Ketogenic-low carb diet??

1235»

Replies

  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,147 Member
    this is all I have for you ..Keto, Low Carb, IF, etc are not some magical diets that burn through fat….all they are is tools to create a calorie deficit..

    You can accomplish the same thing with a calorie deficit, hitting macro targets, and working out. Sugar is not making you fat. Eating caloric surplus is. I just think it is not a good idea to label certain foods "bad" and then entirely restrict them.

    Ask yourself this. Are you going to eat just about zero carbs/sugar for the rest of your life? I highly doubt it, but I could be wrong...

    ^^^ THIS. This dude knows what he's talking about. Diets are for suckers. Develop lifelong sustainable and enjoyable habits and F the fad diets.

    My eating plan isn't a "diet" or a "fad diet". I do plan to eat low carb for life, with a few cheat meals here and there to shake things up. I'm really getting sick of the keto-bashers on here. NO ONE is forcing any of you to eat keto/paleo/etc, so why come in EVERY thread about low carb and spout your talking points? It's getting bloody ridiculous!

    so when someone posts in an open forum asking for opinions if they should do this, or that we can't suggest an alternate, easier approach?

    Telling people they can't have an opinion on something because it hurts your low carb/keto sensitivities is even more ridiculous...

    Oh please. Don't pretend like all you're doing is offering another alternative. You go into EVERY thread about keto/paleo/etc and you spout the same talking points. It's like an evangelical yelling at a bunch of atheists. It's annoying and makes you look like an *kitten*.

    the buthurt is strong in this one…

    Just trying to offer people a more sustainable and realistic path…Life is about having options, so what matter is it to you if I provide people with an alternate path?

    Oh yea, I'm so butthurt by a dude-bro.....whatever.

    no worries, I will keep offering people an alternate path to your disdain :)
  • gigglesinthesun
    gigglesinthesun Posts: 860 Member
    this is all I have for you ..Keto, Low Carb, IF, etc are not some magical diets that burn through fat….all they are is tools to create a calorie deficit..

    You can accomplish the same thing with a calorie deficit, hitting macro targets, and working out. Sugar is not making you fat. Eating caloric surplus is. I just think it is not a good idea to label certain foods "bad" and then entirely restrict them.

    Ask yourself this. Are you going to eat just about zero carbs/sugar for the rest of your life? I highly doubt it, but I could be wrong...

    ^^^ THIS. This dude knows what he's talking about. Diets are for suckers. Develop lifelong sustainable and enjoyable habits and F the fad diets.

    My eating plan isn't a "diet" or a "fad diet". I do plan to eat low carb for life, with a few cheat meals here and there to shake things up. I'm really getting sick of the keto-bashers on here. NO ONE is forcing any of you to eat keto/paleo/etc, so why come in EVERY thread about low carb and spout your talking points? It's getting bloody ridiculous!

    so when someone posts in an open forum asking for opinions if they should do this, or that we can't suggest an alternate, easier approach?

    Telling people they can't have an opinion on something because it hurts your low carb/keto sensitivities is even more ridiculous...

    Oh please. Don't pretend like all you're doing is offering another alternative. You go into EVERY thread about keto/paleo/etc and you spout the same talking points. It's like an evangelical yelling at a bunch of atheists. It's annoying and makes you look like an *kitten*.

    it's funny that you consider keto/paleo/etc (something that tells you exactly what you can and can't eat) equivalent to atheists whereas someone saying everything goes / do what you want / in moderation you can have everything is the evangelical ... early morning giggles are the best :laugh:
  • Gdog4evr
    Gdog4evr Posts: 1 Member
    ...You can accomplish the same thing with a calorie deficit, hitting macro targets, and working out...

    While I completely, 100% agree with this statement, I have to ask... do you really think this is something that hasn't been considered previously?

    I mean, the whole point of a ketogenic diet is that you can maintain a calorie deficit while maintaining satiety by setting the target macro for carbs to be as low as possible, and your response is that since you don't experience satiety problems with high carb diets, nobody does? Your advice consists entirely of "eat less, move more," which is exactly square one of any sort weight loss/health improvement regiment.

