Life after stronglifts?
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Karen_libert wrote: »I looked at Wendler 5/3/1 but couldn't get my head around the app. Can you summarise the workout you do?
My workout is 4x a week.
I have started a new cycle so I have 4 weeks.
Week one is 65%, 75% then 85% of my training max. All lifts are x5 for 3 sets except the last set which is 5+
Week two is 70,80 then 90% of my training max. All lifts are x3 for 3 sets except the last which is 3+
Week three is 75, 85 then 95% of my training max. LIfts are 5,3, 1+
The + meaning as many as I can do at that weight.
Week four is deload week which is 40, 50 then 60% of my training max all x5 again except the last set.
The app I use has warm up sets and they are always 5,5,3.
My training maxes are based on my calculated 1RM in the app.
My increments I set myself for lower body it's 5lbs, Upper body it's 2.5 and that is added to my last cycle.
Yesterday OHP, today DL...rest day then BP on Thurs, Squats on Friday.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/928232/3x5-5-3-1-madcow-texas-life-after-5x5#Item_1
This is a good write up for "Life after SL"
I didn't get the book...found the app was fine.0 -
Karen_libert wrote: »I looked at Wendler 5/3/1 but couldn't get my head around the app. Can you summarise the workout you do?
It seem complicated when I first started, but once you get the hang of it...it makes sense. Get the book like someone else suggested. It's bench, squat, ohp, dl; 4 week cycle; getting the set/rep scheme down is a little confusing at first, you just have to go through a few cycles to remember it. I carry a little cheat sheet with the set/reps.
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@Karen_libert, take a look at Dinosaur Training by Brooks Kubic.0
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Just to say to the contributors, thanks for this thread, gives me a lot to muse on.0
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Id do more stronglifts or madcow if you want to switch it up. 531 is good too but i switched to that after madcow and had a lot of success with it.0
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Karen_libert wrote: »I looked at Wendler 5/3/1 but couldn't get my head around the app. Can you summarise the workout you do?
My workout is 4x a week.
I have started a new cycle so I have 4 weeks.
Week one is 65%, 75% then 85% of my training max. All lifts are x5 for 3 sets except the last set which is 5+
Week two is 70,80 then 90% of my training max. All lifts are x3 for 3 sets except the last which is 3+
Week three is 75, 85 then 95% of my training max. LIfts are 5,3, 1+
The + meaning as many as I can do at that weight.
Week four is deload week which is 40, 50 then 60% of my training max all x5 again except the last set.
The app I use has warm up sets and they are always 5,5,3.
My training maxes are based on my calculated 1RM in the app.
My increments I set myself for lower body it's 5lbs, Upper body it's 2.5 and that is added to my last cycle.
Yesterday OHP, today DL...rest day then BP on Thurs, Squats on Friday.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/928232/3x5-5-3-1-madcow-texas-life-after-5x5#Item_1
This is a good write up for "Life after SL"
I didn't get the book...found the app was fine.
So you just do 1 lift a day over 4 days?
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Karen_libert wrote: »Karen_libert wrote: »I looked at Wendler 5/3/1 but couldn't get my head around the app. Can you summarise the workout you do?
My workout is 4x a week.
I have started a new cycle so I have 4 weeks.
Week one is 65%, 75% then 85% of my training max. All lifts are x5 for 3 sets except the last set which is 5+
Week two is 70,80 then 90% of my training max. All lifts are x3 for 3 sets except the last which is 3+
Week three is 75, 85 then 95% of my training max. LIfts are 5,3, 1+
The + meaning as many as I can do at that weight.
Week four is deload week which is 40, 50 then 60% of my training max all x5 again except the last set.
The app I use has warm up sets and they are always 5,5,3.
My training maxes are based on my calculated 1RM in the app.
My increments I set myself for lower body it's 5lbs, Upper body it's 2.5 and that is added to my last cycle.
Yesterday OHP, today DL...rest day then BP on Thurs, Squats on Friday.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/928232/3x5-5-3-1-madcow-texas-life-after-5x5#Item_1
This is a good write up for "Life after SL"
I didn't get the book...found the app was fine.
So you just do 1 lift a day over 4 days?
It's best to think of something like stronglifts, etc as a program: you turn up on x day, do this many sets for this many reps, progress. It's laid down for you to follow pretty tightly. You do it until you've milked it dry and move on.
It's best to think of something like 5/3/1 as a template. It's a method of progressing a lift over a series of 3 sessions. Essentially the session has a main lift (like a squat, for example) that you'll lift for some percentage of your max. Then you do assistance/accessory work afterwards that is programmed for a particular goal (bring up a weak bodypart, stimulate hypertrophy, etc).
There are 4 main lifts, and you could do them 1 a day for 4 sessions in a week for a 4 week cycle. Or you could sandwich two main lifts into one day and lift 2x week for 4 weeks. Or you could roll it so that you do 3 sessions a week and extend a cycle to 6 weeks. Or you can do a 4 week cycle and mash together two main lifts on a single day for one day (say DL/OHP) and keep Sq and Bench on their own days for 3x week. You can keep the 5/3/1 progression for Sq and DL and run separate programming for Bench/OHP.
