Routine Critique: Experienced lifters, Care to take a quick look?
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It "exploded" because you bumped it after a month of silence.0
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Holy crap, you're right, I didn't realize how long ago you actually replied.0
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Here's a article and chart I have bookmarked. Might help you decide on a rep/set routine based on % max to build strength.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/training-percentages-made-simple
The chart is about 1/2 way down the page.
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So you're not doing the routine you originally posted? What are you doing now
For speed & explosive power, I suggest adding some pause work into your routine while keeping it in the 3-6 rep range.
pause squats, paused bench, dead pause deadlifts, etc. help a ton for explosive power.
And maybe instead of training specific body parts, try training movements instead?0 -
piperdown44 wrote: »Here's a article and chart I have bookmarked. Might help you decide on a rep/set routine based on % max to build strength.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/training-percentages-made-simple
The chart is about 1/2 way down the page.
This charts a nice summary, are you finding this is working quite well for you then?0 -
So you're not doing the routine you originally posted? What are you doing now
For speed & explosive power, I suggest adding some pause work into your routine while keeping it in the 3-6 rep range.
pause squats, paused bench, dead pause deadlifts, etc. help a ton for explosive power.
And maybe instead of training specific body parts, try training movements instead?
Right now I'm cutting, I've got about 6 weeks left. After which I move on to a weightlifting routine, designed to add some serious power and strength behind my martial arts (so I need to stay relatively athletic.). Squats, Bench Press and Deadlifts are all incorporated into my routine but yes I'm isolating with muscle groups such as: Biceps, Triceps, Shoulders, Abs, Forearm curls, and I'm never sure where calf raises sit in that argument... I'm throwing in three HIIT sessions a week of martial arts (me vs heavy bag). The thing is, everyone else in the class that I'll be attending trains solely in their movements, with some body weight exercises thrown in. After about 5 years of that, I decided to hit the weights, that's when I started acing the sparring matches... I was warned repeatedly that doing weights of any kind would make me bulky and in/un-flexible. Which we all know isn't true, I mean it is, to a degree... but not if you make sure to train appropriately for what you're doing. That's kind of when I knew my instructor didn't know much about exercise... I should have guess from his weight problem (he was actually later fired with the class taken over by a more experienced teacher). So anyway my point is I need to be athletic and it needs to hurt on impact. That being said, what do you mean by training movements instead?
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supahdupahfitness wrote: »piperdown44 wrote: »Here's a article and chart I have bookmarked. Might help you decide on a rep/set routine based on % max to build strength.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/training-percentages-made-simple
The chart is about 1/2 way down the page.
This charts a nice summary, are you finding this is working quite well for you then?
I either run 531 or a base strength program using the % in that chart. I switch over to 531 from the base program when I need more gradual increases during a cut. When I'm in maintenance or surplus I run a heavier program.
Typically it's 5-6 sets of 3 reps at 80-85% of my 1rm for the big compounds.
Some weeks it's just singles at 90-95%.
Most of the more experience PL guys I know (that compete) use either triples or singles for strength improvement.
I work on explosive power during the heavy sets, so that's pause on chest for bench, driving out of the whole on squats, tension and speed off the floor for DL, and drive off the shoulders for OHP. Plus I use Pendlay rows to increase pulling power for upper back.
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piperdown44 wrote: »supahdupahfitness wrote: »piperdown44 wrote: »Here's a article and chart I have bookmarked. Might help you decide on a rep/set routine based on % max to build strength.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/training-percentages-made-simple
The chart is about 1/2 way down the page.
This charts a nice summary, are you finding this is working quite well for you then?
I either run 531 or a base strength program using the % in that chart. I switch over to 531 from the base program when I need more gradual increases during a cut. When I'm in maintenance or surplus I run a heavier program.
Typically it's 5-6 sets of 3 reps at 80-85% of my 1rm for the big compounds.
Some weeks it's just singles at 90-95%.
Most of the more experience PL guys I know (that compete) use either triples or singles for strength improvement.
I work on explosive power during the heavy sets, so that's pause on chest for bench, driving out of the whole on squats, tension and speed off the floor for DL, and drive off the shoulders for OHP. Plus I use Pendlay rows to increase pulling power for upper back.
Nice, OK. So if I've understood the chart right, that's something around 4 or 5 sets in total per exercise? Have I massively misunderstood that or is that right? I'm really sorry you're going to get barraged with questions now!0 -
supahdupahfitness wrote: »piperdown44 wrote: »supahdupahfitness wrote: »piperdown44 wrote: »Here's a article and chart I have bookmarked. Might help you decide on a rep/set routine based on % max to build strength.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/training-percentages-made-simple
The chart is about 1/2 way down the page.
This charts a nice summary, are you finding this is working quite well for you then?
I either run 531 or a base strength program using the % in that chart. I switch over to 531 from the base program when I need more gradual increases during a cut. When I'm in maintenance or surplus I run a heavier program.
