If I "need" to lose muscle mass?

charleigh78
charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
edited November 2023 in Fitness and Exercise
Background.... I have been slowly losing since the end of January. I am a slow loser (only about 2-3 pounds a month). I am down 23 pounds. I have been lifting since March and I love it. I can definitely see a difference in body recomp and my bodyfat percentage is going down fast in comparison with my weight loss. I recently began a program on BB and am using bodypace. Let me say before I start quoting their figures....I am not hung up on what they say. I think I will know when I have reached my personal goals. At the same time, I am very curious. It recommends that I lose down to 16% BF with a weight of 122.5 lbs. In order to do that they suggest that I need to lose 20 pounds of muscle. My current BF is 29.5% ( if that matters).
So here is my question...
Let's just say that I seriously embraced this as my end goal. I lose slow, while lifting, and eating a fair amount of protein (usually at least 120-150 grams a day). I do keep a deficit for weightloss purposes but I am not running a huge deficit. No more than 500 calories a day.
With that in mind, will I automatically lose the recommended muscle or do I need to cut protein or create more of a calorie deficit for that to happen? Just humor me...I'm curious and I honestly don't know :)
«1

Replies

  • jeffpettis
    jeffpettis Posts: 865 Member
    edited October 2014
    I think you may be mistaken. I don't think it says to lose 20 pounds of muscle??? The only way to lower your body fat percentage is to hold on to what muscle you have, or if possible add a little, while losing fat. If you lose muscle it is not going to help you reach a lower body fat percentage, it will actually have the opposite effect. You want to hold onto or even try to gain some muscle while losing body fat which will make the percentage of your body that is fat less. (hope that makes sense the way I described it).

    Probably one of the worst things you could "try" to do is actually lose lean muscle tissue. I understand if women don't want to gain any more muscle, which is very hard for a woman to do in the first place, but at the very least you should be trying everything you can to at the very least hold on to what muscle you have while losing fat.
  • CipherZero
    CipherZero Posts: 1,418 Member
    The meme of "you can't gain muscle on a cut" isn't exactly as cut and dried as it sounds when you're over-fat to begin with. The body's fat stores can be used to build muscle, albeit slower than at a surplus.
    Half to three-quarters of a pound a week of weight loss while lifting on a beginner's strength program sounds right to me if you're looking to preserve as much muscle as possible.
  • FitFitzy331
    FitFitzy331 Posts: 308 Member
    I use bodyspace too for some things and they also recommended I lose a substantial amount of muscle mass to get down to the "goal" weight. I customized it to change my goals to 18% BF and 125lbs. In a cut you are going to lose some muscle mass but not as much while lifting and eating enough protein. 20lbs of it? Depending upon your current weight possible but since you're at 29.5% BF I'm going to assume its not feasible without some other changes.
    To answer your question, to lose more muscle mass than with your current regime, you'd need to eat less protein, cut back (if not stop) lifting and potentially use a larger calorie deficit (since I don't know you're current deficit I can't tell you for sure on that).
    Going back to my original point, you don't need to try to get to their goal of 122.5. I think they had me at 121 and I remember how unhealthy I looked at that weight in high school, I looked healthy at 125 so I switched it to that. They are giving a "one size fits all" type of expectation when you select the preset goals. I highly recommend coming up with your own goals on body fat and overall weight then inputting them and track towards your goals and not what a website came up with.
  • jeffpettis
    jeffpettis Posts: 865 Member
    CipherZero wrote: »
    The meme of "you can't gain muscle on a cut" isn't exactly as cut and dried as it sounds when you're over-fat to begin with. The body's fat stores can be used to build muscle, albeit slower than at a surplus.
    Half to three-quarters of a pound a week of weight loss while lifting on a beginner's strength program sounds right to me if you're looking to preserve as much muscle as possible.
    While you are correct, a beginner can gain some muscle for a short period of time while losing fat, the body is not using the fat stores to build this muscle. Fat cannot be turned into muscle, the beginner, as with everyone else, must be eating sufficient protein, and training with a good program, to build any muscle.

  • 12_oz_Curls
    12_oz_Curls Posts: 140 Member
    Simple answer for you. Keep doing what you're doing, and one day you will be there. I found a simple recipie of eating properly and working out is the easiest method. The only math involved was macro counting and TDEE. Don't worry about losing XXX lbs or achieving XX%. it will happen. Just focus on the scale and body measurements going V instead ^ .
  • jeffpettis
    jeffpettis Posts: 865 Member
    edited October 2014
    Sorry... But I am still in shock that a "fitness" website would even suggest that someone actually try, on purpose, to lose lean muscle tissue. I'm not familiar with the website but after seeing something like that I think I would back out and never go to that site again. Makes you wonder if any of their other advice is even worth reading... :#
  • richardheath
    richardheath Posts: 1,276 Member
    Maybe your goal weight 125 is simply too low for you? I don't know about your height, current weight etc, but if you are fairly tall and have some muscle already that weight might not be achievable without some muscle loss? (Or maybe you just entered/read it wrong???)

