Bulking to Cutting Transition

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shanehaggs
shanehaggs Posts: 6 Member
in Health and Weight Loss
Hello I'm a 21 year old male, and have been lifting for 4 years. Sadly never have tracked my macros until now, and never cut until now... Over those four years I gained a total of 23 pounds and even though it is not all muscle I feel good about reaching my goal weight of 197lbs. I have decided it finally is time to "cut"and have been working out 6 days a week while counting calories. Any suggestions or advice that help you guys out to lose weight but retain muscle? My goal weight now is 180 lbs in 5 months or less. Thanks and give me a add if you want to help one another out!

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  • HamsterManV2
    HamsterManV2 Posts: 449 Member
    edited April 2016
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    1. Eat adequate protein. On a cut you need more, I believe it is 0.8g to 1g of lean body mass (calculate this on google, you need an estimate of your bodyfat %). SOURCES
    2. Keep lifting. This way your body knows not to get rid of muscle and it will instead cut from your fat stores.
    3. Aim to sleep 8 hours.
    4. Cardio helps but is not required - you can do low intensity cardio like jogging, or HIIT like sprints and interval rowing/hill work/etc.
    5. Eat -500 calories from your TDEE to lose weight. If you are coming from a bulk, maybe go to maintenance for a few weeks then jump down to -500 calories.

    Bonus: Eat most of your daily carb intake in the meals before and after your workout. This is known as carb cycling and it will provide easily accessible energy for your workout and recovery. Eat most of your fats in the other meals.

    Note: when lifting, keep your intensity the same but reduce the volume. So use the same weight but instead of 4 sets you do 3 sets, instead of 3 sets you do 2 sets. You don't have as much energy to go through so this is recommended.

    With these methods, you will lose mostly fat, with very minor muscle and strength loss. There are lots of scientific literature behind this so you can look around if you need to know (sometimes I find knowing the why is just as important as the how.)
  • tillerstouch
    tillerstouch Posts: 608 Member
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    I second the above! Just remember the smaller your calorie deficit the more muscle you will retain. Also be prepared, when you lower your calories you'll be amazed at how much less energy you have I just started my cut for this summer and it's always depressing when a week in you already have lost energy but keep pushing yourself.
  • pwrlipstick
    pwrlipstick Posts: 43 Member
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    Oh man, I started my cut today and I'm already miserable despite only being 300 cals under maintenance. Solidarity, bruh.

    Drinking a metric ton of water helps, and also--and I can't stress this enough--being okay with the fact that your lifts will be a little bit weaker, initially. It's a bit of a mind-***k, but it's absolutely worth it in the end.
  • HamsterManV2
    HamsterManV2 Posts: 449 Member
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    pwrlipstick wrote: »
    Oh man, I started my cut today and I'm already miserable despite only being 300 cals under maintenance. Solidarity, bruh.

    Drinking a metric ton of water helps, and also--and I can't stress this enough--being okay with the fact that your lifts will be a little bit weaker, initially. It's a bit of a mind-***k, but it's absolutely worth it in the end.

    I find it helps to tell yourself that you are getting stronger by lifting the same weights at a lower bodyweight. You are becoming stronger pound for pound, and it is a necessity or else we would all be balloons lifting 500+lbs. Relative strength is just as important as absolute strength, and a balance is great.
  • HamsterManV2
    HamsterManV2 Posts: 449 Member
    edited April 2016
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    HamsterManV2 wrote: »
    1. Eat adequate protein. On a cut you need more, I believe it is 0.8g to 1g of lean body mass (calculate this on google, you need an estimate of your bodyfat %). SOURCES
    2. Keep lifting. This way your body knows not to get rid of muscle and it will instead cut from your fat stores.
    3. Aim to sleep 8 hours.
    4. Cardio helps but is not required - you can do low intensity cardio like jogging, or HIIT like sprints and interval rowing/hill work/etc.
    5. Eat -500 calories from your TDEE to lose weight. If you are coming from a bulk, maybe go to maintenance for a few weeks then jump down to -500 calories.

