Running and lifting heavy

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  • Capt_Apollo
    Capt_Apollo Posts: 9,026 Member
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    if you're doing shorter races, 10k or less, and enjoy doing obstacle races, then a mixture of cardio and lifting is great. you'll be fast and strong, and have endurance. longer distances might be a problem. i mean, you can probably still do a half marathon, but your time might not be as good as you'd like, and your lower body strength gains might be minimal.
  • aliakynes
    aliakynes Posts: 352 Member
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    At first I started running on alternate days and it worked out brillinatly. But the weights have recently become so heavy that I need a full rest day in between. So I'm attempting to move my runs to after lifts.

    As mentioned above, go with your gut. If it doesn't work out, make adjustments. What works today wont necessarily work out four weeks from now so set short term goals and modify as needed.
  • Capt_Apollo
    Capt_Apollo Posts: 9,026 Member
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    like others have said, you can't be doing everything at once. jimmer said, be an off season/on season athlete. you can run and lift all year, but you make one a priority for 6 months.
  • lporter229
    lporter229 Posts: 4,907 Member
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    Also, you don't really say what kind of running you're doing.

    Sprinting (up to 400m), middle distance (800m-> 1mile) or longer distance? They are all different prospects and how you should organise things is probably different.

    I like to win 5ks, so I am working on tempo runs, rest runs, and sprints nothing longer then 4 miles.

    How were you scheduling your lifting and running on the same day that you found you couldn't recover? What kind of macro split are you running?

    ETA: If you're doing shorter distances like this, I would just do the session after the lifting (time permitting, of course). Make sure you get plenty of carbs, run a small calorie deficit and enjoy your rest days (as in just go for a non-recovery impacting walk or something or even veg out). Try it for a week or two and see how you fare.

    I agree with this. Running is my top priority, but I try to fit lifting in there too. When I am training for a marathon, I usually do 2-3 days of strength training and yoga and focus only on core/ upper body and save my legs for the running. But when I am between training I have done programs like NROLFW, Stronglifts 5X5 and P90X. I usually schedule my lifting to coincide with days when I am doing shorter runs with speedwork or hills, then I back it up with a day of complete rest. My theory is that torturing my legs for one day and then giving them a good rest is better than dragging them through the mud a little each day and never giving them a break. On days that i lift and run, I will usually run in the AM and lift in the PM, but occasionally go back to back. Like you mentioned earlier though, if you are doing both, you have to concede that you will probably not excel in either.
  • JustinAnimal
    JustinAnimal Posts: 1,335 Member
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    For me, lifting is a top priority (well... gettin' sexy is... losing fat, gaining muscle... and I think strength training is the best way to accomplish this), but running is my meditation (and insurance against low weight days). I just started SL 5x5 (like one week into it) and, because the weight is so low, I do what I used to do with New Rules; I do 15-30 minutes of intervals on the exercise bike after my weights. Others have advised me not to run on my "off" days (Tues / Thurs), but I enjoy it too much and I've heard it gets blood flowing to your weakened muscles. I've had no problems so far, but the weights I'm lifting aren't terrifying yet. I take it pretty easy Saturday / Sunday (yardwork, housework, running errands, etc.) and those are my actual recovery days. Hope this helps!

    ETA: My "runs" are more like jogs. Three to five miles at a pretty moderate pace (something like 7 mph...8-8.5 minute miles).
  • The_Enginerd
    The_Enginerd Posts: 3,982 Member
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    I'm running 25-30 miles a week right now, training for a half marathon. I'm also running Wendler 5/3/1.

    It's not as scary as some people make it out to be.

    Am I going to win marathons and powerlifting meets at the same time? No.

    But I can have fun with my races, squat 220, and pull 230.

    Seems to be working just fine.

    The scheduling does take some work. I made the mistake of scheduling my long run the day after leg day ONE time. That was miserable. Right now my schedule looks like this:

    Sunday - Rest
    Monday - Deadlift/accessories + run
    Tuesday - Run
    Wednesday - Squat/Leg day
    Thursday - Run
    Friday - OHP/Bench/accessories
    Saturday - Long run.

    Putting my upper body stuff before the long run works really well for me. I can still lift, but my legs stay fresh.
    I'm in a similar place. I follow a 5x5 program and run 3-4 times a week. When my running was shorter distances (long run was 10k), I was lifting 3 times a week and running 2-3 times a week. As I increased my running base to train for my half marathon and Spartan Beast (12+ miles), I only lift 2 times a week due for recovery and time reasons.

