I had a great conversation with a PF employee
spartan_d
Posts: 727 Member
So I had a very cordial chat with a Planet Fitness employee this weekend. He told me that he wanted to build up his chest muscles, but that the Smith machine felt awkward to him.
Naturally, I took this opportunity to explain why the Smith machine was a poor choice for strength building. I explained that it forces one's joints (shoulders, spine) to move in unnatural ways. I also said that a proper bench press (i.e. without the Smith machine) also engages the stabilizer muscles, which are critical for functional strength.
On the one hand, I was deeply disappointed that a gym employee didn't know such basic things. On the other hand, I'm also sure that most of their employees don't actually have any professional certifications -- not at the kind of membership prices that they charge.
Anyway, it really was a very cordial conversation. I was pleased to see how open he was to learning these things, rather than just saying, "What are you talking about? We only have great equipment at our gym!" I might not like the PF business model, but by and large, I can't voice the same criticism toward the people who work there.
Naturally, I took this opportunity to explain why the Smith machine was a poor choice for strength building. I explained that it forces one's joints (shoulders, spine) to move in unnatural ways. I also said that a proper bench press (i.e. without the Smith machine) also engages the stabilizer muscles, which are critical for functional strength.
On the one hand, I was deeply disappointed that a gym employee didn't know such basic things. On the other hand, I'm also sure that most of their employees don't actually have any professional certifications -- not at the kind of membership prices that they charge.
Anyway, it really was a very cordial conversation. I was pleased to see how open he was to learning these things, rather than just saying, "What are you talking about? We only have great equipment at our gym!" I might not like the PF business model, but by and large, I can't voice the same criticism toward the people who work there.
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I lift at home, but I run at lunchtime at the PF near work.
Not sure why people rank on them all the time.
The convenience store doesn't sell great Italian bread, but that doesn't mean they should all be destroyed.0 -
Heh. There's a marketing opportunity: Fitness Bodega.0
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annaskiski wrote: »I lift at home, but I run at lunchtime at the PF near work.
Not sure why people rank on them all the time.
The convenience store doesn't sell great Italian bread, but that doesn't mean they should all be destroyed.
Where is that claim being made?0 -
Also -- and I know that this has been said many times before -- the complaint isn't simply that they don't provide heavy weights. Neither does Curves, but you don't hear them criticized for that.
Rather, the issues that people have stem from their derogatory marketing strategy, the misinformation that they spread about exercise and fitness, and the fact that they actively discourage people from pushing hard. I know that's been said many times before though, so I really hope that it doesn't have to be emphasized again.
In any event, I did appreciate my conversation with this guy and the chance to educate him a little bit on fitness. It would be much better if PF employees were properly educated on the basics of weight training and general fitness, but still... it was nice to see someone who works for the company but isn't slavishly devoted to the information that they present.
On a related note, he also mentioned that they don't provide bench pressing stations because they don't cater to bodybuilders. I responded by saying that bench pressing is actually a great beginner exercise, as long as you keep the barbell suitably light. I also mentioned that bench pressing is even taught at the high school level. He responded, "Oh, really?" with a tone of genuine interest and intrigue. Again, no defensiveness, no blind toeing of the company line. I can't help but respect that.0 -
Honestly I don't know how they "actively discourage people from pushing hard". I don't think I've ever even had a PF employee speak to me. They're not trainers, they just maintain the premises.
PF is just a place with gym equipment, and you can use it if you like. They don't have any programs.
If you want more than that, then you should go to a gym that offers personal training.0 -
I've encountered people who were told that they need to slow down on the treadmills, lest they "intimidate" the other members. I've also encountered folks who were told that they need to limit the number of plates that they put on the machines. (Apparently, those locations still had machines with removable barbell plates.) And of course, there's the whole rule against even light grunting or loud exhaling, which is natural when lifting heavy objects. Or the fact that one needs to set the weights down ever so gently, which naturally discourages people from pushing for their maximum number of reps. And so forth, and so on.annaskiski wrote: »Honestly I don't know how they "actively discourage people from pushing hard". I don't think I've ever even had a PF employee speak to me. They're not trainers, they just maintain the premises.
