Gaining weight, is it purely about the number of kcals?

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  • Jamal_Guildford
    Jamal_Guildford Posts: 214 Member
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    I already take whey protein. If I want to bulk what kind of supplement I have to take? high in carbs and protein? or low in carbs and high in protein? I find very hard to have massive meals, so that's why I consider to eat or drink every three hours.

    I also started thinking about my training program, I think i am doing too much cardio at the moment (5 sessions per week), maybe replace 3 sessions of cardio by weight lifting. For my weight lifting session, should i do heavy or light?

    So the cardio isn't for some race or event or test or something?
    I thought it kinda needed to be done, at the expense of putting on muscle right now hence the reason to wait until winter.

    If you aren't training for something specific, you are dead on correct, massive cardio will impact ability to put on muscle from lifting, as it'll tend to destroy muscle mass depending on how much you do.

    If you can do the lifting now, for goodness sake do it now. Why put it off. Well, unless you are a member of Procrastinator's Anonymous, in which case you have to put off today what could be done tomorrow.

    The only way to tell your body you want more muscle, is to overload it with weight. If you overload it with reps and light weight you are telling it you want more endurance, which is more glucose stores, not more muscle. If just light weight, you aren't asking it to do anything.
    And make the cardio on between days easy going, as you don't want to tire out muscle you will use the next day or you won't be able to overload them with weight, nor do you want to kill the recovery and repair from the prior day's workout.

    You don't need supplements until you are experienced after several years and it's difficult to get any kind of improvements, they really won't make a difference right now where what you eat and how you lift has a much bigger effect on making improvements.

    Get your protein to 0.82 grams per lb of body weight, fat to 0.35, and carbs is the rest.
    In MFP, lower the protein % until the fat is right, and then lower the carb % until the protein is right.

    Thanks heybales for your response. I am going to follow the Strong lift 5x5 training program from today (after my race). I will try to do it with the maximum of weight I can lift. I also think it's never good to totally give up on cardio, so I will probably try to add one or two session of cardio.

    Regarding the diet, I have to eat 3000kcal a day, below will be my typical diet (can you tell me what you think):
    Breakfast: Two toast of peannut butter with one coffee and one tea (300kcal)
    11am Snack: Milkshake or protein drink (around 250kcal)
    1pm lunch: one baguette with chicken or tuna or eggs plus milkshake or latte plus treat: 900kcal
    post work out drink: milkshake or protein drink (around 250kcal)
    pre work out drink: protein shaker (250kcal)
    7pm drink: Beer (this is my treat ;)): 250kcal
    Dinner: tuna or eggs with some dressing plus vegetables + treat (500 kcal)
    10pm drink: hot chocolate or milkshake (250 kcal)

    The total is 2950 kcal. I find very hard to eat big amount of food so that's why I am trying to get my calories in drink.

    let me know what you think of this.

    Cheers,
    Jamal
  • dennisweiss24
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    Hey, I was wearing hoodie to hide how skinny I was. Even if I was eating a lot and going to gym nothing seems to work. My breakthrough moment came when one girl told me that it isn´t attractive and I decided to really do something with it and start working on myself hard.

    Different things work for different people and I was lucky enough to find one that worked for me. I gained 8 lbs in one month and it's been a life changer. I'm a little embarrased to post my before and after photos here but if anyone actually cares to hear what I've been doing then I'd be happy to help in any way.
  • Jamal_Guildford
    Jamal_Guildford Posts: 214 Member
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    Hey, I was wearing hoodie to hide how skinny I was. Even if I was eating a lot and going to gym nothing seems to work. My breakthrough moment came when one girl told me that it isn´t attractive and I decided to really do something with it and start working on myself hard.

    Different things work for different people and I was lucky enough to find one that worked for me. I gained 8 lbs in one month and it's been a life changer. I'm a little embarrased to post my before and after photos here but if anyone actually cares to hear what I've been doing then I'd be happy to help in any way.

    Hey, I know skinny is not nice at all. I forgot to mention, I think I have an ED.... but now I dont see the food as enemy. If I choose the right aliments, I see it as a way to build a strong body.
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Thanks heybales for your response. I am going to follow the Strong lift 5x5 training program from today (after my race). I will try to do it with the maximum of weight I can lift. I also think it's never good to totally give up on cardio, so I will probably try to add one or two session of cardio.

    Well, make sure you read the program, don't just jump in and do the lifts as heavy as you can. It's very specific as to starting for a reason.

