HOOOOW to make apple cider vinegar drinkable?

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  • neandermagnon
    neandermagnon Posts: 7,436 Member
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    Please could you people who are touting the benefits of apple cider vinegar explain to me what it is about apple cider vinegar, compared to other vinegars such as red wine vinegar or malt vinegar, that has the health benefits? And also, if it's something specific to apples, then wouldn't apple juice have the same health benefit(s)?

    Also, peer reviewed journal articles would be nice....

    Not to be rude by any means, but if you need to read such articles, can't you look them up? I'm sure the benefits from just an apple is fine, I love apples and eat them regularly as well. I just thought the information from the website of the maker of this ACV would be helpful.

    I believe it is personal preference. If you find a way you like it, drink it or use it. If not, don't. I happen to like it. I cannot say for sure, but I have been told that other vinegars are offer great health benefits as well.

    You people are the ones touting this stuff as having health benefits, and I don't believe you. People are extremely gullible and there's so much quackery being touted that I simply don't have the time to look up every single one individually. I will believe in the health benefits when any of you people touting them prove them with actual, bona fide scientific studies that show that whatever it is really does have the effects that are claimed, and preferably with information such as what the active ingredient is in it. Without that, then I will continue to dismiss them as quackery.

    I also urge everyone to do the same, about this, and every other thing on the market out there, because the are people making a crap ton of money selling quack cures that do absolutely nothing except line their pockets. My questions are rhetorical, I don't really want to know the answers, I want the people to question the claims of the people selling these things. I use various different vinegars in cooking purely because I like the taste. I am not really interested in the health benefits of this, more in getting people to ask more questions before believing every single quack-peddler out there. Because they're getting rich selling stuff that doesn't work.
  • whovian67
    whovian67 Posts: 608 Member
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    Just shoot it and follow maybe with 5 cal cranberry juice drink. Nothing makes it takes good. diluting it with water just takes longer..
  • Dragonwolf
    Dragonwolf Posts: 5,600 Member
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    If it were really as beneficial as some reports say - don't you think everyone would drink it? Stop drinking it, substitute it for other vinegar in your cooking and let it go at that. I'm not sure it's even edible...period.

    If weight loss were really as beneficial as reports say - don't you think everyone would be losing weight?

    In other words, your argument is a fallacy.

    It's entirely edible. I second the recommendation for Bragg's raw with the mother. It has more of an apple taste to it than the pasteurized/conventional stuff.

    Acetic acid, the acid in ACV, actually has potent antiglycemic and antimicrobial effects, both of which have been known and studied for some time now. Acetic acid is even prescribed for outer ear infections. Works great for heartburn, too, depending on the underlying cause (I know, counterinuitive, but it really does, because not all heartburn is caused by too much stomach acid). Also works great as a fabric softener, hair conditioner, all-purpose household cleaner, and for removing various skin blemishes like moles and skin tags.

    Oh, and to answer your question -- more people don't drink it, because societal norms have shifted toward shunning natural remedies in favor of pharmaceuticals, even when the pharmaceuticals are using the very natural remedies that the layman shuns (ie - the acetic acid ear drops for ear infections). Just like how more people don't eat organ meat anymore, even though doing so can supply you with more Vitamin A, Iron, and other nutrients than most other "nutrient powerhouse" foods can even dream of supplying.

    http://authoritynutrition.com/6-proven-health-benefits-of-apple-cider-vinegar/ (has around 30 links to PubMed studies)

    I found #3 particularly interesting. But perhaps people will believe you because it has links to med studies.

    3. Apple Cider Vinegar May Lower Blood Sugar Levels, Which is Very Useful For Diabetics
    Type 2 diabetes is characterized by elevated blood sugars, either in the context of insulin resistance or an inability to produce insulin.

    However, elevated blood sugar can also be a problem in people who don’t have diabetes… it is believed to be a major cause of ageing and various chronic diseases.

    So, pretty much everyone should benefit from keeping their blood sugar levels stable.

    The most effective (and healthiest) way to do that is to avoid refined carbs and sugar, but apple cider vinegar may also have a powerful effect.

    Please can you link me to the actual scientific studies that these statements are based on. Otherwise it's just words on a screen. Anyone can type words on a screen.


    "The health benefits of eating ants: 1. they contain formic acid which helps to protect you from tennis elbow. 2. they are a good source of protein. 3. The keratin in their exoskeleton gives you glossy hair and shiny fingernails. 4. Wild chimpanzees eat them all the time, and look how healthy and strong they are."

