The point of strength training?

cincysweetheart
cincysweetheart Posts: 892 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
Okay… I realize this is probably a stupid question… but I just want to make sense of it in my mind.

My question… I see quite often that you cannot gain muscle when you are in calorie deficit. And I also see quite often that there is no such thing as "toning." So… if those things are true… what is the point of doing strength training as part of your workouts if your goal is to lose weight?

For the record… I have been combining strength training with cardio for my workouts. I'm losing weight and I'm happy with the program. And I intend to keep doing it. I'm just trying to understand it a little better.

Replies

  • eireannrae
    eireannrae Posts: 6
    I am no expert, but the consensus is that strength training builds muscle and muscle burns more calories than fat does, so the more you shift to lean mass versus fat mass, the more you will lose weight.
    I'm sure someone else can describe it in better detail though.
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    You want to lose muscle mass?

    You want your metabolism to drop more than needed?

    You want to eat even less than needed to cause a deficit, and less than needed to maintain goal weight?

    You want to make it easier to gain fat back?

    You want to make it harder to lose next time around?

    Your body breaks down muscle all the time, just natural process.
    When you eat enough, it then builds that back up.

    You go in to a diet eating less, and what is used least will not be built back. You will lose muscle mass.
    Same effect applies to eat even less and less, and body won't spend nutrients on growing hair or nails or replacing skin like it used to.
    Body doesn't like being in a deficit, so something isn't going to be done as fast.

    Strength training uses the muscles, so the nutrients you take in are given to that which is used.
    You retain muscle mass.

    Toning is a poor use of term actually, if toning means making muscle stronger, sure you can do that. In fact, that's what is going to happen first.

    But many people seem to say toning as in making long muscle, as if there is some difference. If anything, with the rep ranges usually given of over 30 with light weights, toning is just using the muscle in cardio format, instead of strength training format with lower reps.

    If you are a newbie and tap out your existing muscle fast, if you have enough fat stores, and your deficit isn't too extreme, you can gain muscle in a deficit for a while. But is 1 lb in say 2 months a lot?
  • vfnmoody
    vfnmoody Posts: 271 Member
    keep the muscle you have built over time hauling the extra weight around
  • cincysweetheart
    cincysweetheart Posts: 892 Member
    keep the muscle you have built over time hauling the extra weight around

    That helps. Thank you for keeping it simple and free of jargon! So… to make sure I understand… I probably will lose some muscle as I lose weight… but by doing strength training as part of my workouts… I can minimize that loss and keep as much muscle as I can while losing fat?
  • misstweedy
    misstweedy Posts: 45 Member
    Yes, that's pretty much it. I'm doing strenght training three times a week (have progressed to free weights now and enjoy the heck out of it) and I cycle around 100 miles a week. I cycle because I enjoy it and I can eat more but I can also see and feel the difference that the strength training makes.
  • _Zardoz_
    _Zardoz_ Posts: 3,987 Member
    To get stronger
  • jimmmer
    jimmmer Posts: 3,515 Member
    To get stronger

    Ha ha!

    The clue's in the name...

    But seriously:

    1) strengthen and thicken connective tissue (ligaments, tendons),
    2) increase bone density,
    3) prioritise fat loss as the majority of weight loss,
    4) make you stronger
  • CipherZero
    CipherZero Posts: 1,418 Member
    "Strong people are harder to kill than weak people, and more useful in general." --Mark Rippetoe
  • DavPul
    DavPul Posts: 61,406 Member
    To get stronger

    Crazy talk
  • WalkingAlong
    WalkingAlong Posts: 4,926 Member
    To get stronger

    Ha ha!

    The clue's in the name...

    But seriously:

    1) strengthen and thicken connective tissue (ligaments, tendons),
    2) increase bone density,
    3) prioritise fat loss as the majority of weight loss,
    4) make you stronger
    I agree.

    The bone part is important for women. And if you feel like you don't need to get stronger (or keep the strength you have) talk to some old women who need help getting off the toilet seat.
  • Fit_Housewife
    Fit_Housewife Posts: 168 Member
    I notice the benefits of strength training in my everyday life like I can refill the 5 gallon water tank, carry my very heavy four month old in the carrier, can go up and down my steps without getting out of breath and most importantly can run after my 2 year old. I also like seeing progress in the gym like being able to lift heavier weights and hold my plank longer.
  • AmyRhubarb
    AmyRhubarb Posts: 6,890 Member
    To get stronger

    Ha ha!

    The clue's in the name...

    But seriously:

    1) strengthen and thicken connective tissue (ligaments, tendons),
    2) increase bone density,
    3) prioritise fat loss as the majority of weight loss,
    4) make you stronger
    This.
    The bone part is important for women. And if you feel like you don't need to get stronger (or keep the strength you have) talk to some old women who need help getting off the toilet seat.
    And this.
  • jimmmer
    jimmmer Posts: 3,515 Member
    The bone part is important for women. And if you feel like you don't need to get stronger (or keep the strength you have) talk to some old women who need help getting off the toilet seat.

