A calorie is not a calorie - proof sugar is the problem.
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Lol, this thread is getting hilarious. Lots of other countries who don't have obesity issues eat LOTS of sugar products. They just don't eat TONS of sugar laden products daily.
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Obese by 'BMI' standards and eating large amounts of carbs.For those who claim they can lose weight while eating loads of sugar, have any of you ever been very overweight or obese?
Also at some points have eaten proportions of carbs and lost weight.
I wonder if 'these foods' really do make most of those people sick.The basis of paleo dieting is 'These foods make us sick. It's probably because as a species we aren't used to eating them. To avoid getting sick we will eat foods as close as we can to what we ate as we evolved to the humans we are now.'
It's not about living like a caveman, its about not becoming ill because you haven't adapted to eating grain.
I have not seen any evidence that the foods we may have eaten while evolving to our current state are 'healthier' for us than we eat now.
To presume that evolution gives us the chance of perfection if we match it shows a great misunderstanding of the concept of evolution (by 'natural' selection.)
I rather suspect that paelo people generally suffered a lore more illnesses and certainly were more likely to die younger. So from that, I expect the little data we have won't point to them generally being healthier than we are today, even if that were the case.0 -
Nice to read opposing views (especially from the scientists - thanks for that).
I guess you have to look at upsides versus downsides right:-
A) If Lutwig is right and I cut all sugar out except from eating fruit - then I stand to get potentially massive health gains (or disease avoidance) for the price of losing out on the taste of ice cream or chocolate (which I definitely ate way too much of).
If Lutiwg is wrong and I wont get any disease prevention, the only thing I'm losing is the taste of ice cream or chocolate right? I mean there are no nutritionists I've heard of suggesting we actually need to eat extra sugar in our foods to survive right? We clearly do not or our ancestors wouldn't have survived.
If you look at this with an un-biased (non-sugar addicted) mindset - I think it's objectively clear that what you 'lose' in cutting sugar is zero to trivial (taste pleasure) versus the potential upsides if Lutwig is correct (major disease avoidance). If we were talking about an essential macro-nutrient here like protein or fat, then the decision would be more complicated but this is sugar we are talking about here - humans didn't even have it in significant amounts until Barbados was settled in the 18th Century.
Addicted to Pleasure - Sugar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lG1CM7zXK5w0 -
oh, you can live without carbohydrates. i'm not arguing that point. you just won't have the readily available energy you'd have if you ate carbohydrates and you'll likely be sluggish.
But I'm not sluggish and I have plenty of energy and people on even lower carb than I, for longer periods that I, are not having problems with energy or mental sluggishness.
a) i don't know your dietary intake of carbs
b) you can't self-diagnose sluggishness. that's like asking a frog to guess the temperature of the water in the pot it's in as it's brought to a slow boil.0 -
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If you can't say no to sugar, then sure, avoid it. But not everybody lacks the mental fortitude to turn away sugar.0 -
oh, you can live without carbohydrates. i'm not arguing that point. you just won't have the readily available energy you'd have if you ate carbohydrates and you'll likely be sluggish.
But I'm not sluggish and I have plenty of energy and people on even lower carb than I, for longer periods that I, are not having problems with energy or mental sluggishness.
a) i don't know your dietary intake of carbs
b) you can't self-diagnose sluggishness. that's like asking a frog to guess the temperature of the water in the pot it's in as it's brought to a slow boil.
Are you serious?!! You cant self diagnose sluggishness?
Who diagnoses sluggishness for you? Do you have to go to the doctor and take the sluggishness test? When you go to the doctor and complain you are feeling tired and sluggish does your doctor say 'hold on there! We cant know if you're sluggish or not until we perform some mental acuity tests!'
What a ridiculous thing to say.0 -
Obese by 'BMI' standards and eating large amounts of carbs.For those who claim they can lose weight while eating loads of sugar, have any of you ever been very overweight or obese?
Also at some points have eaten proportions of carbs and lost weight.
I wonder if 'these foods' really do make most of those people sick.The basis of paleo dieting is 'These foods make us sick. It's probably because as a species we aren't used to eating them. To avoid getting sick we will eat foods as close as we can to what we ate as we evolved to the humans we are now.'
It's not about living like a caveman, its about not becoming ill because you haven't adapted to eating grain.
I have not seen any evidence that the foods we may have eaten while evolving to our current state are 'healthier' for us than we eat now.
To presume that evolution gives us the chance of perfection if we match it shows a great misunderstanding of the concept of evolution (by 'natural' selection.)
I rather suspect that paelo people generally suffered a lore more illnesses and certainly were more likely to die younger. So from that, I expect the little data we have won't point to them generally being healthier than we are today, even if that were the case.
these paleo nutters make claims about "inflammation" and how their diet fights that and thus makes them healthier. the problem is that it's a nebulous concept the way they use it and there is no medical or scientific research on this subject and the paleo diet that i'm aware of. it all sounds vaguely pseudo-scientific and they make all sorts of claims that non-scientific people who desperately want to believe do believe, but that doesn't pass muster for me.
wanna cut down on "inflammation"? take an advil every morning. maybe that's the next big diet fad... "the ibuprofen diet"0 -
Here's what I think:
Sugar, and carbs in general, may or may not be bad for you. They may or may not be less bad for you in moderation.
But here's what I'm certain of:
If you eat a paleo-like diet, that is, a diet that consists mostly of meats, vegetables, and other unprocessed foods, you will probably be eating at a calorie deficit and you will probably be eating food that is good for you.
Yes, you can become fat eating good food, and all through the ages there are records of fat people. A glutton is a glutton.
But I can sit down and eat an entire tin of breakfast cinnamon buns with icing, because it tastes so damn good!. But put a serving bowl of scrambled eggs in front of me, and after about 2-3 eggs worth of the stuff I've about had enough because it's just not that captivating.
