People, get to know your CARBS!

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  • stroutman81
    stroutman81 Posts: 2,474 Member
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    I should add that of course there's variations in how well certain folks will handle, say, carbs due to genetics. Something like insulin resistance *can* be influenced by genetics. Off the top of my head, I can't think of something genetic outside of diseased states that would impact protein metabolism... but that doesn't mean something doesn't exist. I simply haven't looked into it extensively.

    Quite possibly the strongest indicator that the upper limit of protein digestion per feeding is much higher than the often passed around 20-30 grams is the work done on intermittent fasting.

    There are a couple of papers floating around showing pretty significant protein loading in brief periods of time. Stuff like this:

    http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/85/4/981?maxtoshow=&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&fulltext=Stote+KS,+et+al.+A+controlled+trial+of+reduced+meal+frequency+without+caloric+restriction+in+healthy,+normal-weight,+middle-aged+adults.+Am+J+Clin+Nutr.+2007+Apr;85(4):981-8&searchid=1&FIRSTINDEX=0&resourcetype=HWCIT

    Anyhow, this has been quite the thread. From carbophobia, to the state of the industry, to protein metabolism, to cavemen. Gotta love the net!
  • Chelsinicole63
    Chelsinicole63 Posts: 62 Member
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    I read the south beach diet book and it relies on this GI system... Tells you not to eat bananas... Or apples and other fruits... Yet we are told to eat 5 servings a day....
    Im confused.
  • July24Lioness
    July24Lioness Posts: 2,399 Member
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    I read the south beach diet book and it relies on this GI system... Tells you not to eat bananas... Or apples and other fruits... Yet we are told to eat 5 servings a day....
    Im confused.

    Apples are included in the South Beach Plan, in Phase 2 they are reintroduced. It is the very first entry on the Foods list. They don't say eat 5 servings of fruit a day, those servings should always be based first and foremost on Veggies.

    Fruits should sort of be treated as a dessert or treat, not something to have multiple, multiple servings of every day.
    Foods Allowed in Phase 2 (Foods you can reintroduce to your diet)

    FRUITS

    Apples
    Apricots-dried fresh
    Blueberries
    Cantaloupe
    Cherries
    Grapefruit
    Grapes
    Kiwi
    Mangoes
    Oranges
    Peaches
    Pears
    Plums
    Strawberries

    DAIRY

    Milk-light soy, fat-free or 1%
    Yogurt-light, fruit-flavored, plain, low-fat or fat-free


    STARCHES (use sparingly)

    Bagels, small, whole grain
    Bread-multigrain, oat and bran, rye, whole wheat
    Cereal-Fiber One, Kellogg's Extra-Fiber All Bran, oatmeal (not instant), other high-fiber, Uncle Sam
    Muffins, bran-sugar-free (no raisins)
    Pasta, whole wheat
    Peas, green
    Pita-stone-ground, whole wheat
    Popcorn
    Potato, small, sweet
    Rice-brown, wild

    VEGETABLES AND LEGUMES

    Barley
    Beans, pinto
    Black-eyed peas

    MISCELLANEOUS

    Chocolate (sparingly)-bittersweet, semisweet
    Pudding, fat-free/sugar-free
    Wine, red
  • lilmissy2
    lilmissy2 Posts: 595 Member
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    I read the south beach diet book and it relies on this GI system... Tells you not to eat bananas... Or apples and other fruits... Yet we are told to eat 5 servings a day....
    Im confused.

    I think the 5 a day message is confusing! but I guess they were thinking they would rather get people eating more fruit and veg and trying to change their lifestyles than worry about the calories they might contribute. Also, to be fair if you are replacing other food you eat with fruit, there are very few snack foods that would be lower calorie than a piece of fruit (especially if you compared it per gram of food). In the UK it is also '5 a day'. I personally like the Australian recommendations where we say 'go for 2 and 5' 2 fruit and 5 veg.
  • July24Lioness
    July24Lioness Posts: 2,399 Member
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    I read the south beach diet book and it relies on this GI system... Tells you not to eat bananas... Or apples and other fruits... Yet we are told to eat 5 servings a day....
    Im confused.

    I think the 5 a day message is confusing! but I guess they were thinking they would rather get people eating more fruit and veg and trying to change their lifestyles than worry about the calories they might contribute. Also, to be fair if you are replacing other food you eat with fruit, there are very few snack foods that would be lower calorie than a piece of fruit (especially if you compared it per gram of food). In the UK it is also '5 a day'. I personally like the Australian recommendations where we say 'go for 2 and 5' 2 fruit and 5 veg.

