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stevencloser wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »
Do you really want to argue that artificial sweeteners, according to the FDA the most thoroughly studied food additive to exist, are dangerous to you?@stevencloser where is your proof to back up your view on what is right or wrong? To say only you know what is true or not is narcissistic at best. Doctors have said they are not healthy for you, yet you're telling people in the community to only believe you. Perhaps their is conflicting information on this topic, and accordingly you cannot say with 100% certainty that you are correct. The users on here will have to choose who they want to believe.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1308408/why-aspartame-isnt-scary
Here's 29 pages of why they're fine. Have fun reading.
The FDA is federally regulated and usually lags behind in determining and defining what is healthy. Our FDA is pretty lax as compared to other first world countries and accordingly many of those countries choose not to consume some of our food. But this is tangential. I won't debate the FDA with you. There are people that believe eating non organic is ok and those that don't. FDA says there is nothing wrong with the pesticides. Some don't feel that's true. If you shop at WholeFoods and places like that, you typically stay away from diet drinks because you believe them to be not healthy.
It's not the FDA saying it's fine, it's over 3 decades worth of research, more than was put into any other food additive, solely because of fear mongering like yours.
Ok! Whatever you say. People will decide.
Can you show any evidence to back up your point of view?
Well the most sophisticated and scholarly articles cannot be found online. I'd advise anyone that is wondering what to believe to do their own research and ask some doctors and dietitians. However here are a few online and reputable sources. I have tried to get different sources (docs, respected news,and a fitness mogul).
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2015/03/17/bad-news-diet-soda-drinkers-your-favorite-beverage-may-lead-to-more-belly-fat-as-you-age/
http://www.jillianmichaels.com/fit/lose-weight/myth-diet-soda
http://drhyman.com/about-2/about-dr-mark-hyman/
I call troll.
Why do you call troll? What online Google search can you use to back you up? What source would satisfy you? Scholarly journals are not available from a Google search that I can copy and paste to you. I already stated to just ask doctors. On your next visit, ask. See what they tell you.
I call troll because of this....Well the most sophisticated and scholarly articles cannot be found online
You were doing quite well before that.
But anyway, I'll play along.
All the articles, citations and references needed to back my point up (not that I've actually made one) are in the thread previously linked to you in this thread.
I'm not sure what Google has to do with anything. Surely the research and evidence you have used to develop your entrenched views has come from reliable peer reviewed scientific papers that you have found on services such as PubMed, OMICS, highwire, JSTOR, or SAGE.
What would satisfy me is you showing any evidence to back up your claims. You know, like the evidence shown in the thread linked to you in this thread.
You seem to be banding about this 'ask doctors'. I'm a doctor, I work in paediatric oncology, my wife is a doctor, she works in emergency medicine, we both say you are wrong. The fact that you have just been told by two doctors that you are wrong doesn't mean anything though does it, for that you need to look at the evidence, and for that you need to look at the thread linked to you in this thread.
If you were a doctor that I went to and trusted it would mean something to me. However, since you are not, then no it does not have that same power over me. The reason I say for everyone to ask their doctor is because there are some doctors that say that diet sodas are not good for you. I think it's unnecessary to debate with people about what they believe and I think THE BEST way to satisfy yourself is to ask your doctor. Not read articles from people you do not know online.
I brought up Google because I was saying completing a Google search is the only way I could think of to get that information on here.
Doctor, as you know JSTOR is not widely available to the public. You need access. And as an attorney I know it is not wise to copy that info that is not available to everyone and post it on a public forum.
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I shop at WholeFoods sometimes. I drink diet sodas sometimes.
Me too! I was unaware this rule existed. I will speak with the manager of my local Whole Foods and ask if I am still allowed to shop there.
Dr. <ahem> Hyman and Jillian Michael are sales people who need to get you to buy-in to their spiel so you will buy their lifestyle products. And newspapers routinely publish overly dramatic stories that misinterpret random scientific studies in order to fuel an attention-getting headline. Not reputable sources.