    See? I just made that up off the top of my head. Mix of stuff I know about ants and stuff I just made up right now for a laugh. How do we know the difference? Well, unless I can show you peer reviewed journal articles to back up each point (and I can, for some, such as chimpanzees eating ants and the fact that ants contain formic acid, protein and ketatin) and the claim that there's a health benefit in humans eating ants, then you can dismiss what I'm saying as whacko-jacko. And yes, I can back up about 60% of what's written up there with scientific sources, so beware of quacks who do exactly the same thing, i.e. mix of fact and stuff they just made up to sell you something, and then back up the facts that you can back up with semi relevant scientific sources so it *looks like* you did all your research, but actually you just made up about 40% of it.

    The quote that the other person copied here was in the link posted in the block quote, but here are the studies that the original article cites:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7796781
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/27/1/281.long
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/11/2814.full
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20068289
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9630389
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16034360
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/11/2814.full.pdf
    https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bbb1961/52/5/52_5_1311/_pdf
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1750-3841.12434/full
  • levitateme
    levitateme Posts: 999 Member
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    Please could you people who are touting the benefits of apple cider vinegar explain to me what it is about apple cider vinegar, compared to other vinegars such as red wine vinegar or malt vinegar, that has the health benefits? And also, if it's something specific to apples, then wouldn't apple juice have the same health benefit(s)?

    Also, peer reviewed journal articles would be nice....

    Not to be rude by any means, but if you need to read such articles, can't you look them up? I'm sure the benefits from just an apple is fine, I love apples and eat them regularly as well. I just thought the information from the website of the maker of this ACV would be helpful.

    I believe it is personal preference. If you find a way you like it, drink it or use it. If not, don't. I happen to like it. I cannot say for sure, but I have been told that other vinegars are offer great health benefits as well.

    And this is how we go from, "There is a ton of proven, scientific research on the benefits of apple cider vinegar." to "Look it up yourself, it's a personal choice."

    If you're making a claim about something, you should be able to back it up. If you're proven wrong you should learn from that and examine your personal decision making process.

    Because if you're following bad sources of information you'll end up with children who have whooping cough and bad teeth. That's a "personal choice" nobody wants.

    :drinker:
  • Dragonwolf
    Dragonwolf Posts: 5,600 Member
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    Don't drink it. Those health benefits are HIGHLY overrated.

    If you insist on it, take it with a chaser of your favorite intensely flavorful beverage.

    Actually that is incorrect. Drinking apple cider vinegar before a meal reduces the insulin spike that results from eating.

    How is that even possible? Apple cider vinegar is just fermented apple juice. A lot of the sugar is removed, but that doesn't mean that there isn't still sugar present.

    There have been countless studies on this and the results are lower blood sugar levels.

    http://www.diabetesincontrol.com/contact-us/2475-&action=1
    http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/06/02/apple-cider-vinegar-hype.aspx
    http://simpledailychange.com/apple-cider-vinegar-for-insulin-sensitivity/
    http://www.thealternativedaily.com/multiple-studies-you-can-control-blood-sugar-with-apple-cider-vinegar/
    http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-816-APPLE CIDER VINEGAR.aspx?activeIngredientId=816&activeIngredientName=APPLE CIDER VINEGAR

    Mercola is a well renouned quack. Maybe he has shares in apple cider vinegar.

    You need to be a bit more selective in your reading. Try peer reviewed scientific journal articles.

    You mean like these?

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1785201/ -- review, has a bunch of other studies as well
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7796781/
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16034360/
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/11/2814.full
    http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/22/1_MeetingAbstracts/315.2

    From the first study (Did you actually read it by the way?);

    "But whether vinegar is a useful adjunct therapy for individuals with diabetes or prediabetes has yet to be determined"

    Did you not read my comment next to the first link? It's a review (read -- not study), published seven years ago. I linked to it, because it links to a number of other studies for the various reported benefits.
  • 3laine75
    3laine75 Posts: 3,070 Member
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    Why are you drinking vinegar?!
  • canadjineh
    canadjineh Posts: 5,396 Member
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    I'm skeptical of the health benefits, although oddly I find it helps with heartburn. Whatever works, works.

    but am I the only one that *likes* the taste? I'll often add a pour to my water-- tap or club-- just to liven it up. mmmm

