Cycling at a deficit?

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Replies

  • hebdenbiker
    hebdenbiker Posts: 24 Member
    Bypassing the cadence discussion for a second (I've already commented on that) your post is really about your plateauing cycling performance.

    To see improvement, you need to *kitten* your legs up, let them recover for a few days, then go and *kitten* them up again.

    Find new routes, go further, go steeper, go higher, enter a time trial, join a club, do a multi-day tour. Whatever, as long as it's challenging.
  • kcjchang
    kcjchang Posts: 709 Member
    3dogsrunning wrote: »

    What about those of us without a way to measure power output?

    Save up. Watteam is releasing L/R at end of August for $499 and hope that will drive down the prices for other PMs. Stages already had their end of year clearance at around $450 (left only).
  • beemerphile1
    beemerphile1 Posts: 1,710 Member
    OP, what pedals and shoes? It is easier to spin a faster cadence with clipless pedals.
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
    I primarily mountain bike and cadence isn't something I worry about too much (I just can't spin fast uphills) but I will say that practicing it on pavement or the trainer through the winter really helped just develop the habit of spinning faster. Now I spin at 80 on flats just out of habit when I think I was 60 before.
  • 3dogsrunning
    3dogsrunning Posts: 27,167 Member
    kcjchang wrote: »
    3dogsrunning wrote: »

    What about those of us without a way to measure power output?

    Save up. Watteam is releasing L/R at end of August for $499 and hope that will drive down the prices for other PMs. Stages already had their end of year clearance at around $450 (left only).

    I'm in Canada so those things usually end up being a bit more. I'm not sure it is worth the money to me at this point.
  • KittensMaster
    KittensMaster Posts: 748 Member
    Cycling is my main cardio

    I try and get 4 rides of 25 miles + per week and keep it at 18+ mph.

    Squats and deadlifts get your quads stout.

    HIIT will help build aerobic capacity.

    I don't do much of the high carb stuff. I am a low carb person and have spent a few months riding more and more with less carbs. I'm working on getting my mitochondria conditioned to burn a greater percentage of fat as fuel in the mix. It isn't anything new but is a little challenging at first.

    Over the last 3 months it seems to have given results. I do a few GU packs and can ride 40 as my long Saturday ride and still keep it over 17+ mph

    Protein afterwards is key for me

    I also drink Acceleraide during rises which has protein in it. I add BCAA scoops to the mix.

    I'm 54. So it isn't really an age thing.

    I would say to add thigh muscle mass and then build your cardio capacity to utilize that added muscle.

    Good luck with it.
  • 257_Lag
    257_Lag Posts: 1,249 Member
    beemerphile1 wrote: »
    OP, what pedals and shoes? It is easier to spin a faster cadence with clipless pedals.

    Lightweight running shoes and straps. I,\'m just not that serious a rider to do toe clips :)
  • 257_Lag
    257_Lag Posts: 1,249 Member
    I appreciate everyone's input. I will consider it all.

    I guess I will just keep putting the miles behind me and see how it goes. If that means turning off the computer sometimes so I can just enjoy riding again than so be it!
  • msf74
    msf74 Posts: 3,498 Member
    Mr_Knight wrote: »
    msf74 wrote: »
    Nuke_64 wrote: »
    msf74 wrote: »
    Personally, I think that training cadence is a largely an unnecessary distraction which came to life because people wanted to mimic Lance Armstrong's ultra high cadence (while all the while forgetting about his freakish CV ability...and errrr, other stuff...). Before that most people were quite happy with their self selected cadences.

    I'm not going to disagree because frankly I don't know, but I will say they I have found higher cadence (80-90) and not mashing has been better for my knees.

    Fair play and if you have found a general cadence which suits you and your riding then more power to you.

    I guess what I am saying is outside what the fashionable advice is at the moment which, in my opinion, arose from a time where power meters were less commonly used and available.

    Training cadence is not a training goal to me - improving threshold power is though and the cadence / gearing to achieve that is a personal thing.

    I wouldn't necessarily call 80-ish a "high" cadence, and that should be reachable by any amateur on anything up to a 5% grade (unless it's really long).

    But if someone is targeting Armstrong (and dare I say it...Froome) style spinning where you're at 100-ish going up Ventoux, it's worth keeping in mind that Lance's doping regimen would have produced physiological changes best expressed as a high-cadence riding style. It's debatable that style is suitable for someone on a more....normal..."food" intake.

    Yeah, fair point.


  • msf74
    msf74 Posts: 3,498 Member
    3dogsrunning wrote: »
    kcjchang wrote: »
    3dogsrunning wrote: »

    What about those of us without a way to measure power output?

    Save up. Watteam is releasing L/R at end of August for $499 and hope that will drive down the prices for other PMs. Stages already had their end of year clearance at around $450 (left only).

    I'm in Canada so those things usually end up being a bit more. I'm not sure it is worth the money to me at this point.

    I would just do what this bloke said if you don't have access to a PM:

    hebdenbiker wrote: »
    Bypassing the cadence discussion for a second (I've already commented on that) your post is really about your plateauing cycling performance.

    To see improvement, you need to *kitten* your legs up, let them recover for a few days, then go and *kitten* them up again.

    Find new routes, go further, go steeper, go higher, enter a time trial, join a club, do a multi-day tour. Whatever, as long as it's challenging.

    Just keep challenging yourself progressively and then do periodic checks along the same route to see if there is an improvement (or see if your local gym has something like a Wattbike.) You may end up doing the same few routes regularly and you could use Strava to assess improvements in segments or the whole route over time.

    If you want a good level of basic fitness rather than racing specific events (my goal) I would suggest learning to pace effort by feel and experience. It takes a bit of experimenting though to find your limits (although you are probably a lot more capable than you think). A structure like:
    • one long ride of over 3 hours where the pace is such that your breathing is unlaboured and you could hold a conversation with your riding partner (or yourself if you prefer the solo thing!) but you are not pootling along
    • middle distance of about 2 hours or so where your breathing is laboured but not overly so - hard but not stupidly hard
    • short ride of under 90 minutes to an hour which either incorporates hill repeats or very hard intervals sandwiched between a warm up and warm down - very hard and dependent on your current level of conditioning so treat with caution and consider omitting until fitter and replacing with another middle distance ride
    • one or two pure rides for enjoyment / recovery to add miles to legs (optional)

    Will cover a lot of bases and see good improvements over time. If monitoring heart rate / cadence is your thing then keep an eye on it on your rides but don't be a slave to it.

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