How do you deal with sugar withdraw??
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stevencloser wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »sandywaterbaby9 wrote: »I need inspiration for avoiding sugar!
I'm not sure what sugar withdrawal is...?
If you're not feeling well, have you been to the doctor? There could be something more going on.
If you are trying to avoid sugar, you will need to cut out all fruits, vegetables, sauces and any other kind of food that has one trace of sugar added. You will then be 100% sugar free.
However, I don't recommend this at all because sugar is as necessary as all your other micro nutrients.
Some people choose not to have added sugar, but still eat vegetables and fruits. However, your body knows no difference between added sugar and sugar in fruits and vegetables when it come to weight loss.
Have you thought of just moderating your sugar intake to a certain amount that you want to do? This would have nothing to do with weight loss/gain, as those are dependent on CICO, and would be preference only.
I find sugar very useful at times (while participating in an endurance sport for example) but I wouldn't consider it to be a micro nutrient.
I also disagree slightly with "your body knows no difference between added sugar and sugar in fruits and vegetables when it come to weight loss", because the sugar that comes with fruits and vegetables always comes with fibre and micro nutrients (aka vitamins and minerals), whereas your added sugar may or may not.
And personally at least, the amount I moderate my sugar affects adherence to CICO because of satiety. So I would disagree that it has nothing to do with my weight loss/gain.
Btw, I LIKE the message that sugar isn't evil and we make it harder on ourselves than need be when we try to eliminate it completely. I credit MFP and the sugar crusaders for changing my view of sugar. But if someone has felt that they have turned to sugar habitually, separating themselves from it for a period of time isn't such a bad thing.
You're disagreeing with the sugars being the same by talking about things that come WITH the sugar and have nothing to do with the sugar itself.
Yes, it's semantics. But I interpret "your body knows no difference" to mean "your body doesn't react any differently". And if you look at the GI studies, your body reacts differently depending on what is accompanying the sugar.
But the thing is you rarely eat things in isolation, so there won't just be sugar alone coming into your body.
When was the last time you ate a piece of white bread alone for example? Not good GI by itself but you know, you usually make a sandwich with some meat, cheese and veggies or whatever out of it and it doesn't matter.
Pop (soda to Americans I think) and hard candy are basically eating sugar alone, and cake and pastries (my favs) don't have sugar alone but have very little fibre or protein, the two things that most change how the body reacts to the sugar.
But you're not consuming those on an empty stomach alone either. At least I hope your diet doesn't consist of days of just cake and soda.stevencloser wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »sandywaterbaby9 wrote: »I need inspiration for avoiding sugar!
I'm not sure what sugar withdrawal is...?
If you're not feeling well, have you been to the doctor? There could be something more going on.
If you are trying to avoid sugar, you will need to cut out all fruits, vegetables, sauces and any other kind of food that has one trace of sugar added. You will then be 100% sugar free.
However, I don't recommend this at all because sugar is as necessary as all your other micro nutrients.
Some people choose not to have added sugar, but still eat vegetables and fruits. However, your body knows no difference between added sugar and sugar in fruits and vegetables when it come to weight loss.
Have you thought of just moderating your sugar intake to a certain amount that you want to do? This would have nothing to do with weight loss/gain, as those are dependent on CICO, and would be preference only.
I find sugar very useful at times (while participating in an endurance sport for example) but I wouldn't consider it to be a micro nutrient.
I also disagree slightly with "your body knows no difference between added sugar and sugar in fruits and vegetables when it come to weight loss", because the sugar that comes with fruits and vegetables always comes with fibre and micro nutrients (aka vitamins and minerals), whereas your added sugar may or may not.
And personally at least, the amount I moderate my sugar affects adherence to CICO because of satiety. So I would disagree that it has nothing to do with my weight loss/gain.
Btw, I LIKE the message that sugar isn't evil and we make it harder on ourselves than need be when we try to eliminate it completely. I credit MFP and the sugar crusaders for changing my view of sugar. But if someone has felt that they have turned to sugar habitually, separating themselves from it for a period of time isn't such a bad thing.
