Acupuncture- real or hooey?

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  • DatMurse
    DatMurse Posts: 1,501 Member
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    My child was having a serious asthma week a few weeks ago. We had been to urgent care and the allergist that morning and his breathing was still labored. He had an acupuncture appointment already so we just kept it. We walked in and the dr runs out "I hear asthma" and takes him directly back. She breaks her "routine" and puts the needle in his asthma spot first. Within the minute his breathing returns to a normal range. His next appointment at the doctor he makes a 100 on his breathing test -- something my kid doesn't do.

    My daughter had a similar experience (see my ealier post) . I recommend ANYONE whose child is diagnosed try it.

    Please, please, please any parent whose child has asthma DO NOT use acupuncture as an emergency treatment if their symptoms worsen. Children deteriorate very quickly, asthma KILLS children frequently throughout the world. I have seen this happen in emergency departments and the later you leave it to get medical assistance the harder it is to save them. An acupuncturist can not intubate and ventilate your child when their lungs shut down.

    This
    Would you really risk status asthmaticus for acupuncture?
  • jamiek917
    jamiek917 Posts: 610 Member
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    I really think you should see a Dr about your hormones and cycle.

    ive of course seen a doctor. we are about to resort to a 2nd round of meds, so i wanted an opinion about other options.

    thanks all!

    TMI alert, but acu helped lessen the rate at which my body loses blood. Awesome! Keep your hands still when the needle is in your uterus point :)

    thanks for the input! my post was about acupuncture for hormone/cycle regularity, but of course it spiraled to other debates child treatment and acupuncture for weight loss. sigh...forums- lol
  • girlinahat
    girlinahat Posts: 2,956 Member
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    I don't know if acupuncture works, but I can certainly feel a 'pull' when the needle goes into the right point. I don't understand it, and I can't explain chi either but I know it's there.

    Acupuncture helped me with digestive issues, I know anecdotally it has helped people with fertility/hormone issues. Whether that is to do with sticking needles in particular points or just to do with the whole experience I do not know, but it is worth a go anyway.

    Be wary of chinese herbalists however - there are an awful lot of dangerous herbs (and substances derived from questionable sources) that get used. find someone reputable.
  • sailawaykate
    sailawaykate Posts: 126
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    Well if you stick a bunch of little needles into a certain area, your body releases endorphins to cover the pain, relaxing that area. My med school friend was required to go get acupuncture (he did it in his legs after a race when they were really tight) and said that even though he knew there was no "real" scientific/medical backing to it, he really did feel a difference.
  • terlyn20
    terlyn20 Posts: 142 Member
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    my daughter got help for pain, but it didnt help her with weight loss. i've never been myself, but i love
    my acupunture mat because it helps me with stress and tention.
  • Shan790
    Shan790 Posts: 280 Member
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    I used it with physiotherapy to treat a hamstring injury and lower back injury. It did help me a lot but I have never tried it for treating other ailments. I do know that for me I can only do short periods. I get nauseous when the needles are in for too long.
  • SrJoben
    SrJoben Posts: 484 Member
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    Accupuncture isn't a simple subject. As seen by the testimony in this thread it would be silly to claim it doesn't 'work' for some people.

    There are some problems though. Placebo controlled trials produce some interesting results.
    For example people getting needles poked into random spots get as much relief as people getting "real" acupuncture on the sites of the so called meridians.

    Think about that. Imagine if you went to a doctor and get the same relief whether he gave you the 'right' medicine or one picked at random off the shelf. Would you conclude that the medicines were good and the doctor was competent?

    Bottom line accupuncture works about as well as placebo. That is to say it works sometimes, but not reliably, and is more likely to work if you believe it's going to do something.

    Some people would say that means it doesn't really work at all.
  • erin4609
    erin4609 Posts: 131 Member
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    My friend just went for a sprained wrist and it healed it the next day. not exaggerating or anything. she swears by it now.
  • Cobwellac
    Cobwellac Posts: 75 Member
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    Well, it helped me with weight loss and it helped me quit smoking. I also get acupuncture to regulate my hormones and found it's helped there, too. So, yeah, I believe in acupuncture. You just need to find a good practitioner, there are too many bad ones out there.
  • Gongfu_1960
    Gongfu_1960 Posts: 23
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    My child was having a serious asthma week a few weeks ago. We had been to urgent care and the allergist that morning and his breathing was still labored. He had an acupuncture appointment already so we just kept it. We walked in and the dr runs out "I hear asthma" and takes him directly back. She breaks her "routine" and puts the needle in his asthma spot first. Within the minute his breathing returns to a normal range. His next appointment at the doctor he makes a 100 on his breathing test -- something my kid doesn't do.