    And men, too.

    We're not immune to the ravages of age! I'm mindful that now I'm hitting 40 and beyond that bone density and muscle mass will start to tail off if left to their own devices.
  • meshashesha2012
    meshashesha2012 Posts: 8,329 Member
    To get stronger

    this..

    getting stronger is a reward in itself
  • margannmks
    margannmks Posts: 424 Member
    The bone part is important for women. And if you feel like you don't need to get stronger (or keep the strength you have) talk to some old women who need help getting off the toilet seat.

    And men, too.

    We're not immune to the ravages of age! I'm mindful that now I'm hitting 40 and beyond that bone density and muscle mass will start to tail off if left to their own devices.
    I think i messed my knees up when i was in my 30s doing the front leg lift machine at the all womens gym i went to. I really got into strength training but without any guidance and there was no youtube google etc. I do barbell squats deads and dumbell lunges ,step ups etc now, i love strong legs, but they are no help getting up and down when the knees are messed up. Just be careful while your young not to overtrain it will come back to haunt you.Im almost 54 and will keep lifting squatting lunging etc till i cant.
  • wheird
    wheird Posts: 7,963 Member
    To get stronger

    Ha ha!

    The clue's in the name...

    But seriously:

    1) strengthen and thicken connective tissue (ligaments, tendons),
    2) increase bone density,
    3) prioritise fat loss as the majority of weight loss,
    4) make you stronger

    Best answer.
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,865 Member
    To preserve muscle mass...so that as you shed primarily fat you get that "toned" look. Also, you can get stronger without adding new muscle...so there's that. Increased bone density is another nice benefit, particularly for women as they are more susceptible to osteoporosis.

    The list goes on and on...
  • Spaced_out_lady
    Spaced_out_lady Posts: 111 Member
    <<<<< This
  • Ready2Rock206
    Ready2Rock206 Posts: 9,487 Member
    You know those skinny people that are still jiggly or just look all flat and blah with their pancake butts? They skipped strength training day.
  • 999tigger
    999tigger Posts: 5,235 Member
    No expert, but I understood it as follows.

    1. Muscle is useful, it burns more calories even whilst you sleep. More muscle = more calories burned per day.
    2. lets you handle physical acivity better i.e it will enable yoi to cycle, row, run, cross train better, which will burn more calories.
    3. you will be healthier with muscle instead of fat. Yoo much fat can be a health hazard. It's the health aspect i'd emphasise and that will be especially valuable in later life.

    What's not to like?
    We all have to start somewhere, but strength training is important.
    Dont forget to eat some protein with a few hours of finsihing to help your muscles rebuild themselves.

    Ps I think this My question… I see quite often that you cannot gain muscle when you are in calorie deficit. is incorrect?
    I understood it to be tha you can lose both fat and muscle, but strength training will help you buil more muscle back, so over time your exercise and weights will help you gain more muscle. Your BMI should change to a decreasing % of fat.
  • JoRocka
    JoRocka Posts: 17,525 Member
    get awesome.

    that's really all you need to know.
  • Ms_J1
    Ms_J1 Posts: 253 Member
    I'm in a calorie deficit (and quite a significant deficit, by the way) and I have no problem gaining muscle mass from strength training. My diet is mostly protein. Protein intake is the most important factor in keeping and building muscle while in a calorie deficit.

    I do strength training so that my muscles can keep up with my cardio endurance. I can't keep my cardio endurance up unless my other muscles can keep up with my heart. How is one suppose to be able to run a mile if their legs give out at 1/4 mile?
  • meshashesha2012
    meshashesha2012 Posts: 8,329 Member
    No expert, but I understood it as follows.

    1. Muscle is useful, it burns more calories even whilst you sleep. More muscle = more calories burned per day.
    2. lets you handle physical acivity better i.e it will enable yoi to cycle, row, run, cross train better, which will burn more calories.
    3. you will be healthier with muscle instead of fat. Yoo much fat can be a health hazard. It's the health aspect i'd emphasise and that will be especially valuable in later life.

    What's not to like?
    We all have to start somewhere, but strength training is important.
    Dont forget to eat some protein with a few hours of finsihing to help your muscles rebuild themselves.

    Ps I think this My question… I see quite often that you cannot gain muscle when you are in calorie deficit. is incorrect?
    I understood it to be tha you can lose both fat and muscle, but strength training will help you buil more muscle back, so over time your exercise and weights will help you gain more muscle. Your BMI should change to a decreasing % of fat.


    weellll, i hate the burst this bubble but muscle doesn't burn all that many calories more when iat rest. it's something like 6 extra calories per pound of muscle AND it's really hard to build muscle especially at a calorie deficit and especially if you're a woman. newb gains are like 5 pounds or something and then after that you have to work HARD for your gains (ie pushing serious weight + eating at or over your maintenance)
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    No expert, but I understood it as follows.