You're disagreeing with the sugars being the same by talking about things that come WITH the sugar and have nothing to do with the sugar itself.
Yes, it's semantics. But I interpret "your body knows no difference" to mean "your body doesn't react any differently". And if you look at the GI studies, your body reacts differently depending on what is accompanying the sugar.
But the thing is you rarely eat things in isolation, so there won't just be sugar alone coming into your body.
When was the last time you ate a piece of white bread alone for example? Not good GI by itself but you know, you usually make a sandwich with some meat, cheese and veggies or whatever out of it and it doesn't matter.
Pop (soda to Americans I think) and hard candy are basically eating sugar alone, and cake and pastries (my favs) don't have sugar alone but have very little fibre or protein, the two things that most change how the body reacts to the sugar.
But you're not consuming those on an empty stomach alone either. At least I hope your diet doesn't consist of days of just cake and soda.
Hmm. I agree that what's already in your stomach can change the GI response. So your argument is that if your supper was steak and vegetables (protein and fibre) and you have an equivalent amount of sugar from either a piece of fruit or a small candy that the extra fibre in the fruit wouldn't matter much and your body's response would be roughly the same? I'm not sure.
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If something in my head or my stomach is screaming for sweets (and I am trying to avoid eating them), I can often shut it up by drinking herbal tea. Not sure why, but it helps. If I am strong enough to say NO for just a few days, the cravings diminish.0
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More or less yeah. Besides, how you feel from that differs between people too. Apples make me hungry for some reason.1
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lemurcat12 wrote: »goldthistime wrote: »Pop (soda to Americans I think) and hard candy are basically eating sugar alone, and cake and pastries (my favs) don't have sugar alone but have very little fibre or protein, the two things that most change how the body reacts to the sugar.
Off-topic, but it's pop in most of the midwest. (But I taught myself soda in college, in MA, and now use both interchangeably.)
Sort of on-topic, although I'm not sure that it is for the thread, I think how your body reacts to specific foods is different, but claiming this is about the sugars being different, as many really do seem to think, is wrong, so I think it's a worthwhile correction, and weird how people argue that no, the sugars ARE different. A good illustration of this is that some would say added sugar is BAD (or processed sugar is BAD, more often), so must be avoided, even if it makes oatmeal (with fiber) taste a bit better for you or you enjoy a tsp in coffee, which you consume with your morning omelet. That's an ignorant claim and it's worth educating people out of false information.
(And although this always gets "enjoy your poison, then, but I won't!" as a response -- yes, I absolutely know that wouldn't be your response, of course -- I will note again that I don't like sugar in coffee or oatmeal. But if someone does there's no reason to avoid it.)
I'm going to admit that I had trouble agreeing that sugar is sugar is sugar for a long time. But I think that how the sugar is delivered (with the fibre that a fruit gives, or with fat as most desserts contribute), is still really meaningful.
But yes, if you need a bit of sugar to eat your oatmeal, then I agree, it shouldn't make weight loss measurably more difficult.
As to having sugar in your coffee (as I have), it gets trickier. There's fibre in oatmeal but no fibre or protein in coffee, and we're back to the ultimate sin of drinking your calories (least satiety cues). It's not a bad thing to give up if you can.
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CorneliusPhoton wrote: »If something in my head or my stomach is screaming for sweets (and I am trying to avoid eating them), I can often shut it up by drinking herbal tea. Not sure why, but it helps. If I am strong enough to say NO for just a few days, the cravings diminish.
I eat a bit of raw turnip, sour pickle, or something pungent. That kills the sweet craving and shocks the taste buds. Lol.1 -
I budget calories for a sweet snack every evening. If I get a sweet craving during the day, I look forward to that treat all day. And I'm even losing weight!3
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Honestly... I eat sugar. Ergo, no withdrawal. Ergo, life is good.5
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The sugar detox headache is no joke! I'm on day 4 of keto and holy moly!!!1
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I didn't work to cut sugar directly, just to eat less sugary stuff in general. Every time I want something sweet, I ask myself if the taste of it is worth it. Store bought junk food isn't. Brownies made on my Birthday by my 12 year old daughter are. After awhile it became second nature to NOT want the junk.
