question about bulk/cut cycle...
ndj1979
Posts: 29,136 Member
Right now I am doing my first bulk. Started about first week of October at just about 176 pounds, and my goal is to get to 185, maybe 188 pounds depending on how I am feeling. As of right now I am 183.5 and have been on track for about .5 pound per week gain.
My question is that when I go to cut down, should I try to cut down to above my starting weight of 176 or below that, or does it matter??
My thought process was that I should not go below 176 because I want to minimize muscle loss during my cut...but that could be dead wrong..
Then, when I bulk again should I aim to go higher then where I stopped? So if my cut off this time is 185 and then I cut down, should I shoot for 190 the next time..?
Just kind of curious as to the mechanics of whole process..
thanks in advance...
My question is that when I go to cut down, should I try to cut down to above my starting weight of 176 or below that, or does it matter??
My thought process was that I should not go below 176 because I want to minimize muscle loss during my cut...but that could be dead wrong..
Then, when I bulk again should I aim to go higher then where I stopped? So if my cut off this time is 185 and then I cut down, should I shoot for 190 the next time..?
Just kind of curious as to the mechanics of whole process..
thanks in advance...
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Replies
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Do you have any idea of your bf% at the start?0
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Just drop weight untill you get around 10% body fat, unless you want to get absolutely shredded0
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Last time (and planning to this time too) I went below my start weight on the cut BUT I'm 100% sure, I'm doing it wrong.
I have a lack of discipline that means I'm bulking again, when really I should've cut down to optimum bf%. I'm not really that bothered about getting there quick or having a bit of extra fat on me though.
Depends how you feel I think.0 -
Last time (and planning to this time too) I went below my start weight on the cut BUT I'm 100% sure, I'm doing it wrong.
I have a lack of discipline that means I'm bulking again, when really I should've cut down to optimum bf%. I'm not really that bothered about getting there quick or having a bit of extra fat on me though.
Depends how you feel I think.
I was thinking of going easy with a .5 pound per week loss to retain as much muscle as possible and get lean at same time...
beach season comes quickly in Florida!0 -
Your change in LBM would be about 2.5 lbs. from 176 to 185. LBM at 13% (starting) would be 153.12. So at the end of your bulk if you cut back to 176 lbs. you would be at 11.6%. This is assuming a 1:1 muscle fat gain ratio.0
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If you are going to start a new bulk cycle 173 lbs. will get you 10%0
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You'll get a few pounds of glycogen and water bounce when you switch from deficit to maintenance, so if it's the number on the scale you're after, I'd go under it.
Then again, you may just look at yourself at some point during the cut and go "watch out Ladies ITS BEACH TIME!!!"0 -
Springfield1970 wrote: »You'll get a few pounds of glycogen and water bounce when you switch from deficit to maintenance, so if it's the number on the scale you're after, I'd go under it.
Then again, you may just look at yourself at some point during the cut and go "watch out Ladies ITS BEACH TIME!!!"
only if you are on that beach spring...:)
ETA - I agree on the glycogen/water weight thing..which is why I was thinking about going a tad over 185 to maybe 187-188...0 -
Your change in LBM would be about 2.5 lbs. from 176 to 185. LBM at 13% (starting) would be 153.12. So at the end of your bulk if you cut back to 176 lbs. you would be at 11.6%. This is assuming a 1:1 muscle fat gain ratio.
Just out of curiosity, how do you estimate 2.5lbs? Is that a conservative approach? I would think with 9lb gain for a male that it could be closer to 4lbs. Assuming you gained at a steadyish 1lb per week. I'm not disagreeing with you just trying to expand my knowledge on the subject. Is that taking in to account that some of the gain may be extra stored water/glucose from high calorie intake that will drop when he returns to maintenance levels? Or that you will lose a little muscle mass during cut? Just 2.5 muscle gain, 6.5 fat gain seems off to me if you are bulking right.
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AKD has the right idea, if you're going for the same weight that you started at then you should be leaner. You should have added mass but we just won't know until you get there. You would hope that let's say you wanted to get down to 13% again you would want to be able to be much closer to 180 lbs this time. We can all assume as much as we want how much muscle you added but you would need to get professionally tested for that and we're amateurs so why bother.
got ya..
I was just curious if it was personal preference as to what to cut to, or if there was a 'tried 'and true method"..
I have been taking measurements..and all of my measurements have increased from when I started...so I have gained something! LOL0 -
AKD has the right idea, if you're going for the same weight that you started at then you should be leaner. You should have added mass but we just won't know until you get there. You would hope that let's say you wanted to get down to 13% again you would want to be able to be much closer to 180 lbs this time. We can all assume as much as we want how much muscle you added but you would need to get professionally tested for that and we're amateurs so why bother.
This is very true lol. I'm pretty much just bulking/cutting till I achieve the look I want so I guess the numbers are pretty moot anyway.
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Your change in LBM would be about 2.5 lbs. from 176 to 185. LBM at 13% (starting) would be 153.12. So at the end of your bulk if you cut back to 176 lbs. you would be at 11.6%. This is assuming a 1:1 muscle fat gain ratio.
Just out of curiosity, how do you estimate 2.5lbs? Is that a conservative approach? I would think with 9lb gain for a male that it could be closer to 4lbs. Assuming you gained at a steadyish 1lb per week. I'm not disagreeing with you just trying to expand my knowledge on the subject. Is that taking in to account that some of the gain may be extra stored water/glucose from high calorie intake that will drop when he returns to maintenance levels? Or that you will lose a little muscle mass during cut? Just 2.5 muscle gain, 6.5 fat gain seems off to me if you are bulking right.
