Starting a loose vegan diet, having trouble with nutrition
Replies
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johnnylakis wrote: »Big_Jim_86 wrote: »but beans and nuts are all full of the nutrients you are trying to add, if they aren't already a part of your diet.
And packed with fat
1) There's hardly any fat in beans.
2) If the OP isn't eating dairy or meat, it's quite possible she's not getting that much fat anyway--those are major sources of fat in a lot of people's diets.
3) What's wrong with fat? Your body needs fat for a host of functions, including being able to use fat-soluble vitamins.
On the debate over using the word vegan, I am not vegan, but I think one practical reason it's bad to misuse it is that it makes it harder for actual vegans to get food that fits their dietary requirements. If they go into a restaurant and ask about some dish that sounds plant-based, it's a lot easier to say "is it vegan?" than "does it contain any animal products? Any meat? Any poultry? Any seafood? Any dairy products? No cheese? No eggs? No honey?" which is what they have to do if other people confuse the issue by appropriating it to describer other ways of eating.
It seems similar to people who claim they can't eat something "because they're allergic," when they're not, and then when other people see them accidentally or intentionally consume something with the supposed allergen in it, and have no reaction, they think, "oh, this allergy stuff isn't that big a deal," and then next thing you know they're sending someone into anaphylactic shock because they don't believe allergies are serious so they give them something they shouldn't.
Edited because I ended up with a whole bunch of repeated quotes for some reason.0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.0 -
Reduce bread, rice, pasta, and fruits in order to fit in more protein: lentils, black beans, broccoli, yellow squash, chic peas, hemp seeds, chia seeds, pinto beans, tofu.cpalumbo89 wrote: »I'm eating loosely as a vegan, but with eggs and occasionally seafood, as an experiment. I feel good, but keep coming up short on calcium, iron and protein. Any suggestions? My calorie limit is 1560 but I usually hang out between 1250-1400
Here are good bean recipes:
http://www.thegardengrazer.com/2014/12/50-awesome-vegan-black-bean-recipes.html
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I'm sorry but you are not Vegan and nor are you Vegetarian. People who claim they are either Vegan or Veggie then eat flesh cause confusion in restaurants & problems for people who actually are vegan or Veggie. I've been caught out more than once by food marked on the menu as suitable, but when it arrived at the table it had fish/shellfish in it. Please stop.
A good multivitamin tablet daily should sort out your iron worries. Tho eating plenty of leafy greens would be better. Calcium is in dairy, or supplements are easily available. Protein is in nuts, beans, Quorn products and eggs.0 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »johnnylakis wrote: »Big_Jim_86 wrote: »but beans and nuts are all full of the nutrients you are trying to add, if they aren't already a part of your diet.
And packed with fat
1) There's hardly any fat in beans.
2) If the OP isn't eating dairy or meat, it's quite possible she's not getting that much fat anyway--those are major sources of fat in a lot of people's diets.
3) What's wrong with fat? Your body needs fat for a host of functions, including being able to use fat-soluble vitamins.
On the debate over using the word vegan, I am not vegan, but I think one practical reason it's bad to misuse it is that it makes it harder for actual vegans to get food that fits their dietary requirements. If they go into a restaurant and ask about some dish that sounds plant-based, it's a lot easier to say "is it vegan?" than "does it contain any animal products? Any meat? Any poultry? Any seafood? Any dairy products? No cheese? No eggs? No honey?" which is what they have to do if other people confuse the issue by appropriating it to describer other ways of eating.
It seems similar to people who claim they can't eat something "because they're allergic," when they're not, and then when other people see them accidentally or intentionally consume something with the supposed allergen in it, and have no reaction, they think, "oh, this allergy stuff isn't that big a deal," and then next thing you know they're sending someone into anaphylactic shock because they don't believe allergies are serious so they give them something they shouldn't.
Edited because I ended up with a whole bunch of repeated quotes for some reason.
I purchased a frozen meal the other day because it said "vegan" on it (I was in a rush, usually I read labels closely) and when I brought it back to my hotel room, I read the ingredients and saw it had honey. So yes, this is a real problem for vegans. Obviously it doesn't have the serious health consequences that exist for someone with an allergy, but it does make it just that much harder.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)
How is it "incorrect" to maintain that vegans will avoid unnecessary animal exploitation and that one who chooses to exploit animals unecessarily isn't vegan?0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
I'm not clear how an ethical vegan would choose to consume animal products unnecessarily 10% of the time, but I'm hoping you will share more context of your situation with me. I'm not ceding "ownership" of the term vegan to Freelee, as I disagree with her position and I think she is actively doing harm to veganism.