But I still enjoy the good stuff.
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Sugar cravings generally exist in people who consistently diet on too little calories per day. Sugar addiction, I know I'll trigger some butthurt, doesn't exist within itself. It could exist as a part of some other bigger picture issue.
What's the big picture issue?
Here's a example:
If you're addicted to sugar and i upended a bag of sugar on the table in front of you, your start snorting and bury your face in the sugar.
What's the big picture issue?
Boredom?
Lack of nutritional knowledge?
Self sabotage?
Seeking love?
Childhood food issues passed along by parents?
I don't want you to think I'm just a snarky guy.
I'm actually a habit coach who works with people who want to have better relationships with food and exercise.3 -
Helloitsdan wrote: »Sugar cravings generally exist in people who consistently diet on too little calories per day. Sugar addiction, I know I'll trigger some butthurt, doesn't exist within itself. It could exist as a part of some other bigger picture issue.
What's the big picture issue?
Here's a example:
If you're addicted to sugar and i upended a bag of sugar on the table in front of you, your start snorting and bury your face in the sugar.
What's the big picture issue?
Boredom?
Lack of nutritional knowledge?
Self sabotage?
Seeking love?
Childhood food issues passed along by parents?
I don't want you to think I'm just a snarky guy.
I'm actually a habit coach who works with people who want to have better relationships with food and exercise.
No, it's your brain screaming that it wants to eat the wonderful tasting donuts regardless of the resulting bodyfat is contributes to. It's eating healthy, whole, nutritional foods for long term and successfully losing body fat but then bingeing on a whole pie even though you know its going to set you back and delay further success for days or even weeks.
It's not out of boredom
its not that you don't know better
its not self sabotage, its a weakness for sugary-fatty-carb loaded foods
it has nothing to do with love, or desire for love
childhood food issues? I don't even know how to respond to that foolishness
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silverfiend wrote: »Helloitsdan wrote: »Sugar cravings generally exist in people who consistently diet on too little calories per day. Sugar addiction, I know I'll trigger some butthurt, doesn't exist within itself. It could exist as a part of some other bigger picture issue.
What's the big picture issue?
Here's a example:
If you're addicted to sugar and i upended a bag of sugar on the table in front of you, your start snorting and bury your face in the sugar.
What's the big picture issue?
Boredom?
Lack of nutritional knowledge?
Self sabotage?
Seeking love?
Childhood food issues passed along by parents?
I don't want you to think I'm just a snarky guy.
I'm actually a habit coach who works with people who want to have better relationships with food and exercise.
No, it's your brain screaming that it wants to eat the wonderful tasting donuts regardless of the resulting bodyfat is contributes to. It's eating healthy, whole, nutritional foods for long term and successfully losing body fat but then bingeing on a whole pie even though you know its going to set you back and delay further success for days or even weeks.
It's not out of boredom
its not that you don't know better
its not self sabotage, its a weakness for sugary-fatty-carb loaded foods
it has nothing to do with love, or desire for love
childhood food issues? I don't even know how to respond to that foolishness
People who binge have emotional issues they associate with food.
Regret, remorse, guilt, shame.
Worry, panic, fear.
Anger, frustration.
And of course you'd think it's foolish, you're the one who binges without understanding why.
When you think about binging, what's the number 1 emotion listed above that best represents your binging?
BTW I have 2 clients who formerly binged. Both are now binge free for a year now.2 -
I quit eating sweets (i.e. candy, cupcakes, brownies, Ice cream, etc) 10 months ago. I started with the goal of 30 days. It's definitely gotten easier over the months.
I'm still occasionally tempted..but by being firm and resolute in my decision I'm much more easily able to avoid any temptations. Grocery shopping is much easier. I just don't eat those things...so don't buy.
