Things I've learned from the forums here

I learned that everything weighs the same, because a pound of X == a pound of Y == a pound of Z. Or something.

Yep, a marble weighs as much as a hypergiant star. In fact we might as well do away with all scales since everything is the same weight.

In...

...for more quoted posts with no new comments.

DR Oz. is the best source of medical advice.

We are all different and what works for one of us might not work for all of us.

Jokes about men and "protein" are unfounded because it is actually made of mostly carbohydrates.

Something I learned: Cat gifs are awesome.

I learned that everything weighs the same, because a pound of X == a pound of Y == a pound of Z. Or something.

Yep, a marble weighs as much as a hypergiant star. In fact we might as well do away with all scales since everything is the same weight.

:flowerforyou: love you

Something I learned: Cat gifs are awesome.

Oh yeah!

Jokes about men and "protein" are unfounded because it is actually made of mostly carbohydrates.

I've learned something new from the forums today.

You cannot just assume that everything you read in the forums is true.

AND THUS I PROPOSE AN EXPERIMENT!

1) Starvation mode (the way most people talk about it) is a myth. Only works for people who are actually starving.

there's no single state of "starvation mode" - that's the myth. The body does have a whole range of responses to insufficient food intake that stopped our evolutionary ancestors from starving to death, and which screw up modern people's diets. They kick in at different times, and some of them are behavioural/psychological responses. So it's not really correct to say it only works for people who are actually starving. Here's an overview:

- behavioural responses kick in early on, can be even on the first day of not eating enough - "increased food seeking behaviour" is what biologists would call it...... in practical terms it means being really hungry and obsessing about food. Like if someone goes on a diet and finds themselves dreaming of going to McDonalds.... also, compensatory overeating due to ramped up hunger. Eating too few calories can be counterproductive

- binge eating - also a behavioural response, it's so common among people doing overly restrictive diets.... it's a survival instinct that kicks in... in an evolutionary context, someone has too little to eat for a while, then suddenly they get hold of a lot of food, well their chances of survival are best if they eat as much of that food as they possibly can, hopefully all of it, and store the excess as fat. This is exactly what many people experience on diets... they get to a point where they totally binge like a starving Homo erectus person. Because that's exactly what survival instinct is kicking in in response to insufficient food intake

- loss of lean body mass - this can happen quite early on if you're eating too little... if you're eating too little protein it can still happen even if you're not in calorie deficit (your body has to get the amino acids it needs from somewhere). Doing strength training and eating enough protein can help protect against this, but if the calorie deficit is too big it will happen regardless. Loss of lean mass has a lot of negative health consequences, including loss of bone density which increases the risk of osteoporosis.

- adaptive thermogensis - this is slowing of the metabolism that's over and above what you'd expect as a result of loss of lean mass. This doesn't kick in immediately but a lot of people on diets do experience this and it has been demonstrated in scientific studies too. "starvation mode" I think was originally used as a layman's term for adaptive thermogensis. It is real and you don't need to be half way starved to death to experience it. People who do a lot of cardio and eat too little are particularly at risk of it, and all the other responses listed above. Adaptive thermogenesis is not good for long term health, as energy is directed away from non-essential functions in the body, including the immune system and reproductive system. Someone going through this is likely to look ill and feel tired and run down all the time.

- the body doesn't store fat in a deficit, but when you have a combination of the above, especially with the rebound binge eating, the result is that the body composition gets worse, as in muscle is lost and fat is gained. Without the binge eating, muscle and fat is lost, but the body tries to make the fat stores last as long as possible. If binge eating is happening in combination with adaptive thermogenesis, then more of the binge calories will be stored as fat than it would be in someone who ate the same amount of food but hadn't previously restricted their calories.

- rebound fat gain is something that's inevitable if you don't stick to your diet/new lifestyle long term, even if none of the above have happened... but adaptive thermogenesis, loss of lean mass and rebound overeating/binge eating make the rebound fat gain all the more likely and greater in magnitude.

So when you consider all the above, there is some truth behind the starvation mode myth... but it's not at state that the body can be in or out of (like sleeping or waking) - and much of what is believed about it (like if you skip breakfast, don't eat for a day, or whatever, you will immediately screw up your metabolism) is total mythology. But in debunking the myths, it's really important not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.... there are some serious issues that can arise which screw up people's efforts at dieting, that people do need to be aware of. In particular, because it seems to be the most common, avoiding being stuck in a cycle of binge eating and excessive calorie restriction. Also, the message that strength training + adequate protein + sensible calorie deficit protects against loss of lean mass needs to be out there. Also, all the above responses make people really miserable and have a negative impact on health, while eating at a sensible deficit while strength training and eating lots of protein tends to result in people being healthier, happier and finding the whole fat loss experience a lot more positive and sustainable.