It's pretty flexible and can be tailored around a sport. Made on-season/off-season. Done for mass. Programmed around conditioning. Done for reduced volume/increased intensity. All kinds of stuff. Conceivably (with some intelligence and foresight) you could run some version of it for years.
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Thank you. That's very helpful. It's tough for me as this is the first time that I have really wanted to follow a specific plan. My workouts were pretty random with no specific goal except lifting heavy things up with the goal of loosing weight.
Now I am close to my goal weight the thoughts turn to gaining muscle so I need a more goal specific programme. Strong lifts has been great and I have made strength and hypertrophy gains but I have reached my 1 rep max now.
For me, following a rigid programme is vital. I am just the type of person that likes to have a list and tick it off. I don't have the knowledge or skills to create my own programme so what I really need is for someone to tell me what to do and when to do it! That's why the strong lifts app was so good for me.
On Monday I did Madcow, and although it was very easy I am sure the weight will go up pretty quickly. I have found an accessory programme so I do:
Monday - squat, bench, row + chest/tri (pushups, lat fly and tricep extension
Wednesday - squat, OHP, deadlift + back/bi (lat pulldown, preacher curl and seated cable row)
Friday - squat, bench, row + legs (calf raise, good mornings, hanging leg raises)
I also do box-it-out on a Tuesday and circuits on a Sunday plus a 10k run once a week.
If I can find an app that walks me through Wendlers I'll likely move on to that next - or perhaps in a few months I'll feel a little more confident to write something out for myself. Training for hypertrophy is new for me and I'm hoping that simply continuing the training and upping the calories will grow me some big ones!
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Karen_libert wrote: »Thank you. That's very helpful. It's tough for me as this is the first time that I have really wanted to follow a specific plan. My workouts were pretty random with no specific goal except lifting heavy things up with the goal of loosing weight.
Now I am close to my goal weight the thoughts turn to gaining muscle so I need a more goal specific programme. Strong lifts has been great and I have made strength and hypertrophy gains but I have reached my 1 rep max now.
For me, following a rigid programme is vital. I am just the type of person that likes to have a list and tick it off. I don't have the knowledge or skills to create my own programme so what I really need is for someone to tell me what to do and when to do it! That's why the strong lifts app was so good for me.
On Monday I did Madcow, and although it was very easy I am sure the weight will go up pretty quickly. I have found an accessory programme so I do:
Monday - squat, bench, row + chest/tri (pushups, lat fly and tricep extension
Wednesday - squat, OHP, deadlift + back/bi (lat pulldown, preacher curl and seated cable row)
Friday - squat, bench, row + legs (calf raise, good mornings, hanging leg raises)
I also do box-it-out on a Tuesday and circuits on a Sunday plus a 10k run once a week.
If I can find an app that walks me through Wendlers I'll likely move on to that next - or perhaps in a few months I'll feel a little more confident to write something out for myself. Training for hypertrophy is new for me and I'm hoping that simply continuing the training and upping the calories will grow me some big ones!
The thing is, when you've done a few routines as written and see how you respond to various rep schemes and progressions, then you'll have a more of an idea about what you're doing.
Everyone needs something cookie-cutter to start with or else they just make a bunch of stuff up and get nowhere. You could continue to make progress on well laid-out intermediate routines (such as Madcow) for a good long while. If you want to try something different after a while, then there are various upper/lower splits which are also well laid out and will let you try your hand at something new.
If you think something like 5/3/1 is going to be too open-ended and leave you too much rope to hang yourself with, then save it for when you feel like you've got more variety under your belt and can make more discriminating choices about your training direction. It'll still be there waiting for you if you decide to tackle it.
There's really no rush with any of this stuff, just keep making progress, try to stay injury-free and enjoy the process as much as possible! There's also no, one, God given, rep range/scheme. Every so often it doesn't hurt to try something different - it'll give you new insights and also can be good for mental freshness. Just something to keep in mind after Madcows...
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Thanks very much, you've been very helpful. I'm certainly feeling madcow in my legs more than stronglifts and I've certainly seen gains in my arms since starting SL 5x5 . What I am doing is working for me for now (my current goal being fat loss.) When it stops working or I stop progressing I will be back for more advice and more resources to read. I will be upping my calories in a few weeks and hope to see muscle gains with as little fat gain as possible!0
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I'm not sure which app you are using but try Big Lifts 2, it sets up the 5/3/1 programme for you and walks you through each day/phase.0
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GuitarJerry wrote: »Use this app: blackironbeast.com. Look for the 5/3/1 programming, and select the options you want. Without reading the book, it's going to be difficult to understand.
This.
I don't know why so many people are so hesitant to read a (slim) book about something they are willing to devote so much of their life to.
It's well written. Funny. A quick read and will make you think about why you're choosing to do BBB or Dave Tate's Periodization Bible or the Triumvirate. An app or website - no matter how good - can't really tell you why to do a particular thing. Only how it will look if you decide to implement it given your current lifts.
