Female trying to gain muscle tone?
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hnovak0103 wrote: »I started doing Insanity 5 weeks ago and it is giving me great muscle definition without gaining weight. I eat 1500 cal a day. I think its a great program because it builds muscle and is a cardio workout but no equipment is need.
My college aged daughter and her friends did the insanity program and they were ripped at the end. so much muscle definition that was not there before. Its was insane to watch them.
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Okay so getting ripped and bulking are two different things. I'm not really sure what I want in that case; just some definition in my shoulders and abs, and for my thighs to be more toned. Why do I need to up my calories? Is it not possible to gain muscle at a deficit? My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body. I'm probably wrong, I just need some clarification.0
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jangus9416 wrote: »Okay so getting ripped and bulking are two different things. I'm not really sure what I want in that case; just some definition in my shoulders and abs, and for my thighs to be more toned. Why do I need to up my calories? Is it not possible to gain muscle at a deficit? My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body. I'm probably wrong, I just need some clarification.
Yes you're wrong.
All you need to do it eat 250 cals above maintenance per day for a half a pound a week gain, which if you're progressivly lifting heavier and eating .8g of protein per lb of body weight will hopefully give you 50/50 muscle to fat. Afterwards you cut the fat you gained just do it slowly and carefully.
There is no way to cheat the fat gain. Trust me, I've tried, and all the others here. You can try slow recomping, but it's far too difficult and easy to not get any muscle gain at all.
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Hi there, I understand your issue of gaining fat while trying to build your muscle mass. What you need to do initially is have a body fat analysis done so that you know what your lean body mass - fat mass is so that you can then establish a daily caloric intake that will support muscle gain and limit fat gain. I understand that your trying to muscle up an not bulk up, so if you don't know what your daily caloric intake should be (the only accurate way to get to this point is to know how much lean body mass you have) then you can never gain muscle without also gaining as much as, or more fat.
Here in our facility we use an anthropological lbw / fat testing method which is very non invasive and as easy as measuring as accurately as you can... your wrist with the tape measure running over the bony protrusion, your forarm at the widest point, your waist running the tape measure in a straight line at belly button height, your hips running a tape measure around the very top of your hip bones, and weighing yourself first thing in the am upon rising and having gone to the bathroom and completely naked. Knowing these measurements and your naked weight we then run them thru a program and can pretty accurately determine your LBW (lean body weight) and your fat weight. From there with some additional calculations we can figure out your BMR (basal metobolic rate, the rate at which your body burns calories while laying on the couch doing nothing but not sleeping), factor in your activity levels and give you a pretty accurate caloric need for the day and what you should take in for adding muscle to your frame while keeping the fat gains to a bare minimum.
One also has to difference between strength training and hypertrophy training (muscle building) which is what you want.
If you want to send me your measurements I would be happy to figure out your daily caloric needs, broken down into carbs/proteins/fats for you and offer up some advice as to how to go about implementing a hypertrophy training program.
With the right nutritional plan, adherence to a regular hypertrophy training program, adequate rest, a good positive mental attitude and a view to the future there is no reason why you cannot put on good quality muscle mass and keep the fat levels to a bare minimum.
This will not happen in a week or a month but you should be in this for life and not looking for any quick fix, for if you are then you can expect to put on plenty of fat with your muscle gain.
However you decide to go about your muscle gain, all the best and even if your not looking to get more muscular keep exercising and training hard to stay fit and healthy.
Shes lean enough, that's all she needs to know.
To gain muscle and fat at the best ratio possible women are advised to eat 1750 cals a week extra, men twice that.
You're making it too complicated, and promising something which isn't really there, minimal fat gain.
It's not rocket science. Loads of us have done it and reduced our body fat.
Bulk n cut innit.
Only the mentally strong who are willing to gain the fat get the rewards in the end.
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Springfield1970 wrote: »jangus9416 wrote: »Okay so getting ripped and bulking are two different things. I'm not really sure what I want in that case; just some definition in my shoulders and abs, and for my thighs to be more toned. Why do I need to up my calories? Is it not possible to gain muscle at a deficit? My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body. I'm probably wrong, I just need some clarification.
Yes you're wrong.