Nobody said anything about the lack of programs, Anna, so that point -- while perfectly valid -- is irrelevant to the topic at hand.PF is just a place with gym equipment, and you can use it if you like. They don't have any programs.
If you want more than that, then you should go to a gym that offers personal training.
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annaskiski wrote: »Honestly I don't know how they "actively discourage people from pushing hard". I don't think I've ever even had a PF employee speak to me. They're not trainers, they just maintain the premises.
PF is just a place with gym equipment, and you can use it if you like. They don't have any programs.
If you want more than that, then you should go to a gym that offers personal training.
The stories come from people who were generally fit who were trying to build muscle.
- Members would complain the guys in the squat rack were grunting or lifting too much and the squat rack guys would be asked to leave. Eventually, they pulled the squat racks.
- A woman, who looked awesome, was asked to leave because she was intimidating some of the other women. When she asked why, they said she was too muscular and that alone made her a lunk (I think that’s the term they use).
When people who are pushing themselves hard are interrupted during their workouts and/or asked to leave, well that’s a pretty clear message. You have to be in the sweet spot of our customer-base bell curve or we don’t want your $10.0 -
Well, I guess I'm skeptical of these stories, but whatever....0
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annaskiski wrote: »Well, I guess I'm skeptical of these stories, but whatever....
https://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play;_ylt=A2KLqIXMg0JVSU8ACD37w8QF;_ylu=X3oDMTEwdHQyYmoyBHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDdmlkBHZ0aWQDVklEMDMEZ3BvcwM0?p=Girl+Kicked+Out+of+Planet+Fitness&vid=e9311bd0620d50ff0c99e9d6d17f4ce9&l=1:54&turl=http://ts1.mm.bing.net/th?id=WN.%2fcXopoGpZYT8vigeX8pK7w&pid=15.1&rurl=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQ6OrO1f610&tit=Don't+Grunt+in+Planet+Fitness!&c=3&sigr=11bvagbeq&sigt=112hf10nj&sigi=121hk57as&age=1162523060&fr2=p:s,v:v&fr=aaplw&tt=b
https://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play;_ylt=A2KLqIXMg0JVSU8ADD37w8QF;_ylu=X3oDMTEwb2VsajQ5BHNlYwNzcgRzbGsDdmlkBHZ0aWQDVklEMDMEZ3BvcwM4?p=Girl+Kicked+Out+of+Planet+Fitness&vid=142c0d25724d3592f755d3f20cc8e4b3&l=5:57&turl=http://ts1.mm.bing.net/th?id=WN.H6lj90ro7LuW%2bVvhEWRFpQ&pid=15.1&rurl=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXA1TPwBBZI&tit=KICKED+OUT+PLANET+FITNESS+IN+KY&c=7&sigr=11bdrvder&sigt=10vrdv9ei&sigi=12196mv00&age=1397228778&fr2=p:s,v:v&fr=aaplw&tt=b
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/20/too-fit-for-planet-fitness_n_5002658.html
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Yeah I have been going to PF for the past 7 months and now that I've gotten more in shape, I really hate the gym. I'm moving in a week and a half and cancelling my membership (don't want to go to PF ever again) It's not a real gym at all but it can do wonders for anyone who puts the equipment to use but don't expect to get big at PF. It's a very casual gym. Most employees at my gym are in fair shape except a few who I can honestly say are out of shape but I never intended to get a trainer there anyways. I make use of the equipment as best as I can and still feel like I'm making progress albeit slower than I would at a gym with the proper equipment.