Not to mention the fact that eating sugary things definitely spikes your blood sugar and you definitely feel hungry when your blood sugar level crashes, compelling you to seek out the yummy food again.0 -
I must be a unique butterfly-unicorn-wizard, I lost my weight eating between 100-200g of sugar a day.
No Foods are Inherently Fattening.
Consider this study showing that “reduced-calorie diets result in clinically meaningful weight loss regardless of which macronutrients they emphasize.” - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19246357
Or perhaps this study which found “diets differing substantially in glycemic load induce comparable long-term weight loss.”- http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17413101
The astounding results of Professor Mark Haub who lost 27lbs and improved markers of health while eating a diet consisting of Twinkies.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html
The evidence is clear: No foods are inherently fattening!
Flexible dieting
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/117075500 -
I'm glad I'm "special" and can have sugar daily and still be fit and lean. I should pass my genetics on to others.:laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition0 -
My brother swears by this no sugar philsophy. He does power lifting and constantly building more mass muscle. Since Im not a huge meat eater, it made me very sluggish to just eat mean and veggies, when I tried to adapt his philosphy exactly. Anyways, when I do eat simple sugars, I just can't stop...it's like a drug high. So I have adapted that for me, there is no such that as moderation when it comes to sugar, cause on bite can be to much. I do still like to eat fruit, and that's one thing Im not giving up. I believe that if it came from the earth and grows from the ground it's good for me.0
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oh, you can live without carbohydrates. i'm not arguing that point. you just won't have the readily available energy you'd have if you ate carbohydrates and you'll likely be sluggish.
But I'm not sluggish and I have plenty of energy and people on even lower carb than I, for longer periods that I, are not having problems with energy or mental sluggishness.
a) i don't know your dietary intake of carbs
b) you can't self-diagnose sluggishness. that's like asking a frog to guess the temperature of the water in the pot it's in as it's brought to a slow boil.
Are you serious?!! You cant self diagnose sluggishness?
Who diagnoses sluggishness for you? Do you have to go to the doctor and take the sluggishness test? When you go to the doctor and complain you are feeling tired and sluggish does your doctor say 'hold on there! We cant know if you're sluggish or not until we perform some mental acuity tests!'
What a ridiculous thing to say.
you ask the people around you if they notice a difference. they will have a better perspective than you will. it's the same with drunks. drunk people never think they are as drunk as they actually are. it takes an outsider to see how drunk they truly are.
you are claiming that you are not sluggish. i am just saying that you probably have a bias and cannot be the one to make that determination.
anyway, i don't really care what you do. this discussion has gotten absurd. eat zero carbs for all i care. you're an anonymous person on a free forum that has clearly fallen for the low carb propaganda. do whatever floats your boat. it matters not to me.0 -
Curious
For those who claim they can lose weight while eating loads of sugar, have any of you ever been very overweight or obese?
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250lbs.0 -
Sugar: The “Poisonous” Sweet?
Readers of National Geographic who are accustomed to reading about exotic animals and locations may be disappointed when they pick up their August addition. Rather than lions and tigers or Mount Everest being featured on the cover, the top story for this new addition will profile a humdrum foodstuff: Sugar.
While some may find the article’s 1,400 word history of sugar a dazzling read, the key notes are devoted to convincing people that a perfectly safe food ingredient is the modern-day plague. Robert Lustig makes an appearance to shill for his dubious theories, which gives an idea where the piece is going.
According to one Richard Johnson it’s not even your fault that you decided to lay on the couch and watch television all day. No, it’s the sugar that kept you watching Animal Planet instead of hiking the wilderness:
[Americans] eat too much and exercise too little because they’re addicted to sugar, which not only makes them fatter but, after the initial sugar rush, also saps their energy, beaching them on the couch. ‘The reason you’re watching TV is not because TV is so good . . . but because you have no energy to exercise, because you’re eating too much sugar.’
In Lustig’s and Johnson’s view, sugar controls your mind at every twist. It’s an appealing view for the food cops, since it denies personal responsibility and empowers trial lawyers, but it lacks scientific validity. Researchers from Cambridge University investigated this notion of “food addiction” and determined that “criteria for substance dependence translate poorly to food-related behaviors.”
You would think a publication like National Geographic would use the concern about obesity as an opportunity to get everyone more interested in exploring the great outdoors. But as we see on an all-too-frequent basis nowadays, it’s just another Food Police hit piece on Americans’ favorite sweets.0 -
I abstain from sugar and its processed cousins...have since 1978, before a lot of you were born.
But that is because I'm an admitted "Sugarholic" and couldn't eat just one piece like many of my MFP friends, and was tired of yo-yo dieting. I will never give up my fruit, or limit myself to one piece a day as you do.
As long as my calorie count stays at maintenance level, I can eat all the fresh fruit, vegetables, good carbs, poultry and fish/seafood I want.
I am healthy, active and happy gal of almost 73!0 -
I'm glad I'm "special" and can have sugar daily and still be fit and lean. I should pass my genetics on to others.:laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Not a personal attack, but your ticker says 15lb out of 30 lost - how did a certified trainer get so overweight?0 -
If you ate a crap ton of sugar but still created a deficit, you'd lose weight. Sugar does not break the laws of thermodynamics.0
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By engaging in deliberate cycles of bulking and cutting, in order to achieve the muscle mass and definition they desire. Also, "overweight" here is probably misleading.I'm glad I'm "special" and can have sugar daily and still be fit and lean. I should pass my genetics on to others.:laugh:
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness industry for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Not a personal attack, but your ticker says 15lb out of 30 lost - how did a certified trainer get so overweight?0 -
thanks tweetr0
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