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New study suggests exercise may play more important role in weight loss
Azdak
Posts: 8,281 Member
One of the most consistent phrases used on MFP is "exercise is not necessary for weight loss". The underlying principle is that all one needs to lose weight is a calorie deficit, and that exercise is for "fitness only".
The point of this statement (I think), along with the "you can outrun a bad diet" is to emphasize that a calorie deficit is the only real way to lose weight, and that exercise only, without controlling food intake, is likely to be unsuccessful. I have seen some people write that exercise is really only useful in order to be able to eat more food (and for fitness).
The reference I saw today--
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/27169833/
suggested that, while an energy deficit is still necessary for weight loss, it might be better to create that deficit via a combination of increased food intake AND increased exercise, rather than just through diet alone. This was referred to as "high energy flux".
Example: if one's TDEE was 1700 cal/day and one ate 1200 cal/day with no exercise to create a 500 cal/day deficit, it might be better to add 300 cal/day of exercise for a TDEE of 2000 cal/day and then eat 1500 cal/day.
At first glance, this might seem to violate the laws of CICO, but it doesn't really. The authors suggest that the improved loss seen by the "high energy flux" plan actually increases BMR, which then increases actual TDEE--basically you are getting the extra boost from exercise (and maybe even the thermic effect of food).
As always, this is just one study, and I am taking this solely from the abstract. I suspect if one reads the whole thing there are a ton of caveats and methodology concerns, because these are not easy to do. So, as always, one study should not be seen as a criticism of anyone's current plan.
What I do think it does, however, is put a notch on the board slightly in favor of the "diet and exercise" approach vs the "diet only" approach, and maybe give some motivation to those of you out there working out and working hard that your approach may be giving you more than just "fitness"benefits.
The point of this statement (I think), along with the "you can outrun a bad diet" is to emphasize that a calorie deficit is the only real way to lose weight, and that exercise only, without controlling food intake, is likely to be unsuccessful. I have seen some people write that exercise is really only useful in order to be able to eat more food (and for fitness).
The reference I saw today--
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/27169833/
suggested that, while an energy deficit is still necessary for weight loss, it might be better to create that deficit via a combination of increased food intake AND increased exercise, rather than just through diet alone. This was referred to as "high energy flux".
Example: if one's TDEE was 1700 cal/day and one ate 1200 cal/day with no exercise to create a 500 cal/day deficit, it might be better to add 300 cal/day of exercise for a TDEE of 2000 cal/day and then eat 1500 cal/day.
At first glance, this might seem to violate the laws of CICO, but it doesn't really. The authors suggest that the improved loss seen by the "high energy flux" plan actually increases BMR, which then increases actual TDEE--basically you are getting the extra boost from exercise (and maybe even the thermic effect of food).
As always, this is just one study, and I am taking this solely from the abstract. I suspect if one reads the whole thing there are a ton of caveats and methodology concerns, because these are not easy to do. So, as always, one study should not be seen as a criticism of anyone's current plan.
What I do think it does, however, is put a notch on the board slightly in favor of the "diet and exercise" approach vs the "diet only" approach, and maybe give some motivation to those of you out there working out and working hard that your approach may be giving you more than just "fitness"benefits.
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*i have not read the article yet.
( big delete)
Ok I read the article.
My post was out of context.
Sorry, h.1 -
Sounds like the usual to me.
My predictions: The increase in BMR isn't going to be practically significant, only statistically (something like an extar 50 or so), the way they measured does not allow for implications of causation to be made, i.e. people who exercise very regularly pay more attention than people who just want to lose weight and aren't too much into that healthy lifestyle stuff, leading to the first to be overall more successful.
"Adolescents (n = 154) and college-aged women (n = 75) underwent 2-wk objective doubly labeled water, resting metabolic rate, and percentage of body fat measures at baseline. Percentage of body fat was measured annually for 3 y of follow-up for the adolescent sample and for 2 y of follow-up for the young adult sample."
