Squats + Dead lifts

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  • aledba
    aledba Posts: 564 Member
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    I do them both on the same day. It's part of Stronglifts 5x5 to do that, but you always do squats first.
    YAY! Stronglifts! I do them both on the same day, for the most part. As I progress, I'll probably split them up.
  • dbmata
    dbmata Posts: 12,951 Member
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    Apparently having good balance and stability in the knee just isn't a priority to some people.

    Let's be clear, that's not what I asked.

    Now another poster alluded to it helping combat runner's knee (patellofemoral instability issues). Is that what you were talking about?

    Considering distribution of balance, isn't there a strong potential for shearing force on the knee when the person doing it loses balance?
  • brower47
    brower47 Posts: 16,356 Member
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    Apparently having good balance and stability in the knee just isn't a priority to some people.

    Let's be clear, that's not what I asked.

    Now another poster alluded to it helping combat runner's knee (patellofemoral instability issues). Is that what you were talking about?

    Considering distribution of balance, isn't there a strong potential for shearing force on the knee when the person doing it loses balance?

    Isn't there a potential for injury when losing balance no matter the activity?
  • dbmata
    dbmata Posts: 12,951 Member
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    Eh. From how lunges look, you are spreading your balance over a long plane, and fairly susceptible to perpendicular shift. That's been my concern about the lunge, personally.

    Hell, if it's the de facto thing to build knee stability, who am I to argue that, seems like it is time to try it. I'm just curious how it does that while still mitigating potential shear.
  • kelly_e_montana
    kelly_e_montana Posts: 1,999 Member
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    If I'm not working at a high percentage of my 1 rm, I can superset squats and deads. I do think of deads as a back exercise as much as a lower body exercise. I only deadlift once per week for the most part. I usually squat 2x per week. I don't do all that other lower body stuff except maybe calf raises once per week just for aesthetics. For assistance exercises, I like lunges with an overhead plate, glute-ham raises (usually weighted) and good mornings. The lunges do really help with stability. I also work on pistol squats once every week or two for the same reason. It sounds like you, the OP, are looking to get away from machines and into the direction of more functional moves, and I think that's great.:smile:
  • Sam_I_Am77
    Sam_I_Am77 Posts: 2,093 Member
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    Eh. From how lunges look, you are spreading your balance over a long plane, and fairly susceptible to perpendicular shift. That's been my concern about the lunge, personally.

    Hell, if it's the de facto thing to build knee stability, who am I to argue that, seems like it is time to try it. I'm just curious how it does that while still mitigating potential shear.

    Then do them unweighted and just practice with your BW until you get the movement correct. But that's one of the benefits of a unilateral movements, building stability.
  • jason_adams
    jason_adams Posts: 187 Member
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    Do them.
    Do them both.

    And never, ever, skip leg day.

    *I can't believe we're on page 2 and this hasn't come up....
  • mryak750
    mryak750 Posts: 198 Member
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    don't restrict yourself..try it out and see how you feel
  • msncush
    msncush Posts: 23 Member
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    if you do the squat correctly, it works all your lower muscle.
  • wonderwoman234
    wonderwoman234 Posts: 551 Member
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    Bonus question, what will a lunge do more safely than a squat? Considering how off weight and balance is distributed, it seems fairly high risk and suspceptible to shearing forces on the knees at any heavy weights.

    This.....

    I pulled out both right and left gluteals (not on the same day) doing lunges after squats and deadlifts. Never doing that again.

    I posted another thread a while ago about this and there were lots of anti-lunge peeps. I guess everyone has to do what works for them.
  • jlclabo
    jlclabo Posts: 588 Member
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    my program runs squats and deads the same day and both are 80% on the heavy day and 70% on volume days, along with all accessory work that consists of ham curls, calf raises, stiff leg dl, and leg press. it does take a little to get use to it, but i love it.
  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
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    my program runs squats and deads the same day and both are 80% on the heavy day and 70% on volume days, along with all accessory work that consists of ham curls, calf raises, stiff leg dl, and leg press. it does take a little to get use to it, but i love it.

    ^This. The issue is programming. If squats and deads are performed at a workload percent that is below 1RM, and the goal isn't to max out on every lift, then there is nothing wrong with doing them on the same day. I run them both on the same day, at least 2 times a week. Natural advanced lifters will benefit from more than 1 day of stimulation for a body part - so once a week "leg days" are sub-optimal. Again, it's the workload that must be monitored and adhered to. Maxing out every lift is uneccesary.
  • kapoorpk
    kapoorpk Posts: 244 Member
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    Great discussion. What I deduce from all the wisdom shared here is that there is no harm in doing these two together as long as I am not maxing out on 1RM each time. Plus, the leg curls lunges, etc. aren't necessary given sufficient stimulation of all leg muscles, but could throw them in there if I could.

    My focus at the moment is muscle mass gain, not so much of trying to max my lifts, as such have been performing 3 or 4 sets of 10-12 reps. That should put me around 60-70% of 1RM, perhaps. Having said that, I could skip all the other leg stuff to avoid overtraining.

    BTW, I rotate the push, pull, leg routine through a 2 day work/1 day rest split, so end up focusing on each muscle group twice in 8 days.

    Any other thoughts, please do share.

    Thanks!

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