Attempting my first bulk

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Replies

  • Amadbro
    Amadbro Posts: 750 Member
    You're right, it's completely a mental issue :-) The hard part for me, I think, is that because I teach yoga I can't exactly go hide under sweaters and pants until spring. I had thought about doing a slow bulk/recomp but I just want to see results instead of spinning my wheels. I go to Hawaii in September though, so I'm probably going to be cutting again by early July.

    Sounds like you have it all together. The most important part is having a game plan when transitioning from cut-bulk or vice versa. Have your program laid out completely from nutrition/caloric intake/macros all the way to training, (frequency, volume etc). I can tell you now at 17% BF as a female you can be a little more liberal in your surplus depending on exactly HOW lean you want to stay throughout.

    I've learned that bulking is very very mental. There have been several times when I just wanted to say screw it and revert back to maintenance or a deficit because my abs wen't away. But the strength gains and increase in mass far outweighs having abs to me. The abs are still there, they didn't go anywhere and you'll get them back, this time you will be bigger, leaner and more define for sticking it out through the bulk.

    Keep us updated and good luck!
  • _TastySnoBalls_
    _TastySnoBalls_ Posts: 1,298 Member
    in for women who bulk. good luck OP.
  • geekyjock76
    geekyjock76 Posts: 2,720 Member
    Here is a detailed research review on training frequency, volume and intensity on muscular hypertrophy. Read section 2 and 2.1, then section 4. By implementing the findings according to your training experience, you can maximize lean mass gains.

    http://www.carblesspostworkout.com/uploads/4/8/2/9/4829089/hypertrofie_training_review.pdf
  • Joannesmith2818
    Joannesmith2818 Posts: 438 Member
    .
  • Joannesmith2818
    Joannesmith2818 Posts: 438 Member
    17% is not low, you clearly don't know.

    wow this guy...STRONG 3RD post. You're right bro...I OBVIOUSLY dont know at all. I mean..look at me..do i even lift?

    ur right, whether u even lift is debatable

    This is gettin good. You boys should go outside and let us watch.

    My money is on Amadbro!!
  • uconnwinsnc
    uconnwinsnc Posts: 1,054 Member
    IAFDR07.jpg?1
  • Amadbro
    Amadbro Posts: 750 Member
    lol golden
  • jofjltncb6
    jofjltncb6 Posts: 34,415 Member
    what? bulk with 17.5% BF? i hope you are kidding

    Huh???

    Oh, I get it. Your type of broscience is gender-specific.

    17.5% is *plenty* lean enough for a woman to bulk.
  • chrisdavey
    chrisdavey Posts: 9,834 Member
    My recommendation would be to gain weight very slowly. I don't know if you are familiar with FULKING but that is basically adding a lot of fat while bulking and typically done by guys who have no idea. For women, the speed you can gain LBM is much slower than guys so any quick weight gain will most likely be fat (not the best obviously). So I'd really be aiming for an absolute max of only around 2lbs per month. I know that seems very slow but it will help you to avoid the yoyo dieting.

    Also, madcow and SL are good but I'll also include some exercises for the muscles not worked. Chinups or lat pull downs (plus curls if you do lat pull downs) and some reverse flys would be good. Core work optional and calves also.
  • agthorn
    agthorn Posts: 1,844 Member
    Good luck! I recently started my first bulk as well. Although I gave in to the mental game and cut back on calories after all my holiday indulgences. :-/ I was scared of starting off on the wrong foot with an excess of fat gain.

    And by the way, in this article Lyle McDonald suggests bulking for women at the 19-24% body fat range. So whoever suggested 17% was too high is nuts! He mentions that athletes or those looking to compete start at 17-20%.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/general-philosophies-of-muscle-mass-gain.html
    Thanks for the link! That poor guy that always ends up being the image in ALL the articles about bulking the wrong way...

    I hadn't seen that article specifically. I had read that men should be at 10-12% before bulking, and so I had used this table (http://blog.withings.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ACE-Fat-Lean-ratio.jpeg) to guess that the equivalent range for a woman should have been about 17-19%. 24% seems kind of high to bulk to me, but that might be partly to do with my frame. That was close to where I had started in 2011 and I was about 139lbs at 24%.
  • agthorn
    agthorn Posts: 1,844 Member
    My recommendation would be to gain weight very slowly. I don't know if you are familiar with FULKING but that is basically adding a lot of fat while bulking and typically done by guys who have no idea. For women, the speed you can gain LBM is much slower than guys so any quick weight gain will most likely be fat (not the best obviously). So I'd really be aiming for an absolute max of only around 2lbs per month. I know that seems very slow but it will help you to avoid the yoyo dieting.

    Also, madcow and SL are good but I'll also include some exercises for the muscles not worked. Chinups or lat pull downs (plus curls if you do lat pull downs) and some reverse flys would be good. Core work optional and calves also.
    Yeah, 2lbs a month is about 230 calorie surplus. I erred on the side of slightly higher because it's sometimes hard to account for how many calories I burn while teaching yoga (because when I sub, my schedule varies). I tend to work chin-ups randomly because I have a doorway bar on my walk-in closet. Probably hitting my core okay during yoga.
  • cingle87
    cingle87 Posts: 717 Member
    Sorry for hijacking your thread but as a noob who is 20lbs away from starting myfirst bulk, why is it better to get down to low 10's to start bulking? is it for aesthetics ie muscle defitinition or is there a proper reason why?
  • Springfield1970
    Springfield1970 Posts: 1,945 Member
    Sorry for hijacking your thread but as a noob who is 20lbs away from starting myfirst bulk, why is it better to get down to low 10's to start bulking? is it for aesthetics ie muscle defitinition or is there a proper reason why?