As for the whole intimidation thing, I think that varies from place to place. Each PF i've been to here in Las Vegas has had many different kinds of people. Surprisingly, I have seen a few people in great shape but nothing was ever said to them as I have seen them come back again and again but of course, body builders shouldn't consider PF at all as the equipment is just bad. The best gyms though are the ones that are owned by locals and not big franchises which is hard to find these days but luckily, the city I'm moving to has one that is owned by local people in the city. Overall, PF is great for beginners and once you outgrow it, it's time to move on even if you won't find a price as cheap as $10 a month.
Oh. None of the PF gyms here in vegas have that lunk alarm.0 -
annaskiski wrote: »Honestly I don't know how they "actively discourage people from pushing hard". I don't think I've ever even had a PF employee speak to me. They're not trainers, they just maintain the premises.
PF is just a place with gym equipment, and you can use it if you like. They don't have any programs.
If you want more than that, then you should go to a gym that offers personal training.
Other than ' hi' and 'have a nice day' on my way out the door, I barely speak to them (other than if i have, yet again, left something behind the day before in the locker room and am looking for it.)
I have no doubt that some people have had some issues, and i do think this can vary WIDELY from gym to gym. There are women who push far harder than i do (and have the body to prove it) who work out there every day. They are a great motivation! There are also old people, young people, fat people, thin people, and people of all kinds. I love the diversity.
Are they for everyone, no - but neither is (for example) Gold's Gym. I think the world is plenty big enough for a multitude of gym types and price points. I"m grateful for a cheap one that has what I need and (from what I've seen) has no issues regarding how members use equipment or what they wear or look like.
My PF does have personal trainers (at least one)- though based on what I've SEEN.... I'm not sure its worth much. The lady who leads my zumba class (obviously not affiliated with pf) is also a personal trainer and I've seen her in sessions with clients in her own studio, and I think she pushes her clients much harder (which would be the point, afterall) that pf 'trainers'.
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annaskiski wrote: »Well, I guess I'm skeptical of these stories, but whatever....
You are allowed to be skeptical, but let me ask you this. Have you seen any of their commercials on TV? They are disgusting. For promoting themselves as a Non judgemental gym their commercials are the most judgemental things I have seen. (The one with the muscular guy that they portray as not being able to say anything other than "I lift things up and put them down" over and over again is THE WORST) Just because someone lifts weights and wants to gain muscle does not make them stupid, or unable to put sentences together, it's disgusting really. I would never ever give my money to an organization like that. NEVER!
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branflakes1980 wrote: »annaskiski wrote: »Well, I guess I'm skeptical of these stories, but whatever....
For promoting themselves as a Non judgemental gym their commercials are the most judgemental things I have seen.
even i will agree its rather hypocritical, but so are lots of things in this world (myself too, at times LOL)
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I LOVE THAT COMMERCIAL!
I want to get a t-shirt that says "I pick stuff up and put stuff down".
I'll wear it every time I lift.0 -
I think it all depends on the Planet Fitness. The one near my place never had any problems with people pushing themselves, and I saw plenty of people there that were fit. I never heard the lunk alarm once. They had a personal trainer there that would write up workouts for people and show them how to use the equipment. ( Since their weights were limited, I believe he used another gym to do his own workouts. I don't know if he was certified, or just someone that was in shape.)The only problem that I had with them was that they didn't have enough weight to continue to challenge me and I wanted to start a barbell program.0
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annaskiski wrote: »I LOVE THAT COMMERCIAL!
I want to get a t-shirt that says "I pick stuff up and put stuff down".
I'll wear it every time I lift.
there are people on etsy who make/print customized shirts that i bet could do that for you. i think they run around $25 (i have some on my etsy list LOLOLOL)
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To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.0 -
AllanMisner wrote: »To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.
I'd join that gym too....
I'm aiming to look like Emily Blunt in "Edge of Tomorrow".
