Mythical "clean bulk"

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  • astronomicals
    astronomicals Posts: 1,537 Member
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    One more thing.. You talk about being as efficient as possible at gaining muscle, however, you wanna maintain 8-9%? Those ideas are contradictory

    Staying ripped all year is inefficient if optimal gains are your goal, PERIOD
  • TonyStark30
    TonyStark30 Posts: 497 Member
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    Exactly, a clean bulk is vain, not efficient.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
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    Exactly, a clean bulk is vain, not efficient.

    Could you elaborate?
  • Mrsallypants
    Mrsallypants Posts: 887 Member
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    1.5 grams of protein per pound of boydweight seem exorbitant.
  • TonyStark30
    TonyStark30 Posts: 497 Member
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    Exactly, a clean bulk is vain, not efficient.

    Could you elaborate?

    If your goal is to have more muscle, you can, eat lots and train heavy, gain lots of muscle and get fat, or you could eat a slight excesss train hard, gain muscle little by little and fat little by little over a long period.

    Now the first person will get the extra Muscle and Strength no doubt, but get fat, so they spend time Losing fat over a long time, but having the Muscle size and strength already. So they are spending a lot of time on the trying to look good bit. The second person takes ages to get the size, but looks good the longest, if their starting point looked good.

    So back to efficiency, the first person gets the size and strength quicker and easier, and gets much more muscle, they just get as fat as they let themselves go, and have to cut it. Second one is building themselves a bit up over a time, and is not complete until the end just a slighly more muscular version of themselves, if that what your goal was then thats cool, but efficient? Person one can start when they are extremely lean, bulk, diet off the fat, long before person 2 gets big but person 2 will always have their beautiful body.
  • waldo56
    waldo56 Posts: 1,861 Member
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    Peak muscle building efficiency is reached at a lower intake than dirty bulking.

    However typical lean bulking intakes are lower than what you would need for peak efficiency.

    To reach peak efficiency, you have to be in a calorie surplus 24/7, an intake high enough that the body stays in a surplus despite low intake periods like sleeping and gaps like lunch to dinner.

    Standard bulking, neither lean nor dirty bulking, is about the sweet spot. Fat gain is real but not a big deal. The energy is there for the body to be building 24/7.
  • astronomicals
    astronomicals Posts: 1,537 Member
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    Exactly, a clean bulk is vain, not efficient.

    Could you elaborate?

    If your goal is to have more muscle, you can, eat lots and train heavy, gain lots of muscle and get fat, or you could eat a slight excesss train hard, gain muscle little by little and fat little by little over a long period.

    Now the first person will get the extra Muscle and Strength no doubt, but get fat, so they spend time Losing fat over a long time, but having the Muscle size and strength already. So they are spending a lot of time on the trying to look good bit. The second person takes ages to get the size, but looks good the longest, if their starting point looked good.

    So back to efficiency, the first person gets the size and strength quicker and easier, and gets much more muscle, they just get as fat as they let themselves go, and have to cut it. Second one is building themselves a bit up over a time, and is not complete until the end just a slighly more muscular version of themselves, if that what your goal was then thats cool, but efficient? Person one can start when they are extremely lean, bulk, diet off the fat, long before person 2 gets big but person 2 will always have their beautiful body.

    Thats not what I meant, and if you looked at my first, of three discombobulate posts, you'd realize that. I don't advocate dirty bulks. Clean bulks dont mean you'll see your 6 pack every day. "Clean bulk" and "stay ripped 24/7/365" are not the same thing, but, if you have decent muscle mass, bouncing between 10-15% will look pretty good all year (just not sub 10 shredded type look).

    You're limitation of muscle growth is pretty established via your genetics. Whether you gain 3 pounds a week or 1 pound a week, your muscle gains will be virtually the same. Dirty bulking is not for raw lifters, period!

    Not to mention, studies have shows that leaner invdividuals have better calorie partitioning and will put more into building lean mass.
  • TonyStark30
    TonyStark30 Posts: 497 Member
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    But a person Clean bulking but not eating enough to gain the Max they can is less efficient than the person who is eating too much as they are eating enough. So yes it is down to genetics but the guy eating too much will always be gaining whilst the other guy is tweaking his cals. If you knew Exactly how much to eat that's a different matter altogether.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
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    But a person Clean bulking but not eating enough to gain the Max they can is less efficient than the person who is eating too much as they are eating enough. So yes it is down to genetics but the guy eating too much will always be gaining whilst the other guy is tweaking his cals. If you knew Exactly how much to eat that's a different matter altogether.

    Eat lots at abandon is a good recipe for getting fat.

    For a lot of people that balance between clean and dirty is the best place to be.

    too much "dirty" and you gain to much fat. you dn't want that- because it means harder longer cuts. Goal is to optimize but not compromise.
  • scottejohnson83
    scottejohnson83 Posts: 1 Member
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    www.iifym.com


    you're welcome :)
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
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    www.iifym.com


    you're welcome :)

    that's nice- but not relevant to the discussion of clean or dirty bulk to be honest.
  • TonyStark30
    TonyStark30 Posts: 497 Member
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    You gain about 6-8 pounds just by eating some proper meals after a cut so people who clean bulk 12-14 haven't really done much I would call that just filling out!

    You get fat when you bulk that's why people are doing less efficient things.

    I doubt I'll ever Dirty bulk ever again, but if you want that big base getting fatter is gonna be the best bet. If you just want to be a slightly bigger you then put all that effort and planning and logging into a clean bulk.

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