March 2016 Running Challenge

1575860626385

Replies

  • vandinem
    vandinem Posts: 550 Member
    Date      Miles      MTD
    ------    -----    -----
    Mar 01      3.7      3.7
    Mar 02      3.8T     7.5
    Mar 04      3.8     11.3
    Mar 08      4.1T    15.4
    Mar 10      5.1     20.5
    Mar 12      6.5     27.0
    Mar 13      5.1     32.1
    Mar 15      3.5T    35.6 Hills, L8, 6.5MPH, 30+
    Mar 17      4.0T    39.6 Hills, L10, 6.5MPH, 35+
    Mar 19      6.5     46.1+
    Mar 20      3.0     49.1
    Mar 22      4.5T    53.6 QS 6.5-7.0, 42m
    

    exercise.png
  • greenolivetree
    greenolivetree Posts: 1,282 Member
    @ccnagain When I first started running I would only run on house-less streets (undeveloped neighborhood) because I was so embarrassed! It goes away :)

    @4leighbee I think the same thing every work commute! I see all the runners and wish I were running rather than driving to or from work.

    No run for me today. Crazy windy and I was due a rest day. From running. I did do an hour strength training. Tomorrow is storms plus I've gotten sicker (so congested) so probably no running until Friday but maybe Thursday.
  • ariceroni
    ariceroni Posts: 422 Member
    3/01: 3 miles, easy (am)
    3/01: 6 miles, 2x1 mile at LTP (7:30) then 800m @ 5K pace (pm)
    3/02: 6 miles, easy
    3/03: 5 miles, 5x800m @ 6:45 pace with 400m recovery jog between
    3/04: 5 miles, easy
    3/05: 6 miles, easy
    3/06: 13.1 miles, long and easy
    3/07: Off, have the flu
    3/08: 4.25 miles, easy
    3/09: 5 miles, easy (am)
    3/09: 5 miles, easy (pm)
    3/10: 4.75 miles, 3x800m @ 6:45 pace + 2x400m @ 6:30 pace with 400m recovery jog between
    3/11: 5 miles, super easy
    3/12: 2 miles, warm up
    3/12: 5K race, 23:27
    3/13: 9 miles, easy with strong finish
    3/14: 5 miles, easy
    3/15: 5 miles, 1.5 miles at LT pace (7:40)
    3/16: 5 miles, easy
    3/17: 5 miles, 3x1/2 mile @ 7:00 pace with 1/2 mile recovery
    3/18: Off, rest day
    3/19: 3 miles, easy with quick finish
    3/20: 10 mile race, 1:19:39
    3/21: 4 miles, easy
    3/22: 5 miles, easy
    Total: 124.84 miles

    Overview:
    Today’s run was an easy 5 miles after work. Nothing like a beautiful run along Lake Michigan to welcome me back to Chicago running! My legs are still a little sore from the race sunday, but not too bad. Had a little pain in my right plantar fascia though, which I’ve never experienced before. My calves are really tight though so I think that might have something to do with it? Hopefully nothing a little foam rolling and icing can’t fix!


    exercise.png


    Races I'm registered for:
    03/20 - Excalibur 10 Miler 1:19:39 - PR and 2nd in my age group!
    03/26 - Chicago Quarter Marathon
    04/03 - Shamrock Shuffle (8K)
    04/09 - Chi Town Half Marathon
    04/24 - Ravenswood Run (5K)
    05/28 - Soldier Field Run (10 miles)
    10/09 - Chicago Marathon
    11/27 - Space Coast Half Marathon
  • MobyCarp
    MobyCarp Posts: 2,927 Member
    Stoshew71 wrote: »
    I refuse to run 50 yards. A waste of time for me. LOL

    Last year, when someone was trying to talk me into running a mile race, I told them I hadn't done much sprinting. Big mistake. I got a long lecture on how a mile isn't a sprint, complete with a discussion of race strategies for a mile.

    Funny thing, aside from the ridiculously short distances and time involved, those race strategies sounded a lot like standard advice for a half - don't go out too fast or you'll fad at the finish, pace yourself, finish strong, etc. But from my perspective, the only strategy for a mile race is just run as fast as I can. It looks like a sprint to me.

