What do I have to do to get a six pack?
Replies
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There is a poster here called BarbellGirl. She is currently doing a lean gain, where she lifts heavy and has a modest calorie surplus. She is gaining about 0.5 lb of muscle a week and her body fat has remained low (~17%). She has a thread on here, but I can't seem to find it...
Ah, here it is.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1088730-female-bulking-advice-needed
To balance out the example:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/user/sarauk2sf/status
She has done/does bulks and cuts. She has blogged about them so if interested you could PM her and ask for the links. I'll put up if I can find them...I have a lot of bookmarks to go through
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*like*There is a poster here called BarbellGirl. She is currently doing a lean gain, where she lifts heavy and has a modest calorie surplus. She is gaining about 0.5 lb of muscle a week and her body fat has remained low (~17%). She has a thread on here, but I can't seem to find it...
Ah, here it is.
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1088730-female-bulking-advice-needed
To balance out the example:
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/user/sarauk2sf/status
She has done/does bulks and cuts. She has blogged about them so if interested you could PM her and ask for the links. I'll put up if I can find them...I have a lot of bookmarks to go through0 -
OH, and any way we can see pics?0
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Two observations:
1) All those women you see with perfect six pack abs in magazines and in competitions have (a) trained for multiple hours a day to get there, usually lifting heavy weights, (b) are photoshopped to within an inch of their lives and probably don't look like that in real life, (c) may or may not be on a steroid cocktail to get that kind of pump, and (d) generally deliberately will dehydrate themselves for days before a show. I have an acquaintance who used to bodybuild and show in competitions. She struggled for years with anorexia induced by the requirements of having and maintaining "that body" and recently has overcome a steroid addiction, again directly attributable to the pressures of showing in training competitions. She is retraining to show "naturally" and struggling to overcome an eating disorder. She is not an exception, but she had the courage to speak about her experience openly.
2) In order to get man-style washboard abs, women generally need to get below 15% body fat. Want to have kids? Probably not a good idea to do this, as getting below the 15% (sometimes 12% in naturally slender women) mark will do things like cause your period to stop altogether. In the long run, this is going to do more damage to your body and your reproductive system than it is worth. Estrogen that is too low due to amenorreah can also cause thyroid dysfunction, hair loss and hirsuitism (excessive body hair, especially around the face), all very common side effects of PCOS, a disorder that causes periods to stop in most women and creates imbalances between testosterone and estrogen.
Given that at 5'8" and 123 lbs, you are probably already substantially underweight, and at 19%, you are already dusting the low end of the Athletic scale, I just wanted to point these things out. As many here have said, in order to get the look you want, you need to add bulk (muscle). This means you need to eat more, and probably do workouts that will cause you to gain weight, at least initially. This is going to be psychologically difficult for you. Check out the threads on Eat Less to Weigh More for more information on one of many possible approaches to this. You will also have to change some of the cardio to weight bearing exercises. Start with bodyweight workouts like the ones found on NerdFitness and work out from there.
I wish you all the best on your journey to health and happiness.
=Betty=0 -
Two observations:
1) All those women you see with perfect six pack abs in magazines and in competitions have (a) trained for multiple hours a day to get there, usually lifting heavy weights, (b) are photoshopped to within an inch of their lives and probably don't look like that in real life, (c) may or may not be on a steroid cocktail to get that kind of pump, and (d) generally deliberately will dehydrate themselves for days before a show. I have an acquaintance who used to bodybuild and show in competitions. She struggled for years with anorexia induced by the requirements of having and maintaining "that body" and recently has overcome a steroid addiction, again directly attributable to the pressures of showing in training competitions. She is retraining to show "naturally" and struggling to overcome an eating disorder. She is not an exception, but she had the courage to speak about her experience openly.
2) In order to get man-style washboard abs, women generally need to get below 15% body fat. Want to have kids? Probably not a good idea to do this, as getting below the 15% (sometimes 12% in naturally slender women) mark will do things like cause your period to stop altogether. In the long run, this is going to do more damage to your body and your reproductive system than it is worth. Estrogen that is too low due to amenorreah can also cause thyroid dysfunction, hair loss and hirsuitism (excessive body hair, especially around the face), all very common side effects of PCOS, a disorder that causes periods to stop in most women and creates imbalances between testosterone and estrogen.
