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Beyond a calorie deficit - exercise is good for weight loss?
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600 cals is a piece of cake. That's like a gym class and a dog walk. Sorted.3
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I'll just add, that I believe that it's also dependent on the how one exercises that MAY dictate how weight is lost (if a calorie deficit is implemented). Longer duration exercising (say like running long distances), don't help to retain lean muscle like a program that's based around overall body weight resistance training. And one can usually see this in the physiques of runners vs lifters in most cases.
Also higher intensity exercise will affect how hormones regulate. Higher HGH and test are 2 of these and definitely help with muscle retention during calorie deficit.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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Really? You must be really light in weight then, because 600 calories in 90 minutes isn't that hard for someone in the 150lbs range to do if that's the duration.Nikki10129 wrote: »I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I'm 5' female, 130 lbs so that may be it. Sometimes it takes me by surprise when I see the amount of calories people are eating and losing on, so I suppose it shouldn't surprise me that people are burning more than me with their exercise. I could also just be underestimating, which is entirely possible.
Edit: I do concede that point, since I often forget that I have a bias due to my height and weight being outside the average range.1 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »So when recommending that people focus on calorie deficits also remember that activity and exercise also have a multi-factorial positive effect that shouldn't be forgotten.
Exercise is great and is helpful for overall health and even makes CO more efficient. However, for weight loss, it's essentially a separate issue. You can't outrun a calorie surplus. Exercise calories should be eaten back so that the exercise isn't causing extra weight loss because the exercise needs to be fueled.
When people who are trying to lose weight ask about what exercises they should do so that they can lose weight, it makes sense that they are pointed toward CICO and counting calories because that's where weight loss is found. They aren't inquiring about fitness, they are inquiring about weight loss.
ETA: I just saw your diagram. That's essentially what I'm saying about weight loss and exercise being mostly separate topics.
Except evidence from the National Weight Control Registry suggests only around 10% of people maintaining a weight loss do so without exercise. You can't outrun a bad diet, but it is pretty hard to eat a good, maintainable diet inside the calorie window a completely sedentary lifestyle provides.
Hill of the NWCR sees it as a range where calories needed and calories desired are close enough to work.6 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »So when recommending that people focus on calorie deficits also remember that activity and exercise also have a multi-factorial positive effect that shouldn't be forgotten.
Exercise is great and is helpful for overall health and even makes CO more efficient. However, for weight loss, it's essentially a separate issue. You can't outrun a calorie surplus. Exercise calories should be eaten back so that the exercise isn't causing extra weight loss because the exercise needs to be fueled.
When people who are trying to lose weight ask about what exercises they should do so that they can lose weight, it makes sense that they are pointed toward CICO and counting calories because that's where weight loss is found. They aren't inquiring about fitness, they are inquiring about weight loss.
ETA: I just saw your diagram. That's essentially what I'm saying about weight loss and exercise being mostly separate topics.
Except evidence from the National Weight Control Registry suggests only around 10% of people maintaining a weight loss do so without exercise. You can't outrun a bad diet, but it is pretty hard to eat a good, maintainable diet inside the calorie window a completely sedentary lifestyle provides.
Hill of the NWCR sees it as a range where calories needed and calories desired are close enough to work.
Bam! Exactly
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Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.0 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.0 -
Totally n=1 here but I also tend to be more dedicated overall when I'm following an exercise routine.
I'm a firm believer that what head-space you're in has an effect and I know exercise helps with my head-space.
I also agree with a poster above that weight loss seems easier when I exercise. It definitely could be that I log more accurately when I'm exercising, so I don't know that there's anything else going on.
I look forward to following this thread!3 -
Nikki10129 wrote: »I guess what I'm saying is yes, exercise can help with weight loss, but it does so by increasing your caloric deficit or increasing your BMR. You can still gain weight while exercising: I've gained weight while exercising, and not the good bulking kind, the bad fluffy kind. People looking to lose weight and that's all they're looking to do, don't need to exercise.
I know they say weight loss is 80% kitchen and 20% exercise, but honestly, weight loss is 100% in the kitchen, you could lay in bed all day and lose weight as long as you were in a deficit. You may not be super healthy, but you'd lose weight.
Exercise benefits go beyond weight loss. Mental health, heart health, physical fitness, but I wouldn't necessarily say weight loss. When people ask me why I exercise, my answer isn't to lose weight, I eat in a calorie deficit to lose weight, I exercise for fitness.
The point of the article I included is that it goes beyond creating a calorie deficit or increasing BMR. It would seem that it affects TEF and fat oxidation levels during activity (beyond BMR). Now, as has been point out by cwolfman, this might be a minor effect (it is), but the fact that it is there is interesting and I think, worth sharing in an area dedicated to "debate". It shouldn't be the core of a decision process obviously but it is interesting to know.