As far as dealing with the initial cravings...I second fruit if you are still eating that.
And I don't even crave that as much anymore.
But I would either snack on raspberries (1 cal each) or I would cut up a banana, warm it for about 40 seconds in the microwave, stir in a couple tsp peanut butter and a little plain cocoa powder. Got me thru the first couple weeks. Now I just eat a plain piece of fruit when I'd like a sweet snack. Yesterday I had raspberries. Today I had some fresh pineapple. My favorite fruit are oranges, and occasionally I'll have an Apple or banana.0 -
I eat a cookie. Cookies make me happy.3
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cardiacmommy wrote: »I quit eating sweets (i.e. candy, cupcakes, brownies, Ice cream, etc) 10 months ago. I started with the goal of 30 days. It's definitely gotten easier over the months.
I'm still occasionally tempted..but by being firm and resolute in my decision I'm much more easily able to avoid any temptations. Grocery shopping is much easier. I just don't eat those things...so don't buy.
As far as dealing with the initial cravings...I second fruit if you are still eating that.
And I don't even crave that as much anymore.
But I would either snack on raspberries (1 cal each) or I would cut up a banana, warm it for about 40 seconds in the microwave, stir in a couple tsp peanut butter and a little plain cocoa powder. Got me thru the first couple weeks. Now I just eat a plain piece of fruit when I'd like a sweet snack. Yesterday I had raspberries. Today I had some fresh pineapple. My favorite fruit are oranges, and occasionally I'll have an Apple or banana.
So is this for life?2 -
I quit soda for 6 months after drinking it all the time because it was an easy way to cut calories. Didn't have any problems. I wasn't stealing my mother's savings or robbing the laundromat for a donut.
Now I have 200 ml of Coke or Pepsi a couple of times a week because I like it.
I've eaten chocolate and drank alcohol pretty much every day the whole time.
I lost 80 lbs between April 2015 and April 2016, and have maintained my goal range since then.1 -
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stevencloser wrote: »More or less yeah. Besides, how you feel from that differs between people too. Apples make me hungry for some reason.
Definitely different from person to person. Apples are one of my go-to filling snacks.0 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »More or less yeah. Besides, how you feel from that differs between people too. Apples make me hungry for some reason.
Definitely different from person to person. Apples are one of my go-to filling snacks.
Whereas I hate them (most fruit actually), and it's probably been 10 years since I've had a raw apple (apple pie at Thanksgiving probably doesn't count lol). It is interesting how we're all so different
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crzycatlady1 wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »More or less yeah. Besides, how you feel from that differs between people too. Apples make me hungry for some reason.
Definitely different from person to person. Apples are one of my go-to filling snacks.
Whereas I hate them (most fruit actually), and it's probably been 10 years since I've had a raw apple (apple pie at Thanksgiving probably doesn't count lol). It is interesting how we're all so different
I find apples really filling, but yeah -- satiety and preferences are very individual things that can't be generalized about.0 -
The sugar detox headache is no joke! I'm on day 4 of keto and holy moly!!!
Note that this isn't about "detoxing" at all, or about lowering the consumption of sugar alone. It's the effect of your body going into ketosis, from being extremely low carb. Someone who merely lowers added sugar (or even sugar in general) won't experience it (it being low carb flu or some other name if you prefer, but there's no detoxing going on).2 -
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.0 -
CorneliusPhoton wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.
Gut biome is the new buzz word to throw around while making woo claims. Don't put too much faith in that stuff.5 -
CorneliusPhoton wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.
We seek sugar because of the brain. It's #1 priority is maintaining energy.
But when you look into the rodent models on sugar you'll see several key factors.
1). Extremely limited food choices. The rodents eat nutrient dense nuggets that taste like cardboard.
2). Dopamine increase only lasted a short while in rodents when fed sugar water but returned to normal.
3). Rodents experienced a dopamine rush that continued to build when given cocaine. This lasted long after they stopped.
