Weight Watchers (my theory).
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MondayJune22nd2015
Posts: 876 Member
I've never been a member of WW but I've read many threads concerning it because I was considering joining, not for the points but for the meetings. It's not that I need someone to hold my hand & reward me, it's that I have no social life because of my disability & figure that a group of local's, whom have the same interests/goals as me; would be a great avenue to acquire "associates", instead of "friends" because friends require so much more attention weekly, than someone that I'll only interact with; once a week & the associate relationship is built upon one specific subject/hobby (this has become a hobby for me, sort of like with the people; that go to car shows but don't have anything to do with each other, beyond that one hobby/interest).
Here's what I figure, concerning what I've read:
1 When WW members came to MFP & calculated what they consumed via their points, into calories here; they where under 1200 (for women) & exercise put them under, even further; hence why so many complain about feeling starving. I assume WW did/does this because if you under eat, you're more than likely to binge & thus not meet your weekly weight goal. If they keep you overweight, they keep you needy & thus they keep you paying.
2 I believe that the introduction of "free fruits", was meant to corral those; that didn't binge and/or binge enough, to put them over; their weekly goal weight. Fitness/nutrition isn't common sense & this possibly convinced some, to think that they can eat a ridiculous amount of fruits & still lose weight, only for that not to be so; when they get on the scale.
3 They don't factor in weight fluctuations via water retention, etc., so that they; charge you for that (If your a lifetime member & don't stay within 2 pounds, of your goal weight; when maintaining). I think this tactic just makes a person, feel defeated & then subsequently gain weight because of it, then attempt again to lose weight; via WW. This seems to me, to be an abusive relationship, that induces Stockholm Syndrome (WW helps one lose some weight because one did actually lose weight, WW will blame you (penalize you) & so those members'll also then, blame themselves; when their weight naturally fluctuates, they can't stick to under eating and/or overeat "free fruits" & can't attain/maintain their goal weight). myfitnesspal.com/blog/annekenlon/view/i-m-breaking-up-with-you-weight-watchers-but-can-we-still-be-friends-757840
4 Their meetings are more like "Tupperware parties" because they have their products on display, for sale & peddle them to you, during their meetings.
5 Another issue concerns cancelling the membership, I've read complaints from former members; about their inability to cancel their membership & still having automatic payments occur, after their cancellation. So I'd recommend (if possible) only using a gift card and/or a debit card, that you only put enough funds on; to cover known withdrawals & don't allow overdrafts, for that card (if applicable).
Any business that's charging you, isn't there for your benefit; just their own! Basically they want you to lose some weight but they don't want you, to maintain; that loss because then they'd go out of business, since their best customers; appear to be repeat customers. It's your responsibility to make the program benefit you, more than them. It's sort of like with grocery shopping, you can pay full price & get less for your money or you can acquire a member card (if applicable), go through their circular/competitors circulars, buy only on sale items/price match, clip corresponding coupons for those on sale items & stock up, so that you won't run out & then have to pay regular price & also without a coupon.
To me the price of the meetings only, seems reasonable because they have a brick & mortar store, to fund. However it's still above my current budget, so I'll ponder joining; within a few months. If I did join, I wouldn't use their points; I'd use CICO here (which would also ensure, that I achieve my expected weight loss there; as well) & if I did buy a consumable item, that they offer; I'd consider it a "treat" (as I do with Atkins/Slim Fast products).
Here's what I figure, concerning what I've read:
1 When WW members came to MFP & calculated what they consumed via their points, into calories here; they where under 1200 (for women) & exercise put them under, even further; hence why so many complain about feeling starving. I assume WW did/does this because if you under eat, you're more than likely to binge & thus not meet your weekly weight goal. If they keep you overweight, they keep you needy & thus they keep you paying.
2 I believe that the introduction of "free fruits", was meant to corral those; that didn't binge and/or binge enough, to put them over; their weekly goal weight. Fitness/nutrition isn't common sense & this possibly convinced some, to think that they can eat a ridiculous amount of fruits & still lose weight, only for that not to be so; when they get on the scale.
3 They don't factor in weight fluctuations via water retention, etc., so that they; charge you for that (If your a lifetime member & don't stay within 2 pounds, of your goal weight; when maintaining). I think this tactic just makes a person, feel defeated & then subsequently gain weight because of it, then attempt again to lose weight; via WW. This seems to me, to be an abusive relationship, that induces Stockholm Syndrome (WW helps one lose some weight because one did actually lose weight, WW will blame you (penalize you) & so those members'll also then, blame themselves; when their weight naturally fluctuates, they can't stick to under eating and/or overeat "free fruits" & can't attain/maintain their goal weight). myfitnesspal.com/blog/annekenlon/view/i-m-breaking-up-with-you-weight-watchers-but-can-we-still-be-friends-757840
4 Their meetings are more like "Tupperware parties" because they have their products on display, for sale & peddle them to you, during their meetings.
