Nature's Freak: Is this impossible?
governatorkp
Posts: 89 Member
I'm stuck with a rather specific question.
As someone who enjoys (what I find to be) a natural lifestyle best; my preference translates into my eating habits and activities.
I'm currently (since about a month vegan) supporter of a gluten-free vegan diet.
I've always preferred body-weight exercises and (minimalist) running over any other exercise.
In the exercise topics I keep reading 'lifting heavy' to be the way to go for building muscle mass - as well as a huge overdose on animal protein. However, lifting can't catch my interest in the slightest.
Is it possible for the average vegan young male to build muscle mass with solely body-weight exercises?
Additionally, is the overdose in protein truly needed - aren't the amino acids within the protein really what one needs for muscle maintenance and growth (with plant-based food generally containing more different essential amino acids packed in each kind of vegetable - eradicating the need for huge amount of protein?)
I'm 19 years old, 172 cm, 64 kgs.
Best case scenario would be to find someone with the same lifestyle choices with personal experiences to share.
As someone who enjoys (what I find to be) a natural lifestyle best; my preference translates into my eating habits and activities.
I'm currently (since about a month vegan) supporter of a gluten-free vegan diet.
I've always preferred body-weight exercises and (minimalist) running over any other exercise.
In the exercise topics I keep reading 'lifting heavy' to be the way to go for building muscle mass - as well as a huge overdose on animal protein. However, lifting can't catch my interest in the slightest.
Is it possible for the average vegan young male to build muscle mass with solely body-weight exercises?
Additionally, is the overdose in protein truly needed - aren't the amino acids within the protein really what one needs for muscle maintenance and growth (with plant-based food generally containing more different essential amino acids packed in each kind of vegetable - eradicating the need for huge amount of protein?)
I'm 19 years old, 172 cm, 64 kgs.
Best case scenario would be to find someone with the same lifestyle choices with personal experiences to share.
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Replies
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As a vegan powerlifter and bodybuilder, you don't need animal protein, but you do need sufficient protein which you do not get as easily as with animal protein since plant protein is less bioavailable and harder to get overall hence the suggestions that vegans consume around 10% more protein than normal in their daily intake.
It would be entirely possible to gain strength, but harder to gain mass in my experience. To gain mass you need not only to do some form of progressive overload training (which can be done with bodyweight, but not as efficiently) but also to eat at a caloric surplus in order to have the building blocks needed for your body to produce mass from.
Right now, you are in the prime of your life for building muscle... and I'd recommend a good, solid lifting program as well, but if you are determined to do it via bodyweight you might check out http://www.fitness666.com/p/exercise-progressions.html which has some good progressions for increasing strength via bodyweight.
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animal protein and lifting weights is not needed to grow - protein is a prime macronutrient but not necessarily only from animals - in terms of size weights or body weight is as good as - have a look at calisthenics as an example.1
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Google frank medrino1
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protein becomes more important when one wants to preserve mass; when bulking/adding mass, carb intake becomes more important; however, you still need adequate protein.
as far as building muscle with just body weight exercises, yes, you can get some gains; however, at some point those will stop and you will need to find a way to simulate your muscles. Why is lifting heavy not an option? That's like saying you like to read, but don't want to take the time to read a novel.2 -
Thanks for your answer!BecomingBane wrote: »
At first glance, the site you provided seems very useful indeed.
I hear you talk about the recommendation for vegans to eat 10% MORE protein than they usually would.
I've read from several sources that 10% of calories coming from protein would be enough for a vegan - however I don't know if this includes an active lifestyle.
Seeing you recommend +10% that leads me to think that 10% of calories coming from protein probably would not be enough.
Do you happen to have a recommendation for protein intake for vegans wishing to build primarily muscle strength and secondarily muscle mass?
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As a runner do you really want to put on a lot of extra muscle mass?
If you're doing body weight exercises it's hard to add weight (as you would to progress using weights) just do more reps. bodybuilding.com/fun/bodyweight-bodybuilder-the-mass-building-calisthenic-workout.html
Protein is the building block of lean muscle mass, plant based or animal based there's no getting around it.0 -
You seem to think it must be animal protein. It doesn't have to be, but you do need more protein. As for building muscle, it can be done using only body weight. Look at gymnasts, they generally do not use any weights but their body. However, using only body weight means you need to be much more creative in ways to continue to progressively over load your muscles. With weights, you just add another 5 pounds, with body weight you either add more repetitions or find ways to change the action to make it more difficult.
An example of this would be pushups. You can increase or decrease the difficulty by changing the lever point. To make them easier, place your hands on a surface that is higher up than your feet, say a step on the stairs. To make them more difficult raise your feet up higher. However, even with this, there will be limits, and then you have to get into more difficult types of pushups like partial and full planche pushups. So it is possible, but it is more difficult.0 -
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Thanks for your input!
Lifting heavy technically is an option - I've done it before (some years ago) for about a year.
However, for some reason it simply didn't make me feel 'good' - the same good running, HIIT and body-weight exercises would give me.
That's why I prefer not to do lifting - I do want to push myself to my limits, every single day if needed, but also want to have fun and feel good whilst doing it.
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governatorkp wrote: »
Thanks for your answer!BecomingBane wrote: »
At first glance, the site you provided seems very useful indeed.
I hear you talk about the recommendation for vegans to eat 10% MORE protein than they usually would.
I've read from several sources that 10% of calories coming from protein would be enough for a vegan - however I don't know if this includes an active lifestyle.
Seeing you recommend +10% that leads me to think that 10% of calories coming from protein probably would not be enough.
Do you happen to have a recommendation for protein intake for vegans wishing to build primarily muscle strength and secondarily muscle mass?
When people say 10% of calories, they really mean that's an RDA, which means it is a minimum required to prevent deficiency and ensure an adequate amino balance... that is not the same as optimal for mass growth, though.
The generic answer you will get will be something as follows:
.8-1.2 grams of protein per lb of current lean mass
.4 to .65 grams of fat per lb of lean mass
the rest of your calories come from carbs.
As @ndj1979 stated above, carbs will become more important in that process as you try to gain more mass so you may find yourself lowering protein or fat to increase carbs... I generally find it easier to add extra carbs in (which increases total overall calorie count) but if your goal is to gain mass, like was stated above, you'll need to eat for it.
Try adding an extra 100-250 calories a day each week until you see a gain of about .5 lbs a week... this will be a good slow bulk to minimize fat gains as you gain lean mass.
But as stated above, the process will be harder and slower if you aren't lifting simply due to the nature of the exercises.1 -
BrianSharpe wrote: »
Thank you for joining in, Brian!
Whilst looking for some muscle gain (primarily in the upper body - running has given me quite muscular legs already), I'm certainly not looking for attaining a very bulky look.
I suppose I'm looking for a good balance.1 -
I don't think 10% if your total calories coming from protein would be adequate. Something closer to 30% is usually recommended. Also, you can build mass without weights, it's just harder. Check out male gymnasts...1
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Thanks for your thorough explanation!rileysowner wrote: »
The progressive exercises BecomingBane linked will certainly help me take my exercises up a notch, when needed!
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governatorkp wrote: »
Thanks for your input!
Lifting heavy technically is an option - I've done it before (some years ago) for about a year.
However, for some reason it simply didn't make me feel 'good' - the same good running, HIIT and body-weight exercises would give me.
That's why I prefer not to do lifting - I do want to push myself to my limits, every single day if needed, but also want to have fun and feel good whilst doing it.
you could always go for a hypertrophy based program where you go a tad lighter on the weight and work in the 6-10 rep range and slowly increase weight on the as the reps get easier to complete...
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