I do Stronglifts, but would love to know what program she follows...0 -
Actually, the PF CEO has gone on record as saying that personal trainers are essentially useless. PF even discountinued their use a while back. Cite: http://www.truealphatraining.com/2010/12/18/planet-fitness-insults-personal-training-industry/callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »My PF does have personal trainers (at least one)- though based on what I've SEEN.... I'm not sure its worth much. The lady who leads my zumba class (obviously not affiliated with pf) is also a personal trainer and I've seen her in sessions with clients in her own studio, and I think she pushes her clients much harder (which would be the point, afterall) that pf 'trainers'.
I'm therefore not surprised that your Zumba instructor pushes her clients harder than the PF "trainer" in question. I'd even question whether this PF trainer has any professional certifications outside of PF.0 -
Meh, I'm not against Smith Machines at all and actually think they get a bad rap. You can absolutely get phenomenal results from a Smith machine. Is it ideal? No, but it can work.0
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annaskiski wrote: »AllanMisner wrote: »To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.
I'd join that gym too....
I'm aiming to look like Emily Blunt in "Edge of Tomorrow".
I do Stronglifts, but would love to know what program she follows...
She follows the "I have lots of money to pay for a fantastic personal trainer and chef" plan. I don't think that's covered under the $10/month PF plan.0 -
Meh, I'm not against Smith Machines at all and actually think they get a bad rap. You can absolutely get phenomenal results from a Smith machine. Is it ideal? No, but it can work.
I have an olympic set at home for my workouts.
But people here have inquired about PF (all they can afford), and people trash talk the place, telling them they can't get a good workout there.
Really, you can get a good workout anywhere, even {gasp} on the weight machines.0 -
annaskiski wrote: »AllanMisner wrote: »To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.
I'd join that gym too....
I'm aiming to look like Emily Blunt in "Edge of Tomorrow".
I do Stronglifts, but would love to know what program she follows...
She follows the "I have lots of money to pay for a fantastic personal trainer and chef" plan. I don't think that's covered under the $10/month PF plan.
Well, she still has to work hard. Can't knock her for having money....0 -
annaskiski wrote: »annaskiski wrote: »AllanMisner wrote: »To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.
I'd join that gym too....
I'm aiming to look like Emily Blunt in "Edge of Tomorrow".
I do Stronglifts, but would love to know what program she follows...
She follows the "I have lots of money to pay for a fantastic personal trainer and chef" plan. I don't think that's covered under the $10/month PF plan.
Well, she still has to work hard. Can't knock her for having money....
I wasn't knocking her. It's part of her job to look awesome. I'm just saying having loads of money helps.0 -
Actually, the PF CEO has gone on record as saying that personal trainers are essentially useless. PF even discountinued their use a while back. Cite: http://www.truealphatraining.com/2010/12/18/planet-fitness-insults-personal-training-industry/callsitlikeiseeit wrote: »My PF does have personal trainers (at least one)- though based on what I've SEEN.... I'm not sure its worth much. The lady who leads my zumba class (obviously not affiliated with pf) is also a personal trainer and I've seen her in sessions with clients in her own studio, and I think she pushes her clients much harder (which would be the point, afterall) that pf 'trainers'.
I'm therefore not surprised that your Zumba instructor pushes her clients harder than the PF "trainer" in question. I'd even question whether this PF trainer has any professional certifications outside of PF.
my brother (who is a certified athletic trainer and pursuing his masters degree) said ' please for the love of god do not use him- you dont know how little he knows ' LOL
and based on my observations.... id say thats accurate
i dont know how much people pay him, but all he does is walk them to different machines and stand there and watch them. i see no pushing or education on what the machines target or how to use them 0 -
annaskiski wrote: »AllanMisner wrote: »To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.
I'd join that gym too....
I'm aiming to look like Emily Blunt in "Edge of Tomorrow".
I do Stronglifts, but would love to know what program she follows...
She follows the "I have lots of money to pay for a fantastic personal trainer and chef" plan. I don't think that's covered under the $10/month PF plan.
d--a--m--n.0 -
The PF advertisements sound obnoxious but I've never seen them and am happy to remain oblivious.
