Perks of becoming a vegetarian?

tlflag1620 · October 2016

rainbowbow wrote: »

kathrynjean_ wrote: »

rainbowbow wrote: »

I agree the main perk is for the animals.

Maybe less food poisoning? Otherwise, i have no idea.

You can still eat all sorts of high-calorie and "unhealthy" foods while being vegetarian. Just because it doesn't have meat doesn't mean it's healthy or fits into your diet.

I totally agree with all of this! But just wanted to say that to my knowledge (and personal experience), food poisoning from unwashed fruit and veg is not exactly uncommon

Oh, i've had it two or three times in my life (i've been a vegetarian since i was born). But my family and loved ones seem to have it far more often as a result of undercooked meats or contaminated meats. That's not to say i trust anyone to handle food properly and cook everything to temperature.

Produce seems to get recalled much more often than meat... Think spinach and E. coli.

I've never had food poisoning and I've been an omnivore since birth. You've had food poisoning two or three times? That seems like a LOT to me.... Maybe wash your produce? Oh, and teach your family and loved ones how to cook... Yeesh. It's not the meat's fault that they can't cook (or wash their hands properly? Ick).

OP - there are no real benefits to a vegetarian diet. It can certainly be healthy, but it can also be unhealthy. It depends on the choices you make. I won't even say it's necessarily better for the animals - gophers get ground up whether you feed the soy to the cows or eat the soy yourself. There is a trail of blood from our plates to the fields either way <shrug>

SezxyStef · October 2016

kathrynjean_ wrote: »

cqbkaju wrote: »

Seriously, re-think it. My wife was a vegetarian, then her neurologist told her to at least eat fish.
I told her to for years, but I'm not her doctor...
She still had to have 3 blood transfusions this year to treat anemia. Women are low on Iron to begin with.

I see your anecdote and raise you my own.

I've been vegan for more than 7 years now and my bloodwork is great. I consult with my physician regularly. I pay more attention to what I eat now and my iron is actually better than it was when I was occasionally eating meat.

Vegetarianism and veganism is not a magic bullet for health, and I'm not claiming that it is. But it's also not a death sentence for women as you make it sound.

It is possible to eat a veg diet and live a healthy life. It is possible to eat a diet with meat and eggs and dairy and live a healthy life. The end.

and I will raise you this one.

Vegans and vegetarians who are female are at a greater risk for experiencing issues during pregnancy which can then be passed to their children.

The inability to absorb certain nutrients while pregnant and passing it onto your kids where it's permanent for them is one of the biggest reasons not be a vegetarian/vegan for a woman.

I believe it was fat that couldn't be absorbed but will find the link to show for sure...as well b12 etc.

https://chriskresser.com/why-you-should-think-twice-about-vegetarian-and-vegan-diets/

this isn't the link but see if I can find it.

trigden1991 · October 2016

lemurcat12 wrote: »

Low muscle-mass vegetarian (vegan, actually).

+HGH, Test, Tren

cqbkaju · October 2016

lemurcat12 wrote: »

Low muscle-mass vegetarian (vegan, actually).

A picture of one person -without references or citations- who looks artificial and out of proportion is supposed to invalidate my entire statement?

Sorry, it doesn't work that way.
For every 1 "vegan" you can show me, I can probably provide dozens of pictures of omnivores, all in better shape.
Mine from a simple Google search, so you can do it yourself.

Besides that, it actually looks like his arm is filled with Synthol to me.

@trigden1991 It looks like you beat me to it..

LaReinaDeCorazones · October 2016

I've been a vegetarian for 5 years, it doesn'tguarantee weight loss, but I feel better since I've stopped eating meat...and have not had any health issues

mburgess458 · October 2016

Like most things diet related I don't see it as a yes/no question. There are plenty of health benefits of eating more fruits and veggies. You don't have to view it as completely cut out meat from your diet or do nothing. There is literally no downside to eating more veggies (as long as your calories are still in check). Eating less meat than you currently eat is probably a good thing (depending on how much you're eating now of course).

melonaulait · October 2016

cqbkaju wrote: »

You get to act morally superior to those of us with more muscle mass

cqbkaju wrote: »

those of us with more muscle mass

cqbkaju wrote: »

more muscle mass

MOOOOOOOOOOOORE!!!

cqbkaju · October 2016

melonaulait wrote: »

MOOOOOOOOOOOORE!!!

BTW, do you like the green tea Kit Kats? I've never tried them.
Matcha, right?

わたしは　にほんごが　すこし　わかります。

melonaulait · October 2016

cqbkaju wrote: »

BTW, do you like the green tea Kit Kats? I've never tried them.
Matcha, right?

わたしは　にほんごが　すこし　わかります。

Unfortunately Nestle isn't as morally superior as those of us with lower muscle mass.

janejellyroll · October 2016

cqbkaju wrote: »

You get to act morally superior to those of us with more muscle mass, more B vitamins, more complete proteins and more Iron in their diets.