That study design does just not allow for any conclusions like the ones they did. The only thing that shows is "People who exercised ended up with better body composition".0 -
I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase (still don't now in maintenance, for the most part). So yeah, for me personally-exercise was not a factor at all. I lost at a steady rate, didn't experience any stalls and all my health markers improved by quite a bit. I'm 3 years into maintenance now. I've never had my bf% professionally taken but again, going by my health markers and my doctor, and then my bmi, I'm not too concerned about it.4
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I don't like feeling hungry so I exercise to, and do, eat more. This for me accelerates my weight loss. This method works well for me but I am not going go the no exercise route to compare results.6
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It's true that you don't need to exercise, but not exercising has its drawbacks. You lose a lot more muscle than you want to if you don't exercise. You can still look flabby when you get done even though you've reached your goal. weight The simple explanation is that muscle improves your metabolic rate and your body contour. Over the last 7 years I have lost 100 pounds, some of it without exercising, but now I work out with weights and do aerobics. Working out has increased my well being 100 percent. I am stronger, my balance has improved, and everything I do in daily life is easier. I still have about 30 pounds to lose.11
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One of the most consistent phrases used on MFP is "exercise is not necessary for weight loss". The underlying principle is that all one needs to lose weight is a calorie deficit, and that exercise is for "fitness only".
Ugh..yes, and that 2nd statement especially, annoys me to no end because it implies that exercise is somehow unrelated to calorie deficit.
As for that study, it makes some sense as far as PREDICTING future weight gain. If a woman loses all excess weight on say 1200 with no exercise (my opinion of what they're calling low energy flux), and continues that way in maintenance, it's such a low amount of food that it would be easy (for me) to eventually eat more over time, which will inevitably result in weight gain. But this would be due to an energy surplus, which the study is suggesting is not the key factor. That part I'm not buying. They're both intertwined.
Personally, if I wasn't exercising, I'd need to eat about 1300 to maintain 117 lbs. I prefer to eat more (~1800-2100) and exercise more (my opinion of high energy flux) and I've found it not only a much more enjoyable way to lose weight, it's also easy during maintenance and it provides more flexibility when I manage the amount of activity vs trying to cut back on food. I'm eating more at 117 lbs than I was eating at 152 lbs (and sedentary) and the main difference is activity level. I feel like it's going to be harder for me to gain in future if I continue this way so the high energy flux idea has some merit.
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I don't know if I have this right, but want to check. When I get to my goal weight my BMR will be 1,359 calories, that's if I do nothing but sit all day right?
So if I wanted to eat say 1800 calories a day to maintain my weight I'd have to exercise to burn 500 calories?
But the BMR is just sitting doing nothing right, so what about when I'm moving around, cooking, cleaning, tidying and the day to day things you do in between sitting. Is it just a case of trial and error to see how many calories you can eat in maintenance if you don't exercise, yet move around during the day?0 -
helenrosec0 wrote: »I don't know if I have this right, but want to check. When I get to my goal weight my BMR will be 1,359 calories, that's if I do nothing but sit all day right?
So if I wanted to eat say 1800 calories a day to maintain my weight I'd have to exercise to burn 500 calories?
But the BMR is just sitting doing nothing right, so what about when I'm moving around, cooking, cleaning, tidying and the day to day things you do in between sitting. Is it just a case of trial and error to see how many calories you can eat in maintenance if you don't exercise, yet move around during the day?
BMR really only matters if you are in a coma. Honestly, it's not a very useful number in isolation. BMR is the base number that then has other things added. Your daily calorie burn is going to be higher than your personal BMR.
The important numbers are either TDEE (which includes exercise) or NEAT (which doesn't include exercise) plus exercise if you vary your exercise a lot. The online calculators only give estimates so you will need to experiment to find your actual numbers.5 -
helenrosec0 wrote: »I don't know if I have this right, but want to check. When I get to my goal weight my BMR will be 1,359 calories, that's if I do nothing but sit all day right?
So if I wanted to eat say 1800 calories a day to maintain my weight I'd have to exercise to burn 500 calories?