Artificial sweeteners have been common-place for decades, and their are still no definitive studies showing any direct causation of health problems. At most it seems like some people are sensitive to particular artificial sweeteners.
OP, apple cider vinegar may have some health benefits, and it won't do any harm, so if you want to have some every day, go for it. Personally, I would use it to make salad dressing or marinade rather than drink it, but whatever. If you are asking about weight loss, it won't help that. Just log your food accurately and stay at your calorie goal for that.
I never said there is a rule that shopping at WholeFoods means you cannot drink diet soda. I said there are a lot of people that shop there that believe that diet soda is not healthy. It goes away from their way of life.
Being condescending and passive aggressive is not healthy discussion. It is rude.
What online sources would you find as reputable?
I was being sarcastic. That was in response to you stating as a fact that something is true, when you cannot prove that it's true (in fact no one has). And to be fair, many of your posts sounded pretty condescending, like he people who don't agree with you clearly haven't done their research.
Reputable sources would be peer reviewed scientific studies, which if they happened in at least the last 10 years, should be available online.
What you call sarcasm I would definitely say is passive aggressive and rude. I did not state there was a rule. I stated that there are people that shop at WholeFoods that won't drink diet soda. That is a fact. That's all I said.
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stevencloser wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »
Do you really want to argue that artificial sweeteners, according to the FDA the most thoroughly studied food additive to exist, are dangerous to you?@stevencloser where is your proof to back up your view on what is right or wrong? To say only you know what is true or not is narcissistic at best. Doctors have said they are not healthy for you, yet you're telling people in the community to only believe you. Perhaps their is conflicting information on this topic, and accordingly you cannot say with 100% certainty that you are correct. The users on here will have to choose who they want to believe.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1308408/why-aspartame-isnt-scary
Here's 29 pages of why they're fine. Have fun reading.
The FDA is federally regulated and usually lags behind in determining and defining what is healthy. Our FDA is pretty lax as compared to other first world countries and accordingly many of those countries choose not to consume some of our food. But this is tangential. I won't debate the FDA with you. There are people that believe eating non organic is ok and those that don't. FDA says there is nothing wrong with the pesticides. Some don't feel that's true. If you shop at WholeFoods and places like that, you typically stay away from diet drinks because you believe them to be not healthy.
It's not the FDA saying it's fine, it's over 3 decades worth of research, more than was put into any other food additive, solely because of fear mongering like yours.
Ok! Whatever you say. People will decide.
Can you show any evidence to back up your point of view?
Well the most sophisticated and scholarly articles cannot be found online. I'd advise anyone that is wondering what to believe to do their own research and ask some doctors and dietitians. However here are a few online and reputable sources. I have tried to get different sources (docs, respected news,and a fitness mogul).
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2015/03/17/bad-news-diet-soda-drinkers-your-favorite-beverage-may-lead-to-more-belly-fat-as-you-age/
http://www.jillianmichaels.com/fit/lose-weight/myth-diet-soda
http://drhyman.com/about-2/about-dr-mark-hyman/
I call troll.
Why do you call troll? What online Google search can you use to back you up? What source would satisfy you? Scholarly journals are not available from a Google search that I can copy and paste to you. I already stated to just ask doctors. On your next visit, ask. See what they tell you.
I call troll because of this....Well the most sophisticated and scholarly articles cannot be found online
You were doing quite well before that.
But anyway, I'll play along.
All the articles, citations and references needed to back my point up (not that I've actually made one) are in the thread previously linked to you in this thread.
I'm not sure what Google has to do with anything. Surely the research and evidence you have used to develop your entrenched views has come from reliable peer reviewed scientific papers that you have found on services such as PubMed, OMICS, highwire, JSTOR, or SAGE.
What would satisfy me is you showing any evidence to back up your claims. You know, like the evidence shown in the thread linked to you in this thread.
