Is Ketosis real?
xjessicaxrx
Posts: 144 Member
I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
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Replies
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You would still need a calorie deficit to lose. But yes, many people successfully lose weight by eating low carb/keto in a deficit.0
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This is the first time I've ever heard anyone say that ketosis worked in a surplus. That is not correct. You still have to be in a deficit.3
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I did think this, thats why im asking if anybody has found this to work.
I have been re-searching Google and the message boards here and saw it stated a few times but all the info was pretty conflicting.
Id just like to know peoples actual experiences with it to be honest 1 -
Ketosis is real of course. It also suits some people and not others.
Losing weight (long term) in a calorie surplus would mean you have to be excreting any excess calories eaten without absorbing them (sounds messy!).
Low carb diets would typically result in a faster initial weight loss (glycogen & water weight) but over time weight loss evens out between different types of diet and is in relation to your calorie deficit.
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xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
They sentence they love most is 'your body is using fat as fuel'. Its indeed just another way to eat at a deficit and thats why they loose weight. People who are doing it say they do feel full the whole day. Thats because of the high protein2 -
hjlourenshj wrote: »xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
They sentence they love most is 'your body is using fat as fuel'. Its indeed just another way to eat at a deficit and thats why they loose weight. People who are doing it say they do feel full the whole day. Thats because of the high protein
It's not just that the macro composition is satiating (for some) it's also that Ketones suppress your appetite. Many find it comfortable to maintain a larger deficit than they would otherwise while in ketosis which allows for faster weight loss.
You do eat at a deficit - of course - but nutritional ketosis is metabolically different than glycolysis. It's really not just another way to eat at a deficit in that regard.1 -
Yes and no. Eating high fat, low carb, moderate protein makes you feel fuller for longer. But a well-formulated ketogenic diet does spike insulin, a hormone that causes fat to be stored. Another way I have heard it explained to me is that fueling your body with fat is like putting a huge log on your metabolic fire (sustains for a long period of time) . Fueling your body with primarily carbohydrates, especially processed ones is like putting paper on your metabolic fire, don't feel full for very long and you have to keep adding fuel (snacking). However, you have to find out what works better for you, everyone's body is different.1
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xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
No, you can't eat as much protein as you want. No you don't typically eat in a deficit, although some people choose to use a deficit to maximize weight loss. No you don't eat as much fat as you want. No you don't eat up to 50 grams of carbs a day, it's typically 5% for the day. I successfully lost over 40 lbs by being in ketosis
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Bottom line is that you still need a calorie deficit to lose weight.
If you want to do Keto that's fine, have at it. But do know that you still need to create a calorie deficit for weight loss. Keto or low carb isn't some weight loss miracle, cico still applies. There's no way around it. You must create a calorie deficit for weight loss.
So if you enjoy Keto or have a medical condition that requires you to restrict carbs then do it but don't be fooled into believing that it's the weight loss miracle that some here make it out to be.
They conveniently leave out that a calorie deficit is still needed for weight loss and also fail to mention that the initial drop on the scale is just water weight.1 -
luvmakeup4ever wrote: »xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
No, you can't eat as much protein as you want. No you don't typically eat in a deficit, although some people choose to use a deficit to maximize weight loss. No you don't eat as much fat as you want. No you don't eat up to 50 grams of carbs a day, it's typically 5% for the day. I successfully lost over 40 lbs by being in ketosis
So are you saying that if I ate at a calorie surplus while in ketosis that i would still lose weight?
I hope I misread your post because that isn't true at all. Besides the initial drop in water weight, you would still need to create a calorie deficit to lose weight. That's fact.3 -
xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
No one claims they eat double their TDEE and still lose weight.0 -
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I've been trying to lose weight for almost 3 years now and had a whole lot of challenges. Despite eating at a deficit that should have resulted in much greater losses, I could only lose on average about 1/5 of 1 lb. per week. There were times when I would be in a plateau, losing nothing for months (even when eating at a calorie deficit) followed by a "whoosh" at the end where I would lose a massive amount in just a few days for no obvious reason. In March of this year, I switched to low carb and have lost about 5 times as quickly since then without a change in calories. I don't know if that means I could still lose at a calorie surplus; but from my experience, a deficit level of calories is significantly different when eating low carb apparently.
