The 'Fat Acceptance' Movement

I was scoffed at in another thread for saying this but I'll say it again:

It was not until I looked at myself in the mirror, at 325lbs and said "Hey, you are as fundamentally good and deserving of good things as any other person out there." that I lost any weight. I have kept off over 50lbs for over 3 years. I had to embrace the girl that I was then so I could become the woman that I am now. I lost and gained the same 40ish lbs over and over for the majority of my adult life, but it wasn't until I said "you are good, too" that anything really changed.

Accepting my body and seeing the value of having a body in the first place also helped me to be more attuned to it. If I stopped writing it off as useless and valueless, I started to pay attention to when my body was saying things like "I'm getting sick" and thus rest it, or "I'm dehydrated" and hydrate it. I ignored it because it was, in my estimation at that time, a POS that I was meant to hate.

I think this is a really important point. Self-acceptance and self-love are pre-requisites for becoming healthy (both physically and mentally) - people who lose weight because they hate themselves often still hate themselves when they're thin, because they never learned to accept themselves as people.

Also, it's really hard to make any kind of improvements in your life (not just health, any aspect of life) when you hate yourself.



The following is addressed at the whole thread, not the above poster specifically:

I think part of the problem is that debates of this type are so polarised, they's always couched in terms of "fat and unhealthy" versus "thin and healthy" - when a) most people don't fit neatly into that dichotomy and b) anything that divides and polarises people is going to struggle to get its message across.

I think there needs to be two separate messages:

1. people are worthy of respect on the basis that they are human, it's shouldn't be conditional on how healthy they are or what they look like.

2. looking after our health is something that EVERYONE should be doing. It's not something that only applies to "fat people" - most people in our society are unhealthy due to a lack of exercise and an unbalanced diet. This forum is full of exceptions, i.e. people who *are* striving to have better health. But let's face it, most people could do a lot more to improve their health, whether fat or thin.

These are two completely separate issues. The first is an inalienable human right. The second is a necessary campaign to encourage people to strive for better health in our society, as the health consequences of a sedentary lifestyle in a society where most people can easily obtain an excess of food is something that urgently needs to be addressed, and it needs to be addressed in thin people too. Obesity may be a risk factor but it's one of many, and the others apply to countless thin people out there who do no exercise and eat an unbalanced diet (albeit one that doesn't put them in calorie surplus).

"healthy at every size" is a poor choice of name for a movement as it's not possible to be healthy at every size. - "people of all sizes striving for better health" would be better. "fat acceptance" needs to be more specific.... i.e. to separate the human rights issue (everyone should be treated with respect and dignity because they're human) from the health issue (the term "fat acceptance" implies accepting unhealthy body composition as inevitable or something that shouldn't be addressed from a health point of view - and there are "fat acceptance" extremists who do just that, as the most eloquent posts on this thread which explained the views of the movement pointed out as being problematic to the movement itself.... but if even those within the movement misunderstand the aims because of the name, surely that means the name is problematic). "treat everyone with respect and dignity" would be a better way to phrase that.... and you can add "regardless of..." statements to that, e.g. "treat everyone with respect and dignity regardless of sexual orientation" "treat everyone with respect and dignity regardless of ethnic origin" "treat everyone with respect and dignity regardless of their current state of health" or "treat everyone with respect and dignity regardless of what they look like"

It may seem like nit-picking to criticise the names of movements, but it absolutely does make a difference what you call something, and a bad name for a movement can cause all kinds of misunderstanding, as is very much the case with "fat acceptance" and "healthy at every size"

This is so ridiculous!

Obviously being extremely over or underweight is unhealthy. Telling someone who is overweight that they are fat doesn't help instead it makes them feel ashamed or embarrassed. Telling someone they are disgusting that is extremely underweight doesn't help either. Our society is based for a great part on how one looks. So if a celebrity looks 'hot', even though they are terribly underweight what kind of message is that sending?

That being said, we are bombarded with poor food choices everywhere we look. And that stuff tastes good too, makes you have cravings and it's really not too expensive. The information about food is skewed as well. 2000 calories for a woman per day is actually on the high side. I'm assuming it's the same for the 2500 for men. Unless you plow fields or something by hand.