The reason you can ask this question is because we ate meat. Period.
Bigger jaws (gorillas, chimps) required bigger jaw muscles; because we had to crush hard roots, etc.
The switch to meat allowed that muscle to grow weaker*, which put less pressure on the brain case and skull.
This allowed the skull to grow and therefore the brain as well. It is simple anthropology.
Now your "bigger brain" is asking if you should give up meat... Wow.

Seriously, re-think it. My wife was a vegetarian, then her neurologist told her to at least eat fish.
I told her to for years, but I'm not her doctor...
She still had to have 3 blood transfusions this year to treat anemia. Women are low on Iron to begin with.

* ADDENDUM: also the amino profile of meats and sweetbreads promote brain growth and development to a degree which a vegetarian diet does not.
This is why some governments are moving to make it illegal to put developing children on vegetarian and vegan diets.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/07/11/italian-baby-fed-vegan-diet-hospitalized-for-malnutrition/

I have more muscle mass than some non-vegans and my blood work, which checks for B vitamins and iron, is fine. I track my amino acids on another website and they're always above 100% to requirements. Ignorance is a bad look.

I understand you have no desire to stop eating meat, but there's no need to traffic in misinformation.

cqbkaju · October 2016

melonaulait wrote: »

Unfortunately Nestle isn't as morally superior as those of us with lower muscle mass.

That may be true.
I wonder if they use butyric acid and vegetable oil in their "chocolate" in Japan like they do in the USA.

I just asked because I saw them in your profile picture.

lemurcat12 · October 2016

cqbkaju wrote: »

lemurcat12 wrote: »

Low muscle-mass vegetarian (vegan, actually).

A picture of one person -without references or citations- who looks artificial and out of proportion is supposed to invalidate my entire statement?

It was how much it was worth.

I'm not a vegetarian, but claiming that one is unhealthy and can't gain muscle on a vegetarian diet (or that eating meat means you have more muscle mass) is as ridiculous as claiming the reverse.

(On the photo, Robert Cheeke is supposed to be natural and I've never heard anything to the contrary, but I'm not a bodybuilding expert or into that scene so not saying there couldn't possibly some rumor about him. There are loads of other examples in other athletic areas, as I'm sure you know.)

tcunbeliever · October 2016

For me the perks are no more migraines and a cheaper grocery bill.

cwolfman13 · October 2016

I'm not 100% vegetarian but I eat a substantively plant based diet...I eat vegetarian 3-4x per week. Keep in mind that any diet can be as healthy as you want to make it. I have a far better overall diet than some of my full time vegetarian friends as my diet revolves largely around whole foods and minimally processed foods...I have some vegetarian friends that basically live off of junk food most of the time.

I don't really think there's a substantive health benefit if you're comparing an omnivore and a vegetarian provided the overall diet is largely whole foods based...an omnivore with a largely whole food based diet is going to be eating plenty of veggies and fruit and good fats, etc. If you're comparing an omnivore who is eating the SAD to a whole foods vegetarian, that a whole other story...but really, you're also comparing apples to oranges there.

If you think being a vegetarian will auto default to weight loss, you are sorely mistaken. Even though my vegetarian meals are very healthy, they can actually be more calorie dense than my omnivore days if I'm not careful. To ensure I'm getting the nutrition I need, I eat a lot of beans and lentils and potatoes and sweet potatoes and whole grains...these things can be very calorie dense vs grilling some kind of lean protein and serving with a big side of veg for example...

I guess you really need to consider why you're doing it. For my wife and I there were a couple of reasons we went part time veg...

1. We were eating a lot of meat and became more concerned with the sourcing of that meat from both an environmental POV as well as treatment of the animals and the hormones and antibiotics and whatnot being pumped into them. We buy locally sourced beef and chicken and wild caught salmon and cod (frozen...I live in the desert) and it gets really expensive when you're eating meat all the time.

2. I have borderline high uric acid and have had gout flares here and there since I was in my 20s...more meat just ups my uric acid and increases my odds of a flare...I do much better eating a more plant based diet.

cqbkaju · October 2016

janejellyroll wrote: »

I understand you have no desire to stop eating meat, but there's no need to traffic in misinformation.

What part of that was misinformation?
I never said "all vegans are smaller than all omnivores". That would be absurd.

If you are "debating" the anthropology then we will have to take that offline.

janejellyroll · October 2016

cqbkaju wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

I understand you have no desire to stop eating meat, but there's no need to traffic in misinformation.

What part of that was misinformation?
I never said "all vegans are smaller than all omnivores". That would be absurd.

If you are debating the anthropology then we will have to take that offline.

I'm debating this: "You get to act morally superior to those of us with more muscle mass, more B vitamins, more complete proteins and more Iron in their diets."

