Stronglifts 5x5 - Barbell Row help

Jenky85
Jenky85 Posts: 190 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
Hi all,

I'm on my second week of stronglifts and loving it so far. The only issue I have is with barbell rows, I just can't seem to get my form right. I've studied YouTube videos but as soon as I try to out it in practice I can't work out how to allow the bar to return to the floor each rep and pick it up without bending/straining my back.

My weight plates are really quite small in diameter, I was given them free by a friend and they're all quite low weights max is 5lbs, amd when I watch the videos the plates as bigger which means the bar is higher up/closer to grab. Would this make the move more difficult for me? I do feel like I have to bend over into my squat to reach the bar rather than it being right as grabbing height.

I have attached a picture of my weights, hopefully you can see the scale of the plates ok. Do I really need to invest in bigger plates? Or is it user error? Also is there a move I could do instead if I'm really not able to work them out?

image_zpsc7a877d1.jpg

Thank you guys in advance!! :)

Replies

  • jlclabo
    jlclabo Posts: 588 Member
    my honest opionion is invest in a decent set of olympic plates. if you have a D i c k s Sporting Goods near they usually have a good set for about 200.00. that is the olympic bar and 300lbs in plates. will give you plenty of room to grow.
    as for bar height off the floor, dont put it on the floor. use the lower pegs on your rack to rest the bar on and just lift it, walk it back enough to do your rows, then rerack it. by thye way i really like that rack. where did you get it? what brand is it?
  • juliewatkin
    juliewatkin Posts: 764 Member
    I don't return the bar to the floor. I just row it and let it fully extend at the bottom but it doesn't touch the floor. There's no need to.
  • Roadie2000
    Roadie2000 Posts: 1,801 Member
    I have the same problem, never really figured out correct form and I always felt it in my back. I've always just used dumbbells.
  • JTick
    JTick Posts: 2,131 Member
    I have the same problem. I really suck at rows and just can't figure them out. I switched to dumbbell rows...I'm still not confident on my form, but at least I can feel those in my back.
  • Leadfoot_Lewis
    Leadfoot_Lewis Posts: 1,623 Member
    I dislike rows from the floor so I just do Bent Over Barbell Rows. These will work just fine for you with your current setup:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xglwz5hwRYs&list=PLBB9B4E3A4DFF26A2&index=47
  • Jenky85
    Jenky85 Posts: 190 Member
    Thanks guys...I was thinking barbell rows might be better so will try those next time.

    Jlclabo - it's Maximuscle...I only bought it as it was the only one in the shop, but it's serving me well so far!
  • parkscs
    parkscs Posts: 1,639 Member
    I wouldn't do them from the floor with short plates (usually I don't do them from the floor either way). For what it's worth, I usually stick with bent over rows if I'm using a barbell, and I like to first bring myself upright like in a dead lift then lean forward and begin the rows.
  • LiftAllThePizzas
    LiftAllThePizzas Posts: 17,857 Member
    I switched to dumbells (Kroc rows) because once I got to heavier weights my lower back became part of the equation instead of the upper back that the rows are supposed to be working.
  • jlclabo
    jlclabo Posts: 588 Member
    if you are feeling it in your back you are bent too far over. that would be more like the form for pendlay rows where the bar touches the ground at every rep. bent over rows are more of a 45* angle and row the weight to your upper midsection. remember its for the lats and mid back not traps/upper back.
  • Jenky85
    Jenky85 Posts: 190 Member
    Thank you for the video leadfoot_lewi! I was worried about not returning them to the floor in case that was worse for my back so good to see it's not a bad thing.

    Glad so many other people seem to feel my frustrations with this move!! I was worried I was just being pathetic :) thank you everyone, really glad I asked the question now.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    I don't return the bar to the floor. I just row it and let it fully extend at the bottom but it doesn't touch the floor. There's no need to.
    ^^^
    Dis Right here.

    it's a row- I guess Pendlay's would be from the floor up? (guess I've done minimal research- I don't like the idea of a pendlay although I hear good things about them)- but a regular BB row? why would you return it all the way to the floor. Extend to arm lenght- pull elbows back- bar to sternum- the more horizontal you are the better. (well- in theory- you don't want to the weight pulling you forward- so hips pull back- but you want to fight for an acute angle- gets more back)
  • rainbowbow
    rainbowbow Posts: 7,490 Member
    I think you are bending over too far. The barbell shouldn't be touching the floor but more-so around knee height.