You mean adding it to a solution of copper sulphate and sodium hydroxide and seeing if the solution turns purple?

I was thinking of more of a long term experiment with a number of participants, the style of which they employ in Japan.

Now what copper hydroxide has to do with proper macronutrient ratios I will never know.

This is serious sciencing we're talking about, Ms. Magnon, not your prestidigitational jiggery pokery!

How to pick a fight on MHP:

Step 1: Post a statement

Step 2: Wait

Do you mean on "MFP" ? Confused.

1) Starvation mode (the way most people talk about it) is a myth. Only works for people who are actually starving.

there's no single state of "starvation mode" - that's the myth. The body does have a whole range of responses to insufficient food intake that stopped our evolutionary ancestors from starving to death, and which screw up modern people's diets. They kick in at different times, and some of them are behavioural/psychological responses. So it's not really correct to say it only works for people who are actually starving. Here's an overview:

- behavioural responses kick in early on, can be even on the first day of not eating enough - "increased food seeking behaviour" is what biologists would call it...... in practical terms it means being really hungry and obsessing about food. Like if someone goes on a diet and finds themselves dreaming of going to McDonalds.... also, compensatory overeating due to ramped up hunger. Eating too few calories can be counterproductive

- binge eating - also a behavioural response, it's so common among people doing overly restrictive diets.... it's a survival instinct that kicks in... in an evolutionary context, someone has too little to eat for a while, then suddenly they get hold of a lot of food, well their chances of survival are best if they eat as much of that food as they possibly can, hopefully all of it, and store the excess as fat. This is exactly what many people experience on diets... they get to a point where they totally binge like a starving Homo erectus person. Because that's exactly what survival instinct is kicking in in response to insufficient food intake

- loss of lean body mass - this can happen quite early on if you're eating too little... if you're eating too little protein it can still happen even if you're not in calorie deficit (your body has to get the amino acids it needs from somewhere). Doing strength training and eating enough protein can help protect against this, but if the calorie deficit is too big it will happen regardless. Loss of lean mass has a lot of negative health consequences, including loss of bone density which increases the risk of osteoporosis.

- adaptive thermogensis - this is slowing of the metabolism that's over and above what you'd expect as a result of loss of lean mass. This doesn't kick in immediately but a lot of people on diets do experience this and it has been demonstrated in scientific studies too. "starvation mode" I think was originally used as a layman's term for adaptive thermogensis. It is real and you don't need to be half way starved to death to experience it. People who do a lot of cardio and eat too little are particularly at risk of it, and all the other responses listed above. Adaptive thermogenesis is not good for long term health, as energy is directed away from non-essential functions in the body, including the immune system and reproductive system. Someone going through this is likely to look ill and feel tired and run down all the time.

- the body doesn't store fat in a deficit, but when you have a combination of the above, especially with the rebound binge eating, the result is that the body composition gets worse, as in muscle is lost and fat is gained. Without the binge eating, muscle and fat is lost, but the body tries to make the fat stores last as long as possible. If binge eating is happening in combination with adaptive thermogenesis, then more of the binge calories will be stored as fat than it would be in someone who ate the same amount of food but hadn't previously restricted their calories.

- rebound fat gain is something that's inevitable if you don't stick to your diet/new lifestyle long term, even if none of the above have happened... but adaptive thermogenesis, loss of lean mass and rebound overeating/binge eating make the rebound fat gain all the more likely and greater in magnitude.

So when you consider all the above, there is some truth behind the starvation mode myth... but it's not at state that the body can be in or out of (like sleeping or waking) - and much of what is believed about it (like if you skip breakfast, don't eat for a day, or whatever, you will immediately screw up your metabolism) is total mythology. But in debunking the myths, it's really important not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.... there are some serious issues that can arise which screw up people's efforts at dieting, that people do need to be aware of. In particular, because it seems to be the most common, avoiding being stuck in a cycle of binge eating and excessive calorie restriction. Also, the message that strength training + adequate protein + sensible calorie deficit protects against loss of lean mass needs to be out there. Also, all the above responses make people really miserable and have a negative impact on health, while eating at a sensible deficit while strength training and eating lots of protein tends to result in people being healthier, happier and finding the whole fat loss experience a lot more positive and sustainable.

