Strength Training

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  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
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    Does it affect your progress if you start your strength training with Machines? So far I can use 10kg on the arm machines (and that's pushing it to failure)

    I didn't see anyone answer this, but it would be OK, if you feel safer, to start doing a stronglifts inspired workout on machines. Just keep in mind it won't last forever and you need to be moving towards a barbell based routine.

    Here are the replacements:

    A
    Squat - Leg press machine
    Bench Press - Chest press machine
    Bent over row - Rowing machine

    B
    Squat - Leg press machine
    Overhead Press - Shoulder press machine
    Deadlift - Smith machine deadlift

    Start out really light, add weight whenever you complete a 5x5, and get transitioned to a real barbell ASAP.

    Good luck.

    I'd actually disagree here. Machines limit range of motion and don't always translate over to the barbell. If you need to go lighter than the bar, dumbbells are a better alternative.
  • lrmall01
    lrmall01 Posts: 377 Member
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    I'd actually disagree here. Machines limit range of motion and don't always translate over to the barbell. If you need to go lighter than the bar, dumbbells are a better alternative.

    Haha, I actually was updating my post to clarify this a little at the same time you replied.

    Totally agree with you that machines are probably the worst option there is, other than sitting on the couch. Just trying to give the OP a little guidance if they are dead set on using machines.
  • IronPlayground
    IronPlayground Posts: 1,594 Member
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    I'd actually disagree here. Machines limit range of motion and don't always translate over to the barbell. If you need to go lighter than the bar, dumbbells are a better alternative.

    Haha, I actually was updating my post to clarify this a little at the same time you replied.

    Totally agree with you that machines are probably the worst option there is, other than sitting on the couch. Just trying to give the OP a little guidance if they are dead set on using machines.

    :laugh: :drinker:
  • CarlKRobbo
    CarlKRobbo Posts: 390 Member
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    As much as I hate to suggest it, try using the smith machine to build your strength up and help with your form. Every week, keep trying to squat the bar without the machine. Once you can successfully squat the empty bar, dump the smith machine entirely.

    There are pros and cons to the smith machine. Yes, it helps to build confidence since you can lock the bar at any point and it guides you. However, at the same time it restricts your range of motion and takes out the stabilizer muscles since it can't leave the track. Use it as a learning tool but don't let it become a crutch.

    Please don't do this... This does not translate to free weights well at all. :noway:

    I have to disagree with you on this. Typically, I'd say avoid the smith machine, but it seems like her problem is the fear of re-injury. The smith machine can help to build confidence and some basic form. As I said in my post, use it simply as a jumping off point and as soon as you can squat the free weight bar, get rid of it. I'd rather see her use the smith machine to build confidence than snap her back up or not go deep enough for fear of injury.

    I'd think goblet squats would be a better alternative than the smith machine. Allows for lighter weight with the dumbbell, but doesn't restrict the movement as would the smith machine.

    1 - This ^^^^^ Goblet Squats over the Smith...

    2 - "I'd rather see her use the smith machine to build confidence then SNAP HER BACK UP or not go deep enough...." Errrrrrr..... It was recommended to start on the EMPTY BAR.......

    OP - I had physio 8 years ago on my Knee. I now squat 418lb's for reps, and 454Lb's as a Comp PB... As has been said practise FORM with the empty bar..
    Also one of the PT's in my gym has had the same injury as you, 14 times!! He now Squats Heavy, and advises the same as above - Master the form with the empty bar.
  • Mrsbeale11
    Mrsbeale11 Posts: 126 Member
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    Thanks everyone everything that you have said has been noted.

    When you start on this journey you look at all the fit people on here who all lift heavy and think (well I did...) that's what I want to be like...putting it into practise has been a bit different from how I thought it be (I didn't think I'd be able to do massive lifts to begin with but something) so duly noted that the general consensus is machines will not give the same results, stretch the h*ll out of my muscles to open hips up, don't be scared by previous injury but do practise form to avoid said previous injury and just keep at it.

    Once again thank you all for taking the time to pass on your personal knowledge that I greatly lack!

    :flowerforyou:
  • DeadliftAddict
    DeadliftAddict Posts: 746 Member
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    If working with the bar is too much right now, consider starting out with a solid body weight program like You Are Your Own Gym to build up some basic strength, and balance, and then after going through the beginner and maybe even intermediate version of it, then revisit the idea of coming back to SL.

    ^This.
  • cmeitz0
    cmeitz0 Posts: 4 Member
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    Google "Goblet Squat". Even with a small amount of weight, a goblet squat is effective and helps your form. Not because of the resistance, but because the weight used acts as a counterbalance and forces your body to use good form. When most people squat with no weight, they unknowingly lean forward too much. This is bad for knee, ankle, calf, and hip mobility. The weight used in a goblet squat (even just a few lbs) will help you stay straight. In fact, many people find that lowering into the squat position is the hardest part - if that's the case, then it is working right and forcing the right muscles to work. Don't feel bad about being weak in a squat, once the form gets right you get strong very quickly.

    An alternative is to squat facing just a few inches from a wall, and when your nose almost touches the wall, ascend back up. Focus on trying to get lower without touching the wall.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    So I was all geared up to start stronglifts 5x5 routine and when I started it there was 2 problems. One I can't do a proper squat ATM without a Swiss ball and Two I have no strength!!!!!

    Haven't worked out in 6 years so in completely outta shape :(

    Does it affect your progress if you start your strength training with Machines? So far I can use 10kg on the arm machines (and that's pushing it to failure)

    Thanks for the responses in advance :flowerforyou:

    ETA as iPhone likes to change squat to sway....

    Do what makes you feel comfortable, secure, and positive. If that means machines, then by all means, do machines.

    There is way too much browbeating people into thinking if they don't start with a program like stronglifts, anything they do is useless.

    There is no reason why you can't start with machines, or a mixture of machines and selected functional exercises to learn fundamentals and body awareness.

    Believe it or not, people don't have to master a complete, free-weight lifting program on day 1. You are allowed to start at a lower level and progress gradually. There are plenty of people who need time to learn how to squat or deadlift properly. While they are learning, they can also do other exercises -- even on (gasp!) machines -- to increase strength. Any so-called "shortcomings" of machines are: a) not that relevant to a new exerciser and b) transient issues that are easily resolved once the person moves into more of a free-weight based program.

    Almost none of my clients do back squats or deadlifts at first. However, just about all of them are doing them by weeks 6-8--even the 70 yr old females with fibro. In the meantime, they have seen dramatic increases in strength, balance, body awareness, etc, doing other exercises---even those on machines.

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