But the BMR is just sitting doing nothing right, so what about when I'm moving around, cooking, cleaning, tidying and the day to day things you do in between sitting. Is it just a case of trial and error to see how many calories you can eat in maintenance if you don't exercise, yet move around during the day?
To add to what seska422 said, the normal multipliers for estimated BMR are 1.2 for sedentary and 1.5 for lightly active (think about 10,000 steps for this). So if you are sedentary (which includes some normal movement, like that you mention), maintenance would still be about 1630, and if lightly active more like 2000. I've found those numbers (well, based on my own estimated BMR, which is lower) to be pretty consistent with reality.
That aside, the BMR is an estimate, the activity factors are estimates, and you will have much better information when you are at goal weight if you've been logging consistently, as you will be able to figure out your actual TDEE.2 -
Thanks everyone, I'll certainly check back when I reach my goal!1
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Exercise is my favourite thing in this fitness game. But it has to be put in context. How many times has a person posted that they worked themselves in to exhaustion and actually gained weight? They are naturally overwhelmed if even more exercise is needed to lose. But of course to lose, the answer is in the kitchen.0
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I've posted previously that exercise causes metabolic changes that are a positive, if small, contribution to increased energy use by the body during weight loss.
If someone can't or doesn't want to exercise to during weight loss, well, I understand that decision since adding a lot might be difficult and overwhelming and it might actually create mental barriers of "too much = impossible". But the most effective methods of weight loss and body composition include some form of calorie restriction AND exercise.
The problem with the term "exercise" is that it assumes a specific set aside time for doing some sort of specific program in a specific space. It can be that but exercise can just as easily be part of an active life style of doing things you enjoy. A long hike in the woods, cycling to work, playing in the park are all exercise.
Stay active, do things, both planned and unplanned exercise helps.
(edit: here is the thread I posted on this subject - many of the responses were disappointing... http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10343378/beyond-a-calorie-deficit-exercise-is-good-for-weight-loss/p1)
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I just skimmed the full text. Energy flux was measured as intake+burn (e.g., someone who eats 1500 and burns 1500 has an energy flux of 3000, whereas someone who eats 2000 and burns 2000 has an energy flux of 4000). There was a moderate correlation of ~.3 between energy flux and RMR, meaning that "energy flux" explains about 10% of the variation in RMR (resting metabolic rate) from person to person. The association between energy flux and body fat % at follow-up was about the same size, with higher energy flux predicting lower body fat % (after controlling for energy balance, or the difference between what people burned and ate).
Looking at the plots of the data, there was a lot of variation from person to person. My own conclusion would be that being more active does help on average (by increasing RMR), but not a ton, and it varies depending on the person. Note that just because it helps doesn't mean that you can't lose weight without being more active (meaning arguments of "I lost weight just fine without exercising" don't contradict what the study found), just that it can help.
Interesting study, thanks for posting it
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Warning - anecdotal evidence - I have always found that my weight is easier to maintain when I eat plenty and work out a lot. It feels better, I look better but also this seems to put me right at a healthy weight. With dieting I can't seem to get it right.
I would suspect it's a whole system thing - bodies work better when they are not idle, and when they are nourished. I do not think we are machines, with precise equations of put this in, get this out.
My skinny brother told me when he was young (he was a nationally ranked swimmer, they burn crazy calories with the twice daily practices) that if you could eat a lot and maintain your weight you should never diet because you don't want to break that, he felt like if he didn't eat so much his body would stop burning so much. My mom used to despair because my brothers would do things like eat the entire loaf of sliced bread that was meant to take us through the week.5 -
Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficit because without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction2 -
CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficit because without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
You aren't going to be burning the same amount of calories at rest anymore anyway because your body is smaller than it was when you were overweight. If you go back to eating the way you were eating before you lost weight, you'll regain weight whether you exercise or not.
Some people can't or won't exercise. They can lose weight too. Is it better to exercise? Sure. Is it required to exercise? No.3 -
Well, I don't think the conclusions follow from the data.
They did a two-week measurement of individuals eating and exercise patterns and used that two-week data to extrapolate three years of weight gain and loss.