    From what I hear, most of the world governments can take some notes from Australia's government. Seems like when it comes to nutrition and such, they spell it out for people and that is great.
  • arewethereyet
    arewethereyet Posts: 18,702 Member
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    I read the south beach diet book and it relies on this GI system... Tells you not to eat bananas... Or apples and other fruits... Yet we are told to eat 5 servings a day....
    Im confused.

    I think the 5 a day message is confusing! but I guess they were thinking they would rather get people eating more fruit and veg and trying to change their lifestyles than worry about the calories they might contribute. Also, to be fair if you are replacing other food you eat with fruit, there are very few snack foods that would be lower calorie than a piece of fruit (especially if you compared it per gram of food). In the UK it is also '5 a day'. I personally like the Australian recommendations where we say 'go for 2 and 5' 2 fruit and 5 veg.

    From what I hear, most of the world governments can take some notes from Australia's government. Seems like when it comes to nutrition and such, they spell it out for people and that is great.

    I was just thinking...........a serving is not an entire apple or orange, either. I had no idea how much a serving of anything was before I had gestational diabetes. nothing like the threat of a sick baby to make you aware of your foods (didnt stop me from gaining 40 more pounds after she was born though!)

    Anyway, point is a small apple can be 2 servings.......3-4 oz of fresh juice is a serving........not the 12 oz cup they give you in a restaraunt.

    I am trying to think more clean............and eat fresher. Hard, because a box of potatoes is so much easier than cleaning, cutting, cooking a idaho......but I am getting back intot he groove.

    LOTS of good give and take on this thread. Thanks for all the research and info. I will take from it what I need, and leave the rest!! :flowerforyou:

    and Cora........LOVE the Av dear
  • July24Lioness
    July24Lioness Posts: 2,399 Member
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    I read the south beach diet book and it relies on this GI system... Tells you not to eat bananas... Or apples and other fruits... Yet we are told to eat 5 servings a day....
    Im confused.

    I think the 5 a day message is confusing! but I guess they were thinking they would rather get people eating more fruit and veg and trying to change their lifestyles than worry about the calories they might contribute. Also, to be fair if you are replacing other food you eat with fruit, there are very few snack foods that would be lower calorie than a piece of fruit (especially if you compared it per gram of food). In the UK it is also '5 a day'. I personally like the Australian recommendations where we say 'go for 2 and 5' 2 fruit and 5 veg.

    From what I hear, most of the world governments can take some notes from Australia's government. Seems like when it comes to nutrition and such, they spell it out for people and that is great.

    I was just thinking...........a serving is not an entire apple or orange, either. I had no idea how much a serving of anything was before I had gestational diabetes. nothing like the threat of a sick baby to make you aware of your foods (didnt stop me from gaining 40 more pounds after she was born though!)

    Anyway, point is a small apple can be 2 servings.......3-4 oz of fresh juice is a serving........not the 12 oz cup they give you in a restaraunt.

    I am trying to think more clean............and eat fresher. Hard, because a box of potatoes is so much easier than cleaning, cutting, cooking a idaho......but I am getting back intot he groove.

    LOTS of good give and take on this thread. Thanks for all the research and info. I will take from it what I need, and leave the rest!! :flowerforyou:

    and Cora........LOVE the Av dear

    That is true about a serving and weighing everything out. I have to admit, I don't always weigh everything, I kind of eyeball it. And I will sit and eat a whole, small apple. I just buy the bags of apples that has all small ones in it.
  • HealthyChanges2010
    HealthyChanges2010 Posts: 5,831 Member
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    That is true about a serving and weighing everything out. I have to admit, I don't always weigh everything, I kind of eyeball it. And I will sit and eat a whole, small apple. I just buy the bags of apples that has all small ones in it.

    I much prefer to buy the bags of the small apples as well Cora, the size of apples these days are what I consider XLarge, they are HUGE! If I'm at a store that doesn't have them at the time I pick up a couple of the med. size apples and simply cut them in half.:flowerforyou:
  • HealthyChanges2010
    HealthyChanges2010 Posts: 5,831 Member
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    I get confused on that 5 servings a day as well.

    I had thought it meant 5 servings of fruit and veggies per day. Meaning 5 servings of the 2 food groups combined. Not 5 of each food group?. Is that what some of you thought as well?
  • July24Lioness
    July24Lioness Posts: 2,399 Member
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    I get confused on that 5 servings a day as well.

    I had thought it meant 5 servings of fruit and veggies per day. Meaning 5 servings of the 2 food groups combined. Not 5 of each food group?. Is that what some of you thought as well?

    I believe people don't particularly like Veggies so they think it is ok to eat say......green beans and then 4 servings of fruit. That is entirely too much sugar, natural or not.