    I do it once in a while to change up the taste of my water - 1 capful of Bragg's with the 'mother' in a 750 ml bottle of water. I really like sour and bitter things (sucked on lemons when I was a baby) but once in a while I'll give it a tiny squirt of Mio in the 750 ml bottle too for something different.

    edit to add: I usually put lemon or lime juice in my water (no sweetener) so this is a bit of a change, although my dentist suggests that I use a straw to drink to help prevent deterioration of enamel.
  • Dragonwolf
    Dragonwolf Posts: 5,600 Member
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    Of course it has "antimicrobial effects" it's a mild acid. That's why it's used as a househould cleaner. You planning on drinking your windex too? Silly argument - but people believe what they want to believe and most will only source links that back up what they want to believe.

    Now "eye of newt" now there's a weight loss diamond!

    cheers

    Do you avoid fat, too? Fats are acids, too. In fact, they're half of the soap equation, and soap is a household (and body) cleaner. In fact, real soap like that is technically a salt! Should you avoid table salt, then, too?

    Also, your comparison to Windex is essentially like comparing ethyl alcohol with methyl alcohol, and saying that, while both can be used as disinfectants, because one is toxic to the body, you shouldn't drink the other.

    Your argument is not only silly, but downright absurd and fallacious. There are thousands of compounds that are both entirely edible and can be used for other purposes, including cleaning and medical purposes. The two sets of uses aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.
  • canadjineh
    canadjineh Posts: 5,396 Member
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    Of course it has "antimicrobial effects" it's a mild acid. That's why it's used as a househould cleaner. You planning on drinking your windex too? Silly argument - but people believe what they want to believe and most will only source links that back up what they want to believe.

    Now "eye of newt" now there's a weight loss diamond!

    cheers

    Do you avoid fat, too? Fats are acids, too. In fact, they're half of the soap equation, and soap is a household (and body) cleaner. In fact, real soap like that is technically a salt! Should you avoid table salt, then, too?

    Also, your comparison to Windex is essentially like comparing ethyl alcohol with methyl alcohol, and saying that, while both can be used as disinfectants, because one is toxic to the body, you shouldn't drink the other.

    Your argument is not only silly, but downright absurd and fallacious. There are thousands of compounds that are both entirely edible and can be used for other purposes, including cleaning and medical purposes. The two sets of uses aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

    LOL... so totally this ^^^^^
  • neandermagnon
    neandermagnon Posts: 7,436 Member
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    Please could you people who are touting the benefits of apple cider vinegar explain to me what it is about apple cider vinegar, compared to other vinegars such as red wine vinegar or malt vinegar, that has the health benefits? And also, if it's something specific to apples, then wouldn't apple juice have the same health benefit(s)?

    Also, peer reviewed journal articles would be nice....

    The active ingredient, acetic acid, is largely what provides most of the benefits, though raw AVC, like Bragg's also includes a number of probiotics, which have their own benefits. On the acetic acid front, though, it doesn't really much matter, as long as it has a sufficient concentration of acetic acid. In that aspect, white vinegar has the same benefits, though I'd argue that ACV tastes better, but that's just personal preference.

    As for other vinegars, I'd suspect that the stock for making it may leave certain properties that could have different effects. Balsamic vinegar, for example, is made from grapes and is sweet. I suspect it therefore has more sugar in it. If that's the case, then the sugar may defeat the antiglycemic effects of the acetic acid (just a guess there, though).

    Wikipedia has a good run down of the different types of vinegars and what they're made from -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinegar#Varieties

    I know all about the various different vinegars for cooking purposes. I'm a connoisseur of vinegars (kidding - I'm not even that good at cooking... I just like the taste of vinegar and use various different ones). Which is why it doesn't make much sense that apple cider vinegar would have health benefits that the others don't

    So if acetic/ethanoic acid is the active ingredient then any vinegar will do. So why not advise people to use malt vinegar, as it's much cheaper and easily obtained in any supermarket? And why tell people that they have to drink it - a strong acid - when they can consume it as part of a delicious salad dressing or something? (if 2 tablespoons are the required amount, you can add that to a tomato based sauce, or even add it to tuna mayonnaise, it'll give it a lot of zing and be a lot more pleasant to consume than drinking it. Also, vindaloo is a delicious curry dish that is made with vinegar... why not have a vindaloo? If someone is diabetic and wants to reduce carbs, serve it with only a small portion of rice, and you can make it not so spicy (eating more sauce and less rice will make the spiciness seem a lot stronger so I'd recommend that).)