Given that at 5'8" and 123 lbs, you are probably already substantially underweight, and at 19%, you are already dusting the low end of the Athletic scale, I just wanted to point these things out. As many here have said, in order to get the look you want, you need to add bulk (muscle). This means you need to eat more, and probably do workouts that will cause you to gain weight, at least initially. This is going to be psychologically difficult for you. Check out the threads on Eat Less to Weigh More for more information on one of many possible approaches to this. You will also have to change some of the cardio to weight bearing exercises. Start with bodyweight workouts like the ones found on NerdFitness and work out from there.
I wish you all the best on your journey to health and happiness.
=Betty=
Your last point is spot on, but the first two just aren't completely true and have some somewhat judgmental overtones of women with visible abs ("man-style"). You can see plenty of women on here who have visible abs through working hard and putting in the time. Obviously it's not something that comes quickly, but nobody needs to do roids to do get them. Also, there's no set body fat percentage for visible abs. It has to do with genetics, how much musculature is underneath, etc.0 -
Betty: that's a big ole bag of worst case extreme scenerio nope...with almost a butthurt undertone if I'm not mistaken.
Misterderping: I can't help but crack up everytime I see that profile pic0 -
Betty: that's a big ole bag of worst case extreme scenerio nope...with almost a butthurt undertone if I'm not mistaken.
Misterderping: I can't help but crack up everytime I see that profile pic
Funny how?
http://youtu.be/IWINtUCshxY 0 -
I locked your other thread since this posted.
The problem that you face, is at 5'8 and 123lbs, you are under weight. Cutting more weight will not provide you results because you do not have enough mass to give you abs. In fact, i have yet to see an under weight person with a good set of abs and this is a very common issue I see on this board. With that said, you probably need to add 10 or so lbs of mass. This means, you will need to do several bulk and cut phases, so you can get back to a normal weight. That means, you will need a good weight training program (you can start with 3 to 4 days of full body routines) and eat above your maintenance calories so you can gain weight. After 8-12 weeks, you can follow it with a cut realizing that about 50% of your weight gain will be new fat. You can not avoid it. You have to accept it and do cycles. You may have to repeat this 1-4 types depending how aggressive you go and how you like your results.
I would suggest spending some time researching the gaining weight section.
^^ This is excellent advice. Absolutely girl - you need to start eating more, putting on weight, and start lifting!
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Two ways
1. Starve like k-pop stars and lose muscle and fat.
Not reccomended*
2. Workout and eat clean(low carb)
- doing crunches won't help, doing hours upon hours of cardio won't help, you have to start lifting weights and movements that engage the core such as squats, planks, lunge and twist etc anything that requires core stabilization.
Do I have a six pack ? no
Do I care about having a six pack? no
For my body type even if I do manage to get my bf low enough to show, the diet and maintenance aspect of it is unsustainable with a lifestyle that makes me happy.
I would be happy with just looking fit.
Rub my bellyyyyyyyyy
agree with work out..disagree with eat clean …clean eating has nothing to do with six pack…IMO
And neither does low carb, lol.0 -
You have to cut down on body fat %. Basically lose more weight or replace weight from body fat with muscle.
So I do more strength training to replace the fat with muscle? I don't think it would be healthy for me to lose anymore weight.
If you "replace" fat with muscle, you're likely to gain weight on the scales. A cup full of muscle weighs more than a cup full of fat, so you could essentially loose inches but gain weight on the scales. This has happened to me :-)
If you don't have much muscle on your belly then there's not much chance at being able to get a 6 pack from cardio. You need to do weight training and eat protein etc. People will all have their opinions but this has worked for me.
Good luck!0 -
It's really personal preference, but there are many women on here who have done the conventional bulk and haven't gain lots of love handles. But leangains is a viable option as well.I locked your other thread since this posted.
The problem that you face, is at 5'8 and 123lbs, you are under weight. Cutting more weight will not provide you results because you do not have enough mass to give you abs. In fact, i have yet to see an under weight person with a good set of abs and this is a very common issue I see on this board. With that said, you probably need to add 10 or so lbs of mass. This means, you will need to do several bulk and cut phases, so you can get back to a normal weight. That means, you will need a good weight training program (you can start with 3 to 4 days of full body routines) and eat above your maintenance calories so you can gain weight. After 8-12 weeks, you can follow it with a cut realizing that about 50% of your weight gain will be new fat. You can not avoid it. You have to accept it and do cycles. You may have to repeat this 1-4 types depending how aggressive you go and how you like your results.