And while you and I might not exercise for weight loss - a lot of people do. Look at the metric senecarr posted - it might be a critical aspect of lifestyle changes that lead to long term success in weightloss for many people.2 -
Nikki10129 wrote: »EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
Currently running 4x (over 25-30 km per week moving toward 40 km/week objective), 2 weight training sessions, 1 additional cross training session, 1 day off. Corresponds to a bit more than 700 cals/day. I probably weigh a little bit more than a 20 year old, female kick boxer, though.
But exercise calorie burn may vary significantly based on level, weight and activity type...
I definitely wouldn't say that's the norm, most people, to burn that many calories in ONE day would have to do some pretty intense exercise, which wouldn't be sustainable to do every day. I definitely wouldn't say the average person who exercises regularly can attribute a 600 calorie burn daily to their exercise. That's a huge overestimation.EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Also the comment on building/maintaining LBM while exercising isn't 100% true. That's going to depend on the exercises you do. You aren't going to be building muscle while eating at a deficit anyways, except for potentially a little bit at the beginning of a resistance program, and the idea that any form of exercise is going to maintain LBM more than doing no exercise isn't correct. If you're going to be doing a lot of steady state cardio exercises with no resistance training incorporated in (which is something a lot of people do) then you'll probably start losing more muscle than if you decided to just eat at a deficit. Muscle is a lot easier for the body to metabolize than fat, so it's the first thing the body is going to go for when working out if it's not regularly using those muscles.
You're partially correct. The type of exercise does impact protein synthesis pathways but all exercise (ALL) has some LBM protective effect. And yes, it does indeed need to be balanced with the calorie burns from that exercise - if someone is creating larger deficits due to exercise then it becomes a race to between anabolic signaling and nutrient deficiency.
If you eat at a 600 cal deficit and do no exercise, versus eat a 600 cal deficit with exercise (and eat back your exercise cals to assure that your deficit is only 600 cals) you will lose less LBM since the deficit is still only 600 cals but exercise creates a substrate utilisation requirement.
Muscle isn't easier to metabolise than fat. The mechanisms are quite different, that is just a very incomplete view of energy utilisation and protein turnover.
And I do realize it's quite a bit more complex than that. But muscle is going to be used more quickly than fat (if the muscles aren't being used) due to the fact that muscle maintenance requires far more energy than fat maintenance, which is why it increases your metabolic rate. If you aren't using the muscles there's a lot of wasted energy going towards maintenance, and so it's much easier to metabolize them for energy than it is to keep them and supply them with energy.
I'll concede that if you make sure you're eating enough you won't be burning as much muscle, but it's still dependent on the types of exercise you're doing.
I do think for overall fitness, exercise is better than no exercise, but for losing weight it still comes down to calories in vs calories out. If you exercise daily and burn 600 calories, but you eat all those calories back and eat over maintenance you are still going to gain weight, regardless of the fact that you're exercising.
Maintaining muscle is rather inexpensive, creation is expensive. Fat requires about 4 calories a pound to maintain - muscle is 6. 2 extra calories isn't hard for your body to find considering the effort needed to build it initially. The fact that preserving is relatively easy is the basis of cutting cycles.0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.1 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.
If you're so smart why CAN'T exercise replace eating? Sometimes I exercise and then I'm not hungry! Let's see your science explain THAT!
/sarcasm 2 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.
If you're so smart why CAN'T exercise replace eating? Sometimes I exercise and then I'm not hungry! Let's see your science explain THAT!
/sarcasm
I do need to eventually look into the research about exercise affecting appetite. There seems to be some evidence that variations on a particular gene or genes affects how exercise impacts appetite.0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.
If you're so smart why CAN'T exercise replace eating? Sometimes I exercise and then I'm not hungry! Let's see your science explain THAT!
/sarcasm
I do need to eventually look into the research about exercise affecting appetite. There seems to be some evidence that variations on a particular gene or genes affects how exercise impacts appetite.
It is probably a bit interesting. I feel like eating everything on the entire planet after a half marathon, but after the first full that I ran I was just not hungry.
I hadn't considered that it was genetic.0 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.
Throw in insulin and leptin and stir. 1 -
I know without a doubt that I would gain weight without exercise. I start off everyday in the red in my diary, so I DO outrun that until I'm back in the green.
Of course, if i buckled down and ate only what MFP has given me then I would lose weight too,but i don't waaaaannnnaaa
If it's a choice between willpower and exercise, I choose exercise!3 -
Yes. I would recommend reading Matt Fitzgerald's discussion of this and of the studies that show that (usually quite moderate to low) amounts of exercise tend to result in more calories eaten than burned (spoiler: that may not be the case with higher amounts of exercise).