I appreciate that you are not using "vegan" to describe yourself if you are choosing to use animals. I don't want to make things difficult for people who are newer to the concept of veganism. Help me understand where you're coming from.
My position right now: someone who is choosing to exploit animals unnecessarily 5% of the time is probably doing much better than the "standard Westerner" and I appreciate that. But it isn't veganism and I think it's okay to say that.
I'm certainly open to sharing more of my experience with you, my inbox is open.
She did not make any claims of veganism. She was merely trying to describe her diet, and I think she did a fine job. We all knew what she meant. What is the point of telling her she can't use the word vegan other than to say, in as many words, "you can't sit here"?0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
I'm not clear how an ethical vegan would choose to consume animal products unnecessarily 10% of the time, but I'm hoping you will share more context of your situation with me. I'm not ceding "ownership" of the term vegan to Freelee, as I disagree with her position and I think she is actively doing harm to veganism.
I appreciate that you are not using "vegan" to describe yourself if you are choosing to use animals. I don't want to make things difficult for people who are newer to the concept of veganism. Help me understand where you're coming from.
My position right now: someone who is choosing to exploit animals unnecessarily 5% of the time is probably doing much better than the "standard Westerner" and I appreciate that. But it isn't veganism and I think it's okay to say that.
I'm certainly open to sharing more of my experience with you, my inbox is open.
She did not make any claims of veganism. She was merely trying to describe her diet, and I think she did a fine job. We all knew what she meant. What is the point of telling her she can't use the word vegan other than to say, in as many words, "you can't sit here"?
I explained why I'm concerned with changing the meaning of "vegan" in my second post in the thread. If you didn't understand what I was saying about the value of having a word describing opposition to animal exploitation, let's talk about it.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)
How is it "incorrect" to maintain that vegans will avoid unnecessary animal exploitation and that one who chooses to exploit animals unecessarily isn't vegan?
You're assuming that she's making an active and informed choice to partake in "unnecessary animal exploitation" and willingly using the word "vegan" to describe herself anyway.
That is an unfair assumption to make. You do not know how well informed she is, you do not know whether there are aspects of her lifestyle that make avoidance of animal products difficult or impossible.
It is incorrect to tell a person, who is not familiar with the vegan community and is making absolutely no claims of veganism, that they cannot use the word vegan at all to describe their meals or the direction they are trying to go in just because we do not fully understand the complexity of their situation.0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)
How is it "incorrect" to maintain that vegans will avoid unnecessary animal exploitation and that one who chooses to exploit animals unecessarily isn't vegan?
You're assuming that she's making an active and informed choice to partake in "unnecessary animal exploitation" and willingly using the word "vegan" to describe herself anyway.
That is an unfair assumption to make. You do not know how well informed she is, you do not know whether there are aspects of her lifestyle that make avoidance of animal products difficult or impossible.
It is incorrect to tell a person, who is not familiar with the vegan community and is making absolutely no claims of veganism, that they cannot use the word vegan at all to describe their meals or the direction they are trying to go in just because we do not fully understand the complexity of their situation.
If it is not possible to avoid the use of a certain animal product, then using it wouldn't be unnecessary.
I'm sorry you felt my response to the OP was unfair. Is there any way someone could advocate for not changing the definition of "vegan" that you think would be fair? If you look at the OP's post, she is making claims of veganism, she describes herself as having a "loose vegan diet." I think it's worth discussing whether "loose veganism" is possible.0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »Calcium- The problem with calcium for vegans is getting it in volume. Try making a habit of choosing calcium rich options, like almonds instead of cashews and dried figs instead of bananas. Drink plant milks, and make sure they're fortified with calcium. This is important because they are usually also fortified with iron and b12 (other hard to get nutrients). If you want to eat fish, eat sardines. They come with the bones in and are loaded with calcium.
Iron- Make sure you get legumes and dark leafy greens with at least half of your meals, and eat them with a good source of vitamin c because non-heme (plant) iron is harder for your body to absorb than heme (animal) iron. Choose plant milks (soy, almond, etc) and grain products (pasta, bread, cereal etc) that are fortified with iron.