    You've kind of answered it yourself, you wouldn't want to bulk when you're already big with fat, as you will be adding more fat with that muscle, the definition would be well hidden under fat and it would be a mighty long cut at the end (you don't want to be on deficit too long).If you lost 20lbs where would that leave you body fat wise? It would be a better place to start from. You get definition first by summer hopefully (even if it's smaller muscles), then bulk up to a less defined place and cut again to even bigger muscles (yum!).

    Lyle talks about Leptin levels (hunger hormones)and how it's not a great idea to be in deficit too long. Better to break up the cuts and not drag em out.

    Body fat isn't a good thing to have as a sportsman (lifting included)anyway. You have to oxygenate it during exercise. Best to get rid of it. I'm sure there are many reasons why it's best to cut first....can't wait to hear them all. Great question.
  • waldo56
    waldo56 Posts: 1,861 Member
    My recommendation would be to gain weight very slowly. I don't know if you are familiar with FULKING but that is basically adding a lot of fat while bulking and typically done by guys who have no idea. For women, the speed you can gain LBM is much slower than guys so any quick weight gain will most likely be fat (not the best obviously). So I'd really be aiming for an absolute max of only around 2lbs per month. I know that seems very slow but it will help you to avoid the yoyo dieting.

    Also, madcow and SL are good but I'll also include some exercises for the muscles not worked. Chinups or lat pull downs (plus curls if you do lat pull downs) and some reverse flys would be good. Core work optional and calves also.
    Yeah, 2lbs a month is about 230 calorie surplus. I erred on the side of slightly higher because it's sometimes hard to account for how many calories I burn while teaching yoga (because when I sub, my schedule varies). I tend to work chin-ups randomly because I have a doorway bar on my walk-in closet. Probably hitting my core okay during yoga.

    Keep in mind that your metabolism will rise over time spent in a surplus. Moreso than muscle gain alone would predict (the same is true in the opposite direction when cutting).

    When you set a fixed calorie target for bulking, your gain rate declines over time, today's 300 calorie surplus might not even be a 200 calorie surplus 3 months from now.

    You also tend to gain cleaner at first, so its better too err on the side of slightly higher when setting initial goals.

    The bigger challenge at first is simply getting into a surplus. If you've never done it before, the required calorie levels really aren't much more than a guess, no matter how good you understand your cutting/maintaining calorie needs. More people tend to undershoot rather than overshoot their needs (spending a month or two thinking you are bulking, but doing nothing of the sort, sucks).

    Also be aware that most people will gain (weight) in waves when bulking, don't try to overadjust to it. It will shoot up to OMG crazy levels, than you spend a couple weeks losing weight despite the surplus, rinse repeat. Trying to adjust to that will just magnify the effect while leaving you spinning your wheels. You have to have faith in your numbers are use patience when deciding to make tweaks to the plan.
  • chrisdavey
    chrisdavey Posts: 9,834 Member
    Sorry for hijacking your thread but as a noob who is 20lbs away from starting myfirst bulk, why is it better to get down to low 10's to start bulking? is it for aesthetics ie muscle defitinition or is there a proper reason why?

    P ratio or the portioning of muscle to fat. A fatter person is more likely to gain fat in a surplus basically. I suppose the opposite end is a SUPER lean person is also likely to gain fat if they go straight into surplus (hence reverse dieting)
  • Amadbro
    Amadbro Posts: 750 Member
    Sorry for hijacking your thread but as a noob who is 20lbs away from starting myfirst bulk, why is it better to get down to low 10's to start bulking? is it for aesthetics ie muscle defitinition or is there a proper reason why?

    P ratio or the portioning of muscle to fat. A fatter person is more likely to gain fat in a surplus basically. I suppose the opposite end is a SUPER lean person is also likely to gain fat if they go straight into surplus (hence reverse dieting)

    Bingo. The lower BF% the more nutrient partitioning plays in your favor.
  • HMVOL7409
    HMVOL7409 Posts: 1,588 Member
    Bumping again bc my fellow bulking ladies might benefit from the last 3 posts. Great info guys!
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,136 Member
    what? bulk with 17.5% BF? i hope you are kidding

    bro, do you even have a brain ..?

    bahahahahaha

    horrible attempt at trolling….
  • fitspo145
    fitspo145 Posts: 81
    Bumping to read all the info in more detail later. Could really use all the tips since I am thinking of trying out bulking and cutting for recomp (currently at 19.5% BF).

    Sorry to ask such a silly question and temporarily hijack the post :tongue: , but I am still pretty much a beginner at lifting, having only done workouts A and B of SL5x5 on and off mixed with Body Pump... Would you need a specific intensity in your lifting regime to get the benefits of bulking or should I rather work on my strength at maintenance and then start a bulk when I reach a certain intensity?
  • 34blast
    34blast Posts: 166 Member
    If by strength standards you are a novice, you will want to use a beginner / novice bulking routine. I prefer Rippetoe's Starting Strength or HST. When you advance to an intermediate, I really like madcow. The beginner routines should concentrate on big compound lifts e.g. Squat, deadlift, bench, overhead press, barbell rows, etc.

    This is a good link to compare your strength standards http://www.lonkilgore.com/freebies/freebies.html
    Too many people go to intermediate and advanced routines too quick. Concentrate on linear progression until it ends. e.g. start light and keep adding weight to the bar each session and make sure to eat a surplus.

    If you don't know the lifts well, I recommend buying Mark Rippetoe's book Starting Strength

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