You seem to be banding about this 'ask doctors'. I'm a doctor, I work in paediatric oncology, my wife is a doctor, she works in emergency medicine, we both say you are wrong. The fact that you have just been told by two doctors that you are wrong doesn't mean anything though does it, for that you need to look at the evidence, and for that you need to look at the thread linked to you in this thread.
If you were a doctor that I went to and trusted it would mean something to me. However, since you are not, then no it does not have that same power over me. The reason I say for everyone to ask their doctor is because there are some doctors that say that diet sodas are not good for you. I think it's unnecessary to debate with people about what they believe and I think THE BEST way to satisfy yourself is to ask your doctor. Not read articles from people you do not know online.
I brought up Google because I was saying completing a Google search is the only way I could think of to get that information on here.
Doctor, as you know JSTOR is not widely available to the public. You need access. And as an attorney I know it is not wise to copy that info that is not available to everyone and post it on a public forum.
Sigh.
Can you show any evidence to prove your claims?0 -
Oh my gosh guys for real. Stop jumping on each other at the little things someone says. This is annoying, who cares what other people think? Don't jump them just because you think something different than they do0
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Oh my gosh guys for real. Stop jumping on each other at the little things someone says. This is annoying, who cares what other people think? Don't jump them just because you think something different than they do
Eh?
Surely a bit of friendly debate is what internet forums are made for?
Isn't this how we learn, from discussing opposing views and developing our own ideas?
Do we just let blatant mistruths and errors go unchallenged, for others to believe. That is how war crimes start.0 -
I shop at WholeFoods sometimes. I drink diet sodas sometimes.
Me too! I was unaware this rule existed. I will speak with the manager of my local Whole Foods and ask if I am still allowed to shop there.
Dr. <ahem> Hyman and Jillian Michael are sales people who need to get you to buy-in to their spiel so you will buy their lifestyle products. And newspapers routinely publish overly dramatic stories that misinterpret random scientific studies in order to fuel an attention-getting headline. Not reputable sources.
Artificial sweeteners have been common-place for decades, and their are still no definitive studies showing any direct causation of health problems. At most it seems like some people are sensitive to particular artificial sweeteners.
OP, apple cider vinegar may have some health benefits, and it won't do any harm, so if you want to have some every day, go for it. Personally, I would use it to make salad dressing or marinade rather than drink it, but whatever. If you are asking about weight loss, it won't help that. Just log your food accurately and stay at your calorie goal for that.
I never said there is a rule that shopping at WholeFoods means you cannot drink diet soda. I said there are a lot of people that shop there that believe that diet soda is not healthy. It goes away from their way of life.
Being condescending and passive aggressive is not healthy discussion. It is rude.
What online sources would you find as reputable?
I was being sarcastic. That was in response to you stating as a fact that something is true, when you cannot prove that it's true (in fact no one has). And to be fair, many of your posts sounded pretty condescending, like he people who don't agree with you clearly haven't done their research.
Reputable sources would be peer reviewed scientific studies, which if they happened in at least the last 10 years, should be available online.
What you call sarcasm I would definitely say is passive aggressive and rude. I did not state there was a rule. I stated that there are people that shop at WholeFoods that won't drink diet soda. That is a fact. That's all I said.
Umm, okay yes, that is true I guess. But what you actually said was, " If you shop at WholeFoods and places like that, you typically stay away from diet drinks because you believe them to be not healthy." I'd disagree with the "typically" in your statement. Which is why I responded.
I'm sorry you felt my response to your condescension was condescending. I'm going to go have a Diet Coke and some popcorn now. Have a great day!0 -
Okay can some of you guys just cut it out? I had an honest question and you're making it a big fight over nothing, who cares who's right or not? Just believe what you believe and move on with your life.
this isn't religion...it's not about beliefs and feelz...there's this thing called science and whatnot to contend with.0 -
Oh my gosh guys for real. Stop jumping on each other at the little things someone says. This is annoying, who cares what other people think? Don't jump them just because you think something different than they do
I'm sorry your post got derailed and I hope you got some useful information from the posts that did apply to your question.