    When bending over you want to keep a neutral spine like below-

    deadlift-technique-rounding-the-back-neutral-spine.jpg

    if you cannot do that i'm wondering if you're lifting too heavy. A general rule when doing barbell rows for me has been to pull the barbell into the belly-button in this position.

    Edit: Also, i don't do pendlay rows. So... sorry >_<
  • ILiftHeavyAcrylics
    ILiftHeavyAcrylics Posts: 27,732 Member
    Stronglifts intends for you to do Pendlay rows (all the way back down to the floor for each rep). I don't know that it's necessary to stick with that kind if you prefer a different type though.

    I set mine up on a stack of larger plates. For Pendlay rows the bar is supposed to be about the same height as for deadlifts (roughly 9 inches off the floor).

    I've also done Kroc rows and I liked them.
  • the_texreb
    the_texreb Posts: 138 Member
    What they said. I don't return to the weights to the floor. And I like your rack. The one in the picture. With the weights.



    **I read the "I like your rack part", and realized what it sounded like, so I clarified. I don't normally attempt to not offend. It's been a weird day for me.
  • DirrtyH
    DirrtyH Posts: 664 Member
    that would be more like the form for pendlay rows where the bar touches the ground at every rep.

    That is the type of row you're supposed to do for Stronglifts. I've read several places that what stronglifts calls a barbell row is actually a Pendlay row.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    that would be more like the form for pendlay rows where the bar touches the ground at every rep.

    That is the type of row you're supposed to do for Stronglifts. I've read several places that what stronglifts calls a barbell row is actually a Pendlay row.

    which could easily be subbed out- but it's definitely good to know the difference.
  • presbyreformed
    presbyreformed Posts: 36 Member
    The barbell row is one that I would not recommend for anyone unless you are already extremely well conditioned and can handle the movements comfortably. The position required for any bent-back lifting can put your back into peril with just a slightly wrong movement. There are so many other good workouts for back that I would stay away from this one.

    This was one reason I abandoned SL 5x5. Of course the main reason I left it was the impossibilty of anyone adding 5 lbs per workout for 14 weeks.... There are much better workout routines for the non professional bodybuilders out there.... My .02
  • Jenky85
    Jenky85 Posts: 190 Member
    What they said. I don't return to the weights to the floor. And I like your rack. The one in the picture. With the weights.



    **I read the "I like your rack part", and realized what it sounded like, so I clarified. I don't normally attempt to not offend. It's been a weird day for me.

    That was hilarious...tea out of nose moment. Thank you!
  • Jenky85
    Jenky85 Posts: 190 Member
    The barbell row is one that I would not recommend for anyone unless you are already extremely well conditioned and can handle the movements comfortably. The position required for any bent-back lifting can put your back into peril with just a slightly wrong movement. There are so many other good workouts for back that I would stay away from this one.

    This was one reason I abandoned SL 5x5. Of course the main reason I left it was the impossibilty of anyone adding 5 lbs per workout for 14 weeks.... There are much better workout routines for the non professional bodybuilders out there.... My .02

    I'd be interested in hearing what other routines you rate? I'm a complete noob so always looking for more info.
  • missdibs1
    missdibs1 Posts: 1,092 Member
    This is by far the best forum in awhile Thanks for the tips
  • TR0berts
    TR0berts Posts: 7,739 Member
    I switched to dumbells (Kroc rows) because once I got to heavier weights my lower back became part of the equation instead of the upper back that the rows are supposed to be working.

    For that very reason, I've switched to the chest-supported T-bar row at the gym. I realize that doesn't help OP, but I figured - given the above - that another suggestion for others would be useful.
  • Bearpunk
    Bearpunk Posts: 4 Member
    For what it's worth, I would suggest investing in a copy of Mark Rippetoe's "Starting Strength". He does a good job of breaking down how to do a proper barbell row (as well as the other lifts in SL as I recall). He has an alternate programming framework, but the mechanics of the lifts are the same and he breaks them down really well.

    I BB Row to the floor and find engages my lower back and hamstrings without overly fatiguing them, unless I did a heavy squat session the day before and am fatigued from that. For me, the main advantage of starting each rep from the floor is the same as for deadlifts: it makes the lift more difficult because you depend on strength rather than your stretch reflex and it gives you a chance to re-set your form if necessary. You don't want to turn it into a break or anything, but you can do a quick check to make sure your lower back is arched, your shoulder blades are tight, etc. And to be honest, if you're new enough that you're having trouble with basic form, then the difference between a 35-degree angle and a 45-degree angle is likely not that important... assuming you're protecting your lower back, engaging the right muscles and developing the stretch in your hamstring.