5 Another issue concerns cancelling the membership, I've read complaints from former members; about their inability to cancel their membership & still having automatic payments occur, after their cancellation. So I'd recommend (if possible) only using a gift card and/or a debit card, that you only put enough funds on; to cover known withdrawals & don't allow overdrafts, for that card (if applicable).
Any business that's charging you, isn't there for your benefit; just their own! Basically they want you to lose some weight but they don't want you, to maintain; that loss because then they'd go out of business, since their best customers; appear to be repeat customers. It's your responsibility to make the program benefit you, more than them. It's sort of like with grocery shopping, you can pay full price & get less for your money or you can acquire a member card (if applicable), go through their circular/competitors circulars, buy only on sale items/price match, clip corresponding coupons for those on sale items & stock up, so that you won't run out & then have to pay regular price & also without a coupon.
To me the price of the meetings only, seems reasonable because they have a brick & mortar store, to fund. However it's still above my current budget, so I'll ponder joining; within a few months. If I did join, I wouldn't use their points; I'd use CICO here (which would also ensure, that I achieve my expected weight loss there; as well) & if I did buy a consumable item, that they offer; I'd consider it a "treat" (as I do with Atkins/Slim Fast products).
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Replies
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There are other groups for weight loss that are not a business model. I'm in Canada so I'm not sure about other places but we have a group called tops (taking off pounds sensibly) they meet one a week weigh in and encourage each other. A friend joined it and they helped her to meet her goals.0
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There are other groups for weight loss that are not a business model. I'm in Canada so I'm not sure about other places but we have a group called tops (taking off pounds sensibly) they meet one a week weigh in and encourage each other. A friend joined it and they helped her to meet her goals.
I am in the United States but I'll look into, if something similar; exists here. Thank you!
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See if there is an Overeaters Anonymous near you.
I was a member of Weight Watchers a few times. The first time I lost forty pounds and was very close to goal. If I could go back in time I would tell that younger self to be bold and insist on switching to maintenance.
I think the organization is committed to success for its members.
The meetings are motivational and supportive.0 -
I don't feel this way at all about the program other than the cost. The old days, meeting and online tools were included but now there are different plans. I lost 30 pounds and 5o pounds on the program (1-2 pounds a week). I didn't feel hungry, in fact I liked the forgiveness of eating my sinful indulgences and exercising/planning for them. I liked the people and advice that was given. Basically you have points and some free foods, but there is a strong correlation to exercise and how much you can eat. (Exercise = more points). The employees are all success stories of WW so if there is a problem then you can talk to somebody that understands.
Why am I fat now and not going back? Fat, was my fault and neglect of my physical health due to family crisis and drastic changes. I let anxiety and depression leave me not caring or having energy. (Plus is is easy to eat like crap and not exercise) I didn't want to admit to my family that I was having issues with self and health. WW was a counselor, confessional, and supportive.
Why I am not going back is that they still allowed a lot of processed foods and I am an addict and I tempted to stick to old habits. I also feel I need to walk the walk and do the things I was taught (log food and find something to do that makes me feel great). So I stopped the membership and am focusing on doing this differently, though if I had more self control I would consider rejoining.
I don't think WW is conspiring to keep us fat. There is enough profit from product, membership fees, and people out there that are looking for help. It does work and I am glad that it isn't medication and a fast fix. But, we all have to find our path and what works. So different strokes for different folks.0 -
See if there is an Overeaters Anonymous near you.
I was a member of Weight Watchers a few times. The first time I lost forty pounds and was very close to goal. If I could go back in time I would tell that younger self to be bold and insist on switching to maintenance.
I think the organization is committed to success for its members.
The meetings are motivational and supportive.
I'll look into that, as well. Thank you! 0 -
hayashiclan wrote: »I don't feel this way at all about the program other than the cost. The old days, meeting and online tools were included but now there are different plans. I lost 30 pounds and 5o pounds on the program (1-2 pounds a week). I didn't feel hungry, in fact I liked the forgiveness of eating my sinful indulgences and exercising/planning for them. I liked the people and advice that was given. Basically you have points and some free foods, but there is a strong correlation to exercise and how much you can eat. (Exercise = more points). The employees are all success stories of WW so if there is a problem then you can talk to somebody that understands.
Why am I fat now and not going back? Fat, was my fault and neglect of my physical health due to family crisis and drastic changes. I let anxiety and depression leave me not caring or having energy. (Plus is is easy to eat like crap and not exercise) I didn't want to admit to my family that I was having issues with self and health. WW was a counselor, confessional, and supportive.
Why I am not going back is that they still allowed a lot of processed foods and I am an addict and I tempted to stick to old habits. I also feel I need to walk the walk and do the things I was taught (log food and find something to do that makes me feel great). So I stopped the membership and am focusing on doing this differently, though if I had more self control I would consider rejoining.