    It should be the other way around............Like eating 4 servings of Veggies and 1 serving of fruit a day.............
  • gmvanloo
    gmvanloo Posts: 100 Member
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    Bumping this! Just started reading The Primal Blueprint and trying to implement some of his ideas.....
  • Barneystinson
    Barneystinson Posts: 1,357 Member
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    Gah, the OP rubbed me the wrong way and I actually eat in the method as described as beneficial...

    Anyway, count me in on the intermittent fasting camp here. Glad to know there are others out there who recognize the benefits of the occasional fast (done properly). I found Brad Pilon's "Eat Stop Eat" and was intrigued and have implemented 22-24 fasts usually 2-3x monthly.
  • emederos
    emederos Posts: 25
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    A) I'm glad to see this thread still alive and kicking and that it's turned into a full-fledged discussion on the issue.

    B) For the Intermittent Fasting camp, i'd advise you take the following into consideration:

    Do not make up for an unplanned binge by skipping meals. A lot of people will eat an unplanned crappy meal, feel guilty about it, and then either not eat for the rest of the day, or become extra drastic the next day. Even worse, they might feel like eating junk later in the day, so they don't eat anything at all before that (basically fasting for almost the whole day) thinking that this will prevent fat gain.

    This is just wrong. In fact, these two mistakes are worse than the binge itself.

    Not eating for a while (starving yourself for 10 hours) before eating a junk meal will put your body in fat storage mode, and you're actually more likely to store the junk in your trunk than if you had not starved yourself. Furthermore, starving yourself is likely to make you eat even more crap because you'll be more hungry than if you had eaten your normal meals.

    Skipping meals after an unplanned binge is no better, especially if you decide to starve yourself the day after a binge to "make up for it." This will create a vicious cycle: by starving yourself you'll actually increase the feeling of hunger and you'll have huge junk food cravings. You then might give in to those cravings by bingeing; this will make you feel guilty so you'll once again starve yourself, etc.

    After an unplanned cheat, go back to your regular diet immediately. Accept your mistake, live with it, and do your best not to let it happen again. Don't compound a mistake by trying to counter it with another mistake.



    Now, I know there are some people who fast for the supposed benefits, and I know that there are people on both sides of the fence. My point: Make sure you're fasting for the right reasons, doing the fast correctly and coming back to a healthy diet, and not to cheat yourself.
  • hadababyitsagirl
    hadababyitsagirl Posts: 21
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    Emederos, is there a specific site or place that you reference the Glycemic Index? I would like to know where the foods that I eat are rated. Thanks
  • emederos
    emederos Posts: 25
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    Emederos, is there a specific site or place that you reference the Glycemic Index? I would like to know where the foods that I eat are rated. Thanks

    you could try http://www.glycemicindex.com/ or just use plain ol google-fu to search the food. honestly there's no go-to place for me.
  • Soon2beskinny73
    Soon2beskinny73 Posts: 255 Member
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    All very interesting information although I know most of it since being on Atkins for the last nine months :) The only thing I know is if I go off Atkins I am a complete mess therefore I don't go off of it if I can help it.

    It's strange that I NEVER really thought the way I was eating before was affecting my health , I guess I was so used to feeling tired , lethargic and run down that I just thought it was all due to all the excess weight. Well a lot of it was due to all the excess weight I had but as soon as I started eating right and reducing carbs and upping protein I started to feel really good. I have more energy than I ever and I love how I feel now.

    The bad carbs were destroying me and I am just glad that I finally admitted to myself that I needed to change. I was in denial for a very long time and I thought as long as I counted my calories and stayed within that range that I would still lose weight and feel great. Boy was I WRONG!! I was either not losing at all or losing very little each week and it was FRUSTRATING. Now I can easily lose between 3-5 lbs. per week.

    Glad this thread was started , very good information!!!
  • tjones7
    tjones7 Posts: 306
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    just bumping so I can read later
  • July24Lioness
    July24Lioness Posts: 2,399 Member
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    All very interesting information although I know most of it since being on Atkins for the last nine months :) The only thing I know is if I go off Atkins I am a complete mess therefore I don't go off of it if I can help it.

    It's strange that I NEVER really thought the way I was eating before was affecting my health , I guess I was so used to feeling tired , lethargic and run down that I just thought it was all due to all the excess weight. Well a lot of it was due to all the excess weight I had but as soon as I started eating right and reducing carbs and upping protein I started to feel really good. I have more energy than I ever and I love how I feel now.

    The bad carbs were destroying me and I am just glad that I finally admitted to myself that I needed to change. I was in denial for a very long time and I thought as long as I counted my calories and stayed within that range that I would still lose weight and feel great. Boy was I WRONG!! I was either not losing at all or losing very little each week and it was FRUSTRATING. Now I can easily lose between 3-5 lbs. per week.

    Glad this thread was started , very good information!!!

    There are many more people out there like you and me.................

    Most people just don't want to make the lifestyle changes that it takes.

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