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Keto VS Paleo
sweatinginpearls
Posts: 17 Member
in Debate Club
Which one do you think is healthier? Have you had any results? Did you keep the weight off?
I've been eating a more Keto friendly diet here lately and I've found that my appetite has subsided. Is this normal?
I've been eating a more Keto friendly diet here lately and I've found that my appetite has subsided. Is this normal?
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Why do the diets have to battle to the death?
The best diet is the one that is the personally the most sustainable and the easiest for you to maintain a caloric deficit. If that's paleo...great. If that's keto...great. If that's IIFYM....great. If it is everything in moderation....great.
I get what you mean. For me, I find it interesting to know how each diet affected different people. Some people experience bloating from going Keto where as I haven't. This is meant to be fun, and informative. I by no means want to bash the way someone is reaching their goals!
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Low carbs, vs. even lower carbs. I tried Paleo for about six weeks. I found intense exercise to be exhausting, and even when just working at my desk job I felt dull and easily distracted. So I'm never even going to try straight Keto. Neither works for me, I need carbs for physical and mental performance.
John Jackson: "It's time someone had the courage to stand up and say: I'm against those things that everybody hates."
Jack Johnson: "Now, I respect my opponent. I think he's a good man. But quite frankly, I agree with everything he just said."
John Jackson: "I say your three cent titanium tax goes too far!"
Jack Johnson: "And I say your three cent titanium tax doesn't go too far enough!"0 -
I've never tried paleo, so can't comment on that. However, I've done keto almost thrice now, so can speak a little about it.
In my experience, keto is the best diet that I've induced upon myself for fat loss. The beauty is its also muscle sparing.. So you tend to lose fat with very little muscle loss.. And the changed are drastic.. Over these three cycles of 4-6 weeks approx, I've shed from 32% BF to 21% BF ..
However , in my experience I've found that after keto, my body became even more sensitive to carbs.. Just a bit of carbs like 75gms from brown rice resulted in significant rise in BF %.. This is just my experience and I'm not generalizing this behaviour..
Cheers!0 -
I've never tried paleo, so can't comment on that. However, I've done keto almost thrice now, so can speak a little about it.
In my experience, keto is the best diet that I've induced upon myself for fat loss. The beauty is its also muscle sparing.. So you tend to lose fat with very little muscle loss.. And the changed are drastic.. Over these three cycles of 4-6 weeks approx, I've shed from 32% BF to 21% BF ..
However , in my experience I've found that after keto, my body became even more sensitive to carbs.. Just a bit of carbs like 75gms from brown rice resulted in significant rise in BF %.. This is just my experience and I'm not generalizing this behaviour..
Cheers!
How are you measuring BF?0 -
Low carbs, vs. even lower carbs. I tried Paleo for about six weeks. I found intense exercise to be exhausting, and even when just working at my desk job I felt dull and easily distracted. So I'm never even going to try straight Keto. Neither works for me, I need carbs for physical and mental performance.
John Jackson: "It's time someone had the courage to stand up and say: I'm against those things that everybody hates."
Jack Johnson: "Now, I respect my opponent. I think he's a good man. But quite frankly, I agree with everything he just said."
John Jackson: "I say your three cent titanium tax goes too far!"
Jack Johnson: "And I say your three cent titanium tax doesn't go too far enough!"
Wow, I've been extra tired lately and have been experiencing a lot of headaches and migraines. I thought it was just because of the time change but maybe it is because of my strict low carb diet.3 -
I've never tried paleo, so can't comment on that. However, I've done keto almost thrice now, so can speak a little about it.
In my experience, keto is the best diet that I've induced upon myself for fat loss. The beauty is its also muscle sparing.. So you tend to lose fat with very little muscle loss.. And the changed are drastic.. Over these three cycles of 4-6 weeks approx, I've shed from 32% BF to 21% BF ..
However , in my experience I've found that after keto, my body became even more sensitive to carbs.. Just a bit of carbs like 75gms from brown rice resulted in significant rise in BF %.. This is just my experience and I'm not generalizing this behaviour..
Cheers!