All you need to do it eat 250 cals above maintenance per day for a half a pound a week gain, which if you're progressivly lifting heavier and eating .8g of protein per lb of body weight will hopefully give you 50/50 muscle to fat. Afterwards you cut the fat you gained just do it slowly and carefully.
There is no way to cheat the fat gain. Trust me, I've tried, and all the others here. You can try slow recomping, but it's far too difficult and easy to not get any muscle gain at all.
Looks like I'll just have to suck it up. I hate putting on weight after I just worked to get rid of it, but I know it will be a lot better for me physically. Thanks again0 -
No, that happens if you eat at maintenance (very slowly).jangus9416 wrote: »My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body.
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jangus9416 wrote: »Springfield1970 wrote: »jangus9416 wrote: »Okay so getting ripped and bulking are two different things. I'm not really sure what I want in that case; just some definition in my shoulders and abs, and for my thighs to be more toned. Why do I need to up my calories? Is it not possible to gain muscle at a deficit? My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body. I'm probably wrong, I just need some clarification.
Yes you're wrong.
All you need to do it eat 250 cals above maintenance per day for a half a pound a week gain, which if you're progressivly lifting heavier and eating .8g of protein per lb of body weight will hopefully give you 50/50 muscle to fat. Afterwards you cut the fat you gained just do it slowly and carefully.
There is no way to cheat the fat gain. Trust me, I've tried, and all the others here. You can try slow recomping, but it's far too difficult and easy to not get any muscle gain at all.
Looks like I'll just have to suck it up. I hate putting on weight after I just worked to get rid of it, but I know it will be a lot better for me physically. Thanks again
I kicked and screamed about the idea of bulking as I'd just been through hell to lose the weight.
I was so surprised at what happened during my bulk! I loved how my body looked EVEN at the top when I'd gained 10lb. It was all in the right places! I only cut to get my running times faster.
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jangus9416 wrote: »Springfield1970 wrote: »jangus9416 wrote: »Okay so getting ripped and bulking are two different things. I'm not really sure what I want in that case; just some definition in my shoulders and abs, and for my thighs to be more toned. Why do I need to up my calories? Is it not possible to gain muscle at a deficit? My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body. I'm probably wrong, I just need some clarification.
Yes you're wrong.
All you need to do it eat 250 cals above maintenance per day for a half a pound a week gain, which if you're progressivly lifting heavier and eating .8g of protein per lb of body weight will hopefully give you 50/50 muscle to fat. Afterwards you cut the fat you gained just do it slowly and carefully.
There is no way to cheat the fat gain. Trust me, I've tried, and all the others here. You can try slow recomping, but it's far too difficult and easy to not get any muscle gain at all.
Looks like I'll just have to suck it up. I hate putting on weight after I just worked to get rid of it, but I know it will be a lot better for me physically. Thanks again
Take "before" pics and regular progress pics.
There are so many stories of women on here, with pics, who added strength training and ate at a mild surplus... and in the end, their weight was up, but their bodies looked better than ever.
Try to get the number out of your head, and instead focus on the body you want. You may find that five pounds higher, with more muscle mass, looks way better to you than ten pounds lighter and very little.0 -
Because they lost a layer of fat that covered the muscles they already had.....Insanity is pure cardio, no one can build muscle with that.....hnovak0103 wrote: »I started doing Insanity 5 weeks ago and it is giving me great muscle definition without gaining weight. I eat 1500 cal a day. I think its a great program because it builds muscle and is a cardio workout but no equipment is need.
My college aged daughter and her friends did the insanity program and they were ripped at the end. so much muscle definition that was not there before. Its was insane to watch them.
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jangus9416 wrote: »Springfield1970 wrote: »jangus9416 wrote: »Okay so getting ripped and bulking are two different things. I'm not really sure what I want in that case; just some definition in my shoulders and abs, and for my thighs to be more toned. Why do I need to up my calories? Is it not possible to gain muscle at a deficit? My understanding is you will lose fat and gain muscle if you're at a deficit but still properly feuling your body. I'm probably wrong, I just need some clarification.
Yes you're wrong.