    Bonus: Eat most of your daily carb intake in the meals before and after your workout. This is known as carb cycling and it will provide easily accessible energy for your workout and recovery. Eat most of your fats in the other meals.

    Note: when lifting, keep your intensity the same but reduce the volume. So use the same weight but instead of 4 sets you do 3 sets, instead of 3 sets you do 2 sets. You don't have as much energy to go through so this is recommended.

    With these methods, you will lose mostly fat, with very minor muscle and strength loss. There are lots of scientific literature behind this so you can look around if you need to know (sometimes I find knowing the why is just as important as the how.)

    Sorry, to clarify point #1, it is 0.8g to 1g per LB of lean body mass. So if I were 170lbs @ 15% bodyfat, I would consume 115g to 144g of protein a day (or more) on my cut, while lifting the same weights or slightly lower with lower volume.
  • shanehaggs
    shanehaggs Posts: 6 Member
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    Thanks for all the tips and support guys! I do find it hard when I'm in the gym to reduce my weight when doing something such as shoulder press because I'm so use to increasing weight and having that "strong man" mentality. @HamsterManV2 I am currently doing everything you said in your 5 points above and eating 500 calories under my TDEE at 2600 calories a day. I bought whole grain bagels, spaghetti squash and such to try and help get me those good carbs that I have been having trouble getting to reach my daily goal. Any tips or things to eat or to do in order to get those needed carbs? My daily carb goal is 228 grams.
    P.S- didn't know about carb cycling but I like it, thanks!
  • shanehaggs
    shanehaggs Posts: 6 Member
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    @tillerstouch Yes I have noticed some energy lost but I still push myself to make sure I make the best use of my time in the gym, thanks for the support! I think I'm going to add more carbs before my workout to try and give myself that extra boost. I also take C4 pre workout and that seems to help, however I am unsure if I should stop taking it because it has creatine and I don't want to take in too much water weight. Anybody have advice on that?
  • Mlund95
    Mlund95 Posts: 5 Member
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    Great progress so far! Remember to keep consistent with your diet, but make sure you're giving yourself enough to keep going! You don't want to starve yourself.

    I know tuna fish, chicken breasts, salmon, and fat free milk are all great things to eat while you're cutting!

    Best of luck!
  • HamsterManV2
    HamsterManV2 Posts: 449 Member
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    Have a list of things you know you like / that are easy to prepare for carbs, fats, and protein. This way you just have to mix and match things to hit your macros. i.e. My list:

    High Carb (that are mostly carb and little protein/fat):
    Bananas, Quick Oats, Rice, Toast. I never make pasta but you can give that a try (I save the very high carbs for the bulk). These are all mostly carbs so they are great to get your carb macro up.

    High Protein (that are mostly protein and little carb/fat):
    Chicken breast or thighs, protein powder, greek yogurt, cottage cheese.

    Fast food for high carb and high protein meals in a pinch:
    Chipotle- Burrito bowl (brown rice, black beans, chicken or/and steak, salsa, veggies) = 560cals (63carb,44pro,14fat) for 1 meat, 750cals (65carb, 74pro, 20fat) for 2 meats.
    Harveys (burger joint in Canada) - Double grilled chicken burger - its basically 2 slices of bread and 2 grilled chicken breasts. Solid macros.


  • tillerstouch
    tillerstouch Posts: 608 Member
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    shanehaggs wrote: »
    @tillerstouch Yes I have noticed some energy lost but I still push myself to make sure I make the best use of my time in the gym, thanks for the support! I think I'm going to add more carbs before my workout to try and give myself that extra boost. I also take C4 pre workout and that seems to help, however I am unsure if I should stop taking it because it has creatine and I don't want to take in too much water weight. Anybody have advice on that?

