Welcome to Debate Club! Please be aware that this is a space for respectful debate, and that your ideas will be challenged here. Please remember to critique the argument, not the author.
Do carbs, protein and fats all impact cancer risks or not?
GaleHawkins
Posts: 8,159 Member
https://youtube.com/watch?v=WUlE1VHGA40
The speaker is Dr. Craig Thompson the president of Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center.
Discussing this subject was getting community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/comment/35784121#Comment_35784121 the Are all calories the same?? thread off track.
The speaker is Dr. Craig Thompson the president of Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center.
Discussing this subject was getting community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/comment/35784121#Comment_35784121 the Are all calories the same?? thread off track.
0
Replies
-
Far too vague, too begin with. The latest study, as regards to lung cancer and carbohydrates, isn't an insular study by any means. Two groups, one comprised of smokers and one of non-smokers. The non-smokers eating a high-carb diet had lung cancer incidence, but the study is far too broad to be definitive. They don't isolate work enviroments, urban environments, even hobbies. All of those particular things can be highly contributory to lung cancer.
And every single different type of cancer is a completely different disease. There aren't even causes known for several different types of cancer, so there's absolutely no way to tie in diet to them. With so many other possible causes of cancer in our industrial society, I'd challenge any study to prove that diet was causal to cancer diagnoses.
We know that smoking cigarettes causes multiples types of cancer (lung, bladder, colorectal, for a start). I'd be shocked to see a correlation so strong between diet and cancer.0 -
While glucose uptake mutations are a sign of cancer, that video doesn't support that dietary macros impact cancer risk.
There is some evidence that calorie restriction in general reduces cancer risk but it is very iffy in humans.
There is strong evidence that being overweight increases cancer risks significantly.
There might be evidence that macro composition has a role, but that video isn't it.
What he states is about "overfeeds" not risks at calorie balanced diets.0 -
No science in my statement, but there are so many things in the environment that are unhealthy, the last thing I worry about is if my macro combination is going to cause cancer.0
-
Just fast forward to 26:30 on the video for the lead up to the slide at 27:00.
That is when the doctor covers the impact carbs, protein and fats can have on cancer risks.
@CasperNaegle did his 60 second blip help you understand that not all calories are the same when it comes to cancer risks.0 -
So you want to start a thread about this, but are you going to discuss opposing views?0
-
CasperNaegle wrote: »No science in my statement, but there are so many things in the environment that are unhealthy, the last thing I worry about is if my macro combination is going to cause cancer.
Pretty much. Besides, hasn't it been well established by now that EVERYTHING you do or don't do causes, or is associated with, cancer?
I saw a stat from the American Cancer Association that my lifetime risk of getting cancer as a woman is 1:3. For a man, it is 1:2. So I have an excellent chance of getting cancer no matter what I do or don't do apparently...I'll put on sunscreen and try to avoid huffing car exhaust and licking bottles of Raid, but ultimately, I have an excellent chance of getting cancer because that's how it is.0 -
The high protein/carbohydrate cancer correlation controversy is well know. Heck, even high fat intake has shown a possible correlation to certain types of cancer (colorectal, prostate, breast, endometrial..etc). I don't think this is a discussion anyone can win (unless you are breatharian).0
-
So you want to start a thread about this, but are you going to discuss opposing views?
@mccindy72 per the doctor from the dated video there are many views to discuss when it comes to how to prevent, cure or something in the middle.
The only thing my view is fixed about today is that prevention is really the only good possible solution since "cures" do not seem to be here yet. There is more science going into the causes and possible risk factors each year so I see more hope than @CrabNebula. I do not view the 1:2 applying to me just yet but could be eaten up with cancer at this moment.
Do you have any research to share about diet based cancer risk issues?0 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »The high protein/carbohydrate cancer correlation controversy is well know. Heck, even high fat intake has shown a possible correlation to certain types of cancer (colorectal, prostate, breast, endometrial..etc). I don't think this is a discussion anyone can win (unless you are breatharian).
But @amusedmonkey discussions are not win or lose events.
It is debates where you get judged as the winner or not.
0 -
Well, the ACS says the following:
don't smoke
don't drink to excess
don't be overweight
don't be sedentary
eat a healthy diet with an emphasis on plant foods
limit processed and red meat
choose whole grains over refined
http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/cid/documents/webcontent/002577-pdf.pdf0 -
Based on limited studies I've seen, it would seem to me that cancer risk may be negatively affected when a diet is high in saturated and omega 6 fats (say, a total of 40% calories) in the presence of a carb-centered diet (45% for example). It may be different in a LCHF diet, but I don't know how much research there is on these differences. I haven't done much research on this though so I'm not very certain.