I've been on Keto for roughly two weeks and I feel like the pounds are melting off. I don't feel hungry as often but like I stated above, I have been getting a lot of headaches and I could literally nap all day. Are you experiencing any of that? Also, do you measure your BF from a scale? I used to use the aria scale for Fitbit and found it to be highly inaccurate. To the point to where I could stand on it, stand off, and stand back on and it would be significantly different. Have you experienced this, or do you have a different method?0 -
I always thought paleo was about specific foods rather than specific macro ratios. I think many could be keto and paleo at the same time, and some are just keto or just paleo... I suppose part of it is just what diet you identify with the most.
I really like the ideas behind the paleo diet. Seems like real food. I think a blanket restriction of dairy may not be needed for people who can handle dairy fine, but it mostly makes sense. Seems like a healthier than average diet.
I follow keto and have for about 9-10 months. It works really well for me. I lost about 40 lbs in the first 4-5 months and have had no problem keeping it off. My diet is paleo like but I include full fat dairy like cheese, butter, 14% sour cream, and heavy whipping cream. I tend to avoid foods made from almond or coconut flour, as well as all grains, just because I don't think I need it, nor do I want it badly. I also avoid natural sugar substitutes like honey since it's all just glucose in the end and I have some insulin resistance that doesn't benefit from sugars.
The other benefits of keto for me was eliminating reactive hypoglycemia, lower blood glucose, better skin, better mental clarity, less autoimmune pain and symptoms. and better and more stable energy. For someone like me with a few health issues, going very low carb can really help.
@caurinus It is possible that your lack of energy was due in part to an electrolyte imbalance that most will experience when carbs are reduced. Increasing sodium to 3000-5000 mg per day usually fixes that; possibly a potassium and magnesium supplement would have helped too.
Also, It takes a few weeks for the body to become adapted to using some ketones for energy (which would have occurred to a lesser degree if your carbs were under 150g per day. Once people get through that, there is no difference in energy levels.
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There are tons of highly nutritious carbohydrates so personally, I don't think avoiding carbs is healthier than eating carbs. I personally see no reason to do keto absent a medical condition that would require being super low carb...otherwise I'd think it torture.
Paleo emphasizes whole foods which is cool...but then they turn around and demonize perfectly nutritious whole foods like legumes. Also, I don't think there's anything inherently evil about wheat or dairy...so Paleo would also be a no go.
I just eat a highly nutritious and well balanced diet made up primarily of whole foods and minimally processed foods.3 -
@nvmomketo wow, very informative. I really appreciated that. I think I have a fear of intaking too much sodium. I've always associated sodium with bloating and water retention so I've tried to keep that as low as possible. I'll try to raise my sodium intake, and make some tweaks to my diet and see if that helps with the headaches and tiredness. Thanks for sharing!0
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@cwolfman13 do you think it's because you're a male? I only ask this because I've notice the way women and men lose weight are differently. Men require more calories than women right? So wouldn't restricting your carbs do more harm than good solely because you're a man? If that's ignorant of me I'm sorry - I'm genuinely curious0
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Something in between works well for me, sort of Paleo minus yams, with dairy, or Keto with an emphasis on vegetables and a serving of fruit on most days. Also in my diet, and not in Paleo or Keto, a small serving of full on starchy legumes every day or two.0
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Of the two paleo is more consistent with how I like to eat (and it allows for a range of carbs, so they aren't really a good comparison -- I just gave this link elsewhere: http://robbwolf.com/2014/12/04/using-evolution-and-exercise-physiology-to-customize-your-carb-intake/).
However, I'm not really a fan of either for me or as a blanket prescription. I know keto works for some and can be done healthfully (or not) and same with paleo -- indeed, although I don't totally understand it, I think paleo helps some start eating better by making it fun or something or providing a structure. No reason you can't do the same things without it, and the truth is the things I like about paleo (focus on the source of meat, lots of vegetables, lots of home cooked foods, eating the whole animal, stuff like that) are things I think are common to the way many people eat and don't require that they be paired with unnecessary (IMO) restrictions on grains, legumes, and dairy. Indeed, apart from those things there's no real effort to eat in a pre-agricultural way (which is fine, since not possible) and the way of eating is more like someone trying to go back to the early 20th century, perhaps, than paleo times. And there are many exceptions even to that, like currently tons of paleo packaged goods.