    Obviously, "eat less, move more" is all you really need to lose weight. So why would anyone choose anything beyond that basic, common sense solution? You said yourself that abstaining from entire swaths of types of food sounds more difficult than having a modest deficit, so then why would anyone do it?
    Sugar is not making you fat. Eating caloric surplus is. I just think it is not a good idea to label certain foods "bad" and then entirely restrict them.

    Again, completely correct. Foods shouldn't be arbitrarily described as bad. Unless, for some reason, eating those foods contributes negatively towards your goals. For instance, I gather from your posts that your able to eat a small amount of some "unhealthy" food and feel satisfied with that. Some ice cream, couple beers, what have you.

    I'm just guessing, of course, since I have no idea what that feels like. When I eat something that is sugar intensive, I somehow become less satisfied; I suddenly crave sugar and high-caloric items more than when I started. "Food addiction" sounds ridiculous, but it's really the only way I can communicate how I feel about eating carb-laden food.

    Imagine for a moment that you're eating something, it's tasty, and you're full. Not just satisfied, but full. Uncomfortably full. Painfully full. Yet, some overpowering part of your brain is shrieking like a maniac that food is scarce, you have to eat now, because if you don't keep eating, there's a risk of dyeing of starvation later. Completely illogical, totally bull****, a leftover piece of instinct that's clinging to the primitive part of the brain long after it was necessary, like an appendix waiting to be infected. It sounds like your brain works better than mine, and I'm happy that you don't have to deal with something so incredibly annoying. For me, personally, I find that minimizing my exposure to carbs in general and simple refined sugars in particular to be helpful in avoiding the powerful urge to consume endlessly.
    Ask yourself this. Are you going to eat just about zero carbs/sugar for the rest of your life? I highly doubt it, but I could be wrong...

    Probably not, but I have significantly more success maintaining a caloric deficit without carbs than with them. And like you said, maintaining a caloric deficit is what's needed for weight loss.
  • ladymiseryali
    ladymiseryali Posts: 2,555 Member
    this is all I have for you ..Keto, Low Carb, IF, etc are not some magical diets that burn through fat….all they are is tools to create a calorie deficit..

    You can accomplish the same thing with a calorie deficit, hitting macro targets, and working out. Sugar is not making you fat. Eating caloric surplus is. I just think it is not a good idea to label certain foods "bad" and then entirely restrict them.

    Ask yourself this. Are you going to eat just about zero carbs/sugar for the rest of your life? I highly doubt it, but I could be wrong...

    ^^^ THIS. This dude knows what he's talking about. Diets are for suckers. Develop lifelong sustainable and enjoyable habits and F the fad diets.

    My eating plan isn't a "diet" or a "fad diet". I do plan to eat low carb for life, with a few cheat meals here and there to shake things up. I'm really getting sick of the keto-bashers on here. NO ONE is forcing any of you to eat keto/paleo/etc, so why come in EVERY thread about low carb and spout your talking points? It's getting bloody ridiculous!

    so when someone posts in an open forum asking for opinions if they should do this, or that we can't suggest an alternate, easier approach?

    Telling people they can't have an opinion on something because it hurts your low carb/keto sensitivities is even more ridiculous...

    Oh please. Don't pretend like all you're doing is offering another alternative. You go into EVERY thread about keto/paleo/etc and you spout the same talking points. It's like an evangelical yelling at a bunch of atheists. It's annoying and makes you look like an *kitten*.

    it's funny that you consider keto/paleo/etc (something that tells you exactly what you can and can't eat) equivalent to atheists whereas someone saying everything goes / do what you want / in moderation you can have everything is the evangelical ... early morning giggles are the best :laugh:

    Well, at least Keto doesn't send you to hell for having cheat days......
  • parkscs
    parkscs Posts: 1,639 Member
    I think it's actually a pretty common occurrence if you frequent keto circles that people can easily drop weight, at least for a while, simply due to the satiety of the foods they're eating.

    The reason for the "for a while" quick weight loss is that people are blowing out there glycogen reserves, which also happen to hold a lot of water.

    It's not real weight loss, and those initial pounds will come back as soon as anything resembling a normal diet is resumed.