Do you have some sort of side-bet about how often you can use the term "Homo Erectus" today and why am I not in on that bet?

Lol you see what you did OP, you got peoples panties in a bunch.

Things I've learned from forums: Don't post anything unless the vast majority of the forum agrees with what you're saying.

It's called discussion. Believe it or not, you can say things other than "I agree!"

How to pick a fight on MHP:

Step 1: Post a statement

Step 2: Wait

Do you mean on "MFP" ? Confused.

That is what is commonly referred to as a "typo"

There you go being sensible and logical.

1) Starvation mode (the way most people talk about it) is a myth. Only works for people who are actually starving.

there's no single state of "starvation mode" - that's the myth. The body does have a whole range of responses to insufficient food intake that stopped our evolutionary ancestors from starving to death, and which screw up modern people's diets. They kick in at different times, and some of them are behavioural/psychological responses. So it's not really correct to say it only works for people who are actually starving. Here's an overview:

- behavioural responses kick in early on, can be even on the first day of not eating enough - "increased food seeking behaviour" is what biologists would call it...... in practical terms it means being really hungry and obsessing about food. Like if someone goes on a diet and finds themselves dreaming of going to McDonalds.... also, compensatory overeating due to ramped up hunger. Eating too few calories can be counterproductive

- binge eating - also a behavioural response, it's so common among people doing overly restrictive diets.... it's a survival instinct that kicks in... in an evolutionary context, someone has too little to eat for a while, then suddenly they get hold of a lot of food, well their chances of survival are best if they eat as much of that food as they possibly can, hopefully all of it, and store the excess as fat. This is exactly what many people experience on diets... they get to a point where they totally binge like a starving Homo erectus person. Because that's exactly what survival instinct is kicking in in response to insufficient food intake

- loss of lean body mass - this can happen quite early on if you're eating too little... if you're eating too little protein it can still happen even if you're not in calorie deficit (your body has to get the amino acids it needs from somewhere). Doing strength training and eating enough protein can help protect against this, but if the calorie deficit is too big it will happen regardless. Loss of lean mass has a lot of negative health consequences, including loss of bone density which increases the risk of osteoporosis.

- adaptive thermogensis - this is slowing of the metabolism that's over and above what you'd expect as a result of loss of lean mass. This doesn't kick in immediately but a lot of people on diets do experience this and it has been demonstrated in scientific studies too. "starvation mode" I think was originally used as a layman's term for adaptive thermogensis. It is real and you don't need to be half way starved to death to experience it. People who do a lot of cardio and eat too little are particularly at risk of it, and all the other responses listed above. Adaptive thermogenesis is not good for long term health, as energy is directed away from non-essential functions in the body, including the immune system and reproductive system. Someone going through this is likely to look ill and feel tired and run down all the time.

- the body doesn't store fat in a deficit, but when you have a combination of the above, especially with the rebound binge eating, the result is that the body composition gets worse, as in muscle is lost and fat is gained. Without the binge eating, muscle and fat is lost, but the body tries to make the fat stores last as long as possible. If binge eating is happening in combination with adaptive thermogenesis, then more of the binge calories will be stored as fat than it would be in someone who ate the same amount of food but hadn't previously restricted their calories.

- rebound fat gain is something that's inevitable if you don't stick to your diet/new lifestyle long term, even if none of the above have happened... but adaptive thermogenesis, loss of lean mass and rebound overeating/binge eating make the rebound fat gain all the more likely and greater in magnitude.

So when you consider all the above, there is some truth behind the starvation mode myth... but it's not at state that the body can be in or out of (like sleeping or waking) - and much of what is believed about it (like if you skip breakfast, don't eat for a day, or whatever, you will immediately screw up your metabolism) is total mythology. But in debunking the myths, it's really important not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.... there are some serious issues that can arise which screw up people's efforts at dieting, that people do need to be aware of. In particular, because it seems to be the most common, avoiding being stuck in a cycle of binge eating and excessive calorie restriction. Also, the message that strength training + adequate protein + sensible calorie deficit protects against loss of lean mass needs to be out there. Also, all the above responses make people really miserable and have a negative impact on health, while eating at a sensible deficit while strength training and eating lots of protein tends to result in people being healthier, happier and finding the whole fat loss experience a lot more positive and sustainable.

Most helpful for the forums: How the automatic ignoring thing works. I even use it when I see crazy, nasty people being rude to others. Zap! All the nonsense and rudeness gone and future stuff avoided entirely.