  • MobyCarp
    MobyCarp Posts: 2,927 Member
    March Running Totals (miles)
    [2/28 – 7.78 easy]
    [2/29 – 7.22 easy + 4 strides]
    3/1 – 9.31 warm up + 8 x Yasso 800s
    3/2 – 6.02 easy
    3/3 – 15.05 easy
    3/4 – scheduled rest day
    3/5 – 17.01 2 easy, 13 MP, 2 easy
    Weekly total 62.39 vs. target 62

    3/6 – 7.70 easy
    3/7 – 8.17 easy + 4 strides
    3/8 – 11.67 warm up, speed work, cool down
    3/9 – 11.03 easy
    3/10 – 8.92 warm up, speed work, cool down
    3/11 – scheduled rest day
    3/12 – 15.10 easy 2 solo, pace 8, race 5
    Weekly total 62.59 vs. target 62

    3/13 – 11.00 – 4 easy, 3 MP, 4 easy
    3/14 – 5.74 easy + 4 strides
    3/15 – 7.96 easy
    3/16 – 9.41 easy
    3/17 – 9.79 easy
    3/18 – scheduled rest day 2.38 easy
    3/19 – 22.03 (14 with 8:00 pace group + 8 solo)
    Weekly total 68.31 vs. target 68

    3/20 – 7.39 easy with stride at end
    3/21 – 8.24 easy + 4 strides
    3/22 – 11.46 easy, speed work, easy
    3/23 –
    3/24 –
    3/25 –
    3/26 –
    Weekly total TBD vs. target 62

    March total to date – 205.38

    Goal – 56, 62, or 68 miles per week, per training plan
    Expected March total - ~282 miles

    Today's notes – Today's assignment was 10 x Yasso 800s. That was not going to happen with my iffy ankle. The club assignment was 1 x 800 at T, 1 x 800 at I, 2 x 1000 at I, all with same time recovery. The course was on Cobb's Hill, with distances marked with cross country marking cones. I figured I could follow someone whose T pace was slower than mine, get a little easy speed work, and not stress the ankle much. I followed Bill.

    Turns out Bill was following people who are faster than he is. I lagged behind, and when I got to the 800m mark the lap said 3:15. Say what? I may as well be running Yassos. So I ran 3 more of them, at 3:11, 3:06, and 3:10. Then my better judgment took hold, and I decided I didn't want to chance the ankle through 10 of these. Ran easy miles to fill out my estimate of what I needed for the day, except I ran the 4 x 50m uphill strides that were assigned to the club. Tomorrow I'll find out if I did too much for the ankle; right now it feels okay.

    In the back of my mind was the idea that 4 x 800m is approximately 2 miles, and Thursday's assignment calls for a total of 2 miles at T pace. If the ankle is okay with 4 x 800 at something slightly faster than T, it should be okay through Thursday's workout at MP and T.

    Upcoming races:
    March 26, 2016 Spring Forward Distance Run 15K (Mendon, NY)
    April 18, 2016 Boston Marathon (Hopkinton, MA)
    April 24, 2016 Flower City Challenge Half Marathon (Rochester, NY)
  • rcsmom2002
    rcsmom2002 Posts: 13 Member
    3/1: 3.25 miles (beautiful day!)
    3/2: 2 miles (indoor track)
    3/5: 3.5 miles (treadmill)
    3/7: 3.25 miles (another nice day)
    3/9: 2.75 (outside)
    3/13: 2.42 (indoor track)
    3/17: 3.19 (Outside. Hello, allergies!)
    3/20: 3.08 (treadmill)
    3/22: 2.88 (indoor track)

    exercise.png

    Upcoming races:
    4/16/16: ODU Big Blue 5K (Norfolk, VA)
    8/6/16: Coast Guard 5K (Portsmouth, VA)
  • 4leighbee
    4leighbee Posts: 1,275 Member
    @rcsmom2002 ... I'm in wmbg - we must be close! :)
  • vandinem
    vandinem Posts: 550 Member
    I believe I am currently on pace to hit my goal by March 34th
  • skippygirlsmom
    skippygirlsmom Posts: 4,433 Member
    MobyCarp wrote: »
    Stoshew71 wrote: »
    I refuse to run 50 yards. A waste of time for me. LOL

    Last year, when someone was trying to talk me into running a mile race, I told them I hadn't done much sprinting. Big mistake. I got a long lecture on how a mile isn't a sprint, complete with a discussion of race strategies for a mile.