Regardless of any correlation there, I think that even among the same macro split, food choices do matter when it comes to cancer risk. One can eat a diet of 45% carbs, 35% fat, and 20% protein on both of these choices: A diet high in refined grains, added sugar, and saturated fat, with little intake of fruits and vegetables vs a diet high in fruits, vegetables, lean protein, some whole grains/dairy, and low intake of added sugar and saturated fat. And I would speculate that for a lot of people who develop cancer or have recurring bouts of this disease that there is not a very strong focus on nutrition overall.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Well, the ACS says the following:
don't smoke
don't drink to excess
don't be overweight
don't be sedentary
eat a healthy diet with an emphasis on plant foods
limit processed and red meat
choose whole grains over refined
http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/cid/documents/webcontent/002577-pdf.pdf
I have had cancer. I don't want it to come back. The above is what I am told every single time I ask about foods and preventing a reoccurance. They also always say that cancer, a reoccurance or any illness can strike regardless of how healthy someone is or not. That's true. When you spend time at a cancer center you see a true representation of all people. Every shape, size, fitness level, young, old and everything in between.
Am I naive thinking that if there was a food or macro group causing cancer, it would be figured out by now?
Some cancers are in your body for years before a tumor forms or becomes big enough to cause issues which lead to diagnosis. How can diet and cancer be studied when we don't have a log of eaten foods for the past years? Hmm is that another reason for me to faithfully log? But only a small minority of people log.
0 -
ten year cancer survivor here, and I was told to not smoke, not drink to excess, etc, and to make sure that I exercised and kept my weight in check. My oncologist has never once said that I should worry about the my macro split as a cause of cancer or recurrence. IF anything, I am more prone to recurrence due to having been bombarded with chemo and radiation...
so, I will go with what my oncologist says and not what the internet says...0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »So you want to start a thread about this, but are you going to discuss opposing views?
@mccindy72 per the doctor from the dated video there are many views to discuss when it comes to how to prevent, cure or something in the middle.
The only thing my view is fixed about today is that prevention is really the only good possible solution since "cures" do not seem to be here yet. There is more science going into the causes and possible risk factors each year so I see more hope than @CrabNebula. I do not view the 1:2 applying to me just yet but could be eaten up with cancer at this moment.
Do you have any research to share about diet based cancer risk issues?
Again, that's going to be specific to the type of cancer and time of detection. Certain types have excellent cure remission rates if discovered soon enough*. And all I'm aware of have much better survival rates if detected sooner rather than later.
*And there's my plug for regular cancer screenings0 -
Immunization against the HPV virus is a pretty darn good prevention against ovarian cancer.
Targeted food cancer prevention is a red herring, IMO. It's like asking which hammer is best for eye surgery.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Well, the ACS says the following:
don't smoke
don't drink to excess
don't be overweight
don't be sedentary
eat a healthy diet with an emphasis on plant foods
limit processed and red meat
choose whole grains over refined
http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/cid/documents/webcontent/002577-pdf.pdf
I have had cancer. I don't want it to come back. The above is what I am told every single time I ask about foods and preventing a reoccurance. They also always say that cancer, a reoccurance or any illness can strike regardless of how healthy someone is or not. That's true. When you spend time at a cancer center you see a true representation of all people. Every shape, size, fitness level, young, old and everything in between.
Am I naive thinking that if there was a food or macro group causing cancer, it would be figured out by now?
Some cancers are in your body for years before a tumor forms or becomes big enough to cause issues which lead to diagnosis. How can diet and cancer be studied when we don't have a log of eaten foods for the past years? Hmm is that another reason for me to faithfully log? But only a small minority of people log.
You are right. I am a cancer survivor of almost 20 years and now work in a cancer center. There are all kinds of people with cancer. The biggest cause is smoking but not in everyone0 -
I'm a little confused; are you saying you do or don't agree with the ACS's diet-related recommendations?lemurcat12 wrote: »Well, the ACS says the following:
don't smoke
don't drink to excess
don't be overweight
don't be sedentary
eat a healthy diet with an emphasis on plant foods
limit processed and red meat
choose whole grains over refined
http://www.cancer.org/acs/groups/cid/documents/webcontent/002577-pdf.pdf
I have had cancer. I don't want it to come back. The above is what I am told every single time I ask about foods and preventing a reoccurance. They also always say that cancer, a reoccurance or any illness can strike regardless of how healthy someone is or not. That's true. When you spend time at a cancer center you see a true representation of all people. Every shape, size, fitness level, young, old and everything in between.