For me the Fat Acceptance movement is more about getting over it. You don't like fat? Don't be fat. You don't have to ridicule someone else because they are.

I was scoffed at in another thread for saying this but I'll say it again:

It was not until I looked at myself in the mirror, at 325lbs and said "Hey, you are as fundamentally good and deserving of good things as any other person out there." that I lost any weight. I have kept off over 50lbs for over 3 years. I had to embrace the girl that I was then so I could become the woman that I am now. I lost and gained the same 40ish lbs over and over for the majority of my adult life, but it wasn't until I said "you are good, too" that anything really changed.

I write a blog that I guess you could consider to be a "fat acceptance" blog. I prefer to use the terminology "body positivity". I write a blog for plus sized horse back riders that while not ignoring the need to be conscious of yourself, encourages those who don't fit the stereotypical body type of a horse back rider to not wait until all the stars align to do the things that they enjoy in their life. I wasted an easy HALF of my life not doing the stuff I wanted to do because I was overweight and thought that I didn't get the good stuff - the good job, the loving SO, the good LIFE, unless I was thin. NO MORE.

Accepting my body and seeing the value of having a body in the first place also helped me to be more attuned to it. If I stopped writing it off as useless and valueless, I started to pay attention to when my body was saying things like "I'm getting sick" and thus rest it, or "I'm dehydrated" and hydrate it. I ignored it because it was, in my estimation at that time, a POS that I was meant to hate.

This is the greatest message of the 'Fat Acceptance' movement. Real change can only come from a place of loving oneself and feeling that you a worthy. Too many people embark upon diets because they hate themselves and they feel they are not good enough. They choose to diet and exercise to punish themselves. The marketers of diets push the message we are not good enough and only when we are skinny, strong, fit and look like someone else will we be good enough. The "Fat Acceptance" movement recognises that being shamed or punished into change isn't going to work, it might in the short term, but no matter how thin, strong, fit you are if you hate yourself on the inside it wont matter and you'll still be unhappy and may end up gaining the weight you lost. However if you learn to love and accept yourself now, just as you are, then maybe the healthy choices will follow. That's what the movement is about.

These are two completely separate issues. The first is an inalienable human right. The second is a necessary campaign to encourage people to strive for better health in our society, as the health consequences of a sedentary lifestyle in a society where most people can easily obtain an excess of food is something that urgently needs to be addressed, and it needs to be addressed in thin people too. Obesity may be a risk factor but it's one of many, and the others apply to countless thin people out there who do no exercise and eat an unbalanced diet (albeit one that doesn't put them in calorie surplus).

"healthy at every size" is a poor choice of name for a movement as it's not possible to be healthy at every size.

Just to play Devils Advocate....is that last point necessarily true?

"every size" includes people who weigh 800lb or more.... it isn't possible to be healthy at that size. So, "healthy at every size" is not possible. I'm not claiming to know at exactly what body fat percentage it's not longer possible to be healthy. Maybe there are people who are 40% body fat and still healthy, maybe there aren't, haven't seen any specific studies on the exact cut-off point for this.... but "healthy at every size" means, every size. Not just people who are somewhat obese.

It doesn't matter if I accept it or not. I don't have the right to make some one miserable or say hurtful things to people. I interview/meet 25 new people/clients every week. Not appropriate to make judgement calls based on appearance.

The only person's health I have the right to comment on is my own.

If others want to be judgmental, all I can do is lead by example.

If some one has to take 15 smoke breaks or eating breaks or personal calls or drinks on the job and it impacts their performance, I don't get to judge them on that, only that work is not getting done in the proper time frame and quality level.

"every size" includes people who weigh 800lb or more.... it isn't possible to be healthy at that size. So, "healthy at every size" is not possible. I'm not claiming to know at exactly what body fat percentage it's not longer possible to be healthy. Maybe there are people who are 40% body fat and still healthy, maybe there aren't, haven't seen any specific studies on the exact cut-off point for this.... but "healthy at every size" means, every size. Not just people who are somewhat obese.

Well that's just an appeal to the extreme. We can assume for this discussion we aren't talking about the minute percentage of people over 800lbs.

My post was meant more to the thread in general, but you have made some comments that might not be true. Again, the research is partly conflicting but things like..