I don't think WW is conspiring to keep us fat. There is enough profit from product, membership fees, and people out there that are looking for help. It does work and I am glad that it isn't medication and a fast fix. But, we all have to find our path and what works. So different strokes for different folks.
I forgot to mention, in my OP; that they also don't help you to wean off of them either. For me someone and/or a business that has a noble interest in my success, should be encouraging me by implying that; it'll be great when I don't need them anymore. I believe that the point system, keeps one dependent on the program because they don't teach anyone about CICO, without the use of the program & that's why it seems, that once someone ceases using them; they gain the weight back & thus have to return to WW, to start the process; all over again.0 -
I don't mean to be rude but if you have never been a member, how would you know all of this? My personal experience is WW is great and it does work. I lost 65 lbs, still have 20 to go. I still pay and attend meetings but need a break from points so I am trying this. The meetings are great. Tons of support and I've met people I talk to outside of the meetings. Please try it before you make such assumptions. Typically people only complain in posts so you tend to find more negative than positive.0
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I don't mean to be rude but if you have never been a member, how would you know all of this? My personal experience is WW is great and it does work. I lost 65 lbs, still have 20 to go. I still pay and attend meetings but need a break from points so I am trying this. The meetings are great. Tons of support and I've met people I talk to outside of the meetings. Please try it before you make such assumptions. Typically people only complain in posts so you tend to find more negative than positive.
I never made the claim, that I know anything. I used the words "I assume", "I believe", "I think", It seems", etc., those are opinions; based upon other's knowledge. It doesn't matter what the ratio of complaints, to compliments are; what matters is their experience & how I use that information, to decide whether or not; to join. It's not like it's 100% free, so current/former members are helping me to evaluate the pros/cons; through them & thus possibly saving me money, time, weight gain, frustration & disappointment.0 -
Just wanted to add that going to Weight Watchers previously helped me because it made me aware of a large group of people that were also eating in a healthy manner like I was.
I was having hard time losing weight because I felt so deprived of what I wanted to eat. My husband was tall and very thin and could eat anything. Then the TV commercials were telling me I "could have it my way". I did want to lose weight but did not want to eat less and miss out on what others were able to eat.
Now I am at a different stage in my life. It does not matter as much if I have to eat less. I am more comfortable eating less calories and MFP works well for me. I am losing slowly, though.
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Quite the expert considering you've never been a member. Not one of the things you listed is even close to my experience with WW. I joined ww again (quit without a single issue when I was working full time and going to law school at night - didn't have time to focus on my eating) because with MFP I wasn't spending my calories wisely, I was eating junk, hungry 100% of the time and absolutely miserable. WW really focuses on healthy eating, whole foods, nutritious choices. I love the meetings, my leader is so inspiring and I've never once been scolded or shamed for a weight fluctuation or even a big gain after a bad week. They know those things happen and life isn't all about the scale. Anyway to each their own, what works for me may not be right for you and vice versa and that's okay. No need to shame anyone for having a different path than you.0
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Weight watchers helped me to know what is healthy and best diet for me... MFP help me in calorie count, correct exercise and a lot of weight loss tips...0
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Ready2Rock206 wrote: »Quite the expert considering you've never been a member. Not one of the things you listed is even close to my experience with WW. I joined ww again (quit without a single issue when I was working full time and going to law school at night - didn't have time to focus on my eating) because with MFP I wasn't spending my calories wisely, I was eating junk, hungry 100% of the time and absolutely miserable. WW really focuses on healthy eating, whole foods, nutritious choices. I love the meetings, my leader is so inspiring and I've never once been scolded or shamed for a weight fluctuation or even a big gain after a bad week. They know those things happen and life isn't all about the scale. Anyway to each their own, what works for me may not be right for you and vice versa and that's okay. No need to shame anyone for having a different path than you.
Theory & expert aren't synonyms, I made no implication of having expertise (theory's antonym); concerning WW & how's my opinion, which is a reflection of other's whom're or were members, shaming them? Especially since I said that I might join myself, I'd be shaming myself then.0 -
I like it. I used to go to meetings but switched to online only. The things I like are that I have most of the points of foods I eat frequently, and keeping track of 40 points is a hell of a lot easier than 1800 calories if I can't get onto my WW app right away (I get a lot of points/calories because I'm nursing). Also, I like it that there are weekly points you can use however you want, so if you overindulge one day, you can just use those points and eat less on other days and it all balances out for the week. Technically, I could do the same thing with calories, but MFP is not set up to do that and I wouldn't know where to begin to do it on my own. Weight Watchers is just simpler to me. I did better when I went to the meetings though.0
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There are many different programs out there that can help you to lose weight. Someone here on MFP could say this is the best way because it works for them and it's free. But someone else may find counting calories and weighing everything they eat too demanding. Others may need the local meetings and a support system that Weight Watchers offers to help keep them on track and motivated. The best diet plan for you is the one that you can stick to for the long haul.0
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Can't speak to the WW issue since I've never been a member but as for the first thing you mentioned about wanting to meet people with common interests: try meetup.com! Depending on where you live, they have groups for all sorts of things including exercise/weight loss groups. I joined a few groups on that site when I first moved to a new town and it's very good for what you're describing - a casual way to get out and meet some people without pressure or long-term commitment.0
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See if there is an Overeaters Anonymous near you.