Protein- Firstly, most people's expectations for protein are too high. It should take up about 10-35% of your calories. Most people eating a deficit are fine with 15%. If you are pregnant, nursing or doing a rigorous strength training program it will need to be higher. Usually when vegans don't get enough protein it's because they're sacrificing nutritious food for junk food while restricting calories. So if you're eating 1200 calories a day as a vegan, you're probably not going to be able to fit in things like soda, candy, or margarine on a daily basis.
All of this!
Also, make sure you are not drinking coffee or tea until more than 2 hours after your non-heme (plant) iron rich foods, since coffee and tea decrease iron absorption
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Honestly, you can get ALL of your vitamins and minerals from eating a whole foods plant based diet. DO NOT WORRY ABOUT taking extra multivitamins yadayada. They're absolute myth. Don't worry about protein, calcium, whatever. You can get enough of your daily calcium just from fresh herbs! Eat an abundance of fruit and veggies, and eat ENOUGH of them. Eat your beans. eIt's all a process and it takes some people months to fully grasp veganism. Do your research, and find out whats best for you. I hope in the end you chose to eliminate seafood and eggs from your diet! I'd also like to add that you should find out how much protein you actually need in a day. Some people over calculate. You can use this calculator here: http://proteinaholic.com/calculator/ I find that I easily reach 45-50+ grams of protein daily.
Sorry this post was kinda all over the place, Good luck!0 -
Honestly, you can get ALL of your vitamins and minerals from eating a whole foods plant based diet. DO NOT WORRY ABOUT taking extra multivitamins yadayada. They're absolute myth. Don't worry about protein, calcium, whatever. You can get enough of your daily calcium just from fresh herbs! Eat an abundance of fruit and veggies, and eat ENOUGH of them. Eat your beans. eIt's all a process and it takes some people months to fully grasp veganism. Do your research, and find out whats best for you. I hope in the end you chose to eliminate seafood and eggs from your diet! I'd also like to add that you should find out how much protein you actually need in a day. Some people over calculate. You can use this calculator here: http://proteinaholic.com/calculator/ I find that I easily reach 45-50+ grams of protein daily.
Sorry this post was kinda all over the place, Good luck!
You cannot meet B12 needs on a whole foods plant-based diet (unless one is choosing foods fortified with B12). B12 supplementation (or eating fortified foods) is essential for those on plant-based diets.
When you say one can meet daily calcium needs from fresh herbs, which herbs are you talking about and how much would one need to eat to meet daily needs?0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)
How is it "incorrect" to maintain that vegans will avoid unnecessary animal exploitation and that one who chooses to exploit animals unecessarily isn't vegan?
You're assuming that she's making an active and informed choice to partake in "unnecessary animal exploitation" and willingly using the word "vegan" to describe herself anyway.
That is an unfair assumption to make. You do not know how well informed she is, you do not know whether there are aspects of her lifestyle that make avoidance of animal products difficult or impossible.
It is incorrect to tell a person, who is not familiar with the vegan community and is making absolutely no claims of veganism, that they cannot use the word vegan at all to describe their meals or the direction they are trying to go in just because we do not fully understand the complexity of their situation.
If it is not possible to avoid the use of a certain animal product, then using it wouldn't be unnecessary.
Exactly. You do not know what constitutes necessity for the OP, and whether or not she is able to avoid animal products all the time. Therefore, it is incorrect to assume that she is supporting unnecessary animal exploitation.I'm sorry you felt my response to the OP was unfair. Is there any way someone could advocate for not changing the definition of "vegan" that you think would be fair? If you look at the OP's post, she is making claims of veganism, she describes herself as having a "loose vegan diet." I think it's worth discussing whether "loose veganism" is possible.
I just don't think it's necessary to throw the dictionary, as it were, at the OP in this situation. Especially not to the scale that it happened in this thread. I mean, look at the extent to which I'm required to defend myself just in trying to be supportive towards her.
There are definitely times when it's necessary. I know someone who tells everyone they're a vegan and then brings in fish every day for lunch. I throw the dictionary at her every chance I get, she's the worst.
There is a difference between saying you're vegan and saying you're trying to have a loose vegan diet. "Loose veganism" is not possible. "Eating loosely vegan," or "eating like a vegan most of the time" is not only possible, it's a positive change that should be encouraged.0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)
How is it "incorrect" to maintain that vegans will avoid unnecessary animal exploitation and that one who chooses to exploit animals unecessarily isn't vegan?