    When I say for a while, I mean months, and I'm not talking about the loss of water weight during the first week or two - I'm talking about fat loss. This is due to these people eating a caloric deficit (at least for a while) simply because they are satiated so much more easily on a LCHF diet, relative to their previous diet. Of course, doing a LCHF diet without tracking your calories may not be ideal for a number of reasons, first and foremost being it doesn't build good habits like weighing your food and tracking your macros/total calories. But many people find they can achieve a caloric deficit simply by switching to this type of diet, which was my point to begin with.

    As for "not real weight loss", I think what you mean to say is the big losses people see at first are mostly water weight and are not entirely fat loss and that's true. But that's not what I was referring to.
  • Sunka1
    Sunka1 Posts: 217 Member
    ...You can accomplish the same thing with a calorie deficit, hitting macro targets, and working out...

    While I completely, 100% agree with this statement, I have to ask... do you really think this is something that hasn't been considered previously?

    I mean, the whole point of a ketogenic diet is that you can maintain a calorie deficit while maintaining satiety by setting the target macro for carbs to be as low as possible, and your response is that since you don't experience satiety problems with high carb diets, nobody does? Your advice consists entirely of "eat less, move more," which is exactly square one of any sort weight loss/health improvement regiment.

    Obviously, "eat less, move more" is all you really need to lose weight. So why would anyone choose anything beyond that basic, common sense solution? You said yourself that abstaining from entire swaths of types of food sounds more difficult than having a modest deficit, so then why would anyone do it?
    Sugar is not making you fat. Eating caloric surplus is. I just think it is not a good idea to label certain foods "bad" and then entirely restrict them.

    Again, completely correct. Foods shouldn't be arbitrarily described as bad. Unless, for some reason, eating those foods contributes negatively towards your goals. For instance, I gather from your posts that your able to eat a small amount of some "unhealthy" food and feel satisfied with that. Some ice cream, couple beers, what have you.

    I'm just guessing, of course, since I have no idea what that feels like. When I eat something that is sugar intensive, I somehow become less satisfied; I suddenly crave sugar and high-caloric items more than when I started. "Food addiction" sounds ridiculous, but it's really the only way I can communicate how I feel about eating carb-laden food.

    Imagine for a moment that you're eating something, it's tasty, and you're full. Not just satisfied, but full. Uncomfortably full. Painfully full. Yet, some overpowering part of your brain is shrieking like a maniac that food is scarce, you have to eat now, because if you don't keep eating, there's a risk of dyeing of starvation later. Completely illogical, totally bull****, a leftover piece of instinct that's clinging to the primitive part of the brain long after it was necessary, like an appendix waiting to be infected. It sounds like your brain works better than mine, and I'm happy that you don't have to deal with something so incredibly annoying. For me, personally, I find that minimizing my exposure to carbs in general and simple refined sugars in particular to be helpful in avoiding the powerful urge to consume endlessly.
    Ask yourself this. Are you going to eat just about zero carbs/sugar for the rest of your life? I highly doubt it, but I could be wrong...

    Probably not, but I have significantly more success maintaining a caloric deficit without carbs than with them. And like you said, maintaining a caloric deficit is what's needed for weight loss.

    Thank you. Well written.
  • judychicken
    judychicken Posts: 938 Member
    I love eating LCHF its my lifestyle now love it..
  • cati785
    cati785 Posts: 3
    If not already mentioned here, there's a very active group on reddit.com called r/keto. Check it out!
  • fraklein
    fraklein Posts: 54 Member
    I am a type 2 diabetic and have been on the low carb/high fat diet for five months. Did I mention that I was a carboholic? You name it, I LOVED it--candy, cookies, muffins, pie, bread, pizza, chips... When the diabetes was diagnosed, I first gave up sugar and was surprised at how much more energy I had. Eventually, I had to give up grains, starches, and beans, because they made my glucose meter very unhappy. Three wonderful things happened: my next lab work came back with normal lipids and glucose, I stopped feeling hungry all the time, and my asthma disappeared. My doctor, who doesn't support low carb at all, is amazed at my success, as am I. I've lost 50 pounds so far, and am continuing to lose at a steady rate, about a pound per week. I would never consider any other way of eating now.
  • fraklein
    fraklein Posts: 54 Member
    Good luck!!! You can do it if you ignore the naysayers. :happy:
  • ThatMouse
    ThatMouse Posts: 229 Member
    OP, not sure if you're still searching for opinions, but I figure I'll offer my experience with keto and coming out of it.