    1. Muscle is useful, it burns more calories even whilst you sleep. More muscle = more calories burned per day.
    2. lets you handle physical acivity better i.e it will enable yoi to cycle, row, run, cross train better, which will burn more calories.
    3. you will be healthier with muscle instead of fat. Yoo much fat can be a health hazard. It's the health aspect i'd emphasise and that will be especially valuable in later life.

    What's not to like?
    We all have to start somewhere, but strength training is important.
    Dont forget to eat some protein with a few hours of finsihing to help your muscles rebuild themselves.

    Ps I think this My question… I see quite often that you cannot gain muscle when you are in calorie deficit. is incorrect?
    I understood it to be tha you can lose both fat and muscle, but strength training will help you buil more muscle back, so over time your exercise and weights will help you gain more muscle. Your BMI should change to a decreasing % of fat.


    weellll, i hate the burst this bubble but muscle doesn't burn all that many calories more when iat rest. it's something like 6 extra calories per pound of muscle AND it's really hard to build muscle especially at a calorie deficit and especially if you're a woman. newb gains are like 5 pounds or something and then after that you have to work HARD for your gains (ie pushing serious weight + eating at or over your maintenance)

    Recently read a study, and couple others where they didn't round figures, it was actually 5.6 cal per pound per day for muscle burn that was used as figure.

    While the slight majority of LBM is muscle mass, muscle is not the biggest metabolic burner, compared to 4-5 big organs causing it.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14647174

    I even think the 5 lb gain is pretty generous, outside the initial carb loading of the existing muscle for new usage of it. 1 lb in 6-8 weeks more likely for woman doing it all correct.
  • meshashesha2012
    meshashesha2012 Posts: 8,329 Member
    No expert, but I understood it as follows.

    1. Muscle is useful, it burns more calories even whilst you sleep. More muscle = more calories burned per day.
    2. lets you handle physical acivity better i.e it will enable yoi to cycle, row, run, cross train better, which will burn more calories.
    3. you will be healthier with muscle instead of fat. Yoo much fat can be a health hazard. It's the health aspect i'd emphasise and that will be especially valuable in later life.

    What's not to like?
    We all have to start somewhere, but strength training is important.
    Dont forget to eat some protein with a few hours of finsihing to help your muscles rebuild themselves.

    Ps I think this My question… I see quite often that you cannot gain muscle when you are in calorie deficit. is incorrect?
    I understood it to be tha you can lose both fat and muscle, but strength training will help you buil more muscle back, so over time your exercise and weights will help you gain more muscle. Your BMI should change to a decreasing % of fat.


    weellll, i hate the burst this bubble but muscle doesn't burn all that many calories more when iat rest. it's something like 6 extra calories per pound of muscle AND it's really hard to build muscle especially at a calorie deficit and especially if you're a woman. newb gains are like 5 pounds or something and then after that you have to work HARD for your gains (ie pushing serious weight + eating at or over your maintenance)

    Recently read a study, and couple others where they didn't round figures, it was actually 5.6 cal per pound per day for muscle burn that was used as figure.

    While the slight majority of LBM is muscle mass, muscle is not the biggest metabolic burner, compared to 4-5 big organs causing it.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14647174

    I even think the 5 lb gain is pretty generous, outside the initial carb loading of the existing muscle for new usage of it. 1 lb in 6-8 weeks more likely for woman doing it all correct.

    so what's some effective organ building workouts? :laugh:

    i'll wait for the spammers to propose some new pill or drink that makes you grow an extra liver and kidneys
  • chrisdavey
    chrisdavey Posts: 9,834 Member
    because going from fat to skinny fat is not much of an improvement (IMO, been there done that)
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    Recently read a study, and couple others where they didn't round figures, it was actually 5.6 cal per pound per day for muscle burn that was used as figure.

    While the slight majority of LBM is muscle mass, muscle is not the biggest metabolic burner, compared to 4-5 big organs causing it.
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14647174

    I even think the 5 lb gain is pretty generous, outside the initial carb loading of the existing muscle for new usage of it. 1 lb in 6-8 weeks more likely for woman doing it all correct.

    so what's some effective organ building workouts? :laugh:

    i'll wait for the spammers to propose some new pill or drink that makes you grow an extra liver and kidneys

    To that end, shouldn't I lose more heat and require higher metabolism in the winter when I wear no hat, and I have, huh, no natural insulation anymore on top?

    Also, does stressing the liver and kidney's with lots of alcohol raise their metabolic rate? Perhaps there is a pill already!

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