Am I naive thinking that if there was a food or macro group causing cancer, it would be figured out by now?
Some cancers are in your body for years before a tumor forms or becomes big enough to cause issues which lead to diagnosis. How can diet and cancer be studied when we don't have a log of eaten foods for the past years? Hmm is that another reason for me to faithfully log? But only a small minority of people log.
0 -
There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.0
-
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
0 -
queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.
No, just stop eating things that aren't food. If it causes cancer, it isn't food.0 -
No true Scotsman extraordinaire!0
-
lemurcat12 wrote: »queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.
No, just stop eating things that aren't food. If it causes cancer, it isn't food.
Good point. While eating fats does not increase the risk of cancer as can carbs and protein may to some extent if we eat fats laced with anything carcinogenic that source of fat could increase our cancer risk.
nhs.uk/chq/Pages/can-eating-too-much-fat-cause-cancer.aspx?CategoryID=96&SubCategoryID=2270 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.
No, just stop eating things that aren't food. If it causes cancer, it isn't food.
Good point. While eating fats does not increase the risk of cancer as can carbs and protein may to some extent if we eat fats laced with anything carcinogenic that source of fat could increase our cancer risk.
nhs.uk/chq/Pages/can-eating-too-much-fat-cause-cancer.aspx?CategoryID=96&SubCategoryID=227
I guess just feel lucky you're a male:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/125716840 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.
No, just stop eating things that aren't food. If it causes cancer, it isn't food.
Good point. While eating fats does not increase the risk of cancer as can carbs and protein may to some extent if we eat fats laced with anything carcinogenic that source of fat could increase our cancer risk.
nhs.uk/chq/Pages/can-eating-too-much-fat-cause-cancer.aspx?CategoryID=96&SubCategoryID=227
I guess just feel lucky you're a male:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12571684
And not a rat.0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.
No, just stop eating things that aren't food. If it causes cancer, it isn't food.
Good point. While eating fats does not increase the risk of cancer as can carbs and protein may to some extent if we eat fats laced with anything carcinogenic that source of fat could increase our cancer risk.
nhs.uk/chq/Pages/can-eating-too-much-fat-cause-cancer.aspx?CategoryID=96&SubCategoryID=227
I guess just feel lucky you're a male:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12571684
And not a rat.
I wouldn't want to falsely assume Gale's level of rage or claustrophobia.0 -
I never thought I would say this but after reading this thread I can see an upside to developing pica.
At least I will avoid cancer...0 -
I never thought I would say this but after reading this thread I can see an upside to developing pica.
At least I will avoid cancer...
@msf74 even that is not always free of cancer risks it seems.
The word "cancer" can bring up many different emotions. In my case I lost my mom to breast cancer. Well she died from heart failure most likely due to cancer treatments I would guess.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pica_(disorder)0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »queenliz99 wrote: »
Food=carbs,fats,protein could contribute to some types of cancers. Good to know.lithezebra wrote: »There are a lot of different kinds of cancers, even different cancers of the same tissues, like different kinds of breast duct cancer. Carbs, fats, and protein could all contribute to some types of cancer, and, possibly, not to others.
Please stop eating. Food contributes to cancer.
If you know that you have significant risk factors for a specific type of cancer that is insulin sensitive, for example, then you could make meaningful dietary changes. There are always trade-offs to be made, depending on your unique set of health risks.0 -
GaleHawkins wrote: »I never thought I would say this but after reading this thread I can see an upside to developing pica.
At least I will avoid cancer...
@msf74 even that is not always free of cancer risks it seems. The word "cancer" can bring up many different emotions. In my case I lost my mom to breast cancer. Well she died from heart failure most likely due to cancer treatments I would guess.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pica_(disorder)
Sigh, yes my own mother passed away from pneumonia associated with pancreatic cancer. I miss her literally every single day. My condolences for your loss as well.
I guess we are all trying to do the best we can and live the longest, healthiest life we can get our hands on.0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 1.4M Health, Wellness and Goals
- 393.6K Introduce Yourself
- 43.8K Getting Started
- 260.3K Health and Weight Loss
- 175.9K Food and Nutrition
- 47.5K Recipes
- 232.5K Fitness and Exercise
- 431 Sleep, Mindfulness and Overall Wellness
- 6.5K Goal: Maintaining Weight
- 8.6K Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
- 153K Motivation and Support
- 8K Challenges
- 1.3K Debate Club
- 96.3K Chit-Chat
- 2.5K Fun and Games
- 3.8K MyFitnessPal Information
- 24 News and Announcements
- 1.1K Feature Suggestions and Ideas
- 2.6K MyFitnessPal Tech Support Questions