Some people who don't eat meat have more muscle mass than those who don't. And people who don't eat meat are perfectly capable of meeting their needs for B vitamins, complete proteins, and iron. Vegetarians are perfectly capable of gaining and retaining muscle mass and meeting their nutritional needs.

As far as the anthropology, I consider it irrelevant. Our species has engaged in a lot of behavior -- we still get to decide for ourselves whether we want to do it individually. Our ancestors ate meat and it may have influenced the way we evolved. Okay. Since we can easily meet our nutritional needs without meat today, we can still decide if we want to eat it or not. Anthropology isn't our destiny. I assume there were behaviors commonly engaged in by our ancestors that you have chosen not to engage in yourself.

You may want to do more research on that Italian story -- Italy isn't seriously moving to make veganism illegal for children and I'm not aware of any government that is attempting to do so at this time.

cqbkaju · October 2016

janejellyroll wrote: »

You may want to do more research on that Italian story -- Italy isn't seriously moving to make veganism illegal for children and I'm not aware of any government that is attempting to do so at this time.

Really? The first Google result: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/italy-law-vegan-diet_us_57ac4664e4b0db3be07d446b

"The law proposes jail sentences of a year for raising a child on a vegan diet, up to four years if the child develops a permanent health problem and up to seven years if the child dies as a result.

It would apply to children under 16 and penalties would increase by a year if the child is under three."

You seem to be cherry-picking parts of the discussion to "debate" instead of the whole thing.

I am not trying to deal in absolutes but apparently you are.

The OP asked for advice. My wife was a vegetarian, now a pescatarian.
I am a trainer and have been for over 20 years. I gave my advice.
Do with it what you will.

lemurcat12 · October 2016

Yes, Italy is NOT seriously moving to make veganism illegal for kids, and that's a terrible source.

I recommend (for that portion of the discussion) going to the Health and Fitness Debate forum where there's a thread on it: http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10441603/do-vegan-diets-for-children-really-need-to-be-outlawed#latest

The reporting on it was ridiculous, as you can see if you try to get specifics from the HuffPo article (picked up from a bad article in the UK press, as I recall) or even on the supposed law. It's like an Italian website suggesting some random thing proposed by some Congressperson with no chance of passing (which happens all the time) reflects some serious policy change in the US.

cqbkaju · October 2016

Wow. Talk about denial.

Well, then here it is an Italian newspaper:

"Known as the “Savino law”, it aims to “stigmatise the reckless and dangerous eating behaviour imposed by parents ... to the detriment of minors”, reports Italian newspaper La Repubblica."

http://www.repubblica.it/salute/alimentazione/2016/08/07/news/proposta_di_legge_fi_per_punire_genitori_che_impongono_dieta_vegana_a_figli-145539707/

I'm done with this thread.

"Italy isn't seriously moving to make veganism illegal for children and I'm not aware of any government that is attempting to do so at this time." -- FAIL

A proposed law is a "moving to make veganism illegal for children" where I come from.

janejellyroll · October 2016

cqbkaju wrote: »

janejellyroll wrote: »

You may want to do more research on that Italian story -- Italy isn't seriously moving to make veganism illegal for children and I'm not aware of any government that is attempting to do so at this time.

Really? The first Google result: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/italy-law-vegan-diet_us_57ac4664e4b0db3be07d446b

"The law proposes jail sentences of a year for raising a child on a vegan diet, up to four years if the child develops a permanent health problem and up to seven years if the child dies as a result.

It would apply to children under 16 and penalties would increase by a year if the child is under three."

You seem to be cherry-picking parts of the discussion to "debate" instead of the whole thing.

I am not trying to deal in absolutes but apparently you are.

The OP asked for advice. My wife was a vegetarian, now a pescatarian.
I am a trainer and have been for over 20 years. I gave my advice.
Do with it what you will.

This is a proposed law -- it's the equivalent of a member of the House of Representatives in the US introducing a bill to impeach Obama (which happens once or twice a year here) but not having the support to bring it to a full vote. All respect to the Huffington Post, but there is no indication that this bill has the votes to be put into law -- it hasn't even come up to debate yet. If it does pass debate, get voted into law, and enacted, then I will be happy to admit that I'm wrong. But that still wouldn't be the "some governments" you mentioned above -- this is just one government and a bill with an unknown amount of support in Italy. Were there other governments you were thinking of?

I'm not attempting to cherrypick your points -- if you tell me which other governments you were referring to, we can discuss those as well. Even if more governments, as you claim, were taking this step, I'm still not clear what relationship it has to vegetarianism, where one is presumably eating eggs and dairy, for an adult. It smacks of fear-mongering, to be honest.

I understand that you are giving advice based on your wife's situation. I'm pointing out there is a wider picture to consider and research on the long-term health of vegetarians that we can draw upon apart from your experience with your wife.

Perks of becoming a vegetarian?

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