Is science failing me here??
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I mentioned it above but it seems to have been missed and OP has gone straight to the starvation mode solution of eating more to lose weight. After 3 weeks of dieting. smh
Oops, forgot to answer that. Yes I bought a food scale and have been measuring everything
How is eating more starvation mode?0 -
I know weight loss is your main goal, and others in this thread have addressed many points related to that. Yes, it takes time. Be patient. But also, to keep your spirits up while your waiting and working for it, try to also remember the other important things that this lifestyle change is bringing you.
-You are improving your cardiovascular function and improving your heart health.
-You are gaining strength and flexibility, which will help prevent injury.
-You are increasing bone density, which will serve you well as you age (women begin losing bone around age 35).
-You are providing your body with more of the vitamins and minerals and all nutrients it needs to keep you healthy.
-You are probably lowering your blood pressure.
So you might not be seeing anything happening when you go looking for it. But good things are happening in your body.0 -
The science is not failing you and don't listen to those espousing ditching cardio -- sheesh, whole lot of 'ex - spurts' here!!!
I've lost 52lbs since I started and I've done it based on MFP's system not TDEE (which many here are trying to tell you to do). Both systems work if you stick to them but don't expect a whole lot in just a few weeks.
1. Find your BMR (MFP does this for you when you set your goals) and be honest about your daily activity (Sedentary)
2. If losing 2lbs per week is your goal and allows you 1400 cals a day then stick with it
3. Overestimating what you eat and underestimating calories burned is ok and I advocate that somewhat -- but a word of caution: don't get crazy!
4, Eating back cardio cals is good but try not to eat more then about half of them when possible
Don't get discouraged and go changing everything because some joker tells you the science is wrong and the system MFP sets up doesn't work etc etc -- take it all with a grain of salt.
The science is accurate but humans aren't perfect. For example, the amount of calories you burn during exercise CAN NOT be accurately measured without some serious equipment and people are not 100% the same in everything so one 247lb woman running 3 miles may burn a different amount of calories then another woman the same weight and age running the same speed and distance -- same goes for how many cals you use in a day etc etc etc.
BUT you WILL lose weight if you stick to a caloric deficit daily with or without exercise. It just takes time -- I'm at 8 months and average about 7.5lbs per month but that means some months I drop like a rock and others my weight barely moves. Sometimes it's water, sometimes it's muscle (getting harder/denser etc) and sometimes it's just a mystery so hang in there and stick with your plan rather then changing it with the wind.
Eating well below BMR is not great for many reasons so a) TDEE already incorporates potential calories burned through workout and b) MFP encourages users to eat bak their calories.
Cardio plus heavy lifting will result in a better body than someone who only does cardio. Ask anyone. True story.0 -
I don't know the science behind it but I will tell you two things that have worked for me. First, eating more. I was keeping to the low calories lost some and then stopped losing. Starving and doing cardio until I dropped and had little loss. Read about eating more, worked up the nerve to actually eat more, and BINGO started to lose again. I'm 5'1 1/2", currently 124 lbs and I eat 1700-1800 calories everyday and I'm still losing. Second, lifting heavy things. I read about it forever but fear kept me from doing it. I'm now only 5 weeks into my lifting program and the changes in my body blow my mind. I noticed my body change around 2 1/2 weeks in and thought I was just seeing things but my husband even said it looks like I'm just melting away. I have no idea why it works but it works!! So I would suggest to you to try the tdee method for a month and just see how you feel. If it doesn't do what you want you can always cut the calories back, and lift. Don't wait until later, do it now. I so wish I had started earlier.0
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The science is not failing you and don't listen to those espousing ditching cardio -- sheesh, whole lot of 'ex - spurts' here!!!
I've lost 52lbs since I started and I've done it based on MFP's system not TDEE (which many here are trying to tell you to do). Both systems work if you stick to them but don't expect a whole lot in just a few weeks.
TDEE and MFP methods aren't that far apart if you're actually honest with the calculations. Why would you recommend the OP to use a sedentary entry if they admittedly aren't living a sedentary lifestyle?0 -
Your husband is right, muscle weighs 4x more than fat. You are increasing muscle mass, that's going to affect the scales. What matters more than numbers, is how do you feel? How do your clothes fit? There's no doubt you've lost inches....
UHH, NO. Muscle mass is not increased in a caloric deficit.0 -
Keep at it and you will eventually see results.
Can't say that I've read all of the responses, but I wanted to chime in and say that three things that helped me stay sane while losing the weight were:
1) Get a heart rate monitor. Taking some of the guess work out of your workout calorie burns will keep you from always second guessing the appropriateness of your calorie intake.
