Advice for a new vegan?

Most vegan food is high in sodium and fat. But what do I know?

Like vegetables? :laugh:

Actually no, whole vegetables are pretty low in sodium...... Lets not forget sugar in conjunction with the fat and sodium.......all those wonderfully healthy vegan foods that are full of trans fats, sodium, refined carbs. I could have a list of foods a mile long but that isn't necessary considering most vegans don't eat those foods, just us unhealthy meat eaters.

Most vegan food is high in sodium and fat. But what do I know?

Like vegetables? :laugh:

Actually no, whole vegetables are pretty low in sodium...... Lets not forget sugar in conjunction with the fat and sodium.......all those wonderfully healthy vegan foods that are full of trans fats, sodium, refined carbs. I could have a list of foods a mile long but that isn't necessary considering most vegans don't eat those foods, just us unhealthy meat eaters.

Yeah, I'd rather not rely on processed "meat substitutes" they taste like **** anyway...

To each their own...but animals are tasty...

I just can't personally not consume animal products..I'm a huge fan of cheese, eggs, and meat, and I seem to being doing just fine on my diet....

So it's not that you can't, it's that you choose not to.

To each their own...but animals are tasty...

I just can't personally not consume animal products..I'm a huge fan of cheese, eggs, and meat, and I seem to being doing just fine on my diet....

So it's not that you can't, it's that you choose not to.

Some of us just aren't as saintly and ethical and empathetic as you vegans. We just like to kill precious little animals and suck the marrow from their bones. Probably because we're evil. :drinker:

So lets say there is no nutritional yeast or anything fortified. You would have no choice but to consume animal products.

Complete protein? lol? you think that the protein in the grass is the same as the protein from the cow? You obviously dont know that those animals synthesize those proteins

If there was nothing fortified, we'd likely not have the other advances we have, so we'd be getting our B-12 the same way the animals do-from the ground. B-12 doesn't naturally occur in animals, it comes from bacteria.

I think she meant that while most plant foods are not complete proteins, as long as vegans eat a variety throughout the day, they are no longer told they need to eat rice and beans in the same meal, for instance.

I'm not vegan for health benefits, and I don't think a vegan diet is better for health, but these points are often used to tell vegans why what they are doing can't be healthy or natural when it's just not true.

You are right, b12 does come from bacteria.
Fortification is not necessary if you consume a well rounded diet.

She is saying the protein from cows is the same as protein from the grass. Something that many people do not know is that amino acids can be used to create various type of amino acids. Some that are essential for us, are non essential for other animals.

She had an all out message about her amazing research and all of her facts which are simply not true. Improper education and spreading it makes the world a dumber place.

Hi there! How are those anger management classes coming along?

I burned down the school, so we're on hiatus. :drinker:

LOL!!!! Good one!

The "ethics" problem lies in the way animals raised specifically for food are treated ... horrifically in too many cases. Caged, abused and viciously put to death. We live in a demand-based society ... if there were less demand for meat and meat byproducts, there would be less of an ethics problem. Vegan and Vegetarian lifestyles are significantly more sustainable, more affordable, and promote better health. If you can replace a few meals every week with healthy non-meat alternatives, you are doing yourself and the world you live in a favor.

To each their own...but animals are tasty...

I just can't personally not consume animal products..I'm a huge fan of cheese, eggs, and meat, and I seem to being doing just fine on my diet....

So it's not that you can't, it's that you choose not to.

Some of us just aren't as saintly and ethical and empathetic as you vegans. We just like to kill precious little animals and suck the marrow from their bones. Probably because we're evil. :drinker:

I don't recall telling anyone I'm saintly - like any other person, I'm not perfect. My very existence causes harm to animals - I live in a metropolitan area, which displaced animals. I receive vaccinations which may contain egg white or other animal products. Sometimes I accidentally step on bugs on the sidewalk, or swat at mosquitos at a baseball game. I don't consider myself perfect, saintly, or any of those words - and any person who does is kidding themselves, vegan or otherwise.

Being vegan is not about perfection - it is about doing the least harm possible.