I would suggest spending some time researching the gaining weight section.
Well I wish you wouldn't present bulking and cutting cycles as the only way. It's not.
Bulking and cutting is very efficient in terms of time to reach your goal, but IMO quality of life suffers on the way.
An approach like leangains allows one to put on the mass gradually, while staying much leaner.
I agree in normal cases but in the case of someone who is already underweight, if not bordering on it, such as in the case of the OP, starting things out with a good bulk cycle is a better route.
I agree, assuming the subject is a machine.
But human beings are highly emotional. Some more than others (like me!). I just can't stand the love handles and man boobs when I bulk. I know I'm growing slower than I could be, but that is ok with me. The trade off is feeling good all the time.
I just wanted to make sure it was offered up as an alternative
It's definitely a viable one, but I think that because the OP is underweight they should probably focus on a bulk initially because they need to get weight up fairly quickly, not only for six pack but for medical reasons. Your experience with both traditional bulking and leangains definitely makes your input weigh heavily here. However, remember, you did not come from the perspective of someone who is legitimately underweight. That, I feel, changes things.
I took that into account, believe me. I was dangerously underweight as a teen so I do know something about this.
Although on the one hand, getting up to a healthy weight is the most medically important goal, it's ok to compromise a little on that to make gaining weight as rewarding as possible, which reinforces the concept that gaining is good.
wrt to medical imperatives the best advice would come from...you know...your doctor.
Talk to one, it's more important than forum advice.0 -
It's really personal preference, but there are many women on here who have done the conventional bulk and haven't gain lots of love handles. But leangains is a viable option as well.I locked your other thread since this posted.
The problem that you face, is at 5'8 and 123lbs, you are under weight. Cutting more weight will not provide you results because you do not have enough mass to give you abs. In fact, i have yet to see an under weight person with a good set of abs and this is a very common issue I see on this board. With that said, you probably need to add 10 or so lbs of mass. This means, you will need to do several bulk and cut phases, so you can get back to a normal weight. That means, you will need a good weight training program (you can start with 3 to 4 days of full body routines) and eat above your maintenance calories so you can gain weight. After 8-12 weeks, you can follow it with a cut realizing that about 50% of your weight gain will be new fat. You can not avoid it. You have to accept it and do cycles. You may have to repeat this 1-4 types depending how aggressive you go and how you like your results.
I would suggest spending some time researching the gaining weight section.
Well I wish you wouldn't present bulking and cutting cycles as the only way. It's not.
Bulking and cutting is very efficient in terms of time to reach your goal, but IMO quality of life suffers on the way.
An approach like leangains allows one to put on the mass gradually, while staying much leaner.
I agree in normal cases but in the case of someone who is already underweight, if not bordering on it, such as in the case of the OP, starting things out with a good bulk cycle is a better route.
I agree, assuming the subject is a machine.
But human beings are highly emotional. Some more than others (like me!). I just can't stand the love handles and man boobs when I bulk. I know I'm growing slower than I could be, but that is ok with me. The trade off is feeling good all the time.
I just wanted to make sure it was offered up as an alternative
It's definitely a viable one, but I think that because the OP is underweight they should probably focus on a bulk initially because they need to get weight up fairly quickly, not only for six pack but for medical reasons. Your experience with both traditional bulking and leangains definitely makes your input weigh heavily here. However, remember, you did not come from the perspective of someone who is legitimately underweight. That, I feel, changes things.
I took that into account, believe me. I was dangerously underweight as a teen so I do know something about this.
Although on the one hand, getting up to a healthy weight is the most medically important goal, it's ok to compromise a little on that to make gaining weight as rewarding as possible, which reinforces the concept that gaining is good.
wrt to medical imperatives the best advice would come from...you know...your doctor.
Talk to one, it's more important than forum advice.
while that is a good idea, doctors don't have any special magic juju, and the recommendations they make tend to be based on whatever seemed to work for their other patients. It's essentially the same info as on a forum, just with a professional moderator who takes sides.0 -
wrt to medical imperatives the best advice would come from...you know...your doctor.