You're assuming that she's making an active and informed choice to partake in "unnecessary animal exploitation" and willingly using the word "vegan" to describe herself anyway.
That is an unfair assumption to make. You do not know how well informed she is, you do not know whether there are aspects of her lifestyle that make avoidance of animal products difficult or impossible.
It is incorrect to tell a person, who is not familiar with the vegan community and is making absolutely no claims of veganism, that they cannot use the word vegan at all to describe their meals or the direction they are trying to go in just because we do not fully understand the complexity of their situation.
If it is not possible to avoid the use of a certain animal product, then using it wouldn't be unnecessary.
Exactly. You do not know what constitutes necessity for the OP, and whether or not she is able to avoid animal products all the time. Therefore, it is incorrect to assume that she is supporting unnecessary animal exploitation.I'm sorry you felt my response to the OP was unfair. Is there any way someone could advocate for not changing the definition of "vegan" that you think would be fair? If you look at the OP's post, she is making claims of veganism, she describes herself as having a "loose vegan diet." I think it's worth discussing whether "loose veganism" is possible.
I just don't think it's necessary to throw the dictionary, as it were, at the OP in this situation. Especially not to the scale that it happened in this thread. I mean, look at the extent to which I'm required to defend myself just in trying to be supportive towards her.
There are definitely times when it's necessary. I know someone who tells everyone they're a vegan and then brings in fish every day for lunch. I throw the dictionary at her every chance I get, she's the worst.
"Loose veganism" is not possible. "Eating loosely vegan," or "eating like a vegan most of the time" is not only possible, it's a positive change that should be encouraged.
I understand what you're saying, I think. You think the default assumption in these conversations should be that OP is required to eat fish and eggs to maintain her health and she has no other options available. However, given that she is asking for advice on how to meet other nutritional needs, I don't think this is a reasonable assumption to make. Someone who is required to eat fish and eggs to meet their nutritional needs and has no other options would likely have already learned how to meet their needs for protein, calcium, and iron in the context of their unique dietary needs.
I don't think explaining the value of maintaining the definition is equivalent to "throwing the dictionary." Given that you think there is no appropriate way to bring it up, I guess we won't be able to find common ground. But I appreciate you taking the time to explain your view.
If someone said they were "eating like a vegan most of the time," I wouldn't have concerns with that phrasing. I don't think it dilutes the meaning of the term. They're describing what they do -- which is to eat *like* a vegan frequently. My concern is with uses that attempt to change the meaning of the word, things like "loosely vegan." I do believe that veganism is an ethical position, one that can't be held loosely.0 -
holothuroidea wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »holothuroidea wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »AceofIvies wrote: »I agree with holohuroidea - every little bit helps. Don't get discouraged. Eating fish and eggs now and then is better than going back to the Standard American Diet any day of the week.
I aim for 95% vegan (screw you haters) and had the same issues as you did. I did the following.
1) Take a vegan multivitamin. has 100% of iron in it and also b12 if you ever cut out fish/eggs. I think I get a 2 pack from amazon for like $10 and lasts forever.
2) Take calcium carbonate aka tums. Mine are like $3 for 300 tabs on amazon subscribe and save. and they taste good
3) I eat a protein shake. Every day. Every. Day. EVERY DAY. I order my protein powder from true nutrition and they have like 30 different flavors you can get. I usually concoct a soy/pea/rice custom mix to ensure a complete protein. But I will probably cut out soy the next time I order. I like vanilla flavor, anything with the word "cream" in it, and orange cream is especially good.
Veganism is an ethical position against unnecessary animal exploitation. I think it's wonderful that you're reducing the amount of animal products in your diet. But you can't be 95% percent against unnecessary animal exploitation and 5% for it.
This has nothing to do with "haters." It has to do with what the word means.
Please don't participate in degrading the meaning of the only word that we have to describe opposition to unnecessary animal exploitation. If you are okay with using animals unnecessarily 5% of the time, please consider using "plant-based diet" to describe your lifestyle.
Personally, I find it super annoying that someone like Freelee the racist-classist and compassionate-to-humans-only-rarely banana girl gets ownership of the word vegan because she eats 100% bananas or whatever but someone like me who is ethically vegan but also acknowledges and tries to incorporate more than one level of ethics into their diet/lifestyle and therefore eats 90% vegan does not just because some people don't understand how that could possibly work.