    The best way to lose muscle is to simply not use it... and I doubt that's what you want to do! I'd say keep doing what you are doing and see where you end up.
  • CipherZero
    CipherZero Posts: 1,418 Member
    jeffpettis wrote: »
    While you are correct, a beginner can gain some muscle for a short period of time while losing fat, the body is not using the fat stores to build this muscle. Fat cannot be turned into muscle, the beginner, as with everyone else, must be eating sufficient protein, and training with a good program, to build any muscle.

    For the beginning lifter it's more about CNS adaptation and getting those fast-twitch fibers recruited anyway; the muscle mass is a nice benefit though.
  • jeffpettis
    jeffpettis Posts: 865 Member
    CipherZero wrote: »
    jeffpettis wrote: »
    While you are correct, a beginner can gain some muscle for a short period of time while losing fat, the body is not using the fat stores to build this muscle. Fat cannot be turned into muscle, the beginner, as with everyone else, must be eating sufficient protein, and training with a good program, to build any muscle.

    For the beginning lifter it's more about CNS adaptation and getting those fast-twitch fibers recruited anyway; the muscle mass is a nice benefit though.
    You are correct. I was just pointing out that the muscle is not being built from fat.
  • rgauthier20420
    rgauthier20420 Posts: 52 Member
    I don't have a trainer background or anything like that, but I thought I'd comment on this simply from my personal experience. I began using MFP about 4 weeks ago at 183.8 and now weight 178.2. I lift 3-4 times a week and run about 30 minutes 3-4 times a week. I'm in a calorie deficit right now, but I'm lifting to maintain, maybe even get some beginner gaines, my lean muscle that's still on me. I've noticed that my body is leaner and smaller and not as wide....does that make sense?

    So from my personal experience, I would suggest you continue a lifting regimen while maintaining your daily calorie deficit to burn off the additional BF you've got. Eat back your burned calories each day, but only if you're hungry. Don't just eat more calories cause MFP says you need them. It may be slow, but you'll get down to where you want to be. Hope this was helpful!
  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    edited October 2014
    jeffpettis wrote: »
    Sorry... But I am still in shock that a "fitness" website would even suggest that someone actually try, on purpose, to lose lean muscle tissue. I'm not familiar with the website but after seeing something like that I think I would back out and never go to that site again. Makes you wonder if any of their other advice is even worth reading... :#


    It really surprised me too. I didn't read it wrong. It is giving me a goal weight that is equal to my current lean body mass :/ I never imagined I could get that low, and I never imagined a weight that low as my goal. I have assumed with my body fat percentage the lowest I could hit without losing a good bit of muscle is 130-135.
  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    Stopping lifting is simply not an option and wouldn't that be a stupid move? ha
  • johnnylakis
    johnnylakis Posts: 812 Member
    At this amount of protein (usually at least 120-150 grams a day), you are asking for kidney problems
  • FitFitzy331
    FitFitzy331 Posts: 308 Member
    jeffpettis wrote: »
    Sorry... But I am still in shock that a "fitness" website would even suggest that someone actually try, on purpose, to lose lean muscle tissue. I'm not familiar with the website but after seeing something like that I think I would back out and never go to that site again. Makes you wonder if any of their other advice is even worth reading... :#

    I know what you mean, but the way it's set up is that it asks "Do you want a Bikini model physique? Fitness model? Body builder?" Then you need to pick one, only after that can you customize to actually be your goals. She definitely picked Fitness model since that is what I picked in the past, and they say "you need to get to 16% BF and for your height a Fitness model would weigh 121 lbs, so lose 15lbs of muscle along with fat. Go!" Which I think is absurd, after you pick your initial "goal" you can customize it to fit your needs, that's when I switched the weight and BF% to be what I actually want for my life. It's just a really poorly set up system for setting fitness goals.
  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    FitFitzy331 wrote: »
    I highly recommend coming up with your own goals on body fat and overall weight then inputting them and track towards your goals and not what a website came up with.

    I considered this. I actually started to and it gave me these warnings, haha. I guess I'll ignore them. :)

  • usmcmp
    usmcmp Posts: 21,219 Member
    Stop worrying about body weight, start focusing on body composition.

    Something went wrong with the numbers you put in. When I enter my numbers it says in the process I will lose a couple of pounds of lean mass during this cut. It's not suggesting I try to lose it, it's implying I will lose that much to make my goal by the date I selected.
  • singingflutelady
    singingflutelady Posts: 8,736 Member
    johnnylakis wrote: »
    At this amount of protein (usually at least 120-150 grams a day), you are asking for kidney problems

    um no, lots of lifters eat more than that amount and don't have kidney problems

  • usmcmp
    usmcmp Posts: 21,219 Member
    johnnylakis wrote: »
    At this amount of protein (usually at least 120-150 grams a day), you are asking for kidney problems

    That's hardly enough to do damage unless she has a medical issue.
  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    johnnylakis wrote: »
    At this amount of protein (usually at least 120-150 grams a day), you are asking for kidney problems


    Wow, according to the calculations for lifting I am undereating protein a bit?