You are right I miscalculated. At the end of the bulk LBM is 157.6 lbs. OP would need to cut to 175 for 10%. Of course this is statistical. Water, glycogen, and actual LBM gains all affect the outcome.
(edit) lots of assumptions made as Mr27 pointed out. Actual results may vary.
Thanks Nolan for the correction!0 -
AKD has the right idea, if you're going for the same weight that you started at then you should be leaner. You should have added mass but we just won't know until you get there. You would hope that let's say you wanted to get down to 13% again you would want to be able to be much closer to 180 lbs this time. We can all assume as much as we want how much muscle you added but you would need to get professionally tested for that and we're amateurs so why bother.
This is very true lol. I'm pretty much just bulking/cutting till I achieve the look I want so I guess the numbers are pretty moot anyway.
so at the end of the day it really is personal preference...:)0 -
This content has been removed.
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AKD has the right idea, if you're going for the same weight that you started at then you should be leaner. You should have added mass but we just won't know until you get there. You would hope that let's say you wanted to get down to 13% again you would want to be able to be much closer to 180 lbs this time. We can all assume as much as we want how much muscle you added but you would need to get professionally tested for that and we're amateurs so why bother.
got ya..
I was just curious if it was personal preference as to what to cut to, or if there was a 'tried 'and true method"..
I have been taking measurements..and all of my measurements have increased from when I started...so I have gained something! LOL
When running these cycles it's all personal preference. Some guys don't mind remaining at 12 or 13% in the summer. Some want to get to 10 or just below. Everyone has different goals. Remaining at 12% during the summer is not conducive to my super vanity goals so I go under that.
ha, I hear ya...
When you cut do you go aggressive = 1 pound per week ...or do you kind of ease into it at .5 pound per week loss...
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Your change in LBM would be about 2.5 lbs. from 176 to 185. LBM at 13% (starting) would be 153.12. So at the end of your bulk if you cut back to 176 lbs. you would be at 11.6%. This is assuming a 1:1 muscle fat gain ratio.
Just out of curiosity, how do you estimate 2.5lbs? Is that a conservative approach? I would think with 9lb gain for a male that it could be closer to 4lbs. Assuming you gained at a steadyish 1lb per week. I'm not disagreeing with you just trying to expand my knowledge on the subject. Is that taking in to account that some of the gain may be extra stored water/glucose from high calorie intake that will drop when he returns to maintenance levels? Or that you will lose a little muscle mass during cut? Just 2.5 muscle gain, 6.5 fat gain seems off to me if you are bulking right.
You are right I miscalculated. At the end of the bulk LBM is 157.6 lbs. OP would need to cut to 175 for 10%. Of course this is statistical. Water, glycogen, and actual LBM gains all affect the outcome.
(edit) lots of assumptions made as Mr27 pointed out. Actual results may vary.
Thanks Nolan for the correction!
I didn't necessarily think you were wrong in the first place just wondering how the estimation calculations worked. But yes, unless you're professionally tested they're all just estimations.
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You want to go closer to 1 lb. or so per week because of hormonal adaptions in response to the cut. 20-25% under maintenance is the sweet spot.0
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I go straight into it. I can cut on about 1900-2000 so I don't really mind going straight into a 1 lb cut. I shorten my eating window and I eliminate my bagel and cookies and I barely feel the drop. I start to reduce my rate after a couple weeks. I can honestly go for even less than half a pound and hit my goal by mid June. One thing I don't do is wait until the last minute to cut.AKD has the right idea, if you're going for the same weight that you started at then you should be leaner. You should have added mass but we just won't know until you get there. You would hope that let's say you wanted to get down to 13% again you would want to be able to be much closer to 180 lbs this time. We can all assume as much as we want how much muscle you added but you would need to get professionally tested for that and we're amateurs so why bother.
got ya..
I was just curious if it was personal preference as to what to cut to, or if there was a 'tried 'and true method"..
I have been taking measurements..and all of my measurements have increased from when I started...so I have gained something! LOL
When running these cycles it's all personal preference. Some guys don't mind remaining at 12 or 13% in the summer. Some want to get to 10 or just below. Everyone has different goals. Remaining at 12% during the summer is not conducive to my super vanity goals so I go under that.
ha, I hear ya...
When you cut do you go aggressive = 1 pound per week ...or do you kind of ease into it at .5 pound per week loss...
got ya...
for me I cut on about 2000 to 2200....
agree on waiting till last minute would be a bad idea...0 -
Last time (and planning to this time too) I went below my start weight on the cut BUT I'm 100% sure, I'm doing it wrong.
I have a lack of discipline that means I'm bulking again, when really I should've cut down to optimum bf%. I'm not really that bothered about getting there quick or having a bit of extra fat on me though.
Depends how you feel I think.
I was thinking of going easy with a .5 pound per week loss to retain as much muscle as possible and get lean at same time...
beach season comes quickly in Florida!
That's what I went with first time round too - and I don't feel like I lost much muscle.
Again, I was far from optimum bf% at the start but I was delighted with results. Like I say, I'm doing it wrong but I'm happy with where it's going.
I think you'll only really be able to judge it once you're into the cut and see what's actually happening - play it by ear, good chance you'll look fabulous at a heavier weight than you think.
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