment show significant gains in math among the 4th to 8th graders, with Hispanic and African American students peforming approximately two grade levels higher than they were when the law was passed a decade earlier."
Despite all the protest, despite all the wailing and gnashing of teeth, our kids are doing better. Whether teachers like it or not, it's WORKING.0 -
*slamming my head on table*0
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How does this pussify anyone? It's an *F* or *wrong* whether it's in blue, black, red or green.
Our elementary schools haven't used red ink in over 10 years. They felt it stood out too much and other kids could easily see it. When you have a kid that's already struggling why add being teased by their classmates to it?
How does this effect you?
"affect"
Maybe if your english teacher used more red ink......
Thank you for doing what I was about to do. Hahahaha! To add: affect is the verb, effect is the noun.0 -
These are the same people that try to lock threads about fat people. If making an error has not consequences they will grow up to be lying cheating pols.
I was an educator for years. I hated it. Little Johnny's mother came in to tell me why he couldn't do his homework, yet, somehow deserved to pass. I finally quit. However; from my computer class of 12 seniors, 11 went on to graduate with degrees in computer science! The other one became a pharmacist.0 -
But it's WORKING.
From USA Today, while trying to knock the law, "Scores on national assessment show significant gains in math among the 4th to 8th graders, with Hispanic and African American students peforming approximately two grade levels higher than they were when the law was passed a decade earlier."
Despite all the protest, despite all the wailing and gnashing of teeth, our kids are doing better. Whether teachers like it or not, it's WORKING.
you can't say that nclb is the reason that kids are doing better in school because of another thing that is much more widely available now than it was back then....the internet. hispanic and african american kids have far more access to the internet now than they did in 2001, white kids and every other race of children as well. i speculate that the internet, where all human information is available at every kid's fingertips (at least 98% in the US) is more likely the reason for improved test scores and better learning.0 -
America is not America anymore!!! Oh, how I wish we could go back to the 80s and 90s. Life was much sane then.0
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But it's WORKING.
From USA Today, while trying to knock the law, "Scores on national assessment show significant gains in math among the 4th to 8th graders, with Hispanic and African American students peforming approximately two grade levels higher than they were when the law was passed a decade earlier."
Despite all the protest, despite all the wailing and gnashing of teeth, our kids are doing better. Whether teachers like it or not, it's WORKING.
What the hell is this "national assessment" they reference? The SAT? State tests? I was not aware that there was a single national assessment given to all students. Assessments can vary drastically from state to state. I've taught for almost 6 years and I'm sitting here trying to figure out what this is referencing. Where are they getting this information?
And NO, it is NOT working. I'll reference my own generation. We knew how to multiply by 2nd grade and even had time left over to learn cursive. The kids that I teach are damn near illiterate and cannot multiply at 6th grade. Forget critical thinking skills! It's not their fault. It's the way the curriculum moves at warp speed without any logical connection from one unit to the next.
NCLB is an absolute disaster when coupled with IDEA 2004 and other special education legislation. I have had kids in my class with IQs below 80. I am expected to administer the same state assessment to them as the kid with the 120 IQ and have them show the same level of mastery. The kid has the cognitive abilities of a two year old and I'm supposed to teach them the political impact and intricacies of John Locke's human rights philosophy (actual curriculum point for my 6th graders.) Get a freaking grip! But that is exactly what legislation like NCLB calls for. It is completely devoid of any rationality.
FERPA, IDEA 2004, and NCLB all make school a bureaucratic black hole where nothing of significance gets done because we're scared of being sued by delusional parents. Red pens are the very least of our worries. And that is the fault of both sides of the aisle. I am also non-union.
/rant.0 -
I was taught (in my teacher training program) in 1988 to not use a red pen. This isn't new!!America is not America anymore!!! Oh, how I wish we could go back to the 80s and 90s. Life was much sane then.
Nor are the ever changing grading schemes.
Remember O,S, NI, U???0 -
Do NOT mess with Aggie hotties!But it's WORKING.
From USA Today, while trying to knock the law, "Scores on national assessment show significant gains in math among the 4th to 8th graders, with Hispanic and African American students peforming approximately two grade levels higher than they were when the law was passed a decade earlier."
Despite all the protest, despite all the wailing and gnashing of teeth, our kids are doing better. Whether teachers like it or not, it's WORKING.
What the hell is this "national assessment" they reference? The SAT? State tests? I was not aware that there was a single national assessment given to all students. Assessments can vary drastically from state to state. I've taught for almost 6 years and I'm sitting here trying to figure out what this is referencing. Where are they getting this information?
And NO, it is NOT working. I'll reference my own generation. We knew how to multiply by 2nd grade and even had time left over to learn cursive. The kids that I teach are damn near illiterate and cannot multiply at 6th grade. Forget critical thinking skills! It's not their fault. It's the way the curriculum moves at warp speed without any logical connection from one unit to the next.
NCLB is an absolute disaster when coupled with IDEA 2004 and other special education legislation. I have had kids in my class with IQs below 80. I am expected to administer the same state assessment to them as the kid with the 120 IQ and have them show the same level of mastery. The kid has the cognitive abilities of a two year old and I'm supposed to teach them the political impact and intricacies of John Locke's human rights philosophy (actual curriculum point for my 6th graders.) Get a freaking grip! But that is exactly what legislation like NCLB calls for. It is completely devoid of any rationality.
FERPA, IDEA 2004, and NCLB all make school a bureaucratic black hole where nothing of significance gets done because we're scared of being sued by delusional parents. Red pens are the very least of our worries. And that is the fault of both sides of the aisle. I am also non-union.
/rant.
Just sayin.0 -
Soon the world will be wimpy, or at least the USA is going to be the wimpiest country that exists. I was just listening to news radio, and some group is saying that teachers should no longer mark school papers in red pen, because red upsets the kids.... it is recommended that they use blue "or other not so intimidating colors".
Are you freaking serious?
my 1st grader's teacher must not have got that memo yet. He accidentally skipped a page in his homework packet. he got it back with big inch high, RED letters that said "please do the WHOLE packet. Not complete " He doesn't seem too traumatized to me... 0
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