I would also add that excretion is a part of CO, so if you are eating so much fat that you can't digest it quickly enough (fat takes a very long time to absorb, which is why it is so much more satiating than carbs) and end up excreting quite a bit, then it would stand to reason that there is a certain point where every additional fat CI becomes 1 additional CO. I'm not sure if that happens at a surplus level or not.0 -
xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Lots of people.Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Yes, as are all successful methods. Doesn't mean it isn't a method that many can use successfully.Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
Yeah, that's silly and false. The reality is that for many people (not everyone) ketosis kills the appetite and also that way of eating tends to be more satiating for many people, especially if they were eating lots of "junk" food (often highly processed combinations of fat and carbs). So when you do keto, a lot of people naturally cut calories even without counting. Still others find they are better off counting but they have an easier time sticking to their calorie goals. My impression is that keto is largely helpful for those who had a problem with hunger on other ways of eating, which is one reason I've not tried it.I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
There have been claims by sources I find generally untrustworthy (bloggers or diet gurus) that they were able to increase their TDEE a huge amount (not an unlimited amount, but something like 300 calories) by eating this way. I don't believe it, but if you are interested another experiment wouldn't hurt. You'd need good logs before and after and also to compare activity to really have anything educational for yourself, IMO. The studies that are more credible seem to support at least a short term natural cut in calories, on average, but not any significant increase in TDEE or better weight loss if calories are held equal.Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
Based on the studies, if you hold calories equal, no, except you will drop a bunch of water weight at first which some find motivating. Again, it might be easier to hold calories to your goal, though, which would make weight loss faster. It all depends on you.2 -
hjlourenshj wrote: »xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
They sentence they love most is 'your body is using fat as fuel'. Its indeed just another way to eat at a deficit and thats why they loose weight. People who are doing it say they do feel full the whole day. Thats because of the high protein
As AlabasterVerve noted, it is also that ketosis kills the appetite, for at least a lot of people. (Again, this shouldn't matter unless you have a problem with appetite on a deficit anyway, which obviously many do not.)
And, a lot of people, especially those eating less healthful diets and quite often people with IR who eat lots of processed carbs (but I don't think this is limited to those with IR), get in a pattern where they are constantly eating, feeling full (and waking up) and then crashing somewhat and feeling like they need to eat again. I happen to think there are ways to fix this besides keto for most people, but I can see that going to keto and finding that this problem goes away would feel like a huge change and benefit of keto.1 -
xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
Ketosis, as in the metabolic process that burns fat and makes ketones, is very real. It's a survival adaptation to handle starvation or less than optimal energy availability. Don't be fooled by the words "burns fat", because in normal conditions you are burning mostly fat at rest even if you are on a very high carb diet.
Now ketosis, as in a magical process that lets you eat thousands of calories over maintenance but end up losing weight, that does not exist.
Some people who do very low carb report that it reduces their appetite to where they feel like they are eating whatever they want and losing. The loss is caused by that reduced appetite leading to a smaller calorie intake. It's worth a try if you wish to see if it works for you. Keep in mind keto is moderate protein, not high protein. Too much protein could ruin ketosis, so it's an open buffet on fat alone, really. Also keep in mind that the appetite reduction effect is very individual and does not happen for some to the same extent (quite the opposite in my case and I ended up gaining weight on it). No reason not to try it if you have appetite issues, like the kinds of foods allowed and don't mind giving up or severely reducing the foods that aren't allowed. Some people really thrive on it.1 -
xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
I've been in ketosis for most of the past 14 months. I lost weight, about 40 lbs, faster than I expected - steadily about 2-3 lbs per week. I had my CI set at 1420kcal to lose 1.5 pounds per week but I ate 1500 because I was hungrier than that, and I still lost well. My weight loss stopped when I started eating more due to hunger, but by then I was a size 8 and in the middle of a normal BMI range.
For weight loss during ketosis, one of the main factors is the cut in appetite and sugar/carb cravings that most experience. It's a LOT easier to eat less when not wanting food as often as before.
Those with insulin resistance are the people who benefit most from a very LCHF diet. Weight loss has been shown to be slightly more (about 6lbs in a year) than those who simply cut calories. If you have PCOS, T2D, prediabetes, NAFLD, CAD or dementia, you may benefit from ketosis more than others. I have insulin resistance and some autoimmune issues so I probably benefitted more than someone who was metabollically healthy. My blood sugar swings (reactive hypoglycemia) completely stopped so I no longer need to eat every couple of hours to avoid shaking, fatigue and headaches - no need for an afternoon nap. LOL
That people in ketosis can eat as much as they want without gaining is a myth. BUT I do believe that some of us are able to eat more than we could on a higher carb diet. There are many n=1 stories out there of people who simply changed their diet without cutting calories and lost weight. I'm one who lost weight faster than expected. I think there may be something about ketosis that increases CO (calories out) in some of us. I doubt it is a huge difference, and studies have never found more than a 100kcal daily advantage, but there is something to it for some people.