An alternate explanation would be that the "high flux" individuals - who were devoting a lot of time to physical activity - might be more successful in terms of weight simply because they pay more attention to their fitness and health.
That said, exercise absolutely has positive metabolic effects, including reducing or even reversing serious chronic problems like insulin resistance or other components of metabolic syndrome. And it's a key pattern of many of the "successful losers" on the national weight control registry - although again, I think it's an open question of whether the exercise makes it easier to maintain weight, or whether those who have a working plan to keep weight under control are likely to also focus on exercise, or both.5 -
In what way is this not similar to what the bodybuilders call "bulking"? I.E., eat more , exercise with progressive resistance, build muscle, increase BMR.0
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@seska422
"Some people can't or won't exercise. They can lose weight too. Is it better to exercise? Sure. Is it required to exercise?"
Yes they can lose weight solely by cico. It's not required to exercise to simply lose weight. It's just harder to maintain because once they reach their goal they will gain if they eat the amount of calories allotted for their age/sex/weight. Their maintenance needs will be lower than the average.2 -
CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.4 -
CaptainJoy wrote: »@seska422
"Some people can't or won't exercise. They can lose weight too. Is it better to exercise? Sure. Is it required to exercise?"
Yes they can lose weight solely by cico. It's not required to exercise to simply lose weight. It's just harder to maintain because once they reach their goal they will gain if they eat the amount of calories allotted for their age/sex/weight. Their maintenance needs will be lower than the average.
Losing and maintaining are two different processes.
Exercising is much easier with a smaller body. Someone can lose most of their weight with little or no exercise but that doesn't necessarily mean they won't exercise as they get closer to their goal weight and then into maintenance.
As for maintenance calories, those vary from person to person anyway.2 -
ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.3 -
CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake
TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off. 7 -
ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off.
First you should tell which one is accurate, in your experience.
If I go to:
http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/
and choose the lighest option ("desk job with little exercise"), I get 1660 cal, for maintenance.
If I go to:
https://www.supertracker.usda.gov/bwp/index.html
and describe my activity level as "very light" (lowest option, unless you manually adjust the coefficient), I get 1949 cal.
If I go to this Italian government website:
http://sapermangiare.mobi/contoemangio/?pag=dieta#
and choose again the lighest option, I get 2345 cal, isn't funny?1 -
Gianfranco_R wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off.
First you should tell which one is accurate, in your experience.
If I go to:
http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/
and choose the lighest option ("desk job with little exercise"), I get 1660 cal, for maintenance.
If I go to:
https://www.supertracker.usda.gov/bwp/index.html
and describe my activity level as "very light" (lowest option, unless you manually adjust the coefficient), I get 1949 cal.
If I go to this Italian government website:
http://sapermangiare.mobi/contoemangio/?pag=dieta#
and choose again the lighest option, I get 2345 cal, isn't funny?
Yeah, funny. The first and second give me the same and the third one is a joke since it doesn't even ask for your weight at all.4 -
Gianfranco_R wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off.
First you should tell which one is accurate, in your experience.
If I go to:
http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/
and choose the lighest option ("desk job with little exercise"), I get 1660 cal, for maintenance.
If I go to:
https://www.supertracker.usda.gov/bwp/index.html
and describe my activity level as "very light" (lowest option, unless you manually adjust the coefficient), I get 1949 cal.
If I go to this Italian government website:
http://sapermangiare.mobi/contoemangio/?pag=dieta#
and choose again the lighest option, I get 2345 cal, isn't funny?
The calorie difference between the three TDEE calculators I use are 8 or less calories.
http://mytdee.com/
http://www.sailrabbit.com/bmr/
http://www.fitnessfrog.com/calculators/tdee-calculator.html2 -
stevencloser wrote: »Gianfranco_R wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off.
First you should tell which one is accurate, in your experience.
If I go to:
http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/
and choose the lighest option ("desk job with little exercise"), I get 1660 cal, for maintenance.