2) Weigh and measure your food. It's really easy to underestimate your intake, or over-estimate. I'm always surprised by how much ice cream I can have by weight, and how little peanut butter.
3) Measure and take photos monthly (front, side, back). This has made ALL the difference for me! When the scale doesn't move much, it's nice to have some objective and subjective proof that I'm still getting smaller.0 -
Keep at it and you will eventually see results.
Can't say that I've read all of the responses, but I wanted to chime in and say that three things that helped me stay sane while losing the weight were:
1) Get a heart rate monitor. Taking some of the guess work out of your workout calorie burns will keep you from always second guessing the appropriateness of your calorie intake.
2) Weigh and measure your food. It's really easy to underestimate your intake, or over-estimate. I'm always surprised by how much ice cream I can have by weight, and how little peanut butter.
3) Measure and take photos monthly (front, side, back). This has made ALL the difference for me! When the scale doesn't move much, it's nice to have some objective and subjective proof that I'm still getting smaller.
Great advice! Thank you 0 -
The science is not failing you and don't listen to those espousing ditching cardio -- sheesh, whole lot of 'ex - spurts' here!!!
I've lost 52lbs since I started and I've done it based on MFP's system not TDEE (which many here are trying to tell you to do). Both systems work if you stick to them but don't expect a whole lot in just a few weeks.
TDEE and MFP methods aren't that far apart if you're actually honest with the calculations. Why would you recommend the OP to use a sedentary entry if they admittedly aren't living a sedentary lifestyle?
Nothing in the OP says she isn't sedentary and most who gain weight (like we all did or why are we here) didn't do so working in construction. Furthermore, exercise is not counted when determining your daily activity level which is why it's added back in later if you choose.
TDEE is different in that it gives an average daily caloric intake rather then a min/max - both systems work and different people will find one more effective then the other at any given time. I'm merely pointing out that telling someone who's started one method that they should drop it and go to another is VERY POOR advice because both work -- what happens 3 weeks later if she still isn't happen? Switch with the wind to another style and hope?
Better to stick with the first one long enough to see some benefit and to get the hang of it rather then 'eating more' when eating more was the problem to begin with.
I see people post 'eat more to lose' often and it isn't accurate. You eat LESS to lose it's just how to calculate how much less daily that differs. For example, if you use MFP the way it was designed and you do not exercise but want to lose constantly then you don't add back to your daily goal but, as a reward, when you do exercise you can eat more.
Anyway, she will do as she chooses but my advice still stands (for what it's worth).0 -
1) Get a heart rate monitor. Taking some of the guess work out of your workout calorie burns will keep you from always second guessing the appropriateness of your calorie intake.
An HRM is still a guess -- don't kid yourself. Without VO2 calculations you are guessing regardless what you use.0 -
Yes, the science is failing you because the science you are using is wrong.
The law of energy conservation such that the amount of energy taken in minus the amount of energy used equals the amount of energy put into storage (such that if out > in that means energy released from storage) is not wrong. There is nothing unique about human weight management that means the laws of science do not apply.
However, there can be errors in accounting for the number of calories eaten, errors in accounting for the exercise taken and errors in the estimation of BMR and the allowance for normal activity level of your lifestyle. In particular there are many that believe that energy used as part of BMR is not fixed or independent of energy taken in but that there are hormonal influences on BMR that mean it can be dependent on what you eat and what you do.Ditch the chronic cardio and start lifting some heavy things. Weights will do more to shape your body than any amount of cardio.
If that's the shape you're after then by all means go for that. On the other hand you are maintaining those muscles at a strength and/or volume than would not otherwise be the case and that will only last as long as you continue to do the training.
Others have pointed out that muscle uses more energy when doing nothing than fat does in the same situation so this would increase your BMR and could aid losing fat. Yet others point to hormones released as a result of the training.
Either way it is certainly not necessary to do strength training to lose weight and, in particular to lose fat.Eat more. You're eating far too little and your body is rebelling. You're probably also causing some insulin issues which can make the body hold on to more fat.
I'd be interested to hear how eating too little causes insulin issues. There can be an issue with blood sugar spikes and a corresponding out-of-sync insulin spike caused by foods that release sugar into the bloodstream quickly such as sugars and refinded carbs.Muscle does not "weigh more than fat". A pound is a pound regardless of what the material is. Fat is BULKIER than muscle, which will cause your clothes not to fit well. You can weigh the same weight with slightly less fat and look thinner.