I was a member of Weight Watchers a few times. The first time I lost forty pounds and was very close to goal. If I could go back in time I would tell that younger self to be bold and insist on switching to maintenance.
I think the organization is committed to success for its members.
The meetings are motivational and supportive.
I've been a WW member for about 4.5 years; lost almost 3 stone & got to goal 4 years ago. Continued to attend meetings as a Gold member for a further 2 years until the leader (who was amazing) retired. I still track online & have remained @ or below goal since then. Once in a while I wander in to a meeting just to see what is new.
The meetings were great, inspirational, & there are different ways to do the program depending on your preference (regular points, filling & healthy, gluten free, etc). Fruit & veg aren't "free" as you mentioned; most are zero points within moderation. You don't have license to gorge on anything.
You have to pay...it's a business, & makes no apology for it. So are gyms, vitamin & supplement companies, Under Armour, etc. WW isn't everyone's cup of tea, & to maintain after reaching goal you have to be disciplined, same as MFP calorie counting. But it helped me, loads of folks I know. Different strokes & all that.
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I agree to a point, which is part of why i only lasted 2 months on WW and why i cringed when my mom offered to pay for a membership so i could go with her.
I was STARVING all the time, partially because i wasn't using my weekly points but also because i was under-eating without realizing i was under-eating until i put my food in MFP.
I agree with the "free fruits", fruits have calories! However, i think it is more to encourage members to eat fruit and veggies vs other junk.
I agree with the weight fluctuations. I could always tell by the persons face, who was weighing me in, if i had gained or lost. There were weeks where i'd lose 3,4,5lbs and the next i'd gain 2, and instead of saying "that's normal especially with the loss last week" i'd get get a disappointed look. This on top of making lifetime members pay if they're over 2lbs is RIDICULOUS!
Completely agree with the "tupperware party" theory. The only fitness tracker that synchs with the app is THEIRS so you have to pay for the tracker on top of the monthly fee...really?!? On top of which, all the snacks they have is PROCESSED CRAP, why not offer members fresh fruit after weigh in versus enticing them to buy PROCESSED CRAP?!?
I didn't have an issue with the cancellation, the only thing i had an issue with was figuring out how to do it. The only way to do it is online, and it's a pain in the *kitten*!0 -
Eh, that wasn't my experience with WW. I don't think it's any better or worse than MFP.0
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my mom lost a ton of weight with WW years ago and she has had no issues keeping it off. I don't really think it matters if you're counting points or calories..if you're counting points, there's still an assigned value to certain things that is more or less going to correspond to calories...higher points, higher calories.
the whole "free" fruit and veg is not without limit, but the idea is to get people eating more of that stuff because it's nutritionally rich and calorie sparse and anyone who eats anything remotely resembling the SAD is not getting enough fruits and vegetables. This gets people to do that.
i'm sure the meetings and whatnot aren't for everyone, but my mom seemed to enjoy them as we had just moved from a state where she had loads of friends to a state where she didn't know a single person...the meetings allowed her to socialize and meet people with common interests and goals.
as far as keeping the weight off goes, it really doesn't matter if you're doing WW or counting calories or doing low carb or this diet or that diet...the fact is that only about 5% keep their weight off long term...it has nothing to do with the diet or eating plan and everything to do with the fact that people tend to go back to old patterns and habits of eating and many, if not most so closely associate exercise with weight loss rather than fitness that they stop exercising once they've lost the weight...and while you don't need exercise for weight management, it certainly makes things easier.
like i said, my mom did very well with that plan and has kept the weight off for a couple of decades...it introduced her to proper nutrition and portions as well as fitness. she has been a regular in the gym for over 20 years now and dances a lot...she's even done a couple triathlons. she did what many fail to do...she didn't just talk about changing her dietary lifestyle, she actually adopted a new life and kept on with it.
i think different things are going to work and click for different people...but ultimately it comes down to adopting a new "normal" and avoiding falling back into old, well ingrained habits. in my experience, my newer and more healthful habits took a bit of work early on...but over time they have become more second nature and I hardly think about that old me much anymore.
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I didn't learn anything of value from WW when I did it; certainly nothing about nutrition. But yes, every time I walked into a meeting, every product was on display.
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