    Creatine is actually good for a cut. You'll have less energy to lift but the water retention from the creatine will help you keep a couple extra lifts. If you care about numbers on a scale stop taking it but if your real goal is to change your body I'd keep it. Plus it'll keep your muscles looking full. Remember though creatine is a supplement that needs to become saturated in your muscles, that's why you take it every day.
  • shanehaggs
    shanehaggs Posts: 6 Member
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    @tillerstouch that makes a lot of sense, I'll make sure to keep it in my daily schedule, and on my off days I have creapure which I'll take 5 grams of. I recently cycled off it for 2 months so I think this would be a great time to cycle back on for a bit. Are you on any sort of diet or workout plan now, just curious?
  • lizzelspark
    lizzelspark Posts: 178 Member
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    Great tips !! Can a girl use the same when she's trying to cut too ?
  • shanehaggs
    shanehaggs Posts: 6 Member
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    @HamsterManV2 great foods, I wrote some of them down for my next trip to the grocery store thanks.
    @Mlund95 thanks for the motivation and advice. Surprisingly I am doing okay and never feel like I need to eat more. If I do get a craving for more food I make sure that I will be within my macros before I eat my next food item and then I dive in for a healthy snack haha.
  • tillerstouch
    tillerstouch Posts: 608 Member
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    lizzelspark wrote: »
    Great tips !! Can a girl use the same when she's trying to cut too ?

    Absolutely!!! I don't know any reason why a women couldn't follow this exact same advice. Lift hard, keep a moderate calorie deficit.
    shanehaggs wrote: »
    @tillerstouch that makes a lot of sense, I'll make sure to keep it in my daily schedule, and on my off days I have creapure which I'll take 5 grams of. I recently cycled off it for 2 months so I think this would be a great time to cycle back on for a bit. Are you on any sort of diet or workout plan now, just curious?

    Right now I'm not following a specific diet, my last cut I went hard core and really limited what I ate, low carb tons of chicken and spinach. This cut though I'm being a little more relaxed, I'm losing at a pound a week (which some might consider a bit fast but it works for me).

    As for workout plan. I'm doing a plan I found on bodybuilding.com called 30 days out which I'm enjoying. I'm not sure what program I'll do after though.

    Also I'm currently taking creatine which hasn't effect my ability to lose weight.
  • shanehaggs
    shanehaggs Posts: 6 Member
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    @tillerstouch sounds like you got a good grasp of things, I'll make sure to keep on my diet and workout regiment to have maximum gains.
  • tillerstouch
    tillerstouch Posts: 608 Member
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    shanehaggs wrote: »
    @tillerstouch sounds like you got a good grasp of things, I'll make sure to keep on my diet and workout regiment to have maximum gains.

    Goodluck!
  • mattfielding1980
    mattfielding1980 Posts: 1 Member
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    HamsterManV2 nailed it. There's also an article here that I advise you to read - it rightly mentions that everyone's body is different so while the basic advice remains the same for everyone, the extent to which you apply each element will depend on what works for you: https://www.dwfitnessclubs.com/blog/2016/can-bulking-and-cutting-be-done-safely-our-experts-have-their-say/
  • StealthHealth
    StealthHealth Posts: 2,417 Member
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    mattfielding1980 wrote: »
    HamsterManV2 nailed it. There's also an article here that I advise you to read - it rightly mentions that everyone's body is different so while the basic advice remains the same for everyone, the extent to which you apply each element will depend on what works for you: https://www.dwfitnessclubs.com/blog/2016/can-bulking-and-cutting-be-done-safely-our-experts-have-their-say/
    Confession - I only skim read it. But IMHO that article is bull example - "When it comes to bulking - look to consume 3000 calories of protein-rich foods". But what a trainee bulks at 2500 calories? Are they supposed to eat another 500 more?

    Also, "Bulking and cutting has long been a controversial and divisive concept within the world of fitness and body sculpting." has it? Really? I've never heard one piece of controversy on the subject. Sure, lots of people argue about the semantics and the mechanisms (how conservative or aggressive each phase is) but honestly, I've never heard anyone question the concept other than the "it might not fit into your lifestyle and so you may be better with re-comp" type statement - which isn't controversial or refuting the value of bulk/cut, just offering an alternative.

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