    I did keto in the beginning of my weight loss (I tried Paleo, but after doing more research, keto snagged me) namely because when I started, I had fatty liver. I was also concerned about what eating a high-fat diet would do to me, so I read up on it and did some research.

    I can't remember the exact papers I read (oh noes! someone poke holes in me!), but one of them mentioned that a ketogenic diet was excellent for mobilizing lipids in the liver. According to the studies, the liver lipids were the first fat stores mobilized, which helped to eliminate non-alcoholic fatty liver.

    I figured, I'll give it a shot. Got a blood test done 3 weeks into the diet, and was subsequently called by my doctor. The liver lipids (or whatever measures them) in my blood work were in the 300+ range - at which point, had I not been on a diet meant for it, I should have had jaundice or been dead (according to him, I don't know). But I was fine, I felt fine and I showed no signs of illness. So I went for another batch of blood work that weekend. Liver lipids down to 33 - half my original count of 66 (fatty liver) and down 10x from the high 3 weeks into keto. Explaining my diet to the doc, we came to the same conclusion that the liver lipids mobilized first, and that was caught in the 3 week blood test, and the current blood test was what my results were now while on the diet.

    I've been fatty liver-free since! (Probably the same thing could have happened on a regular "eat less" diet, but I'm not sure. Maybe keto's just a bit faster at getting the liver lipids? No clue.)

    I did keto for about... er... 6 months or so? Maybe 8? Before I realized that I was having a really hard time sticking to it. I missed my breads and my pastas and, most importantly, my fruits. So I decided to ditch it and see what happened. After some initial water weight gain, I discovered that I kept losing just fine so long as I was in a caloric deficit.

    So now I'm continuing the caloric deficit and, in likely a month, will reach the 10lbs lost since moving out of keto mark. I plan to follow just a simple caloric deficit with a target protein macro as I work my way down.

    Keto for me will always be a nice suggestion because it helped me establish healthier eating habits and moderation. It also really helped me kick my sugar addiction - I can't eat a bag of gummies anymore without getting a massive headache, so I find it doesn't have the same pull on me. Keto's ability to satiate also really helped and it was key to me re-learning how to feel hungry.
  • smcred
    smcred Posts: 2
    Thanks for your story. Very helpful to know about the effect on the liver and "riding it out."
  • hermann341
    hermann341 Posts: 443 Member
    Once upon a time, my cholesterol was over 400 and my triglycerides were over 500. I tried Atkins for about 6 months, lost over 30 pounds and reduced my cholesterol to 180, and my triglycerides were in the normal range, too. Without even exercising. All as predicted by Dr. Atkins. I'm not sure what my cholesterol is currently (about 220 last time I tested 2 years ago), but I tend to reduce my carb intake (especially from breads, pasta, and potatoes) and I'm doing cardio 6 times a week, so I'm not too worried.
  • tennisdude2004
    tennisdude2004 Posts: 5,609 Member
    In
  • _Zardoz_
    _Zardoz_ Posts: 3,988 Member
    Once upon a time, my cholesterol was over 400 and my triglycerides were over 500. I tried Atkins for about 6 months, lost over 30 pounds and reduced my cholesterol to 180, and my triglycerides were in the normal range, too. Without even exercising. All as predicted by Dr. Atkins. I'm not sure what my cholesterol is currently (about 220 last time I tested 2 years ago), but I tend to reduce my carb intake (especially from breads, pasta, and potatoes) and I'm doing cardio 6 times a week, so I'm not too worried.
    The reduction in cholesterol would be due to you dropping weight not due specifically to your diet. If you lose a significant amount of weight your cholesterol will more than likely reduce no matter what you're eating.
  • yarwell
    yarwell Posts: 10,479 Member
    The reduction in cholesterol would be due to you dropping weight not due specifically to your diet.

    Although reduced carbohydrate without weight loss did reduce cholesterol in women with PCOS http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/cen.12175/abstract

    and plenty of other studies show interactions between diet composition and lipid profiles