4). Humans experience the same dopamine rush with sugar compared to hugging their grandparents for 20 seconds.
Therefore
Hugging grandparents is addictive and needs to stop!3 -
Helloitsdan wrote: »CorneliusPhoton wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.
We seek sugar because of the brain. It's #1 priority is maintaining energy.
But when you look into the rodent models on sugar you'll see several key factors.
1). Extremely limited food choices. The rodents eat nutrient dense nuggets that taste like cardboard.
2). Dopamine increase only lasted a short while in rodents when fed sugar water but returned to normal.
3). Rodents experienced a dopamine rush that continued to build when given cocaine. This lasted long after they stopped.
4). Humans experience the same dopamine rush with sugar compared to hugging their grandparents for 20 seconds.
Therefore
Hugging grandparents is addictive and needs to stop!
Hello Dan, stop making sense!2 -
stevencloser wrote: »CorneliusPhoton wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.
Gut biome is the new buzz word to throw around while making woo claims. Don't put too much faith in that stuff.
The importance of a healthy gut biome is nothing new, and though research into the area of its influence on behavior is relatively recent, there is no reason to discount it by calling out "woo."Helloitsdan wrote: »CorneliusPhoton wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.
We seek sugar because of the brain. It's #1 priority is maintaining energy.
But when you look into the rodent models on sugar you'll see several key factors.
1). Extremely limited food choices. The rodents eat nutrient dense nuggets that taste like cardboard.
2). Dopamine increase only lasted a short while in rodents when fed sugar water but returned to normal.
3). Rodents experienced a dopamine rush that continued to build when given cocaine. This lasted long after they stopped.
4). Humans experience the same dopamine rush with sugar compared to hugging their grandparents for 20 seconds.
Therefore
Hugging grandparents is addictive and needs to stop!
Sarcastic comments are not helpful and are demeaning. Addiction is not that simple.
Again, open minded, civil discussion about both the chemical and behavioral motivations of addictive behavior are needed and are much more constructive than sarcasm or smack-downs. Shaming people doesn't change their minds, and taking a hard line just shows that you think that there is nothing left to learn. Nobody here has shown that any theory has been proven or debunked. I don't take a hard line either way. I think there are habitual, cultural, and emotional reasons for craving sugar, but I don't discount the possibility of chemical.
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queenliz99 wrote: »Helloitsdan wrote: »CorneliusPhoton wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »
I wouldn't exactly call that a smack-down "nope" but a call for more discussion on the nature of the various pathways of addiction, both behavioral and neurochemical, both of which need more research. Not to mention the influence our gut biome has on our eating decisions.
We seek sugar because of the brain. It's #1 priority is maintaining energy.
But when you look into the rodent models on sugar you'll see several key factors.
1). Extremely limited food choices. The rodents eat nutrient dense nuggets that taste like cardboard.
2). Dopamine increase only lasted a short while in rodents when fed sugar water but returned to normal.
3). Rodents experienced a dopamine rush that continued to build when given cocaine. This lasted long after they stopped.
4). Humans experience the same dopamine rush with sugar compared to hugging their grandparents for 20 seconds.
Therefore
Hugging grandparents is addictive and needs to stop!
Hello Dan, stop making sense!
Along with the snarky comments I actually do care and work to help people avoid the things I've done in the past before realizing critical thinking is an important skill to grow.
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lemurcat12 wrote: »crzycatlady1 wrote: »GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »stevencloser wrote: »More or less yeah. Besides, how you feel from that differs between people too. Apples make me hungry for some reason.
Definitely different from person to person. Apples are one of my go-to filling snacks.
Whereas I hate them (most fruit actually), and it's probably been 10 years since I've had a raw apple (apple pie at Thanksgiving probably doesn't count lol). It is interesting how we're all so different
I find apples really filling, but yeah -- satiety and preferences are very individual things that can't be generalized about.
Apples by themselves make me hungrier unless I pair it with a protein or a meal.0
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