    This is this week:

    Sun: Lift (Squats)
    Mon: 3 mile trail run/hill training.
    Tue: Rest
    Wed: ~5 mile run with a 1.5 miles pace run in the middle
    Thu: Lift (No Squats)
    Friday: Long run (13.1 miles)
    Sat: 6-8 mile trail run

    My schedule changes a bit week to week, but I follow the basic rule of a rest day or easy run the day before/after squats. It seems to work well for me.

    In the end, it's going to be a balance to what your goals and desires are at the time. Once I complete the Spartan Beast, my plan was to cut back on the running, switch back to lifting 3 days a week, and start another bulk/cut cycle.

    edit: I see as I was typing my reply others also recommended the on/off season approach. I second (third?) this.
  • sculli123
    sculli123 Posts: 1,221 Member
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    I lift heavy 4x per week and usually run about 3x per week. It doesn't matter to me if I run after a workout or on an 'off day'. Either one is fine IMO, I just do whichever fits into my schedule. I only run into issues if I were to do a long run the day before squats which is obvious. Other than that if you're having trouble recovering, you may need to up your calories.
  • gobonas99
    gobonas99 Posts: 1,049 Member
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    like others have said, you can't be doing everything at once. jimmer said, be an off season/on season athlete. you can run and lift all year, but you make one a priority for 6 months.

    So much this. When I'm in tri training mode, it is all about the swim/bike/run. I only get 1-2 body weight strength sessions in a week (and that is usually power yoga, so I get the added benefit of stretching too).

    Now that my tris are over, I'll start shifting...I'll do less swimming and biking (although still running just as much because I have a half marathon in Oct, and that is the discipline I need to work on the most) and lift 2-3 times a week...then after my half, transition to lifting heavy 3x a week.

    I would usually maintain the 3x/wk lifting through April, but since I'm doing the local Ironman 70.3 in June, my tri training "ramp up" will start in March vs May this year, and I'll drop back to lifting only once or twice a week a bit earlier than usual.
  • Otterluv
    Otterluv Posts: 9,083 Member
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    Like others, I've found that it's a matter of priorities. I LOVE trail running, but I decided that for now I need to focus on losing the rest of my weight and maximizing my muscle development. That means that I'm being aggressive about lifting (4x a week) and I had to scale back my running. A lot. But, I figure that as long as I maintain a baseline, I can build it back up again when my goals become once again more centered on running, hopefully in the spring.
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
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    During biking season I try to do this routine 2 days a week:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/373801-two-day-full-body-strength-training-routine

    Stronglifts and squats 3 times a week was just too much.
  • jimmmer
    jimmmer Posts: 3,515 Member
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    During biking season I try to do this routine 2 days a week:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/373801-two-day-full-body-strength-training-routine

    Stronglifts and squats 3 times a week was just too much.

    That guy knows his onions....
  • ShibaEars
    ShibaEars Posts: 3,928 Member
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    like others have said, you can't be doing everything at once. jimmer said, be an off season/on season athlete. you can run and lift all year, but you make one a priority for 6 months.

    :flowerforyou: Thank you for posting this!! I was having a hard time deciding how to move forward with training sessions. I want to focus on strength and my gym partner wants to focus on cardio/circuit training. I thought we may have to think about doing private sessions with our trainer. The thought of setting time frames for each focus never even occured to me. This will help keep us going to our trainer together and make both of us happy!
  • Capt_Apollo
    Capt_Apollo Posts: 9,026 Member
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    like others have said, you can't be doing everything at once. jimmer said, be an off season/on season athlete. you can run and lift all year, but you make one a priority for 6 months.

    :flowerforyou: Thank you for posting this!! I was having a hard time deciding how to move forward with training sessions. I want to focus on strength and my gym partner wants to focus on cardio/circuit training. I thought we may have to think about doing private sessions with our trainer. The thought of setting time frames for each focus never even occured to me. This will help keep us going to our trainer together and make both of us happy!

    in the winter, when i'm less inclined to go outside, i'll be inside lifting things. i'll still get in the occaisonal swim, bike, and run to maintain my base, but winter time is for lifting.
  • dreaming13000
    dreaming13000 Posts: 68 Member
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    I lift heavy 4x per week and usually run about 3x per week. It doesn't matter to me if I run after a workout or on an 'off day'. Either one is fine IMO, I just do whichever fits into my schedule. I only run into issues if I were to do a long run the day before squats which is obvious. Other than that if you're having trouble recovering, you may need to up your calories.