I mean, I get it. I do not describe myself as vegan specifically in solidarity to the vegan community even though it would make my life a lot easier to just use the word. But when someone who is clearly new to the idea specifically describes themselves as "partially vegan" or "loosely vegan," what good does it do to bring the hammer of word-ownership down upon them? How is that helpful to people who are new to veganism and are trying their best? How does that help the animals?
Word-ownership? One poster was a smart aleck but the rest who addressed the OP's misuse of the word vegan were simply correcting her.
Of the 35 posts so far in this thread, 6 of them have made an effort to answer the OP's question without criticizing her post or "correcting" her. (I do not think they are correct, by the way, which was the point of my post.)
16 of the posts attempted to answer the OP's question, and some of them also corrected her. I think it's fine to speak up when your understanding of a word is different from someone else's. I work with many people for whom English is a second language, and I always speak up when they are using a word differently than I do.
The common definition is "does not eat" with no shades or percentages:
0 -
Hey thanks for all the helpful information! Feel free to continue the conversation for everyone's benefit. It's clearly gotten a bit bigger than my initial question and I encourage the discussion.0
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what do Vegans wear for clothes?0
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Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
The same thing everyone else wears minus the wool, leather, and silk?
The clothes I am wearing today are made of cotton and synthetic fibers.0 -
Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
I wear ethically sourced vegan clothing (no wool) ...that's when I'm not running around naked with flowers in my hair, of course.
0 -
TrickyDisco wrote: »Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
I wear ethically sourced vegan clothing (no wool) ...that's when I'm not running around naked with flowers in my hair, of course.
0 -
TrickyDisco wrote: »Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
I wear ethically sourced vegan clothing (no wool) ...that's when I'm not running around naked with flowers in my hair, of course.
see that is what I was thinking.. Naked..lol.. Sorry my first experience with what a Vegan is was outlined in this thread,, I'll Google0 -
Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
Plant and synthetic fibers. The vast majority of clothing is made out of those things so it's not difficult at all. You just need to avoid leather, wool and silk.
The only thing I've found to be tricky is finding a nice pair of oxfords. I have a pair that are cute but they were cheap and I'm afraid they're only going to last one season.
Also sometimes things like higher end coats and bags randomly come with leather pulls and straps or silk liners. That is super annoying.0 -
Oh goodness. This has gotten out of hand, huh? Call yourself flexitarian
And not trying to ruffle anyone's feathers but, as someone who is lacto-ovo, I love it when anyone decides they are going to consume fewer animal products. Good for you OP! Also, someone can be on a vegan diet and not give an eff about animals.
I'm not sure if anyone mentioned nooch (nutritional yeast). Helps to add a savory cheese flavor and has B12, zinc, protein, fiber. For iron, try to avoid calcium sources while your are eating the non-heme sources like cereals, breads, dark leafy greens. Calcium inhibits iron absorption. Soda is also not great for iron absorption.
Protein-- even as vegetarian, it is hard to get the recommended amount. Nuts, seeds, legumes, eggs if you are eating those, fish, mushrooms, wheat germ, soba noodles, quinoa, black bean burgers, vegetarian/vegan protein powders (usually made with pea protein because peas are a good protein source )... All excellent sources.
My diary is open. I try to make sure most everything is met, but I do consume dairy.0 -
TrickyDisco wrote: »Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
I wear ethically sourced vegan clothing (no wool) ...that's when I'm not running around naked with flowers in my hair, of course.
Out of curiosity, why no wool? How is the animal hurt by the process? I understand there is an issue of people breeding over the centuries sheep that have "too much" wool for their comfort and health during warm months, but since these species already exist, and what is done cannot be undone, how is using the wool contrary to being vegan?0 -
TrickyDisco wrote: »Michael190lbs wrote: »what do Vegans wear for clothes?
I wear ethically sourced vegan clothing (no wool) ...that's when I'm not running around naked with flowers in my hair, of course.
Out of curiosity, why no wool? How is the animal hurt by the process? I understand there is an issue of people breeding over the centuries sheep that have "too much" wool for their comfort and health during warm months, but since these species already exist, and what is done cannot be undone, how is using the wool contrary to being vegan?