    And true on cardio, in fact great time for a heavy cardio workout like intervals or such is right after the lifting, part of the workout. True your performance will be impacted once you get up to heavier weights, but it's exactly the kind of training that benefits a race, running tired. So you are training for the end of race.
  • Jamal_Guildford
    Jamal_Guildford Posts: 214 Member
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    Thanks heybales for your response. I am going to follow the Strong lift 5x5 training program from today (after my race). I will try to do it with the maximum of weight I can lift. I also think it's never good to totally give up on cardio, so I will probably try to add one or two session of cardio.

    Well, make sure you read the program, don't just jump in and do the lifts as heavy as you can. It's very specific as to starting for a reason.

    And true on cardio, in fact great time for a heavy cardio workout like intervals or such is right after the lifting, part of the workout. True your performance will be impacted once you get up to heavier weights, but it's exactly the kind of training that benefits a race, running tired. So you are training for the end of race.

    I just broke my rower. It maybe a sign I have to do less cardio and do more weight lifting. This morning I run the 10k in 35 minutes and 36 seconds. Not too bad I think.

    I started to read the program. Correct me if I am wrong but there is no exercise to work out the biceps. Is that correct? So basically if I want to bulk muscle I need to lift heavy weight, is that correct?
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    I just broke my rower. It maybe a sign I have to do less cardio and do more weight lifting. This morning I run the 10k in 35 minutes and 36 seconds. Not too bad I think.

    I started to read the program. Correct me if I am wrong but there is no exercise to work out the biceps. Is that correct? So basically if I want to bulk muscle I need to lift heavy weight, is that correct?

    Great pace, strength can help that for sure, but not much because that's good already.

    The bent over row works the bicep, and since you get up to some heavy weight for the back to get a workout, your bicep really gets one.
    If you like, you can throw in some chin-ups at the end of one of the days, palms back, and work the back and biceps some more big time.
  • Jamal_Guildford
    Jamal_Guildford Posts: 214 Member
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    I just broke my rower. It maybe a sign I have to do less cardio and do more weight lifting. This morning I run the 10k in 35 minutes and 36 seconds. Not too bad I think.

    I started to read the program. Correct me if I am wrong but there is no exercise to work out the biceps. Is that correct? So basically if I want to bulk muscle I need to lift heavy weight, is that correct?

    Great pace, strength can help that for sure, but not much because that's good already.

    The bent over row works the bicep, and since you get up to some heavy weight for the back to get a workout, your bicep really gets one.
    If you like, you can throw in some chin-ups at the end of one of the days, palms back, and work the back and biceps some more big time.

    Hi heybales,

    Thanks again for your response. I will try this training program from tomorrow.

    Also, the weight gain is all about the diet. The thing is I never know if I eat enough food for that (I dont really count the number of kcal).

    Today I had one pot of peanut butter, two toast, one cookie, 2-3 latte, one eggs cress baguette. I am going to train now. This evening I am planning to have a can of tuna with some vegs and dressing. For the desert, probably some ice cream with a mug of milk. For me this is a big amount of food, do I need to eat that every day to gain weight? or should I just reduce cardio?

    I am trying to eat high protein food (peanut butter, milk and eggs) and stay away from the ****ty food (e.g. cookies)

    Thanks,
    Jamal
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    Also, the weight gain is all about the diet. The thing is I never know if I eat enough food for that (I dont really count the number of kcal).

    Today I had one pot of peanut butter, two toast, one cookie, 2-3 latte, one eggs cress baguette. I am going to train now. This evening I am planning to have a can of tuna with some vegs and dressing. For the desert, probably some ice cream with a mug of milk. For me this is a big amount of food, do I need to eat that every day to gain weight? or should I just reduce cardio?

    I am trying to eat high protein food (peanut butter, milk and eggs) and stay away from the ****ty food (e.g. cookies)

    You'll probably need to log for for a couple weeks to get an idea of where a number is, just so you know how much you have to go up.

    And if ever the level of food seems high, or expensive for amount of protein trying to obtain, then indeed, less cardio will mean needing to eat less.

    You can keep cardio gains with a few well placed cardio workouts. Once weekly slower paced run to keep the lower fat-burning aerobic system in shape, and once weekly interval session to keep the higher carb-burning system in shape. Anything else would be about improving, or just getting the feet used to total time on them for a race.
    But at your level of pace, to see increased performance would require doing a bunch more very specific training, but those 2 work outs would at least keep your gains.
  • Jamal_Guildford
    Jamal_Guildford Posts: 214 Member
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    Also, the weight gain is all about the diet. The thing is I never know if I eat enough food for that (I dont really count the number of kcal).

    Today I had one pot of peanut butter, two toast, one cookie, 2-3 latte, one eggs cress baguette. I am going to train now. This evening I am planning to have a can of tuna with some vegs and dressing. For the desert, probably some ice cream with a mug of milk. For me this is a big amount of food, do I need to eat that every day to gain weight? or should I just reduce cardio?