    So again, this idea that you have to buy apple cider vinegar - which is a more delicate vinegar for finer cooking and way more expensive than malt vinegar, which is your basic all purpose vinegar for putting on your fish n chips (yes I'm British so I mean French fries) and is much cheaper and on sale pretty much everywere..... and then you have companies selling you special apple cider vinegar as a health food product, so likely to be that much more expensive than the apple cider vinegar you get in supermarkets for people to use in cooking......... and you're saying that the active ingredient is acetic/ethanoic acid...... well that just smacks of quackery.... if there's truth in it, then use malt vinegar.

    Also, what you wrote seems to be your opinion, or the sales pitch of companies selling apple cider vinegar. Again, without peer reviewed journal articles, how do I separate facts from your opinions or the sales pitch of people selling the stuff?
  • MinMin97
    MinMin97 Posts: 2,676 Member
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    Salad dressing.
    But if you hate it, don't make yourself eat it!
  • Alluminati
    Alluminati Posts: 6,208 Member
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    They made Jesus drink vinegar.
  • neandermagnon
    neandermagnon Posts: 7,436 Member
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    If it were really as beneficial as some reports say - don't you think everyone would drink it? Stop drinking it, substitute it for other vinegar in your cooking and let it go at that. I'm not sure it's even edible...period.

    If weight loss were really as beneficial as reports say - don't you think everyone would be losing weight?

    In other words, your argument is a fallacy.

    It's entirely edible. I second the recommendation for Bragg's raw with the mother. It has more of an apple taste to it than the pasteurized/conventional stuff.

    Acetic acid, the acid in ACV, actually has potent antiglycemic and antimicrobial effects, both of which have been known and studied for some time now. Acetic acid is even prescribed for outer ear infections. Works great for heartburn, too, depending on the underlying cause (I know, counterinuitive, but it really does, because not all heartburn is caused by too much stomach acid). Also works great as a fabric softener, hair conditioner, all-purpose household cleaner, and for removing various skin blemishes like moles and skin tags.

    Oh, and to answer your question -- more people don't drink it, because societal norms have shifted toward shunning natural remedies in favor of pharmaceuticals, even when the pharmaceuticals are using the very natural remedies that the layman shuns (ie - the acetic acid ear drops for ear infections). Just like how more people don't eat organ meat anymore, even though doing so can supply you with more Vitamin A, Iron, and other nutrients than most other "nutrient powerhouse" foods can even dream of supplying.

    http://authoritynutrition.com/6-proven-health-benefits-of-apple-cider-vinegar/ (has around 30 links to PubMed studies)

    I found #3 particularly interesting. But perhaps people will believe you because it has links to med studies.

    3. Apple Cider Vinegar May Lower Blood Sugar Levels, Which is Very Useful For Diabetics
    Type 2 diabetes is characterized by elevated blood sugars, either in the context of insulin resistance or an inability to produce insulin.

    However, elevated blood sugar can also be a problem in people who don’t have diabetes… it is believed to be a major cause of ageing and various chronic diseases.

    So, pretty much everyone should benefit from keeping their blood sugar levels stable.

    The most effective (and healthiest) way to do that is to avoid refined carbs and sugar, but apple cider vinegar may also have a powerful effect.

    Please can you link me to the actual scientific studies that these statements are based on. Otherwise it's just words on a screen. Anyone can type words on a screen.


    "The health benefits of eating ants: 1. they contain formic acid which helps to protect you from tennis elbow. 2. they are a good source of protein. 3. The keratin in their exoskeleton gives you glossy hair and shiny fingernails. 4. Wild chimpanzees eat them all the time, and look how healthy and strong they are."

    See? I just made that up off the top of my head. Mix of stuff I know about ants and stuff I just made up right now for a laugh. How do we know the difference? Well, unless I can show you peer reviewed journal articles to back up each point (and I can, for some, such as chimpanzees eating ants and the fact that ants contain formic acid, protein and ketatin) and the claim that there's a health benefit in humans eating ants, then you can dismiss what I'm saying as whacko-jacko. And yes, I can back up about 60% of what's written up there with scientific sources, so beware of quacks who do exactly the same thing, i.e. mix of fact and stuff they just made up to sell you something, and then back up the facts that you can back up with semi relevant scientific sources so it *looks like* you did all your research, but actually you just made up about 40% of it.