Vegans do not support any form of animal exploitation and raising sheep for their fleece is a form of exploitation. Sheep may produce less wool as they get older and when no longer profitable will be sent to slaughter. Ordinary shearing causes nicks and cuts to the animal. The practice of mulesing to prevent flystrike is cruel as usually done without anaesthetic; the reason sheep are particularly susceptible to flystrike is because they have been selectively bred to have wrinkly skin which produces more wool. Breeders have selected the traits most profitable to them, not traits that are healthiest or most beneficial to the animal.
And what is done can be undone by allowing these breeds to die out. But even if you wanted to preserve them for some reason, they could be bred in sanctuaries; there is no reason to mistreat or kill them.
These are some of the reasons given by many animal rights websites and I personally agree with them.0 -
chastity0921 wrote: »Oh goodness. This has gotten out of hand, huh? Call yourself flexitarian
And not trying to ruffle anyone's feathers but, as someone who is lacto-ovo, I love it when anyone decides they are going to consume fewer animal products. Good for you OP! Also, someone can be on a vegan diet and not give an eff about animals.
I'm not sure if anyone mentioned nooch (nutritional yeast). Helps to add a savory cheese flavor and has B12, zinc, protein, fiber. For iron, try to avoid calcium sources while your are eating the non-heme sources like cereals, breads, dark leafy greens. Calcium inhibits iron absorption. Soda is also not great for iron absorption.
Protein-- even as vegetarian, it is hard to get the recommended amount. Nuts, seeds, legumes, eggs if you are eating those, fish, mushrooms, wheat germ, soba noodles, quinoa, black bean burgers, vegetarian/vegan protein powders (usually made with pea protein because peas are a good protein source )... All excellent sources.
My diary is open. I try to make sure most everything is met, but I do consume dairy.
Veganism is an ethical position of animal exploitation. If someone avoided eating animal products but practiced other forms of animal exploitation, it would be more accurate to say they're on a plant-based diet.
And of course it's wonderful when people decide to consume fewer animal products. I don't think anyone in this thread has said that it isn't.0 -
OP, sorry your post got hijacked. I would like to add that there are excellent ways to get complete proteins in a vegan diet without supplements. You can get organic moringa and chlorella powders to add to your smoothies that are complete proteins and high in B12 especially. Also fermented foods like kombu, tempeh, miso, and fermented soybeans. If you like sea veggies, they also have lots of b12 (nori, arame or wakame). Nooch or Nutritional Yeast is great sprinkled on Popcorn or popped Amaranth - I eat this as a snack almost every night with hot sauce. I add Nooch to soups & salads and I make a condiment with it for veggie burgers (1Tbs Nooch, 1 tsp Mustard, 1 tbs Veganaise - stir together & smear on-yummy). Hope these suggestions help!!0
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OP, sorry your post got hijacked. I would like to add that there are excellent ways to get complete proteins in a vegan diet without supplements. You can get organic moringa and chlorella powders to add to your smoothies that are complete proteins and high in B12 especially. Also fermented foods like kombu, tempeh, miso, and fermented soybeans. If you like sea veggies, they also have lots of b12 (nori, arame or wakame). Nooch or Nutritional Yeast is great sprinkled on Popcorn or popped Amaranth - I eat this as a snack almost every night with hot sauce. I add Nooch to soups & salads and I make a condiment with it for veggie burgers (1Tbs Nooch, 1 tsp Mustard, 1 tbs Veganaise - stir together & smear on-yummy). Hope these suggestions help!!
Vegans relying on algae, seaweed, and fermented foods to meet B12 needs should be aware that studies are very inconsistent when it comes to actually detecting B12 or B12 analogues in these foods. And if they are analogues, the effect of analogues isn't exactly clear. Nutritional yeast can be a great source of B12, but not all nutritional yeast has it. It doesn't naturally have B12 -- so any yeast with it has been fortified (just like plant milks are).
Given the uncertainty of algae, seaweed, and fermented foods to meet B12 needs, I don't know if it is responsible to recommend that new or potential vegans rely on them to meet their needs. B12 supplements and fortified foods are so easy to obtain and so affordable (and the impact of B12 deficiency can be so serious and also permanent) that we should be cautious. Some of the foods you recommend may actually decrease B12 (as one study found with people eating spirulina and nori). The B12 analogues found in these foods may interfere with absorbing B12.
More details for the curious: http://www.veganhealth.org/b12/plant0
This discussion has been closed.
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