So CI<CO still is needed for weight loss but ketosis allows some to have a lower CI easier due to a smaller appetite, and it may increase CO a small amount. Both would help with weight loss for those that experience this.1 -
Been doing Atkins (LCHF) now for 4 months and lost over 50lbs. ✌✌ I am never hungry which takes some getting used to as I always was before however it's very normal for low carb diets as your blood sugar isn't rising up and down all day. Ketosis is a natural state the body enters into when you restrict carbs, it's main source of fuel, so when you do low Carn diet it will burn fat for fuel instead of carbs!!! As for protein I aim for a palm size piece for every main meal daily, on 3 meals a day plan. I will say tho things like bacon have nitrates which slow ketosis down (weight loss) so I would limit to twice a week. My advice follow atkins it's free and everything from nutrition to exercise is online.
Also 1 last note you I have 25g of carbs a day and high amount of good fats like coconut oil / olive oil ect and 3x palm size pieces of any meat a day.0 -
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If you eat too much protein, you will not stay in ketosis, so that part is self-limiting. The amount of carbs you can eat and stay in ketosis is variable, for many it is less than 50g.0
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BreezeDoveal wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »I've been trying to lose weight for almost 3 years now and had a whole lot of challenges. Despite eating at a deficit that should have resulted in much greater losses, I could only lose on average about 1/5 of 1 lb. per week. There were times when I would be in a plateau, losing nothing for months (even when eating at a calorie deficit) followed by a "whoosh" at the end where I would lose a massive amount in just a few days for no obvious reason. In March of this year, I switched to low carb and have lost about 5 times as quickly since then without a change in calories. I don't know if that means I could still lose at a calorie surplus; but from my experience, a deficit level of calories is significantly different when eating low carb apparently.
I would also add that excretion is a part of CO, so if you are eating so much fat that you can't digest it quickly enough (fat takes a very long time to absorb, which is why it is so much more satiating than carbs) and end up excreting quite a bit, then it would stand to reason that there is a certain point where every additional fat CI becomes 1 additional CO. I'm not sure if that happens at a surplus level or not.
Maybe all that time exrecting gave you a chance for mindfullness that allowed you to will your body to stop hanging onto the self image of yourself as overweight, which is why you have so much woosh before?
I don't understand. Please clarify.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »xjessicaxrx wrote: »I am just wondering/ interested if anyone has done this with success?
Or is it really just another way to eat at a deficit?
Apparantly you can eat as much protein and fat as you want (for example: even if its double your TDEE- so not at a deficit?) and so long as your carbs are lower than 50g per day and you are in "ketosis" you will lose weight!
Seems a bit fishy to me?
I would love to know if this has really worked for anyone, even if it was just a short term thing
Also to add- once in ketosis, is the rate of weight loss any faster than it would be otherwise?
No one claims they eat double their TDEE and still lose weight.
I wish it was really no one who said that.5 -
teetertatertango wrote: »If you eat too much protein, you will not stay in ketosis, so that part is self-limiting. The amount of carbs you can eat and stay in ketosis is variable, for many it is less than 50g.
For most eating a nutritional ketosis diet, protein will not be a factor. It is when protein is well over 200+ g per day that it may affect glucose levels in the blood. Most follow a moderate protein plan. I go with about 20%.0 -
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Ketosis is real and ketosis works and here's how: Protein in meat is tough to digest, and in the digestion of that protein your body expends a lot of energy. It turns out that 40% of the available calories in meat is already burned by the time your body gets to it. Somebody with a TDEE of 2000 and a MFP calorie goal of 1800 can possibly eat 3000 calories of meat and net their 1800. Cool, huh? Add a very few well-selected veggies for essential nutrients and rock on.