    My daughter had a similar experience (see my ealier post) . I recommend ANYONE whose child is diagnosed try it.

    Please, please, please any parent whose child has asthma DO NOT use acupuncture as an emergency treatment if their symptoms worsen. Children deteriorate very quickly, asthma KILLS children frequently throughout the world. I have seen this happen in emergency departments and the later you leave it to get medical assistance the harder it is to save them. An acupuncturist can not intubate and ventilate your child when their lungs shut down.

    This
    Would you really risk status asthmaticus for acupuncture?

    Can you read? Or do you prefer to just ask hypothetical questions?
  • Joreanasaurous
    Joreanasaurous Posts: 1,384 Member
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    I tried it once and had to go to the ER with a full-blown panic attack. Not for me it seems.
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,874 Member
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    I find acupuncture to be quite relaxing...much the same way I find a massage to be relaxing. I think it depends on what you mean by hooey...if you think it's some kind of magic cure for all kinds of diseases then you're probably in for disappointment. It is what it is...I just think people make it out to be more.
  • new_bella
    new_bella Posts: 199 Member
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    I tried acupuncture to regulate my hormones and it worked wonders. My blood test results showed major improvements after about 6-7 treatments.

    I also tried acupuncture for lower back pain and it really helped. I could barely walk or bend over prior to having the first treatment. After 3 sessions the pain was pretty much gone.

    It's also very relaxing, I have fallen asleep during most of my sessions.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,535 Member
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    Well my opinion is that acupuncture proves that placebo treatment works.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • keem88
    keem88 Posts: 1,689 Member
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    i had acupuncture done for my knee back in the day when i used to run. it worked so well, i had lots of fluid in my knee and pain all the time, and when i got acupuncture done it helped way better than physical therapy or medication ever did. unfortunately it was not covered on insurance and became too expensive, so i could no longer receive it. i loved it though. turns out that when i stopped running my knee got a million times better, so i guess that was a cheaper but sadder alternative
  • DatMurse
    DatMurse Posts: 1,501 Member
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    My child was having a serious asthma week a few weeks ago. We had been to urgent care and the allergist that morning and his breathing was still labored. He had an acupuncture appointment already so we just kept it. We walked in and the dr runs out "I hear asthma" and takes him directly back. She breaks her "routine" and puts the needle in his asthma spot first. Within the minute his breathing returns to a normal range. His next appointment at the doctor he makes a 100 on his breathing test -- something my kid doesn't do.

    My daughter had a similar experience (see my ealier post) . I recommend ANYONE whose child is diagnosed try it.

    Please, please, please any parent whose child has asthma DO NOT use acupuncture as an emergency treatment if their symptoms worsen. Children deteriorate very quickly, asthma KILLS children frequently throughout the world. I have seen this happen in emergency departments and the later you leave it to get medical assistance the harder it is to save them. An acupuncturist can not intubate and ventilate your child when their lungs shut down.

    This
    Would you really risk status asthmaticus for acupuncture?

    Can you read? Or do you prefer to just ask hypothetical questions?
    I dont know. can you? I just agreed to not using acupuncture as an emergency treatment or would u use acupuncture as an emergency treatment
  • TheRealParisLove
    TheRealParisLove Posts: 1,907 Member
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    I've had acupuncture for a variety of ailments. It did nothing for colds and flu. It helped with difficult periods and PMS. It was nearly miraculous when I had injured my back, and chiropractic failed.

    I've never tried it for mental ailments (like overcoming cravings for tobacco or sweets).
  • liftreadphilosophize
    liftreadphilosophize Posts: 180 Member
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    Hooey.

    From the excellent blog Science Based Medicine:

    http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/acupuncture-does-not-work-for-back-pain/

    "A new study which randomized 638 adults to either standard acupuncture, individualized acupuncture, placebo acupuncture using tooth picks that did not penetrate the skin, and standard therapy found exactly what previous evidence has also suggested – it does not seem to matter where you stick the needles or even if you stick the needles through the skin. The only reasonable scientific conclusion to draw from this is that acupuncture does not work."

    Some points about Acupuncture:
    1) Acupuncture is said to work by "balancing you Chi". Chi come from a pre-scientific view about how the body works. While this make be a useful philosophical concept, it is not a medical one. Chi does not exist the same way insulin exists. You cannot balance it. It will not help regulate your hormones.

    2) All of the positive studies on acupuncture come from places that design their studies poorly and never publish any negative results. The better designed and properly blinded studies all show no effect.