With that said, it is definitely a little sad to see someone completely shut themselves down to suffering and turn to these condescending defense tactics. "Precious little animals"? Can't we just talk about our views like adults?

bump

First of all vegan isn't healthy you have to work hard! To be healthy on it. I researched for months and went vegan and now I am one a temporary break back to veggie because I had so little protein and was completely depressed, lost tons of muscle and actually gained a stone since April, so, deffo doesn't mean weight loss.
My personal opinion if you're doing this for the animals, go for it and be careful get dietician help etc.
If you're doing this to lose weight and be healthy, don't do it, it doesn't make you healthy. There is nothing wrong with dairy, it doesn't make you fat or give you heart attacks etc. just be a healthy vegetarian. Plenty of vegans snacks out there that are just as unhealthy as non vegan ones.

totally agree. veganism will NOT make you lose weight and it is NOT necessarily any better than anything else diet-wise.

you have to be really disciplined to get enough protein without overloading on carbs. that isn't to say it's impossible, though. on my weeklong stints eating only 1400 cals total (every 3 weeks to boost my weight loss, trainer/nutritionist approved), i get over 100 grams of plant-based protein and manage to stay under 110 carbs almost every day. but i plan my meals a day in advance. HARD WORK! if it's for an ethical reason, it's worth it. if not, leave it.

1) What's the best way to tell other people if they do ask why I'm suddenly not eating meat or dairy?


2) What are the staples in your diet that you cannot live without?


3) What do you eat when you go out?


4) What has been your experience with veganism and weight loss?

1) Don't worry about other people. People are all on their own journeys in life. I was a meat eater once who made fun of vegans. The people who don't understand your choice now, might be doing the same thing in a few years when their health takes a turn for the worse.
But, people are very supportive in real life, for the most part. On this site, not so much. People see that it has helped me be happier and more energetic, so they get it.
You just gotta be strong and do what is good for you. I don't tell people, unless they ask, and when they do, i am honest, and they understand. The most common response: "I could NEVER do that!!! But, good for you, if it works for you"

2) Bananas, mangoes, coconut, carrots, romaine, spinach, celery, tomato, cucumber, peaches, blueberries, strawberries. (I grow most of those in my garden, too.)

3) Had sushi last night. They had a really good maki roll with carrots, cucumber, asparagus and lettuce inside. A lot of Asian places cater to vegans. Chipotle burrito bowls are the only fast food i seem to ever find appealing. I usually avoid noodles i lieu of whole foods, but on certain occasions in restaurants, many noodle dishes can be made vegan. A lot of restaurants have fruit smoothies, too.

4) Veganism is awesome! The weight drops off effortlessly, as long as i eat healthy. (You can certainly eat a junk food diet, and still be vegan.) Avoid oils and refined grains. But it's not just the weight of your body. There is another weight that is pulled off your shoulders when you decide to no longer participate in the gratuitous brutality of innocent beings. You also poop better. Your vision gets better. I had a rash for 2 years from a battery that exploded on my hand, go away within 2 months, and never come back. My thoughts are clearer. Sex feels better. You have more energy.

And the biggest advice:
FIND A VEGAN GROUP ON THIS SITE! THE MAIN SECTION OF THE SITE IS VERY MISINFORMED ABOUT VEGANISM!

I would never think ill of anyone who doesn't live vegan, my partner still eats meat and I did for 21 years. However I do believe if you couldn't personally kill and cook your own meat, I don't think you should eat meat.

I think your point on extinction is interesting, as at the rate we are consuming meat now, numbers show we won't be able to sustain the levels of consumption for much longer anyway. I am not a huge animal lover, don't get me wrong I do love a good funny cat/dog picture that clogs up my facebook newsfeed on a daily basis, but I don't think it is up to us to live off another human being. It simply isn't needed anymore. We no longer live in the days where we had to hunt for our next feed.

In relation to sheep comments. The reason vegans won't wear wool isn't just because it comes from the sheep, but because.. well a simple google search can show the horrific wool farming that goes on. Of course you have to shear a sheep, to keep them happy and comfortable. But sadly the chances of the wool jumper you bought from the shop coming from a happily consenting sheep, are near nil.

My advice is to pick up the book The 80/10/10 Diet by Dr. Douglas N. Graham. That is all.

1) Be prepared for major flack just as your friend gave you, Despite the stereotype of loud obnoxious vegans who shove their dietary choices down your throat. It's your social circle who'll tear into you arguing & slagging.
It is futile to argue with them & worse yet to relate conversation back to veganism, Over time you'll get people in your social circle genuinely interested in your opinion on why you eat this way.

2) Fruits aren't particularly required nutritionally bar avacados for dietary fat & just for general taste. Pulses, nuts & lentils however should be a daily thing. They are essential & some of the strongest plant sources of protein (about 20-33% of their calories) & loaded in micronutrients. Thankfully cheap too.