If I go to:
https://www.supertracker.usda.gov/bwp/index.html
and describe my activity level as "very light" (lowest option, unless you manually adjust the coefficient), I get 1949 cal.
If I go to this Italian government website:
http://sapermangiare.mobi/contoemangio/?pag=dieta#
and choose again the lighest option, I get 2345 cal, isn't funny?
Yeah, funny. The first and second give me the same and the third one is a joke since it doesn't even ask for your weight at all.
The third one was in a different language and I didn't even get that far 0 -
stevencloser wrote: »Gianfranco_R wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off.
First you should tell which one is accurate, in your experience.
If I go to:
http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/
and choose the lighest option ("desk job with little exercise"), I get 1660 cal, for maintenance.
If I go to:
https://www.supertracker.usda.gov/bwp/index.html
and describe my activity level as "very light" (lowest option, unless you manually adjust the coefficient), I get 1949 cal.
If I go to this Italian government website:
http://sapermangiare.mobi/contoemangio/?pag=dieta#
and choose again the lighest option, I get 2345 cal, isn't funny?
Yeah, funny. The first and second give me the same and the third one is a joke since it doesn't even ask for your weight at all.
I agree about the third being a joke. As for the difference between the first and the second, the difference is in the coefficient.
Supertracker start from a coefficient of 1.4 for the sedentary level, while scoobyworkshop use a coefficient of 1.2:
Multiplier My Description Alternative Description
1.2 Desk job with little exercise Little to no exercise
1.375 1-3 hrs/wk of light exercise Light exercise (1–3 days per week)
1.55 3-5 hrs/wk of moderate exercise Moderate exercise (3–5 days per week)
1.725 5-6 hrs/wk of strenuous exercise Heavy exercise (6–7 days per week)
1.9 7-21 hrs/wk of strenuous exercise/work Very heavy exercise (twice per day, extra heavy workouts)
So it ranges from 1.2 to 1.9, while supertracker's coefficient ranges from 1.4 to 2.3 (heaviest option).0 -
ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »ReaderGirl3 wrote: »CaptainJoy wrote: »Exercise is extremely important when in a calorie deficitbecause without it you can actually lower the rate you use calories while resting. This was proven by a U.S.government study done in 2009. Ci/co works but what good is losing the weight if you're just going to put it back on because you are no longer burning the same amount of calories at rest as you were before you lost the weight?
https://www.nia.nih.gov/newsroom/announcements/2009/05/study-shows-metabolic-adaptation-calorie-restriction
May I ask how long you've been in maintenance? 3 years into maintenance here, and I didn't exercise at all during my weight loss phase. My TDEE is spot on and has been since I started this whole thing back in 2012.
If you look at my profile it is obvious that I am not into maintenance "here." I did however lose 38 pounds about 28 years ago from diet and exercise and did a pretty good job of maintaining it until about 7 years ago. That would put me in maintenance for about 21 years. Of course that was before MFP. Exercise is important during weight loss to preserve our bone mass and metabolism as we get older. If you're happy and your TDEE is spot on then I'm happy for you. Not everyone is as lucky.
Yes, people keep telling my I'm a lucky freak of nature special snowflake TDEE calculators don't ask you your weight loss and exercise history. Many of us here have found these calculators to be very accurate, regardless of our dieting/exercise history. If not exercising during my weight loss phase had somehow lowered the rate I use calories while resting, then why would my TDEE still be accurate? From my own experience my TDEE is very accurate and it's what I go by now in maintenance. I haven't had any issues with my calorie amount being off.
These formulas are very rough estimators - here is an example graph of two leading formulas. If you find them accurate it is just confirmation bias. In every study they only correspond to about 65% of metabolic factors.
For example, consider women weighing 75Kg of different heights, you'll see that the equations only match at one point and may differ as much as 200 cals (or more).
0 -
Then add the MFP motto of "eating back" your exercise calories. For me, if one is going to count to lose weight, then the TDEE- x% approach seems more logical. Again, assuming you figure out what your TDEE really is. I've never really liked the MFP approach of "eating back".3
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