Talk to one, it's more important than forum advice.
while that is a good idea, doctors don't have any special magic juju, and the recommendations they make tend to be based on whatever seemed to work for their other patients. It's essentially the same info as on a forum, just with a professional moderator who takes sides.
A doctor would have the benefit of actually getting to meet the person in question. Which is likely to give far more background information than you or I have.
They also have credentials, which while not necessarily carte blanche to be believed without question, are a bit more definitive than 'mushroom hunting enthusiast'.0 -
It is difficult to advise on this without seeing a picture. I don't really know if she is underweight (she is only 19 also), although I agree that she should not lose weight. Also, she says she has ab definition at the top, but she has a "lower pooch". Without a picture I'm not sure that I can take the word on this of a 19 year old. She could just be overly critical. Also, what happens when you flex your abs. In the pics of women with six pack abs, they are flexing their abs, not just standing there, slouching and pushing out their tummy.
But, all this aside. I think you should definitely start by at least eating at maintenance. And start learning how to lift weights. Get going in a good program, lifting heavy, with good form. And start a bulk once you know that you will be lifting effectively for the bulk. Isn't that the usual recommendation?0 -
As most people mentioned there are two aspect to a "six pack".
1. Muscles big enough to be seen.
2. Low enough body fat to see said muscles.
At 5'8" and 123 pounds I suspect your problem is the first. I agree that you probably need to gain some weight/muscles.0 -
This content has been removed.
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sell your soul0
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Be 21 or older, show ID at a local bar, have money?0
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walk to the shop and buy one ;-)0
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Be 21 or older, show ID at a local bar, have money?
Unless you live in Canada. Then just be 19.0 -
Don't be afraid of putting on some fat and muscle by lifting in a surplus for a good chunk of time.
This is what I'm struggling with. After losing 50 pounds of fat, it's hard to allow myself to gain. So I'm lifting heavy and eating at maintenance because I don't want to gain weight. (Wrong, I know... but I'm getting there.) Maintaining my weight is helping me gain confidence that I'm in control, and I'm slowly starting to eat a little more (and lots of protein). It's going to have to be a gradual thing for me. In the meantime, I'm noticing decent strength gains and I'm definitely toning up - just not building mass like I want. At least my muscles are in decent shape - when I get the mental and nutritional part figured out I should be good to go. 0 -
Hey, Darlin,' congrats on the weight loss! I am a Registered Dietitian, Personal Trainer, and Body Pump instructor. Everyone has a different body shape, so a six-pack is harder to acheive for some then others. Where do you carry most of your weight? In your butt/thighs, or your stomach? Depending on your body SHAPE you may need to be anywhere from 11% bodyfat (not healthy for most women to maintain) to 20%.
That being said. the answer is certainly to get LEANER. Do not lose weight. You do NOT have to gain weight to gain muscle, either. However, I would change your workouts. Leave the cardio behind for awhile and do some heavy lifting. Again, you don't have to gain weight. Just lift heavy and choose "maintain your weight option" on your calories for MFP. Eat 1 g of protein for every pound that you weigh per day. Chicken, fish, beans, a good protein shake, greek yogurt.
Muscle gain anywhere WILL help your ab definition because you tend to get leaner over-all. EG, when I have more muscular legs, I find my abs to be more defined. Rememebr, too, that when you lift a muscle group heavy, you will tend to retain water there for a few days. SOOOO your thighs may look bigger and you may weigh more after a leg work out. Again, just using that as an example.
You will love the way your body transforms with more weight training. Let me know if you have any questions, I would be happy to advise
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^^^Whoa! Check it out. Someone who knows what they are talking about. I am impressed.0
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Depending on your body SHAPE you may need to be anywhere from 11% bodyfat (not healthy for most women to maintain) to 20%.
This is definitely important to know.0 -
Depending on your body SHAPE you may need to be anywhere from 11% bodyfat (not healthy for most women to maintain) to 20%.
This is definitely important to know.
:laugh:0 -
Depending on your body SHAPE you may need to be anywhere from 11% bodyfat (not healthy for most women to maintain) to 20%.
This is definitely important to know.