And I'll note that I did not say you could eat double your TDEE. 133%. That's what I said.0 -
The body reaction of ketosis is human physiology so yea it is very real. However as other said you still need to eat at a deficit. Some people react well to the keto diet while others don't its not a diet for everyone but really no diet is. If you try it and you feel good, keep doing it. If you feel less energetic then I would go back to using carbs as your bodies energy source.0
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Ketosis is real. Eating too much protein will keep you out of ketosis, because amino acids can be used in lieu of carbohydrates. For me, eating a high protein/moderate fat/low carb diet works better than a ketogenic diet, and it allows me enough carbs to eat vegetables.0
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BreezeDoveal wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »BreezeDoveal wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »I've been trying to lose weight for almost 3 years now and had a whole lot of challenges. Despite eating at a deficit that should have resulted in much greater losses, I could only lose on average about 1/5 of 1 lb. per week. There were times when I would be in a plateau, losing nothing for months (even when eating at a calorie deficit) followed by a "whoosh" at the end where I would lose a massive amount in just a few days for no obvious reason. In March of this year, I switched to low carb and have lost about 5 times as quickly since then without a change in calories. I don't know if that means I could still lose at a calorie surplus; but from my experience, a deficit level of calories is significantly different when eating low carb apparently.
I would also add that excretion is a part of CO, so if you are eating so much fat that you can't digest it quickly enough (fat takes a very long time to absorb, which is why it is so much more satiating than carbs) and end up excreting quite a bit, then it would stand to reason that there is a certain point where every additional fat CI becomes 1 additional CO. I'm not sure if that happens at a surplus level or not.
Maybe all that time exrecting gave you a chance for mindfullness that allowed you to will your body to stop hanging onto the self image of yourself as overweight, which is why you have so much woosh before?
I don't understand. Please clarify.
Well on the normal diet, you didn't have time to think about your diet. THis kidn of stress would reaise cortisol in comparison to the contemplative time spent excreting. Also, time excreting and contemplating would let you think about your new body image to coax your body into becoming that image. On a normal diet, not thinking about your body, your mind creates the image that it wants to hold onto that body, and will cause the body to hold onto water and otehr things to keep from becoming the new body that your mind doesn't conceive. The whoosh is when your mind finally can't force the body to hold onto its old image of what it should look like - it is like using a hammer to force the body to sclpt the body in large pulses of change instead of slow chisel releases it stone by stone.
No, the plateaus I experienced were before I was eating low carb. During and after the plateaus, there wasn't a noticeable difference in excretion / toilet time, with 1 exception: During one of my longer plateaus (6 months), I tried a version of IF that had me eating at a tremendous surplus for about 6 weeks. I started this about 2 months into the plateau, and the logic was that if I couldn't lose weight with just a deficit and I was super hungry all the time, I could at least be hungry only part of the time. So I ate whatever I wanted and as much as I wanted every other day (around 10K calories those days, and I logged it though I ate as much as I desired) and limit to 500 calories on the other days. This was a surplus in total, but in 6 weeks, I didn't have any sustained weight gain (because I was in a plateau... a true plateau, by definition, will not have any sustained gains or losses). This was a high carb (and high every other macro) diet, so the low carb examples don't apply. During that time, I had a lot of weight fluctuations (once, I even gained 9 lbs. in a few hours), but nothing that lasted. And also during that time, I spent more time "excreting." But that wasn't low carb at all.
It is incredibly naive to assume I didn't have to think about my diet on a "normal" intended deficit diet. In fact, because I was not losing as I should have, I was thinking about it even more than I am with low carb. Since I have type 1 diabetes and have to dose insulin based on carbs, I have been thinking about my diet for more than 2 decades. One doesn't need to be sitting on the toilet to think, though. And excreting doesn't magically allow additional time to think about or consider diet. The whoosh I mentioned occurred at the end of the plateau. This was about a year before I started eating low carb, so I can't see a correlation.
I'm still overweight and see myself as overweight, though not as badly as I was at one time. The idea that how I see myself or how I want to see myself having an impact on how easily I can lose weight doesn't sound right and I would need a lot more data before I can accept that as a direct help or hindrance to weight loss. It might be an indirect help or hindrance for some people (i.e. people see themselves as fat and that encourages them to eat fewer calories or it make them depressed and they eat more calories).1 -
It's not fishy. It works. It can be used as a lifestyle. You can lose a lot at the beginning but it is mostly water weight as previously stated. Everyone's metabolism, enviroment, lifestyle, daily stressors etc are different. We are different and react different. Also, some medications interfer with diets and weightloss. I am on this lifestyle and my husband joined me but he is not as strict as I because he doesn't need or want to be.0
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