How much muscle does or does not weigh more than how much fat? Obviously equal weights of anything will weigh the same. I suspect what is meant by that statement is that given equal volumes of fat and muscle the muscle will weigh more or in other words mucle is denser than fat.Be patient as others have said. While it's nice to see some visible progress early on, most people it takes a lot of time to see anything significant, especially if you've been overweight for a long time, as you are likely battling not only fat, but hormonal issues as well (insulin, cortisol, etc. which can also explain some of the depression you mentioned).
I think when I started, not much happenned in the first week but then the weight started to come off steadily.I also personally fully believe in a lower carbohydrate, high fat and protein diet being much more effective for people. Many on this board will disagree, but I've seen results first hand in many people.
A work colleague of mine reported losing plenty of weight on such a diet. The most interesting things for me was that he reported not feeling hungry despite the weight loss and it was this that inspired me to start dieting.
The obvious conclusion to draw from his experience, before having read any background info, was that satiety must be controlled by protein or fat or some combination of the two such that having eaten enough of one or both of those one no longer felt hungry.
Rather than try to eliminate carbs or make an increase in fat or protein I used MFP and just made the reduction in the number of calories to eat from carbs. I figured my meat portions were modest anyway and that seemed to be the amount that satisfied my hunger. It would be hard to reduce fat much without also reducing protein, What I could easily do, however was to eat less carbohydrate while keeping the others things the same by, for example:
1. Eating less breakfast cereal.
2. Instead of easting two lightly filled rolls or sandwiches pack the same filling into one.
3. Serve less pasta with a meal.
And it worked - I started losing weight without getting hungry.
While my current diet now has a higher proportion of energy coming from protein and fat than the previous diet neither the total amount of energy from those sources nor the absolute amount of those has increased. I figure this means this diet can't really be any less healthy than my previous diet and the resultant slimming will have its own health benefits.0 -
...except in the OP where they specifically state "I run between 1-3 miles on the elliptical about 4 times a week. I eat back most of my calories." That kinda spells out "not sedentary" to me.Nothing in the OP says she isn't sedentary and most who gain weight (like we all did or why are we here) didn't do so working in construction. Furthermore, exercise is not counted when determining your daily activity level which is why it's added back in later if you choose.TDEE is different in that it gives an average daily caloric intake rather then a min/max - both systems work and different people will find one more effective then the other at any given time. I'm merely pointing out that telling someone who's started one method that they should drop it and go to another is VERY POOR advice because both work -- what happens 3 weeks later if she still isn't happen? Switch with the wind to another style and hope?
Except that MFP allows folks a lower intake based on "I WANT TO LOSE 2 lbs! I'm SEDENTARY!" when 2lbs per week loss may very well be too aggressive. All I'm saying is that both are calculations and if you're honest/educated when you key the numbers in on MFP, the TDEE -X% is actually only tiny bit different in the net number of calories needed per person. It's a sliding scale. I've been doing this and literally comparing my numbers across the board for 500+ days. The calculations aren't that far apart if you're honest.
Not if the first method is flawed because of the "I WANT TO LOSE 2 lbs/week! I'm Sedentary!" input that most folks key in to MFP. Worst case scenario, they OP will take a look at a few other calorie estimations based on other websites that take more data sets into play.Better to stick with the first one long enough to see some benefit and to get the hang of it rather then 'eating more' when eating more was the problem to begin with.I see people post 'eat more to lose' often and it isn't accurate. You eat LESS to lose it's just how to calculate how much less daily that differs. For example, if you use MFP the way it was designed and you do not exercise but want to lose constantly then you don't add back to your daily goal but, as a reward, when you do exercise you can eat more.
Sadly, most times that I have to give the "eat more to lose" advice, it's to an OP that doesn't understand that they have to eat ENOUGH to sustain themselves. Most folks, myself included, have been obese/overweight.. and when they sign up on here.. track their calories.. and realize that they're losing.. they fall into a "well, I'm losing weight.. MFP tells me that when I lose, I have to eat less to keep losing" which is a flawed logic.
..but again, what do I know about losing weight?0 -
I'm sensing that this is a controversial topic..0
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I love reading responses and seeing the myriad of straight downright awful concepts people are pulling from somewhere.0
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Unfortunately the mfp calculator just does simple math. It based on numbers you put in and doesn't take into account the fact that your body could care less if you exercised. Only your mind thinks that exercise, especially cardio, is inherently good for you. Your body is trying to make it to tomorrow, and the day after, so it will do what it takes to make that happen. Oh yea, and it doesn't think you're going to eat tomorrow.
What you are describing is a text book way to slow down your metabolism.
I'm inboxing you.0 -
Unfortunately the mfp calculator just does simple math. It based on numbers you put in and doesn't take into account the fact that your body could care less if you exercised. Only your mind thinks that exercise, especially cardio, is inherently good for you. Your body is trying to make it to tomorrow, and the day after, so it will do what it takes to make that happen. Oh yea, and it doesn't think you're going to eat tomorrow.