:laugh:
What? :laugh: I thought women would see ab definition at different levels of bodyfat. I don't know how low some women need to go. Maybe 12%? And that some woman see ab definition at 18 or 19%. It depends on if they tend to carry fat in the midsection or not. That was what she meant by different shapes. In my family there are women the same weight and size as me, but they have skinny legs, and more fat around the midsection. I always had fully visible ab definition. I don't know what my bodyfat percent was. It was low, but not down at 12%. I think it was around 18% when I compare what I looked like to the example photos (maybe it was less, I know at one point it was because I stopped getting my period and needed to gain). I always have a very slim mid section, and more of a curvy booty and thighs. I was/am a dancer, so always very active and fit. Is this wrong? :blushing: What bodyfat level do woman see their abs at? Is it actually the same for all women? Her range was a bit large (11-20). But, I thought there was variation. I guess because I always had visible abs, it's not something I ever thought about the specifics on. But, it was something that I noticed came easier for me (or maybe it seemed that way because I danced and exercised so much and saw it as fun and not work) and others had to work very hard at. And there were times when they were less visible (when I probably put on a few pounds, but not anything to stress about).
And just as a side note, I also know how easily young woman can be overly critical of themselves, and not always see what others are seeing.
For the very low part of the abs to show, women usually do need to get pretty low in bodyfat. And maybe the OP also wants to evaluate what goals are most important to her.
But, I also do agree about how people need to build muscle.
Here's a link: http://www.burnthefatinnercircle.com/public/What_is_the_Necessary_Body_Fat_Percentage_to_See_Your_Abs.cfm
So, there is variation. Maybe more like under 15%, depending on how visible you are aiming for. I do think it can be challenging for many women to maintain a very low %. And to get there, she will need to slowly build muscle weight (all over the body) with bulking and cutting, so that she will not be underweight down in the 11 to 15 or less range..0 -
http://www.muscleforlife.com/how-to-get-six-pack-abs/
Also, lots of people have said you need to lift heavy, but in case you don't know what that means - you need to be moving weight that you cannot do more than about 8 reps with. If you can do more reps than that, you need to add weight.
Good luck.0 -
wrt to medical imperatives the best advice would come from...you know...your doctor.
Talk to one, it's more important than forum advice.
while that is a good idea, doctors don't have any special magic juju, and the recommendations they make tend to be based on whatever seemed to work for their other patients. It's essentially the same info as on a forum, just with a professional moderator who takes sides.
A doctor would have the benefit of actually getting to meet the person in question. Which is likely to give far more background information than you or I have.
They also have credentials, which while not necessarily carte blanche to be believed without question, are a bit more definitive than 'mushroom hunting enthusiast'.
You would have to go to a specialist. I am friends with several doctors and none of them have any clue about nutrition and frequently say, if they want to know something, they turn to their staff dietitians. Nutrition, like cardiology, is a specialty. Most doctors do not even have any training or formal classes in nutrition. So for the most part, there several people on this board that know a lot more than a personals GP doctor. Now, if the OP has health issues, or recovered from an ED or other medical information yet that was not mentioned, then what we suggest can be wrong.0 -
Hey, Darlin,' congrats on the weight loss! I am a Registered Dietitian, Personal Trainer, and Body Pump instructor. Everyone has a different body shape, so a six-pack is harder to acheive for some then others. Where do you carry most of your weight? In your butt/thighs, or your stomach? Depending on your body SHAPE you may need to be anywhere from 11% bodyfat (not healthy for most women to maintain) to 20%.
That being said. the answer is certainly to get LEANER. Do not lose weight. You do NOT have to gain weight to gain muscle, either. However, I would change your workouts. Leave the cardio behind for awhile and do some heavy lifting. Again, you don't have to gain weight. Just lift heavy and choose "maintain your weight option" on your calories for MFP. Eat 1 g of protein for every pound that you weigh per day. Chicken, fish, beans, a good protein shake, greek yogurt.
Muscle gain anywhere WILL help your ab definition because you tend to get leaner over-all. EG, when I have more muscular legs, I find my abs to be more defined. Rememebr, too, that when you lift a muscle group heavy, you will tend to retain water there for a few days. SOOOO your thighs may look bigger and you may weigh more after a leg work out. Again, just using that as an example.
You will love the way your body transforms with more weight training. Let me know if you have any questions, I would be happy to advise
As mentioned early, there is nothing wrong with recomposition, it just will take 2 or 3x as long.0 -
just go to the beer store. but, it is more cost effective to buy the whole 24, if you're planning on drinking over the holidays. 6packs are for weaklings.0
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