    I am trying to eat high protein food (peanut butter, milk and eggs) and stay away from the ****ty food (e.g. cookies)

    You'll probably need to log for for a couple weeks to get an idea of where a number is, just so you know how much you have to go up.

    And if ever the level of food seems high, or expensive for amount of protein trying to obtain, then indeed, less cardio will mean needing to eat less.

    You can keep cardio gains with a few well placed cardio workouts. Once weekly slower paced run to keep the lower fat-burning aerobic system in shape, and once weekly interval session to keep the higher carb-burning system in shape. Anything else would be about improving, or just getting the feet used to total time on them for a race.
    But at your level of pace, to see increased performance would require doing a bunch more very specific training, but those 2 work outs would at least keep your gains.

    Hey heybales,

    My new training program consists of 3 cardio session and 3 weight lifting session. Before I was doing 5 cardio sessions. I need to keep cardio session for fat burning.

    Just got back from my cardio session. I felt all the fat in the peanut butter, I really struggle on the treadmill. I think I need to reduce the amount of fat. Peanut butter is a good food but there is a bit too much fat. I am thinking about taking more whey protein shake: one in the morning and one in post work out session (it will increase my protein intake by around 500kcal). What do you think?
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    My new training program consists of 3 cardio session and 3 weight lifting session. Before I was doing 5 cardio sessions. I need to keep cardio session for fat burning.

    Just got back from my cardio session. I felt all the fat in the peanut butter, I really struggle on the treadmill. I think I need to reduce the amount of fat. Peanut butter is a good food but there is a bit too much fat. I am thinking about taking more whey protein shake: one in the morning and one in post work out session (it will increase my protein intake by around 500kcal). What do you think?

    Ah, that is a reduction.
    And the cardio session may, if you go slow enough, burn more fat than the lifting. But you got the wrong idea. And I doubt you are going that slow anyway to burn that much fat during the cardio.

    Good strength training causes a repair process that really uses up your food eaten, so fat is used more for daily use, hence burning more of it. You are viewing things for merely the time of the workout - view the 24 hrs, not the 45 minutes.
    You don't actually need to keep the cardio for the fat burning. If you were trying to lose weight the diet would actually take care of that better. And lifting would burn more fat in 24 hr period than cardio. Intervals would improve on easy cardio, but that's only because it's getting closer to lifting in nature and response. But the lifting is the best.

    If you think there is fat to burn, leave enough energy and strength in muscles to do the best lifting workout you can get, that way they need the most repair, and cause the most fat to be done.

    You don't need protein after cardio, nor after lifting for that matter. As long as you get in enough daily.
    After intense cardio, if planning do to intense tomorrow, then a snack of carb and protein with 4:1 ratio would be best within 30 min. But you are going to be eating enough, and not doing intense cardio day after day, that doesn't matter as much. But if you do want a snack, at least make it that ratio.

    And yes, peanut butter is a great calorie booster because of the high fat, not good for protein or carbs because fat is so much higher.
  • toutmonpossible
    toutmonpossible Posts: 1,580 Member
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    It is a decent starting point. Nothing is ever quite as simple as a nice math equation when it comes to the body. What does "morphology factor" mean?

    I mean there are some people, they gaming weight by eating a few food. Others can eat massive portion of food and they will never gain weight. How can you explain this difference?

    Because the people who eat that massive plate of food, probably don't eat all that much else throughout the day, the person eating smaller portions eats tons and hence why they gained weight. Metabolism plays such a small factor, most people use it as an excuse.

    If your aim is to gain muscle, then yes 500 calories over your TDEE is a decent way of doing it without gaining too much fat.

    I think eating so irregularly (e.g. Skipped breakfast and have a big lunch) will you gain weight. Because your body gets used to not getting food, and receive a lot of food in a short period of time. This is what I think... (sorry for my English, I am on my phone ;)).

    Nope, if you delay eating by a few hours your body isn't suddenly going to store what it gets as fat... its as simple as Calories In vs Calories Out, if you want to gain weight, you have to eat more calories that you put in.

    Eating once a day, skipping breakfast, eating a low-calorie diet twice a week will not cause you to gain weight, although many people find those approaches helpful for losing weight; the most important thing is that they eat a healthy diet with sufficient calories over the course of a week.

    It's not quite as simple as Calories In/Calories Out. Not all calories are equal and people respond differently (there are people who have difficulty gaining weight). The guidelines are a good starting point however. You have to look at what you eat, weigh yourself regularly, and measure your body composition and make adjustments accordingly.
  • Jamal_Guildford
    Jamal_Guildford Posts: 214 Member
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    My new training program consists of 3 cardio session and 3 weight lifting session. Before I was doing 5 cardio sessions. I need to keep cardio session for fat burning.