    Funny thing, aside from the ridiculously short distances and time involved, those race strategies sounded a lot like standard advice for a half - don't go out too fast or you'll fad at the finish, pace yourself, finish strong, etc. But from my perspective, the only strategy for a mile race is just run as fast as I can. It looks like a sprint to me.

    We talk about this at track

    100m is dash run full out
    200m same
    400m same
    800m is a dash 95% speed first lap full out second
    1600m is considered a run, same with 3200m it's a run pacing involved

    Used to be 800m was considered a run but no more.

  • Virkati
    Virkati Posts: 679 Member
    3/1 - Last swim lesson with Davis
    3/2 - 3.28 Treadmill run
    3/3 - ** 3.27 Lunch walk
    3/4 - ** 2.11 Lunch walk
    3/5 - 5.4 Sloan's Lake (includes cool down)
    3/6 - 2.92 Treadmill make-up run
    3/7 - Rest
    3/8 - 2.31 Treadmill run
    3/9 - ** 2.65 Lunch walk
    3/10 - 2.92 Lunch run
    3/11 - Rest
    3/12 - Rest
    3/13 - Lazy
    3/14 - 3.87 (includes cool down)
    3/15 - Swim lesson with Jason
    3/16 - Life Day
    3/17 - 3.42 Treadmill Run, swim lesson cancelled
    3/18 - Last Lenten Fish Fry so I'm calling it a Life-Lazy-eat all the food day
    3/19 - 6.7 (includes cool down) long slow run after swimming a half mile.
    3/20 - 3.89 Recovery run (includes cool down) and 100m in pool swimming with grandkids today.
    3/21 - 3.69 Third day in a row, legs like cement and super slow, but still felt pretty good
    322 - **2.23 Lunch walk, swim lesson

    04/24 Graffiti Run with grandkids - "Memaw's Mini Posse" is our team name!
    04/30 Greenland Trail Race...8 mile
    05/15 Colfax Marathon (Half)
    08/07 Tri for the Cure Sprint Triathlon
    09/05 Labor Day Mini Marathon (Half)
    10/16 Rock-n-Roll Denver Half

    **Ticker is run mileage only**
    exercise.png
  • Virkati
    Virkati Posts: 679 Member
    Saw the PT today. Wants me to only run 4 days a week and if I miss a day, to just let it go. (whaaaat???) I can re-work the training plan to just 4 days, but that means adding miles to the other days to maintain the mileage building. I hate to admit it, but I DO need to set some rest days in stone on my calendar. Otherwise he seems really happy with the progress I'm making, so yay for that.
  • Ron_Dco
    Ron_Dco Posts: 51 Member
    **** Not Running, taking rest for few days. Will start from Easter holidays :) ****

    @ddmom0811.. Thanks for the Advice, seems to be more than first mile problem I guess. I have taken a week off.
    @greenolivetree... Thanks for concern. I think I am sleeping bad, I checked that I have been sleeping around 5hrs / day from last two weeks. Might be the reason I guess. Have taken a week off and will resume once the work load decreases and get better sleep.
    @ceciliaslater.. Congratulations on completing the Marathon
    @shanaber... I stopped calorie counts which I used to do in MFP. Thought it as an overhead as I got the control I needed over chocolates, Ice-creams :). Eating before the run, yes I think I have stopped that, Might be that's the reason.. Thanks. Trying lots of things, Need to stop experimenting and need to stick to one plan.
    @WhatMeRunning, @Stoshew71 .. that's a great share. "Don't compare your chapter 1 to someone else's Chapter 20". I am two month infant in running world so I need to stop worrying on sub 30 5K etc :) and start "Comparing my Capter 2 to chapter 1 instead for motivation.
    @Meffordh.. Don't you worry you'll get there. I had the same thoughts that I can never run a 5K, I am not any better than you. But, after 2 months into running I am comfortable that I can run 5K any day. Just don't give up, we are still better than those who won't try. For advice and help there are so many Experts here they'll help you. Thanks @Stoshew71 for creating this thread.
  • 07KatieP13
    07KatieP13 Posts: 220 Member
    4.5 miles this morning, my longest run for a while and it felt good :)
  • Mari33a
    Mari33a Posts: 1,253 Member
    @07KatieP13 Glad your back on track!
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    @skippygirlsmom - Wow! I can't imagine a full out sprint for 800m!! That is just incredible.

