Intermediate weight training for women

seena511 · October 2013

so i've been lifting for several years now off and on. i'm currently trying to lose at least 10 more lbs, possibly as many as 20. i'm 5'8" 158 lbs; i eat 1900 calories/day flat with my macros set so that i try to get at least 119 g of protein and 60 g of fat. i've been eating this way for about 3 weeks now.

my issue is with my weightlifting progress. during the warmer months i was really focused on endurance cycling, so i only had two days of weightlifting per week at the most, and for about a month i stopped lifting almost completely while i trained for a duathlon. now that it's cold and i can't really get outside, i'm lifting three days per week and then doing two days of cardio. i do the following lifts:

chest/back:
bench press
kroc rows
seated cable row
cable incline/decline chest press
push ups
lat pulldowns

legs:
squats
deadlifts
lunges
calf press
angled leg press

arms/shoulders:
standing OHP
assisted pull ups
assisted dips
lateral raises
bicep curls
overhead tricep extension
face pulls

plus some ab work once or twice a week.

my big issue is with my bench press. basically i've not made any progress (or barely any) in pretty much the entire time i've been lifting. i was excited a few weeks ago when i was able to knock out 8 reps at 65 lbs, but today i barely eked out 7. i then was only able to do 2 reps at 70 lbs, where previously i had been able to get 4. i'm not really sure what the problem is and why i can't advance on bench, especially when i've been able to improve on other lifts.

so what i'm asking is for recommendations of how i can improve this, especially if you know of a program i could follow. i've heard of NROLFW but i was wondering if it's too beginner for me, and i'm worried that StrongLifts doesn't address what i want. i'm happy to hear any and all suggestions :-)

KarenJanine · October 2013

I wonder if benching just once a week could be stalling you, in which case a programme like Stronglifts could help as the frequency is slightly higher (benching every 4 or 5 days). It is generally regarded as a beginner programme but it is aimed at adding strength which I assume is your goal as you are trying to increase the weight. You could always add in your other lifts as accessory work at the end of each workout if you felt the programme was not enough for you.

micheleb15 · October 2013

I can only offer support - but this definitely happens. I have good days and bad days - my two weakest lifts are bench and deadlifts. I have issues with my deadlift form and bench is just one of my weaker exercises. I can knock out squats and overhead presses like a champ, which is completely backwards from what I hear. My chest should be stronger than my shoulders and I should be able to deadlift more than I squat.

I think stronglifts is a good progressive program - I am starting 5/3/1 now that I know my 1 Rep Max. I also only do bench work 1 day a week, but my chest is getting worked with my other upper body exercises on other days.

Leadfoot_Lewis · October 2013

Don't take offense to this, but if you're only benching 70lbs then you are still a beginner.

What does "Stronglifts doesn't address what I want" mean?

Find a good lifting program that focuses on the compound lifts, less isolation work, and that allows you to work muscle groups multiple times a week. If strength is your goal than Stronglifts or Starting Strength are proven programs.

jacksonpt · October 2013

1) make sure your form is at least decent.
2) work secondary muscles (shoulders, lats, etc) to help.
3) "strong lifts doesn't address what I need" - what's that mean?

crb0077 · October 2013

I have issues with bench presses too......ladies just aren't built with strong chest muscles so we have to be patient! I'm currently stuck at about 77lbs (35kg) for 8! I've been doing dumbbell presses and fly's to try to strengthen my chest and some push ups every day (apart from chest day!)

I have the opposite problem to you micheleb15 with Deadlifts...can currently deadlift 198lbs (90kg) but can't squat for diddly as my form is out (my hips tilt too far forward) and I have been working on it for 8 months and still am not allowed to add any decent weight! : (

I love working my legs and butt too...I can press 837lb (380kg) on the angled leg press so it frustrates me that I can't start setting some good pbs on my squats!

Isn't it funny how each body has different limits within itself....funny and frustrating - I want to be good at everything!

jacksonpt · October 2013

It's said that the best way to improve your bench is with dips.

crb0077 · October 2013

Oooh I will be dipping more then!! Thank you for that : )

Will_Thrust_For_Candy · October 2013

1) make sure your form is at least decent.
2) work secondary muscles (shoulders, lats, etc) to help.
3) "strong lifts doesn't address what I need" - what's that mean?