(I got this paleo granola that's local but carried by my WF for free (not from the WF, from the manufacturer when I bought something else), and while the idea is kind of funny (I mean, paleo packaged goods) it was crazy delicious. Also about a million calories for any reasonable sized serving, sadly.)0 -
sweatinginpearls wrote: »@nvmomketo wow, very informative. I really appreciated that. I think I have a fear of intaking too much sodium. I've always associated sodium with bloating and water retention so I've tried to keep that as low as possible. I'll try to raise my sodium intake, and make some tweaks to my diet and see if that helps with the headaches and tiredness. Thanks for sharing!
That was me too. I didn't even salt my food last year because I kept hearing how too much salt is bad. Now I salt everything, including my coffee.0 -
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Paleo had too many restrictions for my liking. I tried it 9 months and just kept spinning my wheels in terms of weight loss since calories still matter. I would like to point out that Paleo is NOT low carb. It can be low carb, but it's far from it. I was eating over 200g of carbs a day. I would never touch Keto since my body runs a lot better with carbs. Hell, I can't even go below 150g without feeling like crap and my workouts suffering.0
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sweatinginpearls wrote: »@nvmomketo wow, very informative. I really appreciated that. I think I have a fear of intaking too much sodium. I've always associated sodium with bloating and water retention so I've tried to keep that as low as possible. I'll try to raise my sodium intake, and make some tweaks to my diet and see if that helps with the headaches and tiredness. Thanks for sharing!
Sodium is an electrolyte. The more active you are, the more you need. You can also offset some of the bloating effects of sodium by eating foods high in potassium and magnesium. In fact, many active people need a lot more than the daily recommended. 2500mg is only for sedentary people.0 -
sweatinginpearls wrote: »@cwolfman13 do you think it's because you're a male? I only ask this because I've notice the way women and men lose weight are differently. Men require more calories than women right? So wouldn't restricting your carbs do more harm than good solely because you're a man? If that's ignorant of me I'm sorry - I'm genuinely curious
Men and women lose weight the same weight....by eating less than they burn.
After I asked the question I researched and found that because men have more muscle man than us women they lose about 20 more calories than women by doing nothing. If a man was to restrict the same amount of calories and and did the same thing as a woman he would lose more weight.0 -
sweatinginpearls wrote: »sweatinginpearls wrote: »@cwolfman13 do you think it's because you're a male? I only ask this because I've notice the way women and men lose weight are differently. Men require more calories than women right? So wouldn't restricting your carbs do more harm than good solely because you're a man? If that's ignorant of me I'm sorry - I'm genuinely curious
Men and women lose weight the same weight....by eating less than they burn.
After I asked the question I researched and found that because men have more muscle man than us women they lose about 20 more calories than women by doing nothing. If a man was to restrict the same amount of calories and and did the same thing as a woman he would lose more weight.
But that's not what she said.
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sweatinginpearls wrote: »sweatinginpearls wrote: »@cwolfman13 do you think it's because you're a male? I only ask this because I've notice the way women and men lose weight are differently. Men require more calories than women right? So wouldn't restricting your carbs do more harm than good solely because you're a man? If that's ignorant of me I'm sorry - I'm genuinely curious
Men and women lose weight the same weight....by eating less than they burn.
After I asked the question I researched and found that because men have more muscle man than us women they lose about 20 more calories than women by doing nothing. If a man was to restrict the same amount of calories and and did the same thing as a woman he would lose more weight.
Shorter people also burn less calories than taller people. Short people do not lose weight differently than tall ones.0 -
I'd choose Keto because there's no way I'd give up cheese and peanut butter.2
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my answer is that neither is "healthier"
a healthy diet is one that you meet your micro nutrient and macro nutrient goals...
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sweatinginpearls wrote: »Wow, I've been extra tired lately and have been experiencing a lot of headaches and migraines. I thought it was just because of the time change but maybe it is because of my strict low carb diet.
What you're going through is widely known as the "keto flu". It's the period during which your body is adapting to the lack of carbohydrates. Lots of advice out there on how to deal with it (just search for that term); what helped my wife and me the most was good bouillon, at least a couple of times a day. For most people, keto flu passes within just a couple of weeks or so and then their energy returns to normal.0 -
Paleo seems to be more of the "hippie BS" type of diet, where its all organic with arbitrary restrictions. Keto is just using fat and protein as your primary fuel sources rather than carbohydrates, and keeping net carbs (carbs minus fiber) under a certain threshold. The threshold is different for different people, for me I can stay in ketosis if I'm under about 50 net carbs a day, which is very easy to do. Feeling like crap is usually called the "keto flu" but as someone above mentioned, it can usually be easily remedied by upping your sodium intake and making sure you're getting the right vitamins and minerals daily.