All you need to do it eat 250 cals above maintenance per day for a half a pound a week gain, which if you're progressivly lifting heavier and eating .8g of protein per lb of body weight will hopefully give you 50/50 muscle to fat. Afterwards you cut the fat you gained just do it slowly and carefully.
There is no way to cheat the fat gain. Trust me, I've tried, and all the others here. You can try slow recomping, but it's far too difficult and easy to not get any muscle gain at all.
Looks like I'll just have to suck it up. I hate putting on weight after I just worked to get rid of it, but I know it will be a lot better for me physically. Thanks again
take beginning pictures and measurements (arms, waist, thighs, shoulders) and then take additional measurements about every four weeks.
I think you will find that you actually enjoy eating more food….but then again, I have always been one that loved crushing large amounts of food.
I have a lot of woman on my friends lists on here (spring included) that have run bulk/cut cycles and they look freaking amazing…and not bulky or fat at ALL….0 -
There is some great advise in this thread. I have just gone through the same thing, I was too scared to eat more and had been weight training for a yr with no results. I was 110 pounds and skinny fat.
The minute I bit the bullet, upped cals and really focused on my weight training I started seeing the results I wanted. See my thread in the eat train, progress group "getting frustrated" and also read the advise in the sticky topics. Then get started!!!
So glad I found that group as my body is looking awesome!!! I even got told last night by a stranger at a boot amp class that my abs are insane, so happy!!! will never go back to low cals and being tired all the time.0 -
Check out StrongLifts 5x5 - they have online videos and a lot of information on strength training including a phone app0
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hnovak0103 wrote: »I started doing Insanity 5 weeks ago and it is giving me great muscle definition without gaining weight. I eat 1500 cal a day. I think its a great program because it builds muscle and is a cardio workout but no equipment is need.
My college aged daughter and her friends did the insanity program and they were ripped at the end. so much muscle definition that was not there before. Its was insane to watch them.
I did insanity and you do look great but basically you just get rid of some fat above your muscles. Your muscles don't really get bigger and so if your looking for a program to make you stronger (give you bigger muscles/abs) insanity doesn't really give that to you (or at least that's what it did for me of course everyone's different). Why don't you alternate and bulk up for four/three weeks and then use a slight calorie deficit and limit strength to once a week and focus on cardio for the next few weeks. Maybe that would combat the extra fat but make sure you keep the muscle? (I'm no expert so maybe do some research )
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Springfield have you written any blogs on how you achieved your amazing bod? I'd love to read0
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jacksonleyla1 wrote: »hnovak0103 wrote: »I started doing Insanity 5 weeks ago and it is giving me great muscle definition without gaining weight. I eat 1500 cal a day. I think its a great program because it builds muscle and is a cardio workout but no equipment is need.
My college aged daughter and her friends did the insanity program and they were ripped at the end. so much muscle definition that was not there before. Its was insane to watch them.
I did insanity and you do look great but basically you just get rid of some fat above your muscles. Your muscles don't really get bigger and so if your looking for a program to make you stronger (give you bigger muscles/abs) insanity doesn't really give that to you (or at least that's what it did for me of course everyone's different). Why don't you alternate and bulk up for four/three weeks and then use a slight calorie deficit and limit strength to once a week and focus on cardio for the next few weeks. Maybe that would combat the extra fat but make sure you keep the muscle? (I'm no expert so maybe do some research )
because that is the definition of spinning your wheels. It can sometimes take two weeks to get your intake right and start gaining, so why would you then just bulk for two more weeks transition to a deficit and lose the one pound you gained and be back to where you started.?? What is the point of that?
so you are saying if you bulked and gained two pounds, one pound of muscle, and then lose two pounds, that you won't lose the muscle????0 -
jacksonleyla1 wrote: »hnovak0103 wrote: »I started doing Insanity 5 weeks ago and it is giving me great muscle definition without gaining weight. I eat 1500 cal a day. I think its a great program because it builds muscle and is a cardio workout but no equipment is need.
My college aged daughter and her friends did the insanity program and they were ripped at the end. so much muscle definition that was not there before. Its was insane to watch them.