The PF I go to seems to be better than most of the ones described here. Most of the employees are very young but in incredible shape (biceps as big as my head in some cases). The people who go there seem to fall everywhere on the fitness spectrum.
One time someone was loudly dropping weights and an employee discreetly asked him put them down more gently (which he did). It didn't seem like a big deal.
However, there are things about the gym that are irritating- like how crowded it gets at peak times, how valuable gym space is taken up with that 30 minute and 15 min circuit that nobody uses, a handful of useless machines, the scarcity of mats, the lack of stability balls and the lack of free weights beyond a few barbells. That said- it provides me with everything I really need and I have weights at home that I can use.
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Naturally, I took this opportunity to explain why the Smith machine was a poor choice for strength building. I explained that it forces one's joints (shoulders, spine) to move in unnatural ways. I also said that a proper bench press (i.e. without the Smith machine) also engages the stabilizer muscles, which are critical for functional strength.
He said his goal was size, not functional strength. Maybe he already has functional strength from a physical job, sports, an active lifestyle, etc, and now just wants to get bigger. Machines are ideal for building mass, since they reduce involvement of non-target muscles, which waste energy. So machines can put more stimulus on the target muscles, which leads to greater hypertrophy.
The risk of injury is low if the machine is properly adjusted to the user (some Smith machines have angled tracks, so they're awkward for benching). If injuries were common with machines, you can be sure they wouldn't be used in large gym chains, which are a magnet for lawsuits.
If you're concerned about working the body in "unnatural ways", then stay away from the bench press. It's highly unnatural for humans to push things in a supine position, with the spine & scapula supported by a bench. Standing, unsupported exercises are more "functional", like the cable chest press, pushing a prowler, boxing, etc. There's certainly some carryover benefit of benching to real-world activities, but it's limited, since the neuromuscular demands of pushing while standing are very different.. especially when done unilaterally.0 -
What's IRONIC to my is that PF is the sponsoring gym for The Biggest Loser and ALL you ever hear is grunting and groaning on the show. Lol, so would they out former contestants who have memberships and are great advertising pulls for their location, if they grunted like they do on TV?AllanMisner wrote: »To be honest, I don’t have a problem with their rules. They market to a very specific customer-base. I’m not in that demo. If you are, enjoy the discounted access to equipment, it is a good deal.
Now, if someone opened a lunk only gym for $10 a month and had 225 lbs on a squat rack by the door saying squat this to join, or walked by and said to a patron, "you’re not working hard enough, please leave..." there’d be an outrage for sure.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Cherimoose wrote: »Naturally, I took this opportunity to explain why the Smith machine was a poor choice for strength building. I explained that it forces one's joints (shoulders, spine) to move in unnatural ways. I also said that a proper bench press (i.e. without the Smith machine) also engages the stabilizer muscles, which are critical for functional strength.
He said his goal was size, not functional strength. Maybe he already has functional strength from a physical job, sports, an active lifestyle, etc, and now just wants to get bigger. Machines are ideal for building mass, since they reduce involvement of non-target muscles, which waste energy. So machines can put more stimulus on the target muscles, which leads to greater hypertrophy.
The risk of injury is low if the machine is properly adjusted to the user (some Smith machines have angled tracks, so they're awkward for benching). If injuries were common with machines, you can be sure they wouldn't be used in large gym chains, which are a magnet for lawsuits.
If you're concerned about working the body in "unnatural ways", then stay away from the bench press. It's highly unnatural for humans to push things in a supine position, with the spine & scapula supported by a bench. Standing, unsupported exercises are more "functional", like the cable chest press, pushing a prowler, boxing, etc. There's certainly some carryover benefit of benching to real-world activities, but it's limited, since the neuromuscular demands of pushing while standing are very different.. especially when done unilaterally.
This...this i agree with.0
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