What you are describing is a text book way to slow down your metabolism.
I'm inboxing you.
That's what I said. But what do I know. Metabolic slowdown exists and possibly more in women than men. BUt again, I'm just ranting.0 -
I'm sensing that this is a controversial topic..
the problem is, especially on mfp is that everyone thinks they are right and will not give up any ground and will fight tooth and nail.
The simple truth is, if its not working for you, try something else. And again, and again and again until it works. Then when it stops working, try something else.0 -
Hi guys,
I'm relatively new to the weight loss game. I've been logging for almost 3 weeks now on MFP and have been reading your forum posts religiously trying to get as much insight as I can into how to best go about losing the weight.
I'm 21 years old, 5'7 and 247 pounds. I've got quite a long way to go and so far I've been so optimistic that if I follow what MFP tells me, I should lose weight, because it's scientific, right? With that in mind, I've been logging every single thing that touched my lips, overestimate my calories, and underestimate my exercise - just to be certain I'm not going over. I eat 1400 calories a day and run between 1-3 miles on the elliptical about 4 times a week. I eat back most of my calories.
I've been trying to eat as healthily as I can. Me and my husband plan our meals at the beginning of the week and cook/pack the food for lunches and dinner so we have no excuses to go out to eat or be lazy when it comes to meals. We're both huge foodies (since we got married last year we've both put on a lot of weight - he's also a damn good cook!) but we've both decided to change our lifestyle to become more healthy together and lose the weight.
Sounds good right? Well since I've been logging I have weighed myself every morning and have only been fluctuating between a loss of 1-2 pounds total in three weeks. I have MFP set to lose 2 pounds a week. What's going on here? I know I shouldn't be discouraged since a two pound loss is still a loss, but it's really disheartening when I've got so far to go and am not making any further progress despite trying so hard.
I was under the impression that eating at a deficit guaranteed weight loss.. have I got my numbers wrong? I have seen some posts on here that say you need to eat more to lose more. I'm not really sure how that works. I don't feel deprived at 1400 calories a day, and I'm scared to go higher for fear of gaining. Is this just a case of wait it out and keep doing what I'm doing, or should I be doing something else? My husband thinks we're just gaining muscle from working out and that's why the scale won't budge. I'm not too sure.
Anyway, any insight or advice would be welcomed. Sorry for the long post. You guys are such inspirations.
Here's my advice:
#1-DONT take everything you see on the forums as gospel truth. Seriously, there's a lot of different opinions, views, and "answers" to every question you could ask. Some people are totally qualified to answer questions you have....and a lot...usually the loudest, most adamant ones AREN'T! Just take what you get on here with a grain of salt. You might find helpful suggestions, but in the long run, everything on here is a suggestion. People lose weight in a billion different ways...you have to find the right way for you.
#2-With that being said, it's time to experiment. Only YOU can figure out how best for YOU to lose weight. Ideally it would be as simple as MFP makes it...and simply it is...but you have to remember that things aren't always simple. You might do wonderful only following calories and not making a single exercise change. You might be able to eat junk and exercise your *kitten* off. You might be best with no gluten, no carbs, no meat, no jelly beans....who knows. Some people run/bike/lift for hours on end. Some just walk for an hour at night. Some can lift hundreds of pounds and some can barely lift 5#s. The best advice I can give you is to find something that works for you LONG TERM. You don't want to lose 100 lbs only eating beans and then go back to eating normally and put it all back on.
#3-The best best best way to make the MFP math work for you is to be as accurate as possible. I'll be the first to admit that I am totally not the person to measure out to the .000001g my food or to the last calorie for my exercise. But tools that have personally helped me are my food scale (~$20 on Amazon) and my Heart Rate Monitor (Mine was ~$100 but you can find cheaper ones for less and fancier ones for more...). Overestimating food and underestimating exercise is all well and good, but in the end that's all it will be...a guess in the dark. For the record, the difference in my burns on my Heart Rate Monitor and MFP can sometimes be half, or double. So underestimating the exercise won't always be sufficient.
#4-Realize your body changes day to day, and water weight, hormones, etc CAN and WILL be influential to your weight on any given day. Drink as much water as you can. Sip it throughout the day, etc.
#5-Sort of 4b, but this is the big one...learn to find the victories off of the scale. It's ok to weigh yourself once a week, etc, but I've seen people on here who not only weigh every day but 2-3 times a day. Take Pictures of yourself before and at regular intervals to compare, take measurements (You can find body measurement tools on amazon too..), see how your clothes fit, etc.