    Truth be told though I might not even have a full out sprint at all. I have done some shorter speedwork intervals at sprint distances at the fastest speed I was comfortable running at. But I suspect (know) that a true sprint is a different beast.

    I also can't imagine the stress of those 800m to 1600m efforts. When I do intervals of those distances there is still something left in reserve to run the recovery period and then do another. I am nowhere near completely spent. I would have no clue how to pace myself for blasting all my energy in such a short period. Long distances however, I can just adapt my pace so I can go the distance. Much easier.

    @Virkati - Good luck letting it go. Maybe just live vicariously off of this thread??
  • 4leighbee
    4leighbee Posts: 1,275 Member

    exercise.png


    Half-mile intervals today - felt great. Who else dreads the shower (and the sting of the water on whatever new rash you've acquired during your run)? I have tried a few things ... what are your secrets? I have a permanent sports bra line and I run sleeveless, so the undersides of my (musclebound, lol jk) triceps gets rubbed against my shirt.
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    I've switched my run to before waking the madhouse up and ready for their schools which means getting up at 4am. This morning I wanted to say F all that and snooze but got up any way. The wind had been howling all night with steady 25 to 30 mph winds from the south so I planned a mostly east/west out and back to avoid too much running against that wind. Despite not wanting to get out and run, and having the wind, I had a great run. Wound up running it sub-tempo effort even though I was shooting for easy, so I'll call it a steady state run so I sound like I am a smart run planner and all that. Truly though, with the actual pace, perceived effort and HR, it may be better referred to as a race pace run (HM target pace). Having all of it be the same feels encouraging that my target HM pace is entirely on target.

    3/1 - 5 miles
    3/2 - 5 miles
    3/3 - 5 miles
    3/4 - Rest
    3/5 - 12 miles
    3/6 - 5 miles
    3/7 - 5 miles
    3/8 - 5 miles
    3/9 - 5 miles
    3/10 - 5 miles
    3/11 - Rest
    3/12 - 12 miles
    3/13 - 5 miles
    3/14 - 5 miles
    3/15 - 5 miles
    3/16 - 5 miles
    3/17 - 5 miles
    3/18 - Rest
    3/19 - 12 miles
    3/20 - 5 miles
    3/21 - 4 miles
    3/22 - 4 miles
    3/23 - 4 miles

    118/150 Miles

    exercise.png

    Upcoming races:
    4/9 - Rock the Parkway half marathon (Kansas City, MO)
    4/16 - Garmin Wickedly Fast half marathon (Olathe, KS)
    4/23 - Race for Hope half marathon (North Kansas City, MO)
    5/1 - Buffalo Bell Stampede half marathon (Leavenworth, KS)
    5/14 - Running with the Cows half marathon (Bucyrus, KS)
    6/2 - Hospital Hill 5k 7pm PRE-RUN (Kansas City, MO)
    6/3 - Hospital Hill half marathon 7am RE-RUN (Kansas City, MO)
    10/15 - Kansas City Marathon 26.2 (Kansas City, MO)
    11/5 - Jenks half marathon (Jenks, OK)
    11/6 - Kansas half marathon (Lawrence, KS)
    11/12 - Longview half marathon (Kansas City, MO)
    11/13 - Gobbler Grind half marathon (Overland Park, KS)
    11/19 - White River half marathon (Cotter, AR)
    11/20 - Pilgrim Pacer half marathon (Lenexa, KS)
  • lillymacki55
    lillymacki55 Posts: 35 Member
    03/01 3.23
    03/02 3.19
    03/03 3.17
    03/04 3.27
    03/05 6.83
    03/06 8.15
    03/07 3.17
    03/08 3.43
    03/09 3.59
    03/10 6.25
    03/11 2.70
    03/12 0.00 (16 mile bike ride)
    03/13 7.01
    03/14 3.09
    03/15 3.28
    03/17 3.34
    03/18 5.21
    03/19 4.90
    03/20 7.01
    03/21 2.79
    03/22 3.11
    03/23 3.29

    TOTAL 91.9
    GOAL 100


    exercise.png



  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    4leighbee wrote: »

    exercise.png


    Half-mile intervals today - felt great. Who else dreads the shower (and the sting of the water on whatever new rash you've acquired during your run)? I have tried a few things ... what are your secrets? I have a permanent sports bra line and I run sleeveless, so the undersides of my (musclebound, lol jk) triceps gets rubbed against my shirt.
    Body glide is my friend in chafing situations. I have a pair of winter running tights that will chafe right where my upper thigh meets my butt cheek. A shower reminds me if I did not use body glide ahead of time. With it however, no issues. Hope that helps!