    Just got back from my cardio session. I felt all the fat in the peanut butter, I really struggle on the treadmill. I think I need to reduce the amount of fat. Peanut butter is a good food but there is a bit too much fat. I am thinking about taking more whey protein shake: one in the morning and one in post work out session (it will increase my protein intake by around 500kcal). What do you think?

    Ah, that is a reduction.
    And the cardio session may, if you go slow enough, burn more fat than the lifting. But you got the wrong idea. And I doubt you are going that slow anyway to burn that much fat during the cardio.

    Good strength training causes a repair process that really uses up your food eaten, so fat is used more for daily use, hence burning more of it. You are viewing things for merely the time of the workout - view the 24 hrs, not the 45 minutes.
    You don't actually need to keep the cardio for the fat burning. If you were trying to lose weight the diet would actually take care of that better. And lifting would burn more fat in 24 hr period than cardio. Intervals would improve on easy cardio, but that's only because it's getting closer to lifting in nature and response. But the lifting is the best.

    If you think there is fat to burn, leave enough energy and strength in muscles to do the best lifting workout you can get, that way they need the most repair, and cause the most fat to be done.

    You don't need protein after cardio, nor after lifting for that matter. As long as you get in enough daily.
    After intense cardio, if planning do to intense tomorrow, then a snack of carb and protein with 4:1 ratio would be best within 30 min. But you are going to be eating enough, and not doing intense cardio day after day, that doesn't matter as much. But if you do want a snack, at least make it that ratio.

    And yes, peanut butter is a great calorie booster because of the high fat, not good for protein or carbs because fat is so much higher.

    What is interval? Do you mean HIIT?

    I think I have a bit of fat around my waist. So are you saying weight lifting will burn the fat?

    People usually say the body absorbes easier the protein 30 minutes after your work session. That's why people recommends to drink a high protein shaker in the 30 minutes after the work out session.

    Tomorrow will be my first weight lifting session in the past 3 weeks. If I want to build muscle, should i do low reps with heavy weight?
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
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    What is interval? Do you mean HIIT?

    I think I have a bit of fat around my waist. So are you saying weight lifting will burn the fat?

    People usually say the body absorbes easier the protein 30 minutes after your work session. That's why people recommends to drink a high protein shaker in the 30 minutes after the work out session.

    Tomorrow will be my first weight lifting session in the past 3 weeks. If I want to build muscle, should i do low reps with heavy weight?

    Intervals, HIIT or regular or SIT, burns more fat compared to steady-state cardio for equal amounts of time, when you include the repair process in the equation, so the workout and the following 24-36 hrs.
    Because intervals is approaching what lifting does to the body. Not exactly, but for cardio folks that don't want to lift - that's the best there is.

    But you are lifting, so you don't need the intervals, or cardio for that matter. And yes it will burn fat, but neither lifting nor cardio will burn and cause fat loss if you are eating in surplus.

    So if you have fat to lose, you need to attempt to eat at maintenance then while starting this lifting program.
    That will cause strength gains, perhaps some muscle gains since new at it, and burn the fat off.

    follow the SL5x5 program, it explains it.

    As to the myths you've heard to protein and timing.
    http://crackingthemusclecode.com/the-truth-behind-nutrient-timing/
  • bridgie101
    bridgie101 Posts: 817 Member
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    Hi,

    I have been browsing on some website and it seems if someone wants to gain 1lb per week, he/she needs to eat 500 kcal above his/her TDEE. Do you think it's as simple as that? Is there any morphology factor?

    Some people eat like horses and never gain weight....

    Jamal

    Nobody eats like a horse and doesn't gain weight: we just think they do or they say they do, or they exercise more than us.

    the laws of physics cannot be altered. the number of calories in food is a measured amount, they burn the food (after drying) to see what heat is given off. That heat is a form of energy. As we know, energy can neither be created nor destroyed but only converted. Thus heat energy unburned is potential energy, and your body uses and stores that potential energy in fat and in its metabolic processes.

    Metabolism also is countable. x number of miles of blood vessel carrying y amount of blood at z amount of speed requries a amount of energy. It's that basic.

    There are 3500 calories in 1lb of fat. That is why you are told to eat 500 fewer calories a day than your body needs. A shortfall of 3500 cals a week will net you a loss of 1lb of fat.

    This stuff is actually really basic. There's a lot of mythology built up around the issues of diet, especially as they have to do with women and their propensity to embellish reality. For every skinny girl you know who rubs her tummy and rolls her eyes and does the 'i'm so full' you have an enormously large woman packing away an entire pizza and saying she has a metabolic problem. Physics is physics. It's as simple as that.