Oh and #6...Since you said you're both foodies, find websites (like skinnytaste.com) that show healthy versions of some delicious food, or look up healthy substitutions for stuff and figure out your own recipes....I've made some of the besttttt stuff that's actually suppper healthy and no one is the wiser.
Edited to add: #7...The community is probably the best part of this site. Sure it's amazing to see my numbers, consistently log and of course lose weight...but the best most magic part of MFP isn't even that. I have met some of the most amazing and supportive people on this site. They've given me advice and suggestions when I've needed it, ran races with me, encouraged me when I was down, and most importantly pushed me to get back at it when I've been in a rut. Don't be afraid to get on the message boards and make some new friends. One thing I didn't realize when I first started to try to lose weight was this: It was a lonely, lonely road. You're lucky that your hubby is trying to do it with you...be each other's support! I've got a pretty supportive family...so the people on here have just been amazing. I hope you find all the success in the world!0 -
I would say the numbers on the scale are only one measure of progress and I would try not to be to discouraged. You should also keep in mind the benefits of eating healthy and exercising regularly i.e. you probably have more energy and are most probably fitter than you were 3 weeks prior. Keep it up, eat clean, train hard and I'm sure the scales will take care of themselves.0
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Here's my advice:
#1-DONT take everything you see on the forums as gospel truth. Seriously, there's a lot of different opinions, views, and "answers" to every question you could ask. Some people are totally qualified to answer questions you have....and a lot...usually the loudest, most adamant ones AREN'T! Just take what you get on here with a grain of salt. You might find helpful suggestions, but in the long run, everything on here is a suggestion. People lose weight in a billion different ways...you have to find the right way for you.
#2-With that being said, it's time to experiment. Only YOU can figure out how best for YOU to lose weight. Ideally it would be as simple as MFP makes it...and simply it is...but you have to remember that things aren't always simple. You might do wonderful only following calories and not making a single exercise change. You might be able to eat junk and exercise your *kitten* off. You might be best with no gluten, no carbs, no meat, no jelly beans....who knows. Some people run/bike/lift for hours on end. Some just walk for an hour at night. Some can lift hundreds of pounds and some can barely lift 5#s. The best advice I can give you is to find something that works for you LONG TERM. You don't want to lose 100 lbs only eating beans and then go back to eating normally and put it all back on.
#3-The best best best way to make the MFP math work for you is to be as accurate as possible. I'll be the first to admit that I am totally not the person to measure out to the .000001g my food or to the last calorie for my exercise. But tools that have personally helped me are my food scale (~$20 on Amazon) and my Heart Rate Monitor (Mine was ~$100 but you can find cheaper ones for less and fancier ones for more...). Overestimating food and underestimating exercise is all well and good, but in the end that's all it will be...a guess in the dark. For the record, the difference in my burns on my Heart Rate Monitor and MFP can sometimes be half, or double. So underestimating the exercise won't always be sufficient.
#4-Realize your body changes day to day, and water weight, hormones, etc CAN and WILL be influential to your weight on any given day. Drink as much water as you can. Sip it throughout the day, etc.
#5-Sort of 4b, but this is the big one...learn to find the victories off of the scale. It's ok to weight yourself once a week, etc, but I've seen people on here who not only weight every day but 2-3 times a day. Take Pictures of yourself before and at regular intervals to compare, take measurements (You can find body measurement tools on amazon too..), see how your clothes fit, etc.
Oh and #6...Since you said you're both foodies, find websites (like skinnytaste.com) that show healthy versions of some delicious food, or look up healthy substitutions for stuff and figure out your own recipes....I've made some of the besttttt stuff that's actually suppper healthy and no one is the wiser.
Edited to add: #7...The community is probably the best part of this site. Sure it's amazing to see my numbers, consistently log and of course lose weight...but the best most magic part of MFP isn't even that. I have met some of the most amazing and supportive people on this site. They've given me advice and suggestions when I've needed it, ran races with me, encouraged me when I was down, and most importantly pushed me to get back at it when I've been in a rut. Don't be afraid to get on the message boards and make some new friends. One thing I didn't realize when I first started to try to lose weight was this: It was a lonely, lonely road. You're lucky that your hubby is trying to do it with you...be each other's support! I've got a pretty supportive family...so the people on here have just been amazing. I hope you find all the success in the world!
Thank you for this advice. I am really looking for a sustainable solution, like you said, finding something that can work long term. I've seen both my mother and father struggle with losing weight and gain it all back again plus some as soon as they get off the diet. This is not a way I want to live. I'm determined to do it right!0
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