It also ignores the intersection between exercise and diet -- for many people, including me, more exercise tends to improve diet/positively improve eating behaviors.1 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
This leads to a thought.
I regularly get 600+ exercise calories from running and biking. Sometimes that requires lots of effort to fit it in my day. Sometimes it's just as a result of running one leg of my commute (or biking home and back -- I get extra calories if I bike extra, as I usually do). Even if I walk significant portions it's likely 600 calories or close.
I am able to do this regularly, which makes my exercise easier to do (and I incorporate into my training plans).
I expect this is more like the normal everyday calorie burn we had before the contemporary era. That allowed people to eat more like what seems a normal amount (and have the benefit of some physical activity, like increased leptin sensitivity). I really do believe that a huge contributor to the obesity crisis is inactivity. (And as an anecdote, I've always been easily able to maintain a normal weight when active and have easily gained weight when sedentary.)3 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.
If you're so smart why CAN'T exercise replace eating? Sometimes I exercise and then I'm not hungry! Let's see your science explain THAT!
/sarcasm
I do need to eventually look into the research about exercise affecting appetite. There seems to be some evidence that variations on a particular gene or genes affects how exercise impacts appetite.
It is probably a bit interesting. I feel like eating everything on the entire planet after a half marathon, but after the first full that I ran I was just not hungry.
I hadn't considered that it was genetic.
I don't recall the first full much (although I know we walked forever and got Chinese after), but I just did a full today and wasn't hungry for a couple of hours and then was ravenous. Got chicken and waffles for a late brunch and it was the best thing ever! I'm similarly not hungry for an hour after a half or tri but then able to eat lots. (I'm always starving after swimming.)0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »EvgeniZyntx wrote: »cwolfman13 wrote: »Nikki10129 wrote: »Just a couple of comments on your post:
600 calories daily can be attributed to exercise? What kind of exercise are you doing to burn 600 calories? I do a hardcore kickboxing class for 90 minutes and I'm not burning 600 calories doing that, even though I exercise regularly the rest of the week.
I don't think 600 calories per day is outlandish...I do that pretty easily on my bike on an average ride.
As to the OP, regular exercise can certainly make weight loss easier in that you obviously increase your energy expenditure and I agree that when done properly with a proper diet it can other positive effects on metabolism (though I think focusing on that aspect is kind of majoring in the minors)...but I think it can also be a detriment in that a lot of people create fairly large deficits with diet alone and then go do a bunch of exercise but don't adequately fuel that activity...this is actually a detriment to preservation of lean mass. It can also be a huge stress on the body and raise cortisol levels.
I tend to encourage people to focus on diet for weight management and exercise for fitness and to more or less disassociate the two...in my experience, when people can start looking at fitness for the sake of fitness, they better understand why they would want to fuel that fitness...there are just way too many people crashing their diets and then doing incessant amounts of exercise without knowing or understanding what they're actually doing to themselves.
I think this touches on exactly some critical points. And perhaps metabolic changes due to exercise is majoring in the minors, agree.
We do see people that throw themselves into exercise and large deficits without proper additional calories and the end results then becomes a net deficit that is too large and LBM suffers.
I hadn't touched on stress and cortisol - I think that, along with the related inflammation response is also an important topic. When we talk about taking time to recover and having time off - well, it is probably a long subject by itself.
I'd say beyond cortisol, several neurotransmitters are going to be involved. I believe epinephrine, norepinephrine, and dopamine would all have increase with strength training to facilitate signalling. These are all also involved to some extent in appetite and satiety.
I'm sure with a simplified rat study I could show pictures of brains that prove exercise can replace eating according to some of MFP poster standards.
If you're so smart why CAN'T exercise replace eating? Sometimes I exercise and then I'm not hungry! Let's see your science explain THAT!
/sarcasm
I do need to eventually look into the research about exercise affecting appetite. There seems to be some evidence that variations on a particular gene or genes affects how exercise impacts appetite.
It is probably a bit interesting. I feel like eating everything on the entire planet after a half marathon, but after the first full that I ran I was just not hungry.
I hadn't considered that it was genetic.
I don't recall the first full much (although I know we walked forever and got Chinese after), but I just did a full today and wasn't hungry for a couple of hours and then was ravenous. Got chicken and waffles for a late brunch and it was the best thing ever! I'm similarly not hungry for an hour after a half or tri but then able to eat lots. (I'm always starving after swimming.)
Hey! Congrats!
I haven't had the same experience after the subsequent ones or the 50k, to be honest. I just remember thinking it was so strange based on the experiences that I'd had after half marathons.
The next day? We ate everything.0
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