    Oh, and while it does sting, it kind of makes me smile, like it is proof that I worked hard. But it is no fun if it interferes with future runs.
  • ErynVee
    ErynVee Posts: 187 Member

    exercise.png


    3.5 yesterday!
  • skippygirlsmom
    skippygirlsmom Posts: 4,433 Member
    edited March 2016
    UGH I'm so freaking pissed off. Yesterday my knee/ITB started to hurt during my run. After almost of month of no pain. After a bit it let off so I kept running and it was uncomfortable but not awful when I was done. By 7:00 last night I could hardly walk on it. Did lots of stretching and all. This morning it didn't hurt when I got up so I got dressed and went out, I didn't even get a 1/4 mile when the pain was so bad I could hardly walk again. Came home and got Macy and decided to try and walk it off. The pain is less, but still hurts like hell. I was just released from PT on Friday, I haven't done a thing differently then I was. I'm so over this, so much for my HM in 3 weeks.

    @whatmerunning I can't imagine it either, the only time I've done a full sprint was if I was chasing the ice cream truck :wink: We have boys who do the 800m in under 2 minutes. Yipe! Skip's goal is 2:30 before the end of the year, that is still taking 20 seconds off her time. That is rough.
  • 4leighbee
    4leighbee Posts: 1,275 Member
    4leighbee wrote: »

    exercise.png


    Half-mile intervals today - felt great. Who else dreads the shower (and the sting of the water on whatever new rash you've acquired during your run)? I have tried a few things ... what are your secrets? I have a permanent sports bra line and I run sleeveless, so the undersides of my (musclebound, lol jk) triceps gets rubbed against my shirt.
    Body glide is my friend in chafing situations. I have a pair of winter running tights that will chafe right where my upper thigh meets my butt cheek. A shower reminds me if I did not use body glide ahead of time. With it however, no issues. Hope that helps!

    Oh, and while it does sting, it kind of makes me smile, like it is proof that I worked hard. But it is no fun if it interferes with future runs.

    I totally get that!
  • mbaker566
    mbaker566 Posts: 11,233 Member
    1-nothing yet
    2-yoga
    3-sicker yet. sick sick sick
    4-still sick
    so since i had no running to blog about i made a blog with some running memes.
    Happy Friday
    5-nothing
    6-nothing
    7-3.77, it felt nice. lots of people out so dog couldn't come with. i have to keep working on socialization
    8-nothing yet
    9-yoga
    10-new medicine-nauseous
    11-yoga
    12-Great Pi Race 5k. great time with some horrible hills. I would have had an amazing time without them and as it was i still beat my last 5k by 2:37min. Stepdaughter to be got second in her age group. i was 20 out of 36.
    13-rest day
    14-4.87mi happy bunny
    15-no run (yet) knee and kidneys are sore.
    16-no run-kidney's still hurt
    17-carpool-no run. grumble.
    18-carpool and slush fell from the sky this morning. so I vinyasa/power aerial yoga-ed
    19-car shopping
    20-family stuff
    21-6.13mi not easy not too hard. well the first 15 min were awful but then it settled in.
    22-wedding stuff to do, hip hurts-yoga tonight
    23-more yoga