I agree with Jackson on the above points.

Do some research on proper form for the bench press. Form breakdown can often be the culprit for a stall. Also, try increasing your weight by 1 or 2lb increments rather than 5lb increments. As women we are often weaker on the upper body lifts so sometimes fractional increases can help a great deal.

SL is a great program and really, even if you just run it for 12 weeks to take advantage of the consistency and progression you will be much further ahead, IMO.

Safiyandi · October 2013

Do some research on proper form for the bench press. Form breakdown can often be the culprit for a stall. Also, try increasing your weight by 1 or 2lb increments rather than 5lb increments. As women we are often weaker on the upper body lifts so sometimes fractional increases can help a great deal.

Came here to suggest this. Sometimes 1.25# plates are expensive, but you can go to any hardware store and get an employee to cut a pair of chains at a little over a foot.

Also Starting Strength/Stronglifts/other LP program.

amy1612 · October 2013

I love working my legs and butt too...I can press 837lb (380kg) on the angled leg press so it frustrates me that I can't start setting some good pbs on my squats!

Leg press less and squat more, really working on it. You'll get there.

crb0077 · October 2013

Thank you Amy.....my trainer can see how frustrated I'm getting so gets me to squat with kettle bells every other leg day (the kettle bell seems to make me straighter.....the leg press has sorted out my knees coming together on the up......so I am halfway towards getting sorted! My other problem is my personality...if I can't do something I get really disheartened so he doesn't push it too much....tries to correct things without me realising and getting stroppy haha! I have noticed he's been making me squat more often....he also puts me in the smith machine to do some and using TRX I will get there in the end!!! : )

ElliottTN · October 2013

Just a couple of suggestions:
-Could be time for a deload week
-if you are on bench than switch over to dumbells for a bit (vice versa if you are already on dumbells)
-Your triceps are a huuuuge part of this lift. If they are not fresh when you work it then the impact is huge. Also maybe time to throw in some heavy tricep work (this is also why another poster said dips work really well)
-incline and decline presses are your friend.
-make sure your form is correct. Packing your shoulders if you are not will bet instant gains and protect against injury.

Just a quick checklist I go through when I encounter a stall.

JoRocka · October 2013

shove your knees out and go deep.

If you want to really work on the squat- ditch the KB and go with the BB- the KB will only get you so far.

As for bench- get a spotter- get stuck under the bar- realize you WON"T die.

Benching is one of the few VERY vunerable places to be- and if you get stuck it can be scary- get a spotter.... push till you fail and realize IT"S OKAY. (not saying fail every time you workout- but you have to realize it's okay- and you need to know what that feels like)

There is a great deal of fear women have with failing lifts- esp bench for some reason. It's okay to fail- as long as you are set up to handle it- either roll of shame- or spotter- or whatever. It's okay.

Keep doing it- 70 lbs isn't much so keep pushing- it'll get better.

Learn how to compound bench- not isolate bench. That will help too.

jacksonpt · October 2013

As for bench- get a spotter- get stuck under the bar- realize you WON"T die.

Benching is one of the few VERY vunerable places to be- and if you get stuck it can be scary- get a spotter.... push till you fail and realize IT"S OKAY. (not saying fail every time you workout- but you have to realize it's okay- and you need to know what that feels like)

There is a great deal of fear women have with failing lifts- esp bench for some reason. It's okay to fail- as long as you are set up to handle it- either roll of shame- or spotter- or whatever. It's okay.

Keep doing it- 70 lbs isn't much so keep pushing- it'll get better.

Learn how to compound bench- not isolate bench. That will help too.

Excellent points.

I don't have/use a spotter, so I bench in a squat rack with safety bars in place. No reason you couldn't do that at a gym if need be.

.

JoRocka · October 2013

I have no pride- I'll roll of shame it- but I'm not talking 200 plus pounds- I"m failing out around 150/160 for reps- so it's not like it's THAT heavy.

But if I was closer to my 1RM with them- I'd DEFINITELY be in the power rack with the rails- it's just safer.

I actually had a guy try to "help" me after I couldn't push 155 up 3/4 of the way through my workout- I was so pissed- he came and lifted ONE SIDE UP.... while I was trying to roll it... I was so pissed- I looked like a knuckle head stuck- when in reality I was just fine rolling it- 155 isn't THAT heavy in terms of real life weight on top of you.