But alot of folks struggling to lose weight are helped enormously by diet drinks, and someone stating as fact that they are "unhealthy" when there is no proof they are unhealthy is unfair to the many people who will read this thread and never post but take that opinion as fact. Diet drinks helped me cut a couple hundred calories a day out of my diet, which is a big deal! Best of luck to you...0 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Okay can some of you guys just cut it out? I had an honest question and you're making it a big fight over nothing, who cares who's right or not? Just believe what you believe and move on with your life.
this isn't religion...it's not about beliefs and feelz...there's this thing called science and whatnot to contend with.
I know but it's just annoying because it's blowing up my phone just because people have different things that they think are right
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cwolfman13 wrote: »Okay can some of you guys just cut it out? I had an honest question and you're making it a big fight over nothing, who cares who's right or not? Just believe what you believe and move on with your life.
this isn't religion...it's not about beliefs and feelz...there's this thing called science and whatnot to contend with.
I know but it's just annoying because it's blowing up my phone just because people have different things that they think are right
Wow. Perhaps an easier solution would be to turn off notifications?0 -
People, there was study published in the last year or so about how artificial sweeteners affect gut bacteria. Long story short, use of artificial sweeteners leads to glucose intolerance, which can lead to weight gain. The initial study was done on mice, but the effect was found in humans, too, even with just a couple cans of diet soda a week. It was all over the news so I am surprised it hasn't been mentioned yet.
Just a couple of articles about it:
http://www.sciencefriday.com/segment/09/19/2014/artificial-sweeteners-might-sour-your-microbiome.html
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/20130710/could-artificial-sweeteners-cause-weight-
Listen to the Science Friday link if you want the most complete explanation.
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For the OP: I like plain water, water with a little lemon juice, or unsweetened iced tea with lemon. I make up big pitchers of iced tea so I have it on hand.0
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I don't know what happened to the rest of my post! But yes, doctors have told me that diet drinks are worse for you than the regular version. Especially the dark sodas so I would agree to stay away.
I know a lot of people that drink warm water with lemon and a couple spoons of apple cider vinegar every morning. I've read it's great for your digestive system. I'd drink it this way so you don't have to change the taste of your other drinks.
This is misinformation. Diet drinks are no better or worse than the other, the only difference being regular has calories and diet has none.
Everything in moderation.
ETA: this comes from a girl who can't stand sugar soda or diet sodas, except for Zevia and the occasional diet 7 UP and Diet Dr. Pepper.
I don't believe it's not true. I chose to go along with what my doctors have told me. I've also seen research on it. Your body knows how to break down the sugar in regular soda but a lot of the diet soda sugars give it trouble. However, in addition to that the dark dyes and coloring are bad for you. I'm not claiming diet sodas will kill you but it seems best to stay away. I know moderation is better than all the time but if you're trying to be healthy diet sodas are not it.
Indeed, you are entitled to believe what you choose. However, what you are being told is incorrect information. Everything has chemicals. Your body knows how to break down whatever we choose to eat and drink.
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queenliz99 wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »
Do you really want to argue that artificial sweeteners, according to the FDA the most thoroughly studied food additive to exist, are dangerous to you?@stevencloser where is your proof to back up your view on what is right or wrong? To say only you know what is true or not is narcissistic at best. Doctors have said they are not healthy for you, yet you're telling people in the community to only believe you. Perhaps their is conflicting information on this topic, and accordingly you cannot say with 100% certainty that you are correct. The users on here will have to choose who they want to believe.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1308408/why-aspartame-isnt-scary
Here's 29 pages of why they're fine. Have fun reading.