  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    edited October 2014
    Do you think my BF is calculated correctly?
    I can't really use online calculators because I am thick in the middle and thin everywhere else. My wrist is like 5.5 inches. My fat is currently all in the middle and the online calculators use a waist measurement. My scale is supposed to be accurate at calculating BF percentage and it has me at the 29.5%??? If I do the online calculators it says I am 38% but even it says it won't be accurate if your fat is disproportionately in your waist. If my bf is higher then my lean muscle is not 122.5 And this is all irrelevant.
    Ultimately, who cares...right? I'll just keep doing what I am doing anyway.
  • TeaBea
    TeaBea Posts: 14,517 Member
    jeffpettis wrote: »
    Sorry... But I am still in shock that a "fitness" website would even suggest that someone actually try, on purpose, to lose lean muscle tissue. I'm not familiar with the website but after seeing something like that I think I would back out and never go to that site again. Makes you wonder if any of their other advice is even worth reading... :#

    This^

    Since when is a higher body fat % healthy? This is crazy advice.
  • usmcmp
    usmcmp Posts: 21,219 Member
    charleigh78 wrote: »
    Do you think my BF is calculated correctly?
    I can't really use online calculators because I am thick in the middle and thin everywhere else. My wrist is like 5.5 inches. My fat is currently all in the middle and the online calculators use a waist measurement. My scale is supposed to be accurate at calculating BF percentage and it has me at the 29.5%??? If I do the online calculators it says I am 38% but even it says it won't be accurate if your fat is disproportionately in your waist. If my bf is higher then my lean muscle is not 122.5 And this is all irrelevant.
    Ultimately, who cares...right? I'll just keep doing what I am doing anyway.

    Irrelevant. Track your weight and your measurements to ensure they are headed the right direction. Keep lifting and eating protein. In the long run all that matters is what you see in the mirror, not what the scale says or what your actual body fat percent is.
  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    edited October 2014
    usmcmp wrote: »
    Irrelevant. Track your weight and your measurements to ensure they are headed the right direction. Keep lifting and eating protein. In the long run all that matters is what you see in the mirror, not what the scale says or what your actual body fat percent is.

    I know, I know....really I do. This whole "bodyspace setting a goal" thingy just side tracked me mentally. I am making huge progress. I will just keep moving forward. It doesn't matter....I know ;)
  • SideSteel
    SideSteel Posts: 11,068 Member
    I would entirely ignore the advice to intentionally lose muscle.

    I haven't been to bodybuilding.com in a while but I'd be curious how this tool works.

    If for example, you input your goal weight and bodyfat% and also your current stats, and it spits out a recommendation then it's probably just a matter of selecting inappropriate goals.

    Anyways, I'd disregard the advice to start trying to lose muscle mass.
  • charleigh78
    charleigh78 Posts: 247 Member
    SideSteel wrote: »
    I would entirely ignore the advice to intentionally lose muscle.

    I haven't been to bodybuilding.com in a while but I'd be curious how this tool works.

    If for example, you input your goal weight and bodyfat% and also your current stats, and it spits out a recommendation then it's probably just a matter of selecting inappropriate goals.

    Anyways, I'd disregard the advice to start trying to lose muscle mass.

    It gives a plethora of desired body appearance - fitness model, fit woman, etc. I did not choose the one with the lowest BF % (fitness model). Instead I chose the higher one (fitwoman). Then it tells you what you need to do to achieve that look. That is how you set a goal. A little narrow minded if you ask me?
  • usmcmp
    usmcmp Posts: 21,219 Member
    I went through their steps and they are calculating it based on what the typical stats for the one you picked are. They don't take into account individual variance. Bodybuilding I have to gain 15 pounds of muscle and everything else I have to lose muscle. You can custom set your weight and body fat % goals on the next step.
  • yopeeps025
    yopeeps025 Posts: 8,680 Member
    Well in a calorie deficit the muscle mass will kind of decrease a little.. There no way of getting total fat loss and if anyone knows how please tell me.
  • dbmata
    dbmata Posts: 12,950 Member
    charleigh78 wrote: »
    Stopping lifting is simply not an option and wouldn't that be a stupid move? ha

    Go by the bf%. Focus on that. Go from there once you hit the BF% goal.

    Attempting to lose lean mass is stupid, as you age into oblivion, it will happen naturally.
  • BigGuy47
    BigGuy47 Posts: 1,768 Member
    I understand that some muscle will be lost with a long term calorie deficit.
    I understand that muscle loss can be minimized with resistance training and a proper diet.
    I understand the goal of lowering BF%.
    I don't understand why someone would intentionally try to lose muscle.
  • philwrightfitness
    philwrightfitness Posts: 122
    Did you use the BB.com automated " find your ideal physique" system which sets up goals based on what you indicate your ideal physique is? This just produces a pre set series of parameters ... It's just a notion to get you started not an absolute " you must be this size" mine told me I should be 235 lbs at 6 % body fat lol....
This discussion has been closed.

Categories