3) I'm personally of the opinion on the paris exemption rule, ie if you are eating at a place that doesn't serve vegan foods. Try vegetarian, if not eat meat. You do far more harm ethically by showing your peers just how nitty-gritty veganism is, refusing to eat something that uses like <5% animal product in its ingredients. All for the sake of a social-meal & to stay true to veganism.
Many in veganism are against this idea though, But if you are not doing it for ethical reasons ignore this so.

4) Bulking on a vegan diet is laborious & extremely filling. Plants are not high calorie foods & bread/pasta quickly becomes boring when ate in large quantities daily. Similarly losing weight tends to be alot easier for this reason.

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Also aware yourself of bioavailablity of nutrients in foods. Animal products can be particularly concentrated sources of nutrients, Just as mercury is found in much higher quantity up the food chain, So is certain nutrients like zinc/iron in animal foods. Plant sources of nutrients tend to be bound up by chelation molecules (inaccessible for digestion & assimilation), Or there is a "battle" between nutrients eg calcium negates plant-iron absorption. On the other hand however certain nutrients also increase absorption of certain nutrients, eg weak acids like vinegar & vitamin C increase iron & zinc absorption For eg it is recommended vegans get at least 1.5x the RDA for iron.

As stated the exclusion of numerous food groups & having to eat a ridiculously varied plant diet with supplementation (Vit D, B12) to meet nutritional requirements should not be considered optimal. Veganism simply has not got the scientific consensus on its side at this moment in time.
Jack Norris a registered vegan dietician with his own website is a useful source for nutrition, He is by far the most scientifically sound & unbiased I've come across in the vegan community. Even arguing against many common held beliefs by vegans on nutrition.

SUMMARY:
- Don't argue with people who argue with you about veganism, It never goes anywhere unless it was a genuine question.
- Pulses are absolute staples
- 100% adherence to a diet may be a personal goal, but this can seriously conflict with social outings as a vegan.
- Caloric intake determins weight gain, Vegan diets are very filling & thus tend to cause below caloric intake.
- Bioavailability of plant nutrients is LARGELY overlooked by vegans
- Jack Norris a registered dietician who has his own website is a great source for veganism.

1) Be prepared for major flack just as your friend gave you, Despite the stereotype of loud obnoxious vegans who shove their dietary choices down your throat. It's your social circle who'll tear into you arguing & slagging.
It is futile to argue with them & worse yet to relate conversation back to veganism, Over time you'll get people in your social circle genuinely interested in your opinion on why you eat this way.

2) Fruits aren't particularly required nutritionally bar avacados for dietary fat & just for general taste. Pulses, nuts & lentils however should be a daily thing. They are essential & some of the strongest plant sources of protein (about 20-33% of their calories) & loaded in micronutrients. Thankfully cheap too.

3) I'm personally of the opinion on the paris exemption rule, ie if you are eating at a place that doesn't serve vegan foods. Try vegetarian, if not eat meat. You do far more harm ethically by showing your peers just how nitty-gritty veganism is, refusing to eat something that uses like <5% animal product in its ingredients. All for the sake of a social-meal & to stay true to veganism.
Many in veganism are against this idea though, But if you are not doing it for ethical reasons ignore this so.

4) Bulking on a vegan diet is laborious & extremely filling. Plants are not high calorie foods & bread/pasta quickly becomes boring when ate in large quantities daily. Similarly losing weight tends to be alot easier for this reason.

I think I have to respectfully disagree with the bolded bullet point here - I think that "waffling" vegans who stick to their values based on convenience wind up causing a lot of confusion to those doing their best to meet the needs of vegan friends and family. If someone witnesses someone who refers to themselves as vegan eat a veggie burger patty made with cheddar cheese, they may put dairy products in a dish later on for their vegan friend visiting for dinner.

I feel that in 2013, not only are there extensive vegan options at restaurants, but it is also the responsibility of the vegan to plan for themselves - whether that's calling a restaurant ahead of time, making a vegan dish to share at a potluck, or always carrying an extra Larabar.

I'm not one for social labels, but they are important when it comes to meeting dietary needs - and not just veganism! Labels exist so that we can create understanding of different eating habits and dietary needs, whether that be vegan, halal, gluten free or Kosher. While we as vegans should strive to be good ambassadors at all times, we should not be made to feel self-conscious for doing what we think is right.