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My question would also be how do you know you have reached your 1RM - if you keep progressing with stronglifts (or at least adapting to 3x5) you should keep getting stronger. Obviously some lifts will progress quicker than others but I wouldnt think you should have to drop stronglifts - particularly if you like it. Have you considered looking at one of those strength charts to see where you really fit and what you could be capable of.
Now of course - im not saying you shouldnt change just because you want to but i would also say - dont be afraid of failure on the 5x5 programme - failure and deloads are what will get you stronger.0 -
Karen_libert wrote: »Karen_libert wrote: »I looked at Wendler 5/3/1 but couldn't get my head around the app. Can you summarise the workout you do?
My workout is 4x a week.
I have started a new cycle so I have 4 weeks.
Week one is 65%, 75% then 85% of my training max. All lifts are x5 for 3 sets except the last set which is 5+
Week two is 70,80 then 90% of my training max. All lifts are x3 for 3 sets except the last which is 3+
Week three is 75, 85 then 95% of my training max. LIfts are 5,3, 1+
The + meaning as many as I can do at that weight.
Week four is deload week which is 40, 50 then 60% of my training max all x5 again except the last set.
The app I use has warm up sets and they are always 5,5,3.
My training maxes are based on my calculated 1RM in the app.
My increments I set myself for lower body it's 5lbs, Upper body it's 2.5 and that is added to my last cycle.
Yesterday OHP, today DL...rest day then BP on Thurs, Squats on Friday.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/928232/3x5-5-3-1-madcow-texas-life-after-5x5#Item_1
This is a good write up for "Life after SL"
I didn't get the book...found the app was fine.
So you just do 1 lift a day over 4 days?
Yes that's it. There are accessories you can add in as well if you want for isolation. My workout takes about 15mins without accessories...40 mins with.
http://www.strstd.com/
I used this site to get my lifts (weights) at first and chose one of the accessory types.
I did Body weight (hated it) then went to Dave Tate's.
I didn't read the book, I did however do a lot of reading online.
I also downloaded an app to keep track of cycles/weeks etc.
I am making gains esp on upper body...about to break through benching 135...OHP triple digits.
I find 5/3/1 harder than stronglifts...Tuesday was DL day and I was wiped for 2 days...mainly because of the quantity of lifts...5x150, 5x170 and finally 5x195...where with SL it was 1x5.0 -
Thanks. I've just finished week 1 of madcow so I'm going to stick with that but 531 is likely to be the next programme when I feel it's time for a change. in the mean time i will do more reading so i appreciate all the input. As far as my 1 rep max goes, perhaps I could of stuck with stronglifts a little longer. I didn't actually get to the deload phase. I was at a point where I wasn't actually failing a lift but I knew I was close so I found myself just repeating weights rather than failing. I researched how to safely fail a squat but it's still something I didn't feel comfortable doing. I also found that the higher weights were wrecking my form. Doing madcow the weights are much lower but my squats are picture perfect and I feel like I have more time under pressure and more control. I "feel" the whole movement if you know what I mean. It takes less time so I've added 3 accessory lifts to each day so I now have a back and bi, chest and tri and a leg day. I've never actually had a leg day before! I think whatever im doing is working. When my diet is tight I loose weight. I feel like I have made some gains in my arms but that's more likely fat loss than muscle size. That's the next step, gain some muscle size !! I am close to my goal of being able to do a chin up ;-)
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Bunch of programs: http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/powerlifting-programs/
I will toss out Texas Method too since no one has (there are a few different templates of this with some additional assistance movements as well).0 -
5/3/1 Summary by Jim posted on T-Nation long ago : https://www.t-nation.com/workouts/531-how-to-build-pure-strength
Still recommend reading the book though.0 -
LolBroScience wrote: »Bunch of programs: http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/powerlifting-programs/
I will toss out Texas Method too since no one has (there are a few different templates of this with some additional assistance movements as well).
Thank you for this. This is what I'm doing with my Friday evening now.0 -
LolBroScience wrote: »Bunch of programs: http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/powerlifting-programs/
I will toss out Texas Method too since no one has (there are a few different templates of this with some additional assistance movements as well).
This is a good resource. I put in a few days just going over the various programs. I just started my second cycle of Candito's Six Week Strength Program as a result.0 -
LolBroScience wrote: »Bunch of programs: http://www.powerliftingtowin.com/powerlifting-programs/
I will toss out Texas Method too since no one has (there are a few different templates of this with some additional assistance movements as well).
Just to add to this good advice, if you're interested in the TM and the different ways it can be run, I'd recommend the excellent "Practical Programming for Strength Training 3rd Edition" by Mark Rippetoe & Andy Baker. Chapter 7 discusses the TM (and also touches on Starr's model (which stuff like Madcow is based on).
It's a total rewrite that Rip bought Baker on board for and he does an excellent job of explaining various set ups and how it can be trigged for various goals too. I really enjoyed reading it and plan to re-read it in the near future. (and the book has a bunch of other stuff in it too from novice to advance and everything in between and lots of the theories and ideas behind strength training).
If you want a lighter book that's TM specific then there's an e-book by Lascek about it that Pendlay normally points people towards, so if he's anointing it, it can't be half bad.
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