Also I've recently been making Keto Chow as a meal replacement thing, and then I just have some extra meats, cheeses, and veggies at night if I still feel hungry. Like last night I had some awesome sous-vide hanger steak (5oz cooked on my plate, I was nice and shared half with my wife) with bloody mary pan sauce, and asparagus sauteed in bacon fat. I had some Beecher's cheese curds as a snack when I got home from work (1.5oz), and my total calorie intake for the day was 1867.
I can definitely say that on Keto Chow, I have never experienced keto flu symptoms, and I'm getting a decent rate of weight loss so far.0 -
@caurinus It is possible that your lack of energy was due in part to an electrolyte imbalance that most will experience when carbs are reduced. Increasing sodium to 3000-5000 mg per day usually fixes that; possibly a potassium and magnesium supplement would have helped too.
Also, It takes a few weeks for the body to become adapted to using some ketones for energy (which would have occurred to a lesser degree if your carbs were under 150g per day. Once people get through that, there is no difference in energy levels.
I would feel dizzy after a workout and unable to safely drive myself home from the gym. The gym personnel recommended Powerade, which I purchased from them, and it provided instant relief from the low blood sugar. This went on for six weeks before I finally said "to hell with this BS" and went back to a diet that was healthy for me.
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By the way, I know Powerade also has electrolytes, but I was operating under the assumption that it was low blood sugar that was the problem since the symptoms exactly matched low blood sugar. Later I always kept an emergency apple or a snack pack of Skittles in my gym bag in case it happened again, and in each case, a little sugar fixed the problem.0
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sweatinginpearls wrote: »sweatinginpearls wrote: »@cwolfman13 do you think it's because you're a male? I only ask this because I've notice the way women and men lose weight are differently. Men require more calories than women right? So wouldn't restricting your carbs do more harm than good solely because you're a man? If that's ignorant of me I'm sorry - I'm genuinely curious
Men and women lose weight the same weight....by eating less than they burn.
After I asked the question I researched and found that because men have more muscle man than us women they lose about 20 more calories than women by doing nothing. If a man was to restrict the same amount of calories and and did the same thing as a woman he would lose more weight.
Every person has a different amount of muscularity. That tends to change the rate they burn calories at rest, but not how they burn them. The metabolic reactions are the same, just more of them going on.1 -
By the way, I know Powerade also has electrolytes, but I was operating under the assumption that it was low blood sugar that was the problem since the symptoms exactly matched low blood sugar. Later I always kept an emergency apple or a snack pack of Skittles in my gym bag in case it happened again, and in each case, a little sugar fixed the problem.
It does sound like low blood sugar. Glucose falls, adrenalin goes up and BP falls. It doesn't feel good. I have reactive hypoglycemia so I used to experience that frequently. I had those symptoms when my BG fell to a 4-4.8, but now my BG can be a 3.8 and I still feel fine. Using a keto diet can get one past that though. It just takes a few days of not adding the sugar hit to treat the falling BG. Unless you are on insulin or a T1D, BG will not fall too low. A small handfull of nuts would work too, and without the high level of sugar.
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sweatinginpearls wrote: »@cwolfman13 do you think it's because you're a male? I only ask this because I've notice the way women and men lose weight are differently. Men require more calories than women right? So wouldn't restricting your carbs do more harm than good solely because you're a man? If that's ignorant of me I'm sorry - I'm genuinely curious
No...my wife loses weight just fine eating carbs...we're both big on oats, quinoa, brown rice, potatoes, sweet potatoes, lentils, legumes, etc...the difference is that she might have 1/2 cooked cup of quinoa with lunch while I'll have a whole cup. She might eat 1/2 a sweet potato while I eat a whole sweet potato. She might skip grains and starches at dinner while I partake...etc, etc, etc.
Men and women don't lose weight differently...we have different calorie requirements and you can move all kinds of stuff around to adjust for that.
I don't low carb, but carbs are my flex generally. Whether I'm eating to maintain or lose weight I eat about the same amount of protein and I eat about the same amount of dietary fat in grams...so when I want to lose weight, I generally cut back on carbs but that doesn't mean I low carb...it just happens to be the macro that I focus on to adjust my calorie intake.1
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