Typically it's 5-6 sets of 3 reps at 80-85% of my 1rm for the big compounds.
Some weeks it's just singles at 90-95%.
Most of the more experience PL guys I know (that compete) use either triples or singles for strength improvement.
I work on explosive power during the heavy sets, so that's pause on chest for bench, driving out of the whole on squats, tension and speed off the floor for DL, and drive off the shoulders for OHP. Plus I use Pendlay rows to increase pulling power for upper back.
Nice, OK. So if I've understood the chart right, that's something around 4 or 5 sets in total per exercise? Have I massively misunderstood that or is that right? I'm really sorry you're going to get barraged with questions now!
Yep, 4-5 sets at 80-85% for 2-3 reps or;
4-5 sets at 90-95% for 1-2 reps. In reality though, at 90-95% you're really looking at single reps. Stop for a few mins, then rep another one out.
Regardless, whether it's 80-85% or 90-95%, after your sets are complete you'll be fatigued.
After a few weeks this is where fractional plates come in handy. Often after 3-4 weeks, a 10lb jump in weights isn't possible but 2 1/2 or 5 lbs might be, especially on a long term calorie deficit.
Of course it also depends on how long you've been lifting. Those with consistent years of training under their belt scratch and claw for every single pound of increase.
People on a weight lifting forum I belong to use these types of sets and reps. 6 of them just competed two weeks ago and set records for their age and weight class. The forum owner Jim (Flex) just did a 600lb squat at 48 years of age and 270lb weight class knee wraps only. He primarily trains with singles past 80% but will do many sets of singles. Another, closer in my weight category of 178 nailed 475lb squat. He uses timed triples and singles. Increased his squat by 100lbs in one year.
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If you're a martial artist I would recommend that you greatly reduce the volume and focus on Strength & POwer. You'll get plenty of endurance work from training, sparring, etc., so you use strength training to compliment that training. If you're in-camp for a fight, probably 2 to 3 days at most and use a more full-body approach. If you're not in-camp, then 3 to maybe 4 days. Strength training is a secondary goal to your Martial Arts training, it supports your Martial Arts training so make sure to approach it that way. You must be able to work on strength and power and recover well enough to not negatively affect your training.
I would suggest that you pick one or two compound exercises and apply a maximal strength approach to training that lift once per week. 80% to 100% of Training Max for 1 to 5 sets of 1 to 5 reps. Then perhaps 2 to 4 assistance exercise to support strength in those lifts and promote balanced strength improvement. With lower body don't neglect unilateral strength improvement exercises such as step-ups or bulgarian split squats. Also train power with one or two exercises every session. You can do Medicine Ball work, various jumps, or Olympic Lifts.
But what you have posted above is something more along the lines of hypertrophy work which you probably don't want as a fighter.0 -
piperdown44 wrote: »supahdupahfitness wrote: »piperdown44 wrote: »supahdupahfitness wrote: »piperdown44 wrote: »Here's a article and chart I have bookmarked. Might help you decide on a rep/set routine based on % max to build strength.
https://www.t-nation.com/training/training-percentages-made-simple
The chart is about 1/2 way down the page.
This charts a nice summary, are you finding this is working quite well for you then?
I either run 531 or a base strength program using the % in that chart. I switch over to 531 from the base program when I need more gradual increases during a cut. When I'm in maintenance or surplus I run a heavier program.
Typically it's 5-6 sets of 3 reps at 80-85% of my 1rm for the big compounds.
Some weeks it's just singles at 90-95%.
Most of the more experience PL guys I know (that compete) use either triples or singles for strength improvement.
I work on explosive power during the heavy sets, so that's pause on chest for bench, driving out of the whole on squats, tension and speed off the floor for DL, and drive off the shoulders for OHP. Plus I use Pendlay rows to increase pulling power for upper back.
Nice, OK. So if I've understood the chart right, that's something around 4 or 5 sets in total per exercise? Have I massively misunderstood that or is that right? I'm really sorry you're going to get barraged with questions now!
Yep, 4-5 sets at 80-85% for 2-3 reps or;
4-5 sets at 90-95% for 1-2 reps. In reality though, at 90-95% you're really looking at single reps. Stop for a few mins, then rep another one out.
Regardless, whether it's 80-85% or 90-95%, after your sets are complete you'll be fatigued.
After a few weeks this is where fractional plates come in handy. Often after 3-4 weeks, a 10lb jump in weights isn't possible but 2 1/2 or 5 lbs might be, especially on a long term calorie deficit.
Of course it also depends on how long you've been lifting. Those with consistent years of training under their belt scratch and claw for every single pound of increase.