    RACES:
    Jan 16-Frosty 5k-33:43:123 (gun time-don't have chip time)
    Feb 13-Steve Cullen Run 8k chip time: 53:37
    Feb 15 Puppy Love Virtual Run 10k runkeeper time: 1:13:20
    Mar 12-Great Pi Run 5k 32:17
    May 7-Door County Half Marathon
    ?Jun 11-Rock n Sole 5 or 8k? honeymoon might interfere
    June 19th through Sunday, July 10th SHE Power Virtual Half


    exercise.png



  • Elise4270
    Elise4270 Posts: 8,375 Member
    @shanaber dang! So sorry about the ITB. I hope another round of PT helps? Did they do ultrasound therapy? It helped in some of my soft tissue areas (shoulder, butt). Really feel for ya.. :frowning:
  • kristinegift
    kristinegift Posts: 2,406 Member
    3/1: Rest day
    3/2: 12 miles (am), 5 miles (pm)
    3/3: 7 miles speedwork (am), 6 miles with Thursday crew (pm)
    3/4: Rest day
    3/5: 7.3 miles
    3/6: 15.2 miles
    3/7: 6 miles with Joe to Go crew
    3/8: Rest day
    3/9: 12 miles (am), 5 miles (pm)
    3/10: 8 miles (am), 6 miles with Thursday crew (pm)
    3/11: Rest day
    3/12: 5.6 miles (2.5 mile warm up and 5k race)
    3/13: 18 miles
    3/14: Impromptu rest day
    3/15: 6 miles (am), 8 miles (pm)
    3/16: 10 miles (am), 7 miles with Wednesday crew (pm)
    3/17: DC mini-vacation
    3/18: DC mini-vacation
    3/19: 7.2 miles
    3/20: 20 birthday miles!
    3/21: 6 miles with Joe to Go crew
    3/22: Rest day!
    3/23: 10 miles (am)

    10 good miles this morning! Perfect springtime weather -- not too hot, not too cold -- and barely a breeze. My calf feels much better, though I think it affected my gait more than I thought. Lots of roving aches today, probably my muscles are trying to get back to normal after a week+ of running a little weird due to the calf stiffness. Oops. 6 more this afternoon, and the high is going to be 70 today, so I'm excited to get out in the heat!

    exercise.png


    Upcoming Races:
    3/12: Run O' The Mill 5K: New PR! 21:55
    4/3: Caesar Rodney HM (Wilmington, DE)
    4/16: River Horse 6K (Ewing, NJ)
    5/1: New Jersey Marathon (Lots of towns, NJ)
  • kristinegift
    kristinegift Posts: 2,406 Member
    edited March 2016
    @WhatMeRunning That's one thing I don't miss about living in the middle of the US... the winds! 25-30 mph winds are a rare thing out here. Now I think 10-15 mph is horrendous :D

    @4leighbee Re; Chafing: I found that Body Glide didn't quite do the trick for me. I have a travel sized tub of Vaseline that I take with me to races and it sits on my bathroom counter otherwise. I put the Vaseline under my sports bra and on my toes and anywhere else I may need it. It's thicker so I find it works better for some tricky spots. Since I started using Vaseline, my perma-chafe from my VS sports bras (which sadly I must retire as they are now too big :'( ) has disappeared.
  • pcarvalho3
    pcarvalho3 Posts: 36 Member

    exercise.png


    Another 5.5k at the Y track. Right knee is bothering a bit. I'll try some strengthening work tonight.
  • MNLittleFinn
    MNLittleFinn Posts: 4,271 Member
    Does anyone else find rest days harder than run days? Today is a rest day....and I just do a little walking and maybe some abs later, and thats it.....I feel like a race horse in the starting gate and can't wait until 0500 tomorrow when I can run again.....But I'm keeping it at 4 days a week for the time being, unless I need to add a 5th in the summer to get the mileage I need to train for the half.
  • GBrady43068
    GBrady43068 Posts: 1,256 Member
    vandinem wrote: »
    I believe I am currently on pace to hit my goal by March 34th

    :D
  • WhatMeRunning
    WhatMeRunning Posts: 3,538 Member
    edited March 2016
    @skippygirlsmom - I hope you get this pain figured out. Maybe some ibuprofen for a couple days might do the trick? Only mentioning because I have been dealing with some occasional piriformis or sciatica type pain which a couple months ago I chalked up to an adductor, then maybe hamstring until I really checked it all out to isolate it. In that case it is about alleviating the inflammation to allow proper circulation and healing back to the area, and careful stretching and strength building to address the root cause without aggravating it more while building up my miles still. I have actually had it flare up when I get too aggressive on either strength or speed, so I stick with running easy for now (and won't visit the trainer at that gym for a while). So far this system has worked. Hoping you might have a similar way out.