    The quote that the other person copied here was in the link posted in the block quote, but here are the studies that the original article cites:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7796781
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/27/1/281.long
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/11/2814.full
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20068289
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9630389
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16034360
    http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/30/11/2814.full.pdf
    https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bbb1961/52/5/52_5_1311/_pdf
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1750-3841.12434/full

    Okay so a quick look at a couple of those shows that there may be some benefit to consuming acetic/ethanoic acid. Although the number of subjects were extremely small, so the conclusions are not firm by any means (sorry I didn't look at all of them, because I have a slow internet connection and they take forever to load... if I missed one that was specifically looking at something else in apple cider vinegar besides acetic/ethanoic acid, then link me to just that one).

    But let's give them the benefit of the doubt.......... those studies brings me back to the question - why are these health food companies always saying that this benefit is from apple cider vinegar... which is expensive (and they're also selling this stuff marketed at the health food market, no doubt even more expensive than the supermarket apple cider vinegar).... when malt vinegar, which is much much cheaper than other fancy vinegars, will give the exact same benefit, as all the studies are on the acetic/ethanoic acid itself........ but I guess it'll be a lot harder for health food companies to market malt vinegar in the same way, seeing as you can buy that very cheap in any supermarket or corner shop..........
  • smantha32
    smantha32 Posts: 6,990 Member
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    I also use it to treat my cat's chin acne. I would never drink it straight.

    How is it working for that? I have a cat with face/chin acne also and nothing the vet does is helping her.
  • levitateme
    levitateme Posts: 999 Member
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    I also use it to treat my cat's chin acne. I would never drink it straight.

    How is it working for that? I have a cat with face/chin acne also and nothing the vet does is helping her.

    I use a qtip to dab a little hydrogen peroxide on my cat's chin acne, it clears it up.
  • smantha32
    smantha32 Posts: 6,990 Member
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    I also use it to treat my cat's chin acne. I would never drink it straight.

    How is it working for that? I have a cat with face/chin acne also and nothing the vet does is helping her.

    I use a qtip to dab a little hydrogen peroxide on my cat's chin acne, it clears it up.

    I might try both. It's a pretty large spot.
  • buzybev
    buzybev Posts: 199 Member
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    I also use it to treat my cat's chin acne. I would never drink it straight.

    How is it working for that? I have a cat with face/chin acne also and nothing the vet does is helping her.

    It's working pretty good so far. I saturate half of a cotton ball with acv and then wet the entire thing with warm water (so one part acv/two parts water??) and scrub gently. It's definitely helping and I'm trying to be diligent about doing it daily. She hates the smell though and tries to lick it off. It's been a few days and her chin is not as crunchy.
  • UsedToBeHusky
    UsedToBeHusky Posts: 15,229 Member
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    Okay... so I actually lost interest in this thread when I realized that it was a zombie, but I actually learned a lot popping back here.

    I didn't know acetic acid had any impact on insulin. Good to know. But like neander said, any vinegar should have the same impact. I am left with just one question. Would cooking the vinegar detrimentally effect the benefit of insulin?

    Because that is the only way I can justify in my mind drinking it raw, and to the best of my knowledge, apple cider vinegar is chosen for drinking because it is more palatable than other vinegars. Also, I don't get the claim that this stuff helps with heartburn and reflux. I admit that I drank the Kool-Aid about ACV, so to speak, for awhile before abandoning it BECAUSE I would get terrible heartburn after. As an acid, I would think it would only make the hydrochloric acid in your stomach worse. Also, I heard that the acid can burn the lining of the esophagus.

    Why can't using vinegar in cooking provide the same insulinogenic effect? Especially, when drinking it raw could be potentially more harmful than helpful.
  • smantha32
    smantha32 Posts: 6,990 Member
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    I also use it to treat my cat's chin acne. I would never drink it straight.

    How is it working for that? I have a cat with face/chin acne also and nothing the vet does is helping her.

    It's working pretty good so far. I saturate half of a cotton ball with acv and then wet the entire thing with warm water (so one part acv/two parts water??) and scrub gently. It's definitely helping and I'm trying to be diligent about doing it daily. She hates the smell though and tries to lick it off. It's been a few days and her chin is not as crunchy.

    thanks!

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