People on a weight lifting forum I belong to use these types of sets and reps. 6 of them just competed two weeks ago and set records for their age and weight class. The forum owner Jim (Flex) just did a 600lb squat at 48 years of age and 270lb weight class knee wraps only. He primarily trains with singles past 80% but will do many sets of singles. Another, closer in my weight category of 178 nailed 475lb squat. He uses timed triples and singles. Increased his squat by 100lbs in one year.Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »If you're a martial artist I would recommend that you greatly reduce the volume and focus on Strength & POwer. You'll get plenty of endurance work from training, sparring, etc., so you use strength training to compliment that training. If you're in-camp for a fight, probably 2 to 3 days at most and use a more full-body approach. If you're not in-camp, then 3 to maybe 4 days. Strength training is a secondary goal to your Martial Arts training, it supports your Martial Arts training so make sure to approach it that way. You must be able to work on strength and power and recover well enough to not negatively affect your training.
I would suggest that you pick one or two compound exercises and apply a maximal strength approach to training that lift once per week. 80% to 100% of Training Max for 1 to 5 sets of 1 to 5 reps. Then perhaps 2 to 4 assistance exercise to support strength in those lifts and promote balanced strength improvement. With lower body don't neglect unilateral strength improvement exercises such as step-ups or bulgarian split squats. Also train power with one or two exercises every session. You can do Medicine Ball work, various jumps, or Olympic Lifts.
But what you have posted above is something more along the lines of hypertrophy work which you probably don't want as a fighter.
Ok, Some really great stuff from both you guys, so I'm tying you both into this just to take a quick look and serve as a better base of discussion: Latest Drawing Board Result:
I work out at a Home Gym that I'm building so right now the equipment is as follows:
- 1 x EZ Bar
- 1 x Barbell
- 2 x Dumbbell
- 1 x Inc/Dec/Flat capable Bench Press Bench { Comes with the legs attachment (that padded pulley thing with a weight disc spike)
- 1 x Pull up bar
- 1 x Heavy Martial Arts Bag Full Body Length - Sand Filled
Sunday: Rest
Monday: Chest and Triceps
- Inc/Dec/Flat Bench Press (Alternate weekly between fly's and presses)
- Skull crushers/Tricep press, Tricep Dumbbell Kickbacks
Tuesday: Back and Biceps
- Barbell Row, Mid DB Pull, Deadlifts
- Barbell Curl, Hammer Curls
Wednesday: Martial Arts Workout (1hr - Steady State - Heavy Bag Sparring)
Thursday: Legs and Abs
- Squats, Russian Deadlifts, Calf Raises
- I have gone from ab routine to ab routine curiosity sake I would love to leave this to your suggestion.
Friday: Shoulders and Forearms
- Lateral Raise, Rear Delt Fly, Anterior Raise, Arnold Press
- Wrist Curls, Reverse Wrist Curls
Saturday: Martial Arts Workout (1hr - Steady State - Heavy Bag Sparring)
Additional Notes: Stretching and Pattern Practice Every Morning for 30mins (Note: Not a workout, it's not easy, but I wouldn't class it as a workout.)
So taking into consideration both your advice about dropping volume to match up to Pipers chart, (something around 1-5x1-5). Sam, I have yet to return to my class after a couple years hiatus. When I return, I must be a machine. So obviously looking at what I've posted there's compound movements included, how about this?
(I feel like we're in the opening of the million dollar man)0 -
Think about your exercise a little differently.
1. Muscle Confusion: This is not a good thing, don't change exercises every week. For lower body if you want to deadlift then deadlift for several weeks, same thing for the bench press.
2. Maximal Strength - Compound movements: 1 to 5 sets 1 to 5 reps @ 85%+
3. Support / accessory movements: 3-5 sets to 8-12 reps 65% to 75% but only select like 2 to 4, you don't need to destroy your triceps. If you do some kind of press 3 days a week you don't need a lot of triceps work.
4. Power Exercises: Olympic Lifts, Plyometric Jumps, Ballistics via Medicine ball throws (1 to 2 exercises)
5. Core exercises: I don't know that you really need to do any direct Core training at all between lifting and sparring. Maybe as your training do one or two exercises for your anterior Core muscles, don't really need to do anything for the posterior Core muscles because the Deadlift crushes those muscles pretty well.
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Sam_I_Am77 wrote: »Think about your exercise a little differently.
1. Muscle Confusion: This is not a good thing, don't change exercises every week. For lower body if you want to deadlift then deadlift for several weeks, same thing for the bench press.
2. Maximal Strength - Compound movements: 1 to 5 sets 1 to 5 reps @ 85%+
3. Support / accessory movements: 3-5 sets to 8-12 reps 65% to 75% but only select like 2 to 4, you don't need to destroy your triceps. If you do some kind of press 3 days a week you don't need a lot of triceps work.
4. Power Exercises: Olympic Lifts, Plyometric Jumps, Ballistics via Medicine ball throws (1 to 2 exercises)
5. Core exercises: I don't know that you really need to do any direct Core training at all between lifting and sparring. Maybe as your training do one or two exercises for your anterior Core muscles, don't really need to do anything for the posterior Core muscles because the Deadlift crushes those muscles pretty well.
There's a couple of things here that are news to me... what kind of routine would you suggest?
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