    3) You may feel better after an acupuncture session. Most people really enjoy going to a practitioner, having their concerns addressed, and undergoing some sort of intervention. However, it doesn't matter what that intervention is. It could be poking you with needles or toothpicks or waving magic crystals over you. It also won't do much for you medically other than create a placebo effect.

    I would suggest checking out more articles on the Science Based Medicine blog on acupuncture. I find it is a really good resource for this kind of thing. It has well researched and cited articles written by physicians and researches who want to make sure science is the foundation of medicine.

    All the fully -convinced people with no personal experience on a given subject are so arrogant...and sad....and ridiculous....and sad...and arrogant...(did I mention ridiculous? :yawn: (Or does your version of "science" include accepting hearsay as fact?)

    Go get some acupuncture treatments from an experienced Chinese doctor, and THEN discuss the subject....Until you have had acupuncture, you're just another parrot.

    Quoting scientific studies is not parroting in the pejorative sense of the term. People who use anecdotal evidence as "proof" that something is across-the-board-inherently efficacious are far more parrot-like than those using valid scientific studies to form their opinions.

    Also, placebo effect. That's why acupuncture "works."
  • liftreadphilosophize
    liftreadphilosophize Posts: 180 Member
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    Hooey.

    From the excellent blog Science Based Medicine:

    http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/acupuncture-does-not-work-for-back-pain/

    "A new study which randomized 638 adults to either standard acupuncture, individualized acupuncture, placebo acupuncture using tooth picks that did not penetrate the skin, and standard therapy found exactly what previous evidence has also suggested – it does not seem to matter where you stick the needles or even if you stick the needles through the skin. The only reasonable scientific conclusion to draw from this is that acupuncture does not work."

    Some points about Acupuncture:
    1) Acupuncture is said to work by "balancing you Chi". Chi come from a pre-scientific view about how the body works. While this make be a useful philosophical concept, it is not a medical one. Chi does not exist the same way insulin exists. You cannot balance it. It will not help regulate your hormones.

    2) All of the positive studies on acupuncture come from places that design their studies poorly and never publish any negative results. The better designed and properly blinded studies all show no effect.

    3) You may feel better after an acupuncture session. Most people really enjoy going to a practitioner, having their concerns addressed, and undergoing some sort of intervention. However, it doesn't matter what that intervention is. It could be poking you with needles or toothpicks or waving magic crystals over you. It also won't do much for you medically other than create a placebo effect.

    I would suggest checking out more articles on the Science Based Medicine blog on acupuncture. I find it is a really good resource for this kind of thing. It has well researched and cited articles written by physicians and researches who want to make sure science is the foundation of medicine.

    It's foolish to form opinions about without knowledge.

    Personal experience:

    1) My daughter (at 4 years old) was diagnosed with asthma She was being poisoned by inhaler steriods, vomiting after treatment, etc...It was horrible. ..Then, cured (c-u-r-e-d) of the disease with acupuncture and herbs from a Chinese-trained doctor. Cured.

    2) I had a 110 lb steel hatch slip at work and jam my neck, and within a year there were days I literally COULD NOT turn my head, period. Chiropractic failed...Physical terapy made it worse....Cortisone injections, temporary relief.....Then my gongfu teacher introduced me to HIS teacher, who with one (1) acupunture session fixed my neck.....Been 16 years now.

    Sigh. Looking into the scientific studies examining the question at hand constitutes forming and gathering knowledge, knowledge you then use to form rational opinions. Using purely anecdotal evidence in isolation of available studies creates a very limited base of knowledge, so limited that you are very likely to make incorrect assumptions (and thus form incorrect opinions) about the truth of the whatever issue you're making claims about. There are so many factors in anecdotal situations that we can never measure or detect that anecdotes cannot be relied upon as the final word in whether something like acupuncture "works."
  • vingogly
    vingogly Posts: 1,785 Member
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    Personally, I lean toward the hooey side of the spectrum.

    I had acupuncture at a college of chiropractic here for back problems over a nine month period ... unfortunately, they also did a lot of other stuff, including teaching me exercises for my back. That was about 20 years ago, and I've had few problems with the lower back since ... but since they did so many other things (it was a teaching school), it's not clear what did the trick.

    I think the exercising and weight loss I've done since have done more for the back problems than anything else. I've had problems with upper back stiffness (age and inactivity related), and exercise (especially Pilates with a personal trainer) and therapeutic massage has helped a great deal with this over the past year.

    Don't underestimate the placebo effect, either, or the possibility that something else going on at the time had a positive influence rather than (or in addition to) the acupuncture. Correlation is not causation, and personal testimonies aren't particularly useful in "proving" something scientifically.

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