    I have not been consistently logging calories since I have started lifting heavier, so I know my calories have gone up a little(I am hungry hungry lol), but I have no accurate measurement of that. I am on the lower end of carbs....I might need to re evaluate my approach to that.
  • dreaming13000
    dreaming13000 Posts: 68 Member
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    During biking season I try to do this routine 2 days a week:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/373801-two-day-full-body-strength-training-routine

    Stronglifts and squats 3 times a week was just too much.

    Thanks for this link!

    I just found a modified SL 5x5, madcow, that I will look into some more.

    In this short amount of time I have really grown to enjoy the heavy lifting, but maybe I will modify the progressive loading.
  • kelly_e_montana
    kelly_e_montana Posts: 1,999 Member
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    Here's my experience from a couple of years ago when I started Starting Strength...

    Basically I was fine lifting and either running or cycling on non lifting days for a few months...I started to have issues though as the weight became heavier. Squatting heavy weight 3x weekly pretty much left my legs shot to ****...I could still run and I could still ride, but my times were not getting better, they were getting worse.

    At that point I wanted to continue with strength training but determined that Starting Strength just wasn't going to work for my goals...this is when I switched to Wendler's 5/3/1 programming. Rather than being full body like Starting Strength, it is a split routine...I wasn't squatting every time out and I could schedule run/ride days around my leg days, etc for better recover. I did this program for quite awhile and found it to be a much better fit for me as someone who likes to do other things besides lift...I was a lot fresher for those other things.

    I'm currently doing New Rules Supercharged which I enjoy because it takes me through various cycles of Strength/Power, hypertrophy, and endurance/stamina...I enjoy having cycles in different rep ranges. I also find it beneficial because I can, for example, downshift to an endurance/stamina rep range for a cycle or two while I'm in cyclocross season which will help me be more explosive and give me greater endurance and stamina for racing this fall...when racing season is over and we go into the dark of winter I will switch over to a hypertrophy or strength cycle where I'll really be killing it in the weight room and not worrying too much about racing or times on my bike...I can get back to all of that in the spring and just use my winter to become bigger and stronger.

    I do 5K's in the spring and most of the year, I do a 2-3 mile run 1x per week. I also do Crossfit (mostly for cardio) and we do a lot of 100, 200, and 400 m runs, with the occasional miles or 800's. I use Wendler 5/3/1 outside of CF and find it allows me to get pretty strong while still doing the other sports I like (Crossfit, hiking, trail running, swimming). Check it out if you don't want to do some of the moves with as much frequency. I've never done a higher frequency program than Wendler and I can still squat 225, DL 285, & bench 140 (I've been lifting with barbells for 10 months).
  • ChasingMyBliss
    ChasingMyBliss Posts: 803 Member
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    So much good information here. Thanks OP for posting. I have been doing more lifting, and have been trying to find a balance that works for me.
  • 1princesswarrior
    1princesswarrior Posts: 1,242 Member
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    During biking season I try to do this routine 2 days a week:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/373801-two-day-full-body-strength-training-routine

    Stronglifts and squats 3 times a week was just too much.

    This is just what I need as an equestrian to keep my legs fresh and still get my running in (needed for mental breaks)!
  • jason_adams
    jason_adams Posts: 187 Member
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    I started SL's a while back. I'd been focused on running for a few years and missed lifting.
    Now I'm lifting and happy, but missing running.

    I dabbled with a mix for a while and found if I didn't push hard on short runs, I could do both. My schedule has currently been shifted around and I'm trying to find a new way to settle in. Here's what did work:

    M / W / F: SL + hip & hammy stretching
    T/ Th: 5k run + full body stretching

    I've NOT tested this while pushing my limits with SL. I was still within a known success range. I'll post back with other successful & failed schedules. :O)
  • jimmmer
    jimmmer Posts: 3,515 Member
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    During biking season I try to do this routine 2 days a week:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/373801-two-day-full-body-strength-training-routine

    Stronglifts and squats 3 times a week was just too much.

    Thanks for this link!

    I just found a modified SL 5x5, madcow, that I will look into some more.

    In this short amount of time I have really grown to enjoy the heavy lifting, but maybe I will modify the progressive loading.

    It's more like madcow is a modified version of Bill Starr's work (that Rip modified to become Starting Strength which Mehdi modified to become SL 5x5.)

    Anything with Bill Starr's fingerprints on it is gold.

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