A$$HAT.

Other note- if you get a random spotter- or you spot someone BE VERY CLEAR AND SPECIFIC about what you do and do not want. nothing's worse than a spotter ripping the last rep out of your hands because you're struggling- and you wanted help fighting it out- they wanted to just pick it up and walk off.

vorgas · October 2013

chest/back:
bench press
kroc rows
seated cable row
cable incline/decline chest press
push ups
lat pulldowns

You don't really give sets/reps here, so it's hard to say for sure. You could try to vary the amount of weight/reps you do in the bench press each week. So start at a lower % of max, but higher reps. Each week bump up the weight, but reduce the reps, until you are hitting 95% - 100% at 1 rep. The wendler method is a good version of this (look up Wendler 5 3 1).

From a bio-mechanical standpoint, lat pulldowns are not the same as a pull-up. In both of these lifts there are two fulcrums, the elbows and the shoulders, with the primary fulcrum being the shoulder. In a lat pulldown the weight is out near the hands, far away from the fulcrum. In a pull-up the weight (your body) is on the other side of the fulcrum and exists very close to the fulcrum itself. This actually works different parts of the muscles. You may want to try alternating lat pull-downs and pull-ups each week.

When benching, is your back flat on the bench or are you using leg drive? Elite FS and Mark Rippetoe both have great videos on the bench press form. Make sure you explode out of the bottom, not puppy-pawing, squeezing your scaps together, etc. Check those out.

Are you varying your pushups? Tricep pushups (hands directly under the shoulders) work different muscle groups than wider pushups. There's also declines, inclines, dive-bombers, and diamonds. Lots of different push-up types actually. Cool thing about push-ups is you can drop and do 10 to 20 throughout the day, just about anywhere. Try to get in 100 push-ups throughout your chest/back day, different styles.

BusyRaeNOTBusty · October 2013

I've heard a lot of good things about Wendler 5-3-1.

seena511 · October 2013

thanks everyone. i think that i was thinking SL wouldn't be right for me just based on what i know about it, which clearly is incorrect or incomplete. i'll look in to it more. i'm pretty sure my form is good but again, i'll check. i really appreciate all the feedback!

BusyRaeNOTBusty · October 2013

StrongLifts is very basic, and great for beginners but it's not just for beginners. A big bodybuilder told me he does the whole 12 week cycle once a year just to get/keep his strength up.

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/560459-stronglifts-5x5-summary

Also, generally beginner/intermediate isn't usually based on how long you have been lifting but on how strong you are.

http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/StrengthStandards.htm

http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/BenchStandards.html

MisterDerpington · October 2013

Intermediate programs for women will be the same for men. First, are you really an intermediate? I know benching for women is usually much lower, so what are you squatting and deadlifting?

JoRocka · October 2013

Intermediate programs for women will be the same for men. First, are you really an intermediate? I know benching for women is usually much lower, so what are you squatting and deadlifting?

unless she's super tiny 70 isn't super heavy- mine 1 RM is closing in on 200... and I'm not massive- and I don't bench regularly- so I'd be hard pressed to say intermediate- I personally consider myself advanced beginner- pushing intermediate.

But that's kind of a personal decision- I dont' want to just say she is a beginner because she has low weight- I get stuck benching a 45 bar because of elbow issues- but she maybe have excellent form. shrug- hard to say via internet/keyboard warrior style so I try NOT to.

BlueBombers · October 2013

Find a good lifting program that focuses on the compound lifts, less isolation work, and that allows you to work muscle groups multiple times a week.

^ THIS!!

amy1612 · October 2013

Stronglifts is great, I started with it and it's a great programme for most levels, and very simple.

CRB0077 You need to get a bar on that back

Dont get disheartened with squats, theyre hard but worth the effort

crb0077 · October 2013

I'm desperate to but I've got to try to sort my hip flexibility out before I can squat much weight! : ( I like hard and I like difficult and I really like heavy but I don't want to injure myself and not be able to lift at all!!! I watch with jealousy at people squatting! I may bug my trainer a little bit more and see if we can have another go!

Intermediate weight training for women

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