"Body shaming isn't right, but telling someone that they have too much body fat and it's putting them at risk of health problems isn't body shaming. Fact is, body fat levels above a certain amount is not healthy. "

"I don't think people should just accept unhealthy body composition"

But neither of us (or anyone in this thread) knows what BF% is the cut off point for health...so how could you tell someone they have too much body fat? Unless of course they were...800lbs.

And the reality is - maybe body composition isn't the end all and be all. If someone with an "unhealthy body composition" exhibits no risk factors besides that - they are potentially healthy.

---

That all said - we agree muuuuuch more than we disagree in this thread. This is just a topic i have recently become interested in and found some of the info I posted in above post eye opening.

I'm sorry, but if you're over 30 pounds overweight you're not healthy.

Wrong! I am considered overweight by 40 lbs. my blood pressure, labs (cholesterol, blood sugar), heart function are absolutely perfect according to my doctor. He has told me that if I choose not to lose another pound I will be perfectly fine. That is because I exercise daily and try to eat healthy most of the time. Now I cannot generalize and say this would be the same for every active 50 year old carrying an extra 40. BUT you also cannot generalize and say anyone 30lbs overweight is unhealthy. Individuality....

As for fat acceptance, it's like anything else. If fat people, gay people, black people, mentally retarded people etc. etc. etc. don't stand up for themselves and say it's ok to be who I am, no one else is going to do it for them. And blah blah blah we all have to pay into the health system that deals with some of their health problems. Just add it to the list.... The drinkers, the teen parents, the families that have 6 kids but neither parent works, there is a ton of people biting into the support pie. It's part of being in a developed country. Rather have that than live in a third world country where no one gives a crap for each other and it's a daily battle to survive.

I really hate this excuse. "But my blood work is fine!" Im sure it is, for now. I smoke. I eat way too much salt. I may be fine now, but that doesnt mean my habits are healthy. If I dont quit smoking, it will mean a premature death. My lungs will suffer. My salt in take will cause problems, despite me being healthy right now. If you remain iverweight, your health WILL suffer. Being overweight is an unhealthy habit and you will have to pay the piper eventually.

I'm not wild about this either. Blood work isn't the be-all end-all measure of health. Take my blood work, for example. In 2006, you could have looked at my numbers and thought I was the perfect example of health. But in fact, I had cancer. Not so healthy after all. You have to look at everything as a whole.

All of these fat acceptance bloggers delete comments that oppose their view

No, definitely not all.

Some, yes. The more marginalized a group of people, the more extreme behaviour they tend to resort to when they try to own their rights, so nothing surprizing there and absolutely in no way relevant to the validityof their claims.

Not saying every one of these bloggers has a valid claim100% of the time, just saying that letting your judgement of a person's statements be coloured by factors like how they look or how they behave and even how much you agree with others of their statements is, in effect, prejudice. I know we all do it. But we could all try to do it less and apply the principles of logic and critical thinking (in the academic sense of the term, not as in "adversary opinion") more.

The same exact scientists? Well I'll be, ain't that something. I'll assume they're the same scientists who said that blacks were genetically inferior to whites. Or the scientists who said gay people have a mental illness. Or maybe the scientists who helped justify the Holocaust? Ohhh wait, I bet you mean different scientists...

Don't believe everything you hear on the news and read in your little diet books - it's all a business. I'm not talking correlation vs. causation, I'm talking about the billion dollar companies that benefit off of falsifying research to make money off of YOU. Yes, they do it, and yes, they will happily take your money even if it means plugging millions into fake research. Don't think money can't buy everything, because it can and it does. After working in research labs, I've seen how researchers will write down fake data to receive that $1M grant or a brand new laboratory. Don't think these "scientists" are all moral - even morals can be bought for the right price.

ANd let me guess,all the "real" science is hidden, bought up, or the scientists who do it are suspiciously murdered, right?

The real answer, the TRUTH, that you know is out there, is real. Any scientific evidence to the contrary is simply bought research, squelching, or falsified research.

I guess that makes sense.

I never purported the truth or said I "know" the "real" truth, I simply questioned YOU.... And you didn't deliver. Sounds like your problem, not mine.