    Now that I think about it, I suspect you would have more potential for getting out of form if you deadlift the weight up and then lower yourself down into position. I would rather be in good form all the way through. That's not a knock against the people here who do that successfully or anything, just a different style.
  • presbyreformed
    presbyreformed Posts: 36 Member
    The barbell row is one that I would not recommend for anyone unless you are already extremely well conditioned and can handle the movements comfortably. The position required for any bent-back lifting can put your back into peril with just a slightly wrong movement. There are so many other good workouts for back that I would stay away from this one.

    This was one reason I abandoned SL 5x5. Of course the main reason I left it was the impossibilty of anyone adding 5 lbs per workout for 14 weeks.... There are much better workout routines for the non professional bodybuilders out there.... My .02

    I'd be interested in hearing what other routines you rate? I'm a complete noob so always looking for more info.

    I use two different weight lifting routines at different times. One is a 12 week gain 40 lbs of 1 Rep Max heavy lift on Squat, Bench, Deadlift and Shoulder. The other is a 12 week high rep lower lift weight using the same movements. I alternate them because it is unrealistic to think you can gain 40 lbs of 1RM back-to-back, so when I complete the one I switch to the other to keep my muscles confused and working hard.

    These four major muscle groups lifts will work every muscle in your body, believe me; just try lifting the Squat with poor form: you will feel it in your back!. No need to punish your back with the barbell row. If you wish I can privately send you a spreadsheet I use that gives the schedule for each routine.
  • sjaplo
    sjaplo Posts: 974 Member
    I wouldn't do them from the floor with short plates (usually I don't do them from the floor either way). For what it's worth, I usually stick with bent over rows if I'm using a barbell, and I like to first bring myself upright like in a dead lift then lean forward and begin the rows.

    Me too and I return it to the floor the same way.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    I wouldn't do them from the floor with short plates (usually I don't do them from the floor either way). For what it's worth, I usually stick with bent over rows if I'm using a barbell, and I like to first bring myself upright like in a dead lift then lean forward and begin the rows.

    that's what I do- I do a rack pull essentially (if I'm starting off the rack or safety rails)- walk back- then bend over. Then I 'rack pull' from that position back up to standing then walk it forward to re-rack it.
  • FitRican
    FitRican Posts: 98 Member
    Look at this video it shows almost perfect form.

    http://stronglifts.com/how-to-master-barbell-row-technique/

    Try to Row Each Rep From The Floor. Because you’ll never train your upper-back fully if you let the bar hang in the air. Barbell Row like you Deadlift: with the bar starting and returning to the floor on each rep. The barbell should be above the middle of your feet when you start Rowing, same stance as on Deadlifts.

    I have short arm, so to keep perfect form I raise the bar 2-3 inches using the gym rack equipment. My back is always parallel to the floor, never incline, never rounded. I use the technique to return the bar to the floor because is more effective + reduces the probability of getting injured.
  • stumblinthrulife
    stumblinthrulife Posts: 2,558 Member
    When rowing lighter weights, I put 45s down on the floor to elevate the bar to the proper height.

    You could use anything of the proper thickness, though. A couple of sections of 2x10 would do the trick. You might need two stacked on each side looking at the diameter of those plates.
  • vjohn04
    vjohn04 Posts: 2,276 Member
    I don't return the bar to the floor. I just row it and let it fully extend at the bottom but it doesn't touch the floor. There's no need to.


    ^this.

    You don't have to do the Pendlay version, you can do a traditional row. No need to deload and reset.
  • 212019156
    212019156 Posts: 341 Member
    You could try t-bar rows. I think they are easier to learn (at least I have found it easier to teach people for some reason).
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
    With Pendlay Rows (which is actually what Stronglifts calls for) you are supposed to return it to the ground. But you are supposed to return it to the height it would be if you had on 45lbs plates, and yeah, I still can't do rows with 135lbs. Don't know that I ever will. You can bend your knees a little extra to bring yourself closer to the ground while still keeping your back flat and horizontal. You can set it on something, like extra plates or I've used one of those Rebook steps. Or I also do them in the power cage putting the support bars on the lowest level. You can switch to traditional rows but the reason they suggest Pendlay is supposedly it uses your lats more than traditional.

Categories