I did insanity and you do look great but basically you just get rid of some fat above your muscles. Your muscles don't really get bigger and so if your looking for a program to make you stronger (give you bigger muscles/abs) insanity doesn't really give that to you (or at least that's what it did for me of course everyone's different). Why don't you alternate and bulk up for four/three weeks and then use a slight calorie deficit and limit strength to once a week and focus on cardio for the next few weeks. Maybe that would combat the extra fat but make sure you keep the muscle? (I'm no expert so maybe do some research )
Because bulking for 3 weeks gets you absolutely no where.
like ND said- it's the epitome of spinning your wheels.0 -
Springfield1970 wrote: »jangus9416 wrote: »I do currently strength train and I haven't gotten my body fat since before I started losing weight. I'm 5'5" and 118 so I'm pretty small. Two years ago I got down to 108
Ok, lets go over a few things..
calorie dense foods are not "unhealthy." You really need to rethink how you are viewing food and stop thinking about it in terms of "good" "bad", etc, and just view it for what it is, which is something that fuels our body.
There is nothing wrong with eating ice cream, bagels, pasta etc, in the context of an overall diet that hits macros/micros/calorie targets for the day.
Yes, you should eat eggs, whole wheat, rice, chicken, fish, vegetables, but there is nothing wrong with throwing in bagels, cookies, ice cream, etc.
when you want to add muscle calories are king. You can bulk on 100% broccoli, chicken, rice, and vegetables (good luck doing that as you are going to be miserable) and you will still gain fat.
This is very important - no matter what foods you eat if you are in a calorie surplus then you are going to gain weight.
Do you follow a structured strength training program, or is it a homemade one?
OP please please listen to this golden advice! I floundered around skinny fat for years, decades, starve binging.
It's only since I learned to bulk and cut have I managed to get a body that i can't take my eyes off (sounds vain I know, but I was mortally embarrassed about my sagginess so I'm entitled!)
Bulk until you can't squeeze into your clothes, then slow slow cut. Hey presto! A new hot body
Also, imagine a life where you can eat 2000/2500 calories a day of good food AND treats, and still have great measurements...... It's a dream.
Not to take over this thread, but I'm really confused about this whole bulking and cutting thing. Is it something I have to do if I want to look good? It seems so complicated and time consuming. Can't I just exercise and eat an amount that maintains the weight I want?
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arabianhorselover wrote: »Springfield1970 wrote: »jangus9416 wrote: »I do currently strength train and I haven't gotten my body fat since before I started losing weight. I'm 5'5" and 118 so I'm pretty small. Two years ago I got down to 108
Ok, lets go over a few things..
calorie dense foods are not "unhealthy." You really need to rethink how you are viewing food and stop thinking about it in terms of "good" "bad", etc, and just view it for what it is, which is something that fuels our body.
There is nothing wrong with eating ice cream, bagels, pasta etc, in the context of an overall diet that hits macros/micros/calorie targets for the day.
Yes, you should eat eggs, whole wheat, rice, chicken, fish, vegetables, but there is nothing wrong with throwing in bagels, cookies, ice cream, etc.
when you want to add muscle calories are king. You can bulk on 100% broccoli, chicken, rice, and vegetables (good luck doing that as you are going to be miserable) and you will still gain fat.
This is very important - no matter what foods you eat if you are in a calorie surplus then you are going to gain weight.
Do you follow a structured strength training program, or is it a homemade one?
OP please please listen to this golden advice! I floundered around skinny fat for years, decades, starve binging.
It's only since I learned to bulk and cut have I managed to get a body that i can't take my eyes off (sounds vain I know, but I was mortally embarrassed about my sagginess so I'm entitled!)
Bulk until you can't squeeze into your clothes, then slow slow cut. Hey presto! A new hot body
Also, imagine a life where you can eat 2000/2500 calories a day of good food AND treats, and still have great measurements...... It's a dream.
Not to take over this thread, but I'm really confused about this whole bulking and cutting thing. Is it something I have to do if I want to look good? It seems so complicated and time consuming. Can't I just exercise and eat an amount that maintains the weight I want?
Are you happy with the way you look?
Are you meeting your standards of performance at the gym?
If the answer is yes to both- then no- you don't have to.
But if the answer is no to one or the other- or you think you could have improvement in the either area- a bulk/cut cycle may or- or a recomp (which is slow).0
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