The FDA is federally regulated and usually lags behind in determining and defining what is healthy. Our FDA is pretty lax as compared to other first world countries and accordingly many of those countries choose not to consume some of our food. But this is tangential. I won't debate the FDA with you. There are people that believe eating non organic is ok and those that don't. FDA says there is nothing wrong with the pesticides. Some don't feel that's true. If you shop at WholeFoods and places like that, you typically stay away from diet drinks because you believe them to be not healthy.
It's not the FDA saying it's fine, it's over 3 decades worth of research, more than was put into any other food additive, solely because of fear mongering like yours.
Ok! Whatever you say. People will decide.
Can you show any evidence to back up your point of view?
Well the most sophisticated and scholarly articles cannot be found online. I'd advise anyone that is wondering what to believe to do their own research and ask some doctors and dietitians. However here are a few online and reputable sources. I have tried to get different sources (docs, respected news,and a fitness mogul).
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/to-your-health/wp/2015/03/17/bad-news-diet-soda-drinkers-your-favorite-beverage-may-lead-to-more-belly-fat-as-you-age/
http://www.jillianmichaels.com/fit/lose-weight/myth-diet-soda
http://drhyman.com/about-2/about-dr-mark-hyman/
Seriously, this is what you came up with. Nope. You are going to have to do better then that.
Dang, I concur!
Jillian Michaels? Right.0 -
must_deflate wrote: »People, there was study published in the last year or so about how artificial sweeteners affect gut bacteria. Long story short, use of artificial sweeteners leads to glucose intolerance, which can lead to weight gain. The initial study was done on mice, but the effect was found in humans, too, even with just a couple cans of diet soda a week. It was all over the news so I am surprised it hasn't been mentioned yet.
Just a couple of articles about it:
http://www.sciencefriday.com/segment/09/19/2014/artificial-sweeteners-might-sour-your-microbiome.html
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/20130710/could-artificial-sweeteners-cause-weight-
Listen to the Science Friday link if you want the most complete explanation.
I have been drinking diet soda for at least 30 years and I have not developed this or any other bogeyman attributed to diet soda. That's just me but I feel certain that if a significant portion of the people who drink diet soda were developing severe medical issues, we would hear about it. The Science Friday link says "might." Further that study was done on mice, we would have to ingest extremely high levels of aspartame to ingest a relative amount to what the mice received.0 -
There is no scientific evidence to show that ACV has any health benefits. It also is not unhealthy so do whatever you want. Personally, I prefer my ACV in hot bacon dressing for spinach salads.
I get most of my water by fizzing up chilled, filtered (PUR filter dispenser I keep in the fridge) tap water with my SodaStream. I either drink it plain or flavor it with a little fruit extract (I prefer lime, cranberry, or black currant). Occasionally I will use their syrups to make a diet root beer or a diet caffeine free cola. When I am hiking, I take still water in a water bottle. Once in a great while, I will use something like flavor drops or Crystal Light, or I will make a lemonade with lemon juice and Splenda.0 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Okay can some of you guys just cut it out? I had an honest question and you're making it a big fight over nothing, who cares who's right or not? Just believe what you believe and move on with your life.
this isn't religion...it's not about beliefs and feelz...there's this thing called science and whatnot to contend with.
I know but it's just annoying because it's blowing up my phone just because people have different things that they think are right
Ignore the rude ones, and don't feed into it.
I like to make iced green tea with lemon and mint leafs.
Wow that drink sounds amazing!0 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Okay can some of you guys just cut it out? I had an honest question and you're making it a big fight over nothing, who cares who's right or not? Just believe what you believe and move on with your life.
this isn't religion...it's not about beliefs and feelz...there's this thing called science and whatnot to contend with.
I know but it's just annoying because it's blowing up my phone just because people have different things that they think are right
Ignore the rude ones, and don't feed into it.
I like to make iced green tea with lemon and mint leafs.
Iced green tea with lemon and mint leaves is a wonderful drink. There is nothing wrong